Levels of conscious mind residing...

[Jonesboy]

1 minute ago, C T said:

Im tempted to offer a rebuttal, but to avoid the messiness that usually results from such baseless, emotional (almost insulting) outcries, I'll simply let it go. For the peace of the community... oh yeah, and self-respect, naturally. 

 

About time.

[C T]

7 minutes ago, Jonesboy said:

 

About time.

Of course, nothing prevents me from changing my mind, so don't be gleefully clapping your hands prematurely. 

[allinone]

17 hours ago, Nungali said:

 

 

I don't think   a shortcoming in  '  literature' is the issue  .

 

I will tell you what I think the issue is .   You have a busy 'broadly focused mind '   lets say .  Its making connections all over the place,  so some of those nodes of connections are more significant to you than others and also relate to external stimuli  and others communications.  So that's how you respond , off the nodes. All the other connections that make what you say seem sensible  ,  to   you  ,  are actually inside your head and your 'internal dialogue ' .

 

But we cant hear your internal dialogue, so  we cant make the sensible connections , so when just reading the  words you right, for others, it comes out as  ....       .

 

We all do it, to an extent, but usually we have comparative internal connections so we can fill in the gaps  and sometimes understand each others cryptic  communications .  But when you are having mostly internal connections and just sprouting random seemingly quantum words and phrases, that seem unconnected to us , you become not  clearly understood.

 

I have a woman friend that does this a LOT .. half the time I am " WTF !  How did you get to there ! "  and she will explain  and I go   'ok'  and remind her I am not psychic .  (She also sometimes verbalises when she thinks she is just thinking ... I also had a GF that did that in her sleep, but verbalised from her unconscious  ... oh my goodness !  The things I heard !     )

 

no i am a retard on that respect, i never speak normally, i mean never had spoke normally. I also read you what you write also retardly.

---

you can be right tho, the same idea what you told i am aware of that, but it should not be the main issue.

Edited September 27, 2017 by allinone

[Jeff]

Tom,

 

I realize and appreciate that that you are trying to defend me (and LU). But let’s please drop this. Posting old threads about Bindi’s statements is not going to be helpful (or healing). 

 

I am a big boy and can handle it. Also, I know all of the details and am completely comfortable with all of my actions (or inaction  ).

 

Much love to all,

Jeff

 

[allinone]

Jeff,

Do your group cultivate Jing/urges? (i think urges are jing)

 

Basically you sit in a room and wait till you feel a need or desire to go somewhere and do something. So are you cultivate that force?

[Mudfoot]

8 minutes ago, allinone said:

Jeff,

Do your group cultivate Jing/urges? (i think urges are jing)

 

Basically you sit in a room and wait till you feel a need or desire to go somewhere and do something. So are you cultivate that force?

The force of the bathroom break? 

[C T]

17 minutes ago, Jeff said:

Tom,

 

I realize and appreciate that that you are trying to defend me (and LU). But let’s please drop this. Posting old threads about Bindi’s statements is not going to be helpful (or healing). 

 

I am a big boy and can handle it. Also, I know all of the details and am completely comfortable with all of my actions (or inaction  ).

 

Much love to all,

Jeff

 

Sound post. 

[allinone]

5 minutes ago, Mudfoot said:

The force of the bathroom break? 

 

the water of piss, that feeling is late to cultivate, it will accumulate there from feelings of fear, anxiety etc.

Add exitement you have also brown stuff./////////actually not late, you can use those sensations. I have, but i didn't meant those urges in my post.

 

i mean more like boredom induced, aversion etc sensations. But that is not all, there is waht matters is a common nominator,.. there is something in urge what kind of clicks or works.

--------

So also if said like sitting in a room, it is just to point out a scenario, if you can get what it means then you don't really have to separately practice.

Edited September 27, 2017 by allinone

[Jonesboy]

21 minutes ago, Jeff said:

Tom,

 

I realize and appreciate that that you are trying to defend me (and LU). But let’s please drop this. Posting old threads about Bindi’s statements is not going to be helpful (or healing). 

 

I am a big boy and can handle it. Also, I know all of the details and am completely comfortable with all of my actions (or inaction  ).

 

Much love to all,

Jeff

 

 

Jeff,

 

I know you always want me to let this stuff go.

 

Just years now of this same stuff over and over again. People with no clue as to what we do, how we interact, what if anything that we teach and yet it is all dangerous.

 

You're dangerous, now prove you're not!!!

 

I will let it go at your request even with the perception that I am making baseless accusations against someone after I said I would back it up.

 

I understand and will drop it.

[allinone]

also who are nobodies, basically not know what are the hidden dramas and issues, then OP is VERY MISLEADING. WTF anyone can relate to it. And waht those later do, is fall under ground becasue of embarrasment.

[dwai]

I wonder if people realize that what they find objectionable in "light work" could very well be their own projections. Stuff their minds have to let go of, in order to be free. If one feel upset/angry/sad/sexual attraction during a joint energy session (this happens in solo practice at home as well if one is doing a good energetic/spiritual practice), odds are that they are one's own issues that are becoming apparent. Instead of asking "who is doing this to me?" and looking for a source outside, perhaps one should ask "to whom is this happening? And Why is it happening?".

 

Odds are there will be some things one will learn about one's own mental habits and issues (inner-demons masking as self-righteous indignance based on some moral or ethical framework). If we don't  have buttons to push, there will be no one who can push the buttons (either knowingly or unknowingly).

 

[C T]

11 minutes ago, Jonesboy said:

 

Jeff,

 

I know you always want me to let this stuff go.

 

Just years now of this same stuff over and over again. People with no clue as to what we do, how we interact, what if anything that we teach and yet it is all dangerous.

 

Your dangerous, now prove your not!!!

 

I will let it go at your request even with the perception that I am making baseless accusations against someone after I said I would back it up.

 

I understand and will drop it.

If you only knew how clued in people are, despite your lack of faith, it might actually restore some of that lost shine, and maybe help you to understand why it is important, as one who has the intention to help, never to undermine another person's experiences, no matter how these may seem to be counter to your cause or belief. Of course, if your basic belief is not one of helping but of something other than, then by all means, continue with your emotional outbursts. No one can deny you that. 

 

You think all presumed detractors are 'them' and then there's 'our group' and 'our teachings'. This is a fundamental flaw, something which may not be apparent to you now, but perhaps someday you will learn how to rise above mundane dualistic views and cultivate more equanimity to further strengthen your desire to be of real, genuine service for the good of sentient beings. 

[Jonesboy]

On 9/27/2017 at 7:47 AM, C T said:

If you only knew how clued in people are, despite your lack of faith, it might actually restore some of that lost shine, and maybe help you to understand why it is important, as one who has the intention to help, never to undermine another person's experiences, no matter how these may seem to be counter to your cause or belief. Of course, if your basic belief is not one of helping but of something other than, then by all means, continue with your emotional outbursts. No one can deny you that. 

 

You think all presumed detractors are 'them' and then there's 'our group' and 'our teachings'. This is a fundamental flaw, something which may not be apparent to you now, but perhaps someday you will learn how to rise above mundane dualistic views and cultivate more equanimity to further strengthen your desire to be of real, genuine service for the good of sentient beings. 

 

CT,

 

I am talking about your uniformed posts.

 

You have no clue as to what you are talking about but have been passive aggressive with your ignorance for pages.

 

It is you sir who has shown your true colors.

 

I do hope someday you can actually be an example of that self righteousness you preach to others.

 

As an example maybe you could start by working  on yourself instead of telling everyone how you perceive them to be lacking.

 

Be the example CT.

 

Don't just tell others what to do.

 

Edited to take out the word dumbass.

Edited September 29, 2017 by Jonesboy

[Jeff]

38 minutes ago, allinone said:

Jeff,

Do your group cultivate Jing/urges? (i think urges are jing)

 

Basically you sit in a room and wait till you feel a need or desire to go somewhere and do something. So are you cultivate that force?

 

Not really cultivate the urges or emotions, more focused on the energy underneath (or driving) them.

[Apech]

30 minutes ago, allinone said:

 

the water of piss, that feeling is late to cultivate, it will accumulate there from feelings of fear, anxiety etc.

Add exitement you have also brown stuff./////////actually not late, you can use those sensations. I have, but i didn't meant those urges in my post.

 

i mean more like boredom induced, aversion etc sensations. But that is not all, there is waht matters is a common nominator,.. there is something in urge what kind of clicks or works.

--------

So also if said like sitting in a room, it is just to point out a scenario, if you can get what it means then you don't really have to separately practice.

 

 

I think I may speak for many when I say - what the hell???

[C T]

10 minutes ago, Jonesboy said:

 

CT,

 

I am talking about your uniformed dumbass posts.

 

You have no clue as to what you are talking about but have been passive aggressive with your ignorance for pages.

 

It is you sir who has shown your true colors.

 

I do hope someday you can actually be an example of that self righteousness you preach to others.

 

As an example maybe you could start by STFU, work on yourself instead of telling everyone how you perceive them to be lacking.

 

Be the example CT.

 

Don't just tell others what to do.

Well, im sorry your peace has been disturbed by your own lack of ability to remain calm. 

 

My colours are always true since my views in relation to what your group does will always be consistent, but I have no problems with maintaining mutual respect with members of the group unless such respect is of course unwelcome, which seems to be the case here. You may want to correct me on this, and will be given time to reflect before the contents will be reported for mod's consideration. 

[rene]

10 hours ago, rene said:

 

Thanks, Jeff; now I know what LU stands for! I'll peek around and if any quesions arise I'll ask over there. Cheers!

 

1 hour ago, Jeff said:

 

Also, feel free to ask over here if you want. Not a big deal either way.  

 

Jeff, hello!

 

First, kudos to you and the founders and creators of LU for trying to explain, and teach/share, the syncretic ideas around the non-dual half of the whole.

 

Skipping the forum conversations, I read the ideas on the LU website, primarily those at Level 3, and the idea to absorb self within universal is an interesting way to overcome 'either/or' - compared to the unboundaried (and my natural) path of 'Both, same time'. LU's concluding idea does seem to be a step beyond 'only non-dual' however, and that was refreshing. (-:

 

As you may recall, energy work would be extraneous for me - so the merits of such are something on which I'd have no input or opinion; nor do I have any questions.

 

What I like, though, is that you (and CT and others) all seem to have good intentions towards the benefits of others - especially with all of your futile attempts to put into (too many, lol) words that for which words dont work.

 

Thanks again for the link and best of luck on your path.

 

warm regards

[Jeff]

30 minutes ago, Jonesboy said:

 

Jeff,

 

I know you always want me to let this stuff go.

 

Just years now of this same stuff over and over again. People with no clue as to what we do, how we interact, what if anything that we teach and yet it is all dangerous.

 

You're dangerous, now prove you're not!!!

 

I will let it go at your request even with the perception that I am making baseless accusations against someone after I said I would back it up.

 

I understand and will drop it.

 

Dangerous and baseless are always relative. You need to remember that we do real shit, with real affects.  It is not like someone sitting around reading a book or playing visualization games in their own mind.  Deep subconscious fears and issues do come up, and are hopefully released (or let go), but sometimes people deep down don't really want to let go of them.  In those cases it is better to just be understanding. Do what you can, and just accept that many will not get it.  No big deal, everyone realizes stuff in their own way or their own time.

 

While Bindi is incorrect about a lot of stuff, to be fair, to someone like Bindi, I am sort of like "living kundalini". Any interaction at all with me could theoretically affect her.  It is not anything that I am doing, but more about what she is doing.  She and I have discussed this many times.

[Jonesboy]

1 minute ago, C T said:

Well, im sorry your peace has been disturbed by your own lack of ability to remain calm. 

 

My colours are always true since my views in relation to what your group does will always be consistent, but I have no problems with maintaining mutual respect with members of the group unless such respect is of course unwelcome, which seems to be the case here. You may want to correct me on this, and will be given time to reflect before the contents will be reported for mod's consideration. 

 

CT,

 

Your attacks through out this thread against a person, a group and a set of practices with no interaction or personal knowledge speaks volumes about you.

 

That is not a sign of respect.

 

We are open to questions, have thread after thread providing answers to questions.

 

Beyond just talking we also offer to demonstrate what we are talking about so that someone can experience it.

 

Now the question is, is such demonstrations dangerous?

 

From those with no experience of us, fear group energy work, fear energy work in general or who have publicly stated they have an agenda to stop us then the answer is yes.

 

You sir have been leading that bandwagon and encouraging it and you know you are ignorant of anything we do.

 

That is not mutual respect to me.

 

Maybe that is where our issues lie.. We see respect for others practices and beliefs differently.

 

You have no problem disparaging others without having any information.. just speculation.. You don't see me doing that do you....

[Bindi]

2 minutes ago, Jeff said:

 

Dangerous and baseless are always relative. You need to remember that we do real shit, with real affects.  It is not like someone sitting around reading a book or playing visualization games in their own mind.  Deep subconscious fears and issues do come up, and are hopefully released (or let go), but sometimes people deep down don't really want to let go of them.  In those cases it is better to just be understanding. Do what you can, and just accept that many will not get it.  No big deal, everyone realizes stuff in their own way or their own time.

 

I hope you're not implying that I just didn't want to let go of a deep subconscious fear by refusing to do more energy work with you.

 

2 minutes ago, Jeff said:

While Bindi is incorrect about a lot of stuff, to be fair, to someone like Bindi, I am sort of like "living kundalini". Any interaction at all with me could theoretically affect her.  It is not anything that I am doing, but more about what she is doing.  She and I have discussed this many times.

 

What am I doing that makes interaction with you affect me like 'living kundalini'?

[Jeff]

5 minutes ago, rene said:

 

 

Jeff, hello!

 

First, kudos to you and the founders and creators of LU for trying to explain, and teach/share, the syncretic ideas around the non-dual half of the whole.

 

Skipping the forum conversations, I read the ideas on the LU website, primarily those at Level 3, and the idea to absorb self within universal is an interesting way to overcome 'either/or' - compared to the unboundaried (and my natural) path of 'Both, same time'. LU's concluding idea does seem to be a step beyond 'only non-dual' however, and that was refreshing. (-:

 

As you may recall, energy work would be extraneous for me - so the merits of such are something on which I'd have no input or opinion; nor do I have any questions.

 

What I like, though, is that you (and CT and others) all seem to have good intentions towards the benefits of others - especially with all of your futile attempts to put into (too many, lol) words that for which words dont work.

 

Thanks again for the link and best of luck on your path.

 

warm regards

 

Rene,

 

Thank you for your review.  But the website itself has nothing to do with what we are discussing.  The site is actually owned by some friends who spun off from another site (AYP).  If you are interested in these topics, I would suggest that you look at the forum and posts there. Also, the forum itself is pretty quiet. Only recent posts are with an old friend from India who is huge fan of the Lotus Sutra.  All of the activity is really in the chatroom.

 

Also, I agree with you regarding words. Too many contexts, too many different meanings.  That is why our approach is to directly share.

 

Best,

Jeff

[Jonesboy]

1 minute ago, Jeff said:

 

Dangerous and baseless are always relative. You need to remember that we do real shit, with real affects.  It is not like someone sitting around reading a book or playing visualization games in their own mind.  Deep subconscious fears and issues do come up, and are hopefully released (or let go), but sometimes people deep down don't really want to let go of them.  In those cases it is better to just be understanding. Do what you can, and just accept that many will not get it.  No big deal, everyone realizes stuff in their own way or their own time.

 

While Bindi is incorrect about a lot of stuff, to be fair, to someone like Bindi, I am sort of like "living kundalini". Any interaction at all with me could theoretically affect her.  It is not anything that I am doing, but more about what she is doing.  She and I have discussed this many times.

 

I know we do Jeff.

 

It would just be nice for those with the loudest voices shouting warnings...

 

To at least have the common courtesy to find out what we are doing, to visit, to talk, to experience something of the "light group" before going on for years with thread after thread with the same old uniformed junk.

 

I understand accepting and letting it flow through.. but sometimes it is best to let the rest of the world know what they are saying is a bunch of bs. If all everyone hears is fear, danger and all we do is not respond to such things...

 

Sometimes when you can't even do a thread saying congrats to a friend without it being used to attack an entire group of people...

 

Get's old Jeff..

 

33. Jesus said, "What you will hear in your ear, in the other ear proclaim from your rooftops. After all, no one lights a lamp and puts it under a basket, nor does one put it in a hidden place. Rather, one puts it on a lampstand so that all who come and go will see its light."

 

Nor should you let others put in in a basket.

[Jeff]

1 minute ago, Bindi said:

 

I hope you're not implying that I just didn't want to let go of a deep subconscious fear by refusing to do more energy work with you.

 

My post was addressed to Tom and generic in description.

 

1 minute ago, Bindi said:

 

What am I doing that makes interaction with you affect me like 'living kundalini'?

 

You are subconsciously pretty strong energetically and sort of automatically connect to people. When a connection is established, you naturally start transmitting. This creates an energetic loop.  With me, you are better able to notice this energy flow and hence you feel stuff.  If you remember, we once discussed this in chat when it was causing you concern, and you once allowed me to temporarily dampen/calm that effect for you so that you could notice the change.

[cheya]

We just did a dive (group energy meditation, I guess we could call it) over at LU slack... 

I had a bit of steam built up from reading this morning's posts here... but still able to be mostly amused at the kafuffle...
 

But what really struck me was having the experience of showering energy pouring down from above, a continuous blessing flowing down through my body...  just an amazing space...

And then coming back over here and reading what some people think the "light practices" involve, and how dangerous they are....

Of course YMMV... but, still....
does not compute.

 

[Wizz]

29 minutes ago, allinone said:

Jeff,

Do your group cultivate Jing/urges? (i think urges are jing)

 

Basically you sit in a room and wait till you feel a need or desire to go somewhere and do something. So are you cultivate that force?

 

The energy of desire, taste, dance, sexuality and dreaming all come from the 2nd Sacral Chakra, all of these energies use the same "fuel" or force which Castaneda called the "binding force" because its the force in the universe that keeps things together so when this force gets too weak and "breaks" people die. This is why its important to work on the so called "astral body" which in Nagualism is just referred to as the "dreaming body" its the body of longevity or immortality as people call it here.

 

This is the reason I brought the question of death up since Jeff compared astral levels with the "higher" formless levels as he calls them. Death is real just as life here is and for most traditions this is a very important topic and the difference in approach is what separates them apart. In the same way people prepare for tasks in their life they should prepare for their death and afterlife or they might not end up where they originally thought they would.

 

@Jeff

The astral body is a weak subset of what you call the “soul”, the person we are discussing is well beyond such concepts of the astral body. Or you could say, the person is naturally based in the soul (your terms).

 

By "weak" do you mean its not worth developing the astral body or you are just saying that the "higher" levels are higher in comparison? 

 

Also if and when you die physically how is someone who hasn't yet reached the "higher level" supposed to get it? I'm asking this because you implied that your not doing the energy stuff I described, so how will you do it? Wouldn't it rather be fair to say and give credit to the astral body immortality in a proper supposed way since pursuing it gives you the chance to do your "light work" even in afterlife like here on Earth?

 

Also if this person is well beyond such concepts of the astral body then she or you wont have a problem of showing some advance astral skills either.

 

Finally would you agree that pursing both higher levels and astral levels would be good for people or you think otherwise?