Emotional

[allinone]

14 hours ago, Nungali said:

Well during (my) last night  I slept for a lot of it .  Now its  starting to get light .  I imagine soon it is your turn to go dark.

 

 

here doesn't get dark even if sun is set. So i wonder why there is still light when sun is fallen below the horizon. Must be the curvature tsk tsk.

[Nungali]

19 hours ago, allinone said:

 

if you could see object all sides (whatever shape) then you would not see background and therefore also not able to discern object. Object doesn't exist independently without background.

 

 

 

"Pick up a ball in your hand and grasp it ... feeling it all round, both the side you can see and the side you cannot see . Sense it with your feeling .  Now meld your sense of touch to your sight , Work on that ..

 

Also hold the ball up in front of you, now go look at yourself and the far side of the ball in a mirror.

 

 

This is also true of a flat disc ... hold it up and look at it , can you see the other side ?  Turn it flat, now its a long very thin rectangle."

 

 

 

[Nungali]

19 hours ago, allinone said:

 

here doesn't get dark even if sun is set. So i wonder why there is still light when sun is fallen below the horizon. Must be the curvature tsk tsk.

 

 

[allinone]

8 hours ago, Nungali said:

"Pick up a ball in your hand and grasp it ... feeling it all round, both the side you can see and the side you cannot see . Sense it with your feeling .  Now meld your sense of touch to your sight , Work on that ..

 

Also hold the ball up in front of you, now go look at yourself and the far side of the ball in a mirror.

 

 

This is also true of a flat disc ... hold it up and look at it , can you see the other side ?  Turn it flat, now its a long very thin rectangle."

 

 

you know about fobia of not trusting the senses. Like i can't convince myself that i closed the door or not, even if i check it numerous times. I need to swallow the sensation and accept horror of the worst ever outcome possible, end of the world then i can forget it and let go of the issue.

 

So i can't tell if the ball is round if i touch it or see it is obviously round, but if you have a gun in my head and i need to answer it then i can't tell it, because i can't be sure if it is round or not.

--

But that above i didn't meant what i tried to say. There is actual way to check that you can't tell because you can't see all sides, or touch all sides, the answer from inside doesn't rise(it would save the day), if you decide what it is from observation or any scientific method it is not true, it is false, just agreeing to that it is that shape is not the truth.

--

now remembering what is the subject. One way to tell the object is round all sides or moving is to use background, but if you not have background then there is no way to tell. If you are occupied with the object fully you can't see the background. Taking clues from brain accordingly what info is gathered there and it forms you a picture and knowledge, this knowledge is unreal.

 

Edited October 25, 2017 by allinone

[Lost in Translation]

53 minutes ago, allinone said:

you know about fobia of not trusting the senses. Like i can't convince myself that i closed the door or not, even if i check it numerous times. I need to swallow the sensation and accept horror of the worst ever outcome possible, end of the world then i can forget it and let go of the issue.

 

Let's put a pin in this... ;-)

 

53 minutes ago, allinone said:

So i can't tell if the ball is round if i touch it or see it is obviously round, but if you have a gun in my head and i need to answer it then i can't tell it, because i can't be sure if it is round or not.

--

But that above i didn't meant what i tried to say. There is actual way to check that you can't tell because you can't see all sides, or touch all sides, the answer from inside doesn't rise(it would save the day), if you decide what it is from observation or any scientific method it is not true, it is false, just agreeing to that it is that shape is not the truth.

--

now remembering what is the subject. One way to tell the object is round all sides or moving is to use background, but if you not have background then there is no way to tell. If you are occupied with the object fully you can't see the background. Taking clues from brain accordingly what info is gathered there and it forms you a picture and knowledge, this knowledge is unreal.

 

If I understand you correctly you are saying that the only real knowledge you have is what your perceptions tell you. But, your perceptions only tell you about themselves. They don't tell you about the object of perception. They tell you the ball appears round. They don't tell you the ball is round. To get to that final step requires some form of belief. But belief, no matter how certain it appears, is not quite the same as knowledge.

 

Is this what you are saying?

[allinone]

32 minutes ago, Lost in Translation said:

 

Let's put a pin in this... ;-)

 

 

If I understand you correctly you are saying that the only real knowledge you have is what your perceptions tell you. But, your perceptions only tell you about themselves. They don't tell you about the object of perception. They tell you the ball appears round. They don't tell you the ball is round. To get to that final step requires some form of belief. But belief, no matter how certain it appears, is not quite the same as knowledge.

 

Is this what you are saying?

 

Perception telling that flower is green(it doesn't tell it just discerns). Pretty same what feeling is when i touch it. I can't be convinced by that its flower. Brain is what puts things together and forms a form- it has body and mind it appears when we come introspective.

 

Yes i think you got it, but i can't be 100 percent sure hehe. So i also need think that when you ask a question then its not a sure thing too.

 

And that's what pisses me off and nerve develops and fire arises what forces me to address the problem against someone what is actually just a connection or node in different part of body, forming another path.

Edited October 25, 2017 by allinone

[Stosh]

The object, not existing without background ,, has no shape we can describe, 

it is  without a model. 

The mind concludes shape. Shape is conjecture.Though the object has some bounds. 

 

Anyone might trip over a chair in a dark room , the reality of the chair intrudes upon the model we might have , that the room is empty because we see nothing in it. 

 

This model of what exists , is an object of mind

 So there is the object itself , independent of our mind,

and a model ,which is an object of mind regarding that which is real,

( which may be inaccurate, because it is not the real thing, its just a model.)

 

If a persons model appears to be accurate regarding the prediction of future events , future findings , then we say they know what they are talking about. 

If the model , does not appear to be accurate at predicting future events in a way which fits the general understanding of physics , then we say that it is a faulty model. 

 

We expect that the ball will be round, that if turned there will be another view of it , and so even when we cannot see the other side , our model suggests it still exists.

That you feel insecure , that your model will be vindicated ( as in not being sure of the green flower) is accurate.

The flower may be white.

But all take the chance at being wrong,  coming to conclusions, and making models. 

 

 

 

 

 

[Stosh]

On 10/21/2017 at 8:00 AM, allinone said:

I can read some writings. Then feel my nerves and desire to say something something SOMETHING conservative.

Not able to articulate, to know what exactly causing it, so i keep want attacking persons who seem going somewhere.

Now i am better at acknowledging those phenomena. This also is after the fact post, but i struggled, now i did got a release by noticing i have issue. I should watch nerves and urges not other persons.

 

More free will: Less being on borderline, more stay in center.

Going somewhere accurate ,  or inaccurate? pleasant or unpleasant ? scary or confirming? 

[allinone]

1 hour ago, Stosh said:

The object, not existing without background ,, has no shape we can describe, 

it is  without a model. 

The mind concludes shape. Shape is conjecture.Though the object has some bounds. 

 

Anyone might trip over a chair in a dark room , the reality of the chair intrudes upon the model we might have , that the room is empty because we see nothing in it. 

 

This model of what exists , is an object of mind

 So there is the object itself , independent of our mind,

and a model ,which is an object of mind regarding that which is real,

( which may be inaccurate, because it is not the real thing, its just a model.)

 

If a persons model appears to be accurate regarding the prediction of future events , future findings , then we say they know what they are talking about. 

If the model , does not appear to be accurate at predicting future events in a way which fits the general understanding of physics , then we say that it is a faulty model. 

 

We expect that the ball will be round, that if turned there will be another view of it , and so even when we cannot see the other side , our model suggests it still exists.

That you feel insecure , that your model will be vindicated ( as in not being sure of the green flower) is accurate.

The flower may be white.

But all take the chance at being wrong,  coming to conclusions, and making models. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Lets say intellect is needed to invigorate the brain from a knowledge alone, formless realm. The lowest point is in head, torso not needed.

When you say there is object existing apart of what you guess there is, it is you need torso, body to confirm it.

 

[Stosh]

Data from a body is constrained by that which exists , you would encounter a wall and not be allowed to go forward.. but the body without mind is inert to arriving at conclusions, so the body cannot actually confirm or deny.

You can have ideas sentiments for which there is no bodily confirmation.

 

The mind can sometimes constrain itself. So that one acts within the limits imposed by the mind. 

So I would say No, if you were proposing that the body was required for the mind to move. And No again that the mind creates the actual reality which constrains our physical possibilities. 

[allinone]

1 hour ago, Stosh said:

Data from a body is constrained by that which exists , you would encounter a wall and not be allowed to go forward.. but the body without mind is inert to arriving at conclusions, so the body cannot actually confirm or deny.

You can have ideas sentiments for which there is no bodily confirmation.

 

you need body to have information from a world what is not mind. So if you encounter wall, then it is not mind, so it makes that mind powers like telekinesis doesn't work on inanimate objects---that would mean in order to move stone, it should grow feet and it will walk. Not sure thoughts could make the stone levitate, but never say never.

 

there is some other science. First of if i enter my own room it is a world different than a room where other people are in, despite for sure rooms made of bricks and paint, wallpaper etc point that there is one world earth.

-----

ok i am wrong, water shape can be changed with thoughts? thoughts are body too then. So not wrong.

Edited October 25, 2017 by allinone

[allinone]

ok i think my mind had nuclear meltdown and from now own i troll, so i am now just a troll.

[thelerner]

I can't get seriously involved in philosophy of existence matters unless I've had a few drinks.. then they rock. 

[Nungali]

7 hours ago, allinone said:

 

you know about fobia of not trusting the senses. Like i can't convince myself that i closed the door or not, even if i check it numerous times. I need to swallow the sensation and accept horror of the worst ever outcome possible, end of the world then i can forget it and let go of the issue.

 

So i can't tell if the ball is round if i touch it or see it is obviously round, but if you have a gun in my head and i need to answer it then i can't tell it, because i can't be sure if it is round or not.

--

But that above i didn't meant what i tried to say. There is actual way to check that you can't tell because you can't see all sides, or touch all sides,

 

 

use both hands !  

 

and a ball does not have sides ! It has a surface !

 

7 hours ago, allinone said:

 

 

 

the answer from inside doesn't rise(it would save the day), if you decide what it is from observation or any scientific method it is not true, it is false, just agreeing to that it is that shape is not the truth.

--

now remembering what is the subject. One way to tell the object is round all sides or moving is to use background, but if you not have background then there is no way to tell. If you are occupied with the object fully you can't see the background. Taking clues from brain accordingly what info is gathered there and it forms you a picture and knowledge, this knowledge is unreal.

 

 

 

[Nungali]

55 minutes ago, allinone said:

ok i think my mind had nuclear meltdown and from now own i troll, so i am now just a troll.

 

 

because too much mind, not enough feeling !

[Stosh]

1 hour ago, allinone said:

 

you need body to have information from a world what is not mind. So if you encounter wall, then it is not mind, so it makes that mind powers like telekinesis doesn't work on inanimate objects---that would mean in order to move stone, it should grow feet and it will walk. Not sure thoughts could make the stone levitate, but never say never.

 

there is some other science. First of if i enter my own room it is a world different than a room where other people are in, despite for sure rooms made of bricks and paint, wallpaper etc point that there is one world earth.

-----

ok i am wrong, water shape can be changed with thoughts? thoughts are body too then. So not wrong.

You possibly misunderstand me, I agree , that the physical world is outside the direct control of mind. 

but I claim that there is content in the mind which is not the direct result of the physical world. 

Colors do not exist. Wavelength exists. Color is an extrapolation from the data we get from the eye, The distinctions of color are an weighted averaged data presentation. related to the optic sensors behavior in response to real light, but wavelength is a continuum without distinctions like red or blue. 

 

Somehow a mind can direct our muscles to move. The energy is always there but it is subject to the mind , I conclude that mind can affect some aspect of matter, but not that mind has mechanical force. 

 

To be a troll is intending to be troublesome, otherwise one is just prompting interplay. 

[allinone]

13 hours ago, Stosh said:

You possibly misunderstand me, I agree , that the physical world is outside the direct control of mind. 

but I claim that there is content in the mind which is not the direct result of the physical world. 

Colors do not exist. Wavelength exists. Color is an extrapolation from the data we get from the eye, The distinctions of color are an weighted averaged data presentation. related to the optic sensors behavior in response to real light, but wavelength is a continuum without distinctions like red or blue. 

 

Somehow a mind can direct our muscles to move. The energy is always there but it is subject to the mind , I conclude that mind can affect some aspect of matter, but not that mind has mechanical force. 

 

To be a troll is intending to be troublesome, otherwise one is just prompting interplay. 

 

ok i am off but i think it is fine,

i think it is brain what colors, does those things. Mind is what body isn't but is dependable still on body, like recalling the path to person x home, we reflect momentarily at least once to the forehead region and even eyes usually point that direction of brain, can be verified by watching person who thinks meanwhile when explaining a route or what happened in the past, recreating a past footage of a scene.

A mind what doesn't depend on creating or forming manually a picture from a real life event anymore is after we get a feeling: the feeling originally is gotten through a dream and then in waking reality can recall that feeling. So that feeling doesn't rise from a world where body is in, but now it will be seen as a sensation from a belly instead.

 

Its also how it is annoying when a person starts explain a scenery, while i already got a feeling i know i know i say to him, and just get to the point already, skip the politics and manners.

 

The feeling gotten so hard because its what we avoid, because its the thing we keep in closet hidden and we get a feeling what rises when the closet is discovered and opened, that feeling of nakedness.

If to do it faster we need participate in circumstances what support that opening towards being having less and less things in closet, but its actually a certain feeling what we can't face yet, but when we get the feeling through a dream then we can because we see it is not real world it is in body and ours.

[Stosh]

8 minutes ago, allinone said:

 

ok i am off but i think it is fine,

i think it is brain what colors, does those things. Mind is what body isn't but is dependable still on body, like recalling the path to person x home, we reflect momentarily at least once to the forehead region and even eyes usually point that direction of brain, can be verified by watching person who thinks meanwhile when explaining a route or what happened in the past, recreating a past footage of a scene.

A mind what doesn't depend on creating or forming manually a picture from a real life event anymore is after we get a feeling: the feeling originally is gotten through a dream and then in waking reality can recall that feeling. So that feeling doesn't rise from a world where body is in, but now it will be seen as a sensation from a belly instead.

 

Its also how it is annoying when a person starts explain a scenery, while i already got a feeling i know i know i say to him, and just get to the point already, skip the politics and manners.

 

The feeling gotten so hard because its what we avoid, because its the thing we keep in closet hidden and we get a feeling what rises when the closet is discovered and opened, that feeling of nakedness.

If to do it faster we need participate in circumstances what support that opening towards being having less and less things in closet, but its actually a certain feeling what we can't face yet, but when we get the feeling through a dream then we can because we see it is not real world it is in body and ours.

Yep, that's how it appears to me , as well.  

[allinone]

15 hours ago, Nungali said:

 

 

because too much mind, not enough feeling !

 

Perhaps, but the meltdown was fine. I need think a lot to get to this point of recon i am wrong, its just a certain reaction what makes my tongue weird too. Similar like being too much time, under the sun, working.

--

whilst today, i need visit toilet every now and then, lots of water wants out.

Edited October 26, 2017 by allinone

[allinone]

8 minutes ago, Stosh said:

Yep, that's how it appears to me , as well.  

 

Nice

[Nungali]

9 hours ago, allinone said:

 

Perhaps, but the meltdown was fine. I need think a lot to get to this point of recon i am wrong, its just a certain reaction what makes my tongue weird too. Similar like being too much time, under the sun, working.

--

whilst today, i need visit toilet every now and then, lots of water wants out.

 

Elimination again?  

 

Regarding the 'trolling'; I think it is your own mind, trolling you. You are not your mind ! Important!

 

 

[allinone]

On ‎27‎.‎10‎.‎2017 at 0:30 AM, Nungali said:

 

Elimination again?  

 

Regarding the 'trolling'; I think it is your own mind, trolling you. You are not your mind ! Important!

 

 

 

Meltdown was long, including processes and today finally got my awareness/intellect back. Now using breath with having that intellect embedded to breath and can notice sensation and return to it and focus on it and it seem it is intent with desire embedded to it.

So i can see craving and can direct focus to it from the desire to act. And its not easy, i need do it and repeat it though different obstacles and events till i feel sensation on sensual organs as i open the sensation there, and lower belly.