Zeitgeist

[Wun Yuen Gong]

Check this out guys if you havent seen it already, made alot of sense in ways!

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KeZB2EsPqGE

 

Anycomments?

[sheng zhen]

Check this out guys if you havent seen it already, made alot of sense in ways!

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KeZB2EsPqGE

 

Anycomments?

I saw the first part of it.

 

I've seen several comparisons like that. If we work enough with it Im shure we can find whatever we want. Im actually a little tired of people trying to debunk chistianity. We all know it is a constructed and not the words of God. So the movie didnt shake my grounds.

 

But I have a friend who keeps telling me to watch the second part aswell. Do you think I should?

[doc benway]

I watched the whole thing a few months back - www.zeitgeistmovie.com.

I liked it. I suggested my parents watch it and they loved it - my father is still freaked out, not by the first part but by the third part.

 

Part I shows the sources of the Abrahamic religions in astrology and nature - very common sense stuff yet surprisingly compelling if you're not familiar with it. It serves the purpose of causing you to question what you tend to readily accept as the truth as being what you've been taught to believe. It asks you to be open to seeing things and reaching your own conclusions.

Part II demonstrates disturbing and inadequately explained aspects of the 9-11 attacks and asks you to question the "party line" explanations.

Part III gets into who controls the US and world economies and what their motivation, history, and potential future goals are - to me, part III was by far the most disturbing.

I think it's well worth watching.

 

PS For people who are interested in the exploration of the origins of Christianity theme, there is another well done film that borrows some footage from Zeitgeist and is called "The God Who Wasn't There." It's worth renting the DVD and listening to the extra materials which are extensions of some of the discussions in the main film.

Edited January 14, 2008 by xuesheng

[WhiteTiger]

I tried again and again to get my father to watch the whole thing. I downloaded it for free off the website. I read a little about what there saying. From my understanding (of what i read) and watching the movie. I've gathered that I don't know enough information to say i can actually believe in it or not. Or even all of it. It blows my mind so far. But the websites goals seem to be geared to have people become more aware of things happening. AND it also tries to get you to think. They stated on the website that they hope you don't take there word for what they tell you and investigate it yourself. So yeah the website seems to be made to make people think and widen there awareness of things and events that have happened.

[sheng zhen]

Part II demonstrates disturbing and inadequately explained aspects of the 9-11 attacks and asks you to question the "party line" explanations.

Part III gets into who controls the US and world economies and what their motivation, history, and potential future goals are - to me, part III was by far the most disturbing.

I think it's well worth watching.

 

Great! Sounds like Ill atleast have to watch part 3...

[doc benway]

Great! Sounds like Ill atleast have to watch part 3...

I think that there was a purposeful progression intended from Part I to II to III, in terms of getting you to distance yourself from accepted dogma and consider alternative possibilities. I'd suggest watching the whole thing. They don't try to convince you of their point of view, just stimulate you to investigate the data and reach your own conclusions.

[arnquist]

I saw this film a long time ago, it's on my list of documentaries I've enjoyed on the internet.

 

The Enemies of Reason

Root of All Evil?

Why We Fight

War Made Easy

Loose Change

Zeitgeist

Guns Germs and Steel

Fahrenheit 911

Bowling for Columbine

Michael Moore Hates America

Walmart, High Cost of Low Prices

Lifting the Veil of Polygamy

Bible vs Book of Mormon

DNA vs Book of Mormon

Dangerous Knowledge

America: Freedom to Fascism

20/20 America the Stupid

[Mal]

Thanks for the list Arnquist I'll have to check out "Michael Moore Hates America." I use to be on his mailing list till it just got a bit too much. But his doc's are very enjoyable.

 

Is "Guns germs and steel" a doc of the Jared Diamond book?

[Gerard]

I saw this film a long time ago, it's on my list of documentaries I've enjoyed on the internet.

 

The Enemies of Reason

Root of All Evil?

Why We Fight

War Made Easy

Loose Change

Zeitgeist

Guns Germs and Steel

Fahrenheit 911

Bowling for Columbine

Michael Moore Hates America

Walmart, High Cost of Low Prices

Lifting the Veil of Polygamy

Bible vs Book of Mormon

DNA vs Book of Mormon

Dangerous Knowledge

America: Freedom to Fascism

20/20 America the Stupid

 

Then you'll enjoy this a lot as well:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Corporation

 

Here's part 1:

 

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3969792790081230711

[sheng zhen]

Just finished watching Zeitgeist.

 

Not so much new things but one thing struck me as important, that I havent heard anyone talk about.

 

They said that there are no laws that makes you pay income tax i USA. Is that really true? How many of you are not paying taxes? And if it is true, how many of you are still paying taxes???

 

In norway we get 3 weeks(I think) in jail if we dont pay taxes. There is one guy in here who is famous for going to jail every year

[doc benway]

Just finished watching Zeitgeist.

 

Not so much new things but one thing struck me as important, that I havent heard anyone talk about.

 

They said that there are no laws that makes you pay income tax i USA. Is that really true? How many of you are not paying taxes? And if it is true, how many of you are still paying taxes???

 

In norway we get 3 weeks(I think) in jail if we dont pay taxes. There is one guy in here who is famous for going to jail every year

I'm no expert. I believe that there is no specific law regarding paying income tax yet there is a method to enforce tax payment and punishment if you don't pay. I don't know the specifics and I do pay taxes...

[Taoist81]

I'm no expert. I believe that there is no specific law regarding paying income tax yet there is a method to enforce tax payment and punishment if you don't pay. I don't know the specifics and I do pay taxes...

 

The "not a law" argument usually settles around the amendment allowing income tax not being "properly ratified" however, numerous precedent setting court cases have firmly established the law since. If you really want to do something about this kind of stuff, check out www.fairtax.org and www.lp.org . Do something rather than watching well put together films with lots of bad information.

[sheng zhen]

however, numerous precedent setting court cases have firmly established the law since.

Thought so.

[Pietro]

Thanks for the list Arnquist I'll have to check out "Michael Moore Hates America." I use to be on his mailing list till it just got a bit too much. But his doc's are very enjoyable.

 

Is "Guns germs and steel" a doc of the Jared Diamond book?

 

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4008293090480628280

 

It looks so. 3 google video, each 55 minutes long.

It says:

A National Geography Documentary based on the book Guns Germs and Steels.

 

I have the book, but I only read the first chapters.

I am looking forward to those 3 hours.

 

Pietro

[Smile]

Edited February 22, 2008 by Smile

[Matt]

What you might save in taxes you could end up paying in lawyer fees.

Edited February 23, 2008 by Matt

[doc benway]

Here is the problem that will make anyone a criminal breaking the law if they don't pay taxes...

..............

................

................

This PERSON was created by using our birth certificates as the MCO (manufacturer's certificate of origin) & the state in which we were born as the "port of entry". This gave fictional government a fictional PERSON with whom to deal directly. This PERSON is a straw man (strawman). ..

To continue: You are a strawman

Very interesting and well said... thanks Smile

[Smile]

I'm not sure if it was posted before here:

[WhiteTiger]

But I have a friend who keeps telling me to watch the second part aswell. Do you think I should?

 

Definately, Each part says something different to give a ending conclusion of the whole picture...

 

In the end it doesn't matter how true or untrue all of what they're saying... But it asks you specifically to question things... and actually spend time trying to understand situations... We the people (populous) base things on how deep our knowledge is instead of what people, media tells advocates us to believe... (Similar to trying to dispel ignorance.)

 

Getting into the more depth of the political things and other religious claims that i admit i don't know enough to say anything about... The truth of the matter External Politics don't claim things over you... although as long as you adhere to the system and their rules of order... in some sort of way... Then well you can be very screwed up if things this government in the U.S. was not prepared for happens... They may use that external political things they created to hold you down... and its because of our ignorance on how the system works that they trap us. (if we allow it)

Edited February 26, 2009 by WhiteTiger

[WhiteTiger]

I think that there was a purposeful progression intended from Part I to II to III, in terms of getting you to distance yourself from accepted dogma and consider alternative possibilities. I'd suggest watching the whole thing. They don't try to convince you of their point of view, just stimulate you to investigate the data and reach your own conclusions.

 

I Agree... and wonderfully put also! (I didn't even say it better when i tried!)

[Smile]

Here is an interesting article that basically says Obama failed before he even started:

 

From How Can the U.S. Economy Recover Without Manufacturing Capacity?

 

The strength of the federal economic stimulus package is seriously diluted by the fact that many of the manufactured goods that will be purchased for the attempted recovery must be imported from outside the United States. America simply doesn't make lots of things, anymore. That means many billions of dollars that folks assumed would go towards fueling an American economic comeback, will instead provide work and paychecks to employees in other countries, that still have manufacturing bases. That's fine with the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, which is dominated by large multinational corporations - the same guys that began stripping the United States of manufacturing jobs decades ago.

 

The U.S. Chamber of Commerce was one of the main lobbyists opposed to provisions that would have mandated that stimulus money go to U.S. companies. The Chamber is a U.S. organization in name only, like its finance capital comrades, the guys that gave the world such a bad case of the dreaded "American Disease," much of the planet is praying that cash-rich China will eventually bail everybody out.

The United States' lack of a manufacturing capacity makes it even less likely that anything resembling a lasting recovery can emerge from President Obama's approach to the economic crisis. The infrastructure projects that are supposed to be central to the recovery scheme are only valued at $150 billion - which is not much of a jolt, especially when much of what will have to be bought is only available in other countries, made by foreign workers. Barack Obama has put a huge emphasis on building a green economy. However, according to the

New York Times , most of the sources of solar panels and wind turbines are located in Europe and Asia. There can be no green economy without a mass transit makeover of the United States, but the U.S. hasn't made subway and light rail cars in many years. They'd have to be imported.

 

"Most of the sources of solar panels and wind turbines are located in Europe and Asia."

Every product that must be imported for the infrastructure project means a watering down of the stimulus impact of the dollars spent. You can't put people to work in American factories that don't exist.

A true national recovery effort would mean re-industrialization, on a grand scale and a green model, through massive direct federal creation of state-owned industries independent of the finance capitalists who murdered American manufacturing and then blew up their own businesses on Wall Street. But this is already nearly impossible, since President Obama is committed to saving the banking class through unlimited infusions of public money, and then allowing these reborn zombies to resume their roles as lords of development. The bankster parasites have neither the capacity nor the intention to build anything other than mountains of debt for the rest of us. Therefore, Obama's partnership with them spells doom for national recovery.

Like Billy Preston said, " Nothin' from noth in' leaves nothin'."The U.S. cannot create the conditions for economic health without rebuilding a manufacturing capacity. And the remnants of Wall Street have nothing to contribute to an economic recovery, but an infinite capacity to steal.

============

I would recommend forwarding it to any of your friends who still believes in this BS

[Dreamingawake]

The "not a law" argument usually settles around the amendment allowing income tax not being "properly ratified" however, numerous precedent setting court cases have firmly established the law since. If you really want to do something about this kind of stuff, check out www.fairtax.org and www.lp.org . Do something rather than watching well put together films with lots of bad information.

 

the "not a law" argument also stems from a true lack of a law the amendment in question

might have been ratified (as far as i know) however the supreme court has already declared that it established

NO NEW TAXING POWER and was intended to clarify the previous rules regarding taxation.

 

Many of the previous court decisions quoted as being in favor of the income tax actually say the exact opposite

when you read the whole decision instead of just the piece typically quoted.

 

The current income tax as it is written is completely constitutional however according to IRS code most

U.S. citizens do not actually qualify as "taxpayers" which is in fact a strictly and narrowly defined term.

This doesn't mean they wont still punish you if you dont pay but i've seen several cases where they raided

homes at gunpoint, confiscated personal goods and shut down businesses (in direct violation of IRS code

and the constitution of the united states) of people who had always paid. By the way these confiscations

were all before trial and nothing was returned after they were acquitted.

 

A really interesting documentary about the income tax is "freedom to fascism"

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1656880303867390173

this guy wasn't sure so he decided to ask some really educated people who you would expect to know.

my personal favorites were his interviews with Ron Paul and the ex-head of the IRS.

I dont agree with everything in it but it does make some very strong points.

 

By far the best book on taxation i've ever read is "the best kept secret" by Otto Skinner

If you really want to understand the federal income tax this book is your best bet.

It's very straight forward and sticks mostly to constitutional law and supreme court cases

in order to avoid digressing into frivolous 'legal loop-holes' an half baked arguments.

 

by the way i also still pay the IRS but it's purely a case of duress and extortion and right now

I'm just hoping that paying them will be enough to avoid the hassle. Isn't that why people used

to pay the mob 'protection' money?

[Bruce]

I watched it a while back. It makes you think if you're open minded. You don't have to agree with it, but I would suggest anyone watch it and think for themselves. Draw your own conclusions.

[genmaicha]

I finally watched it. It is definitely nicely done. However, everything is presented as if it were the definite answer and the clear and undeniable truth. I'm not so sure about that.

For example in the movie they claim that the Fed is not owned by the state, but by a group of banks, some of them even being of foreign origin. I cannot believe this. Is there anyone here who has good knowledge on this? In Germany the central bank for sure is owned by the state. I believe that this is the same in all European countries and cannot imagine it to be different in the US.

 

It is also claimed that there is no legal basis for paying income tax. Even two former IRS employees are quoted who say that they don't know of any law regarding taxes. This seems very unbelievable, too. Any tax experts?

[Ryan T.]

For example in the movie they claim that the Fed is not owned by the state, but by a group of banks, some of them even being of foreign origin. I cannot believe this.

 

Wiki says that it is "quasi-public (government entity with private components)". I take this to mean that the banks are for profit and the government steps in with regulations. Of course, most for profit entities will always be trying to wiggle around or out of regulating restraints such as what we are currently seeing with the fallout of CDOs. This tension between the two mindsets of public vs. private will always be at odds. Unfortunately, the profiteers usually seem to win at the expense of the common people.