What is the healthiest way to sleep, and for how long?

[Phoenix3]

I couldn’t find anything by searching.

[Gerard]

1. Before pericardium channel starts to become active you need to be as Yin as possible (sleep or meditation). So this is right before 7pm; it starts and runs up to 9pm but like all organ networks peaks one hour later (mixed up with the organ that is already active, san jiao/triple burner in this case); that is, from 9 to 10pm.

 

2. Early morning workouts (active energy work, like IMA, post standing or walking meditation) are highly beneficial since the Wood (liver) network is most active which in turn greatly nourishes its child (Fire/Heart). This means practicing from 3am to 7am followed by a copious and nutritious breakfast since the Stomach Channel (Yang Earth) has already been activated and therefore your digestion and absorption of nutrients (Gu Qi/Qi of food) will be optimal.

 

3. Early to bed, early to get up.

 

 

Edited November 24, 2017 by Gerard

[oak]

1 hour ago, Phoenix3 said:

I couldn’t find anything by searching.

 

I'm searching for years for something about that position teenagers use for sleeping, some study, something and couldn't even find its name. I know it was the position paramedics would put the patients into in emergencies some decades ago.

[Cheshire Cat]

There is a saying in daoism "Sit like a tortoise, walk like a pigeon and sleep like a dog".

 

There's a peculiar stretch performed by the dog before going to sleep, there's an ability to relax on hard surfaces, there's a certain alertness... not to mention that my dog goes to sleep at 9:00 PM 

[thelerner]

On 11/23/2017 at 11:50 PM, oak said:

 

I'm searching for years for something about that position teenagers use for sleeping, some study, something and couldn't even find its name. I know it was the position paramedics would put the patients into in emergencies some decades ago.

On the side is healthier then the back.  I've heard right side is better for the heart (it's up), on the left side is better for digestion (acids stays lower** and might be more for midday siesta digesting then sleep).  I don't know about teens, but for anyone incapacitated (read drugs, alcohol..) putting them on there side is very important to keep them from choking if they vomit.  (one of the many things learned from Breaking Bad)

Edited November 25, 2017 by thelerner

[oak]

In this thread some members shared some interesting suggestions 

 

6 hours ago, thelerner said:

  I don't know about teens, 

 

Let me try to describe the posture: They lie on their stomach with the head turned right, the right arm and right leg bent, and the left arm and left leg streched. As it is something universal and instinctive (like child's posture) I think that there must be something to it.

[thelerner]

I was going to write something humorous like, 'I didn't know they slept at all;, but the way you describe it.. I remember sleeping that way

[dawei]

1. Don't sleep on your heart (left side sleeping)

2. Figure out if sleeping on your back is good or not... may depend on bed and comfort issues

3. If you are sleeping with another by your side, how often do you fall asleep with them in your arms?

4. Count backwards from 100.   100 is your head/crown... as you count downward, see/feel energy move downward and empty each space just left to the lower area.  

 

Without an idea of your lifestyle or obsessions, this is what I would suggest.

[Phoenix3]

 

3 hours ago, oak said:

Let me try to describe the posture: They lie on their stomach with the head turned right, the right arm and right leg bent, and the left arm and left leg streched. As it is something universal and instinctive (like child's posture) I think that there must be something to it.

 

That’s strange. Almost every source say sleeping on one’s stomach is the worst position, yet i like doing it.

 

15 minutes ago, dawei said:

 

1. Don't sleep on your heart (left side sleeping)

2. Figure out if sleeping on your back is good or not... may depend on bed and comfort issues

3. If you are sleeping with another by your side, how often do you fall asleep with them in your arms?

4. Count backwards from 100.   100 is your head/crown... as you count downward, see/feel energy move downward and empty each space just left to the lower area.  

 

 

This website says sleeping on your right is bad for the heart though, and sleeping on the left is bad for the digestive system:

http://www.medicaldaily.com/sleeping-positions-stay-healthy-best-and-worst-ways-sleep-during-night-296714

 

It’s very hard for me to sleep on my back. I don’t know why.

 

Is falling asleep with an object or a person in your arms a bad thing? I like to put two pillows lengthways beside me, and hold it and pretend it’s a girlfriend/wife sometimes >_<

 

Also, why empty space with energy to just the left of the body? Why not the entirety of the body?

[oak]

46 minutes ago, Phoenix3 said:

Is falling asleep with an object or a person in your arms a bad thing? I like to put two pillows lengthways beside me, and hold it and pretend it’s a girlfriend/wife sometimes >_<

 

I guess you have to find out what works for you and trust your senses. If the pillows help you stop thinking and relax that is great. Sometimes I sleep with a bag of hot water just because it helps me stop thinking.

 

Two postures that I also use to become mindful before I sleep are the starfish and the buddhist laying posture.

[Phoenix3]

I find buddhist techniques unhelpful in regards to sleep because most buddhist exercises and meditations are designed to prevent one from falling asleep while in position. 

 

I always liked sleeping on my stomach, despite most people saying it is unhealthy, and I hate sleeping on my back, even though most people say it’s healthy. Your description on sleeping on the stomach made me curious, so I’ll try it tonight

[oak]

38 minutes ago, Phoenix3 said:

 

 

 I hate sleeping on my back, even though most people say it’s healthy. 

 

I can't sleep laying on my back either. No problem with that. 

 

 

Edited November 25, 2017 by oak

[oak]

39 minutes ago, Phoenix3 said:

I find buddhist techniques unhelpful in regards to sleep because most buddhist exercises and meditations are designed to prevent one from falling asleep while in position. 

 

The idea is to relax in them (they help you stop the monkey mind) and then go to sleep in some more confortable position.

[Taomeow]

The "sleeping Buddha"position  is not buddhist in its origin, but taoist, comes from taiji (the supreme ultimate, not taijiquan the martial art), and a better version of it is reputed to be the pose in which taoist immortals occasionally sleep for indefinite stretches of time when they have nothing better to do or when they practice sleeping arts -- up to four hundred to one thousand years.  Let me respectfully correct the buddha who got a few details of this pose wrong:

 

1.The bottom arm should not be compressed by your neck or head, this impairs circulation.  Instead it has to be rounded naturally and rest near your cheek but not under it.  It may need a small pillow of its own.  The top arm is correct.

 

2. The top leg shouldn't overhang the bottom one, its foot should not be hanging unsupported because this, again, creates circulation difficulties.  Instead, it has to be bent a bit more (not a bit less as is the case with the statue) than the bottom one, and the foot of the top leg must rest just above the ankle of the bottom one.  

 

3. The part the buddha got right is that he is positioned on a flat unyielding surface.  You won't be able to pull it off on a spring mattress, e.g.., the whole structure will sag and you won't be comfortable.  So, this is for a surface as firm as what the statue rests on.  Very little padding, only enough for you to have some buffer between the hard surface and your own bones so there's no uncomfortable pressure.

 

4. Instead of the arm under the neck/head, a sausage-shaped hard(ish) pillow goes under the neck, or the kind that supports both the neck and the head (indented in the middle, a bit toroid).  A Chinese immortal would in all likelihood just use a wooden log under the neck.  No need to be this extreme, but the pillow must have structural integrity and leave your face well alone.  Either a buckwheat husks or silk fiber stuffed pillow works well (and, in my experience, nothing else).    

 

 

Edited November 25, 2017 by Taomeow

[Phoenix3]

1 hour ago, Apeiron&Peiron said:

 

  Hide contents

 

 

I’m going to sleep by trying the first position

 

edit: I just tried it and it’s too uncomfortable. My left hand is on my left knee, but the elbow cant find a stable place so just hangs there, eventually causing my left hand to slip off the knee. Keeping my left foot’s toes in contact with the right foot’s heel requires some attention too, otherwise it slips too.

 

i’ll try the Taiji method now 

Edited November 25, 2017 by Phoenix3

[silent thunder]

I freaking love sleep!

 

My wife ribs me routinely and giggles often at my rather involved relationship with pillows and posture while sleeping, (I have up to eight pillows that I use in various combinations).  You know how a dog circles around before she sleeps... it's very similar to watch me set up and place my pillows as I nestle down. 

 

Last ten years or so, I always sleep on my sides during the night and on my back during the day.  No idea why my body prefers this, but I long since stopped questioning and ignoring the very clear signals and now recognize and follow the wisdom of my body and simply comply to its cues with gratitude and benefit.  I adore sleep these days and am gladly reclaiming all the sleep I fended off when I was 3-37.

 

When I sleep in the day, I drop deeply into sleep in moments on my back in free fall gravity position and it is glorious.  Knees are supported by three pillows two under my knees and one under the feet, that lift my legs up in a gentle arc above the heart level.  My head rests on a small, very firm pillow that follows the contour of the back of my neck/head so the head peers every so gently upward.  My arms 9/10 times are up over the head in victory pose, but arching out wide to the sides, cradled in two soft pillows... once in a while the arms will tell me they want to be by my sides... in this case the upper arms rest on the bed and the two pillows move down to the waist area, and my hands rest on those creating a gentle arch.

 

side note: whenever I have straight arms or tightly bent arms my body will wake me quickly saying, 'curve that shit up mate... yer stifling flow'. 

 

At night, I sleep on my sides.  I always start on my right side and then rotate back and forth.  I have two pillows under my head to straighten the spine... the firm contour pillow I mentioned earlier is not tall enought to keep my head/neck straight, so I top it with a softer down pillow that yields at first, then when compressed holds my head in a cup that supports it and gently cups the limbs, helping to hold them in place.  I roll and shape the soft pillow until my face is free and my neck straight.

 

Next I have two large down pillows that I hug along my chest to rest my upper arm on and to spread and keep the chest wide open.  This is absolutely paramount.  If I do not support the upside arm, my chest compresses and stifles breathing, waking me soon.

 

Two more pillows between the legs, again paramount for me.  One between the thighs and one between the feet in a T shape, so my upper foot can slide forward or back as it wants while supported keeping the leg bones in line with the hips.  This opens the hips wonderfully and my body gently hums with soft gratitude when I get it right.

 

When I wake.  I simply roll over, carrying my chest pillows with me, reset and clear my face and I'm back to sleep in moments.

 

We long ago got rid of spring mattresses.  Metal spring mattresses are abhorrent to me by nature.  I prefer the floor to those things.  And my wife broke several vertabrae in her spine some twenty years ago and spring mattresses are akin to a torture chamber for her.  We use an air chamber/sleep number bed, so she can adjust it as her needs shift.  My side of the bed is always pumped up a good 30 seconds after it reaches its maximum 100 setting for firmness.

 

I highly recommend the book Tibetan Yogas of Dream and Sleep by Tenzin Wangyal Rinpoche.  Sleep used to be something I avoided and tried to do without all too often in my fiery youth.  Now, it is an integral and foundational part of my process and an active part of my energy work, in dreams.

 

[dawei]

On 11/24/2017 at 9:53 PM, Phoenix3 said:

This website says sleeping on your right is bad for the heart though, and sleeping on the left is bad for the digestive system:

http://www.medicaldaily.com/sleeping-positions-stay-healthy-best-and-worst-ways-sleep-during-night-296714

 

It’s very hard for me to sleep on my back. I don’t know why.

 

Is falling asleep with an object or a person in your arms a bad thing? I like to put two pillows lengthways beside me, and hold it and pretend it’s a girlfriend/wife sometimes >_<

 

Also, why empty space with energy to just the left of the body? Why not the entirety of the body?

 

I'd drop books and internet on this... you need to sleep each night and can test it for yourself.  That is my main point.  Find some feeling.  

 

For myself, as my chakras are somewhat realized, if I lay on my left side, my heart feels the pressure.  The right side resides better.  I can't sleep on my back so easy due to a back problem.

 

I personally use 3 pillows: for head, shoulder/arm, and between legs to ease hip rotation.

 

I prefer, over all of this to just hug my wife because within 2 seconds, I begin to internally melt (every muscle relaxes).

 

When I said to empty space with energy,  I mean you are moving / breathing / releasing energy downward through the entire body.  If you want to try a standing up version, imagine oil pouring down your crown... it will point over all four sides... and yet, we also imagine the internal energy moving downward with the oil flowing over the outside of the body...  move it down from crown to sole, and then outside of the body without any ending (ie: till you fall asleep).

[Gerard]

Meditate, meditate, meditate, meditate, meditate, meditate, meditate, meditate, meditate, meditate, meditate, meditate, meditate, meditate, meditate, meditate...

 

And:

 

This is what you should do: do not get angry, do not lay down during the day, and always retire your body but not your shen. The essence of sleep, after all, is the soul of the body. If you can manage to sleep little, then the master mind will be bright and alert. Not only will your shen qi be flowing freely and purely, but you will also not be disturbed by dreams. Every time you are overcome by a craving for sleep, blood rushes to the heart and the original shen is forced to leave its abode. The clouds then cast a gloomy shadow over the heavenly realm of spirit, and the shen itself will grow dim and unconscious just like its domicile.

 

The Daoist master Zhang Sanfeng once said: 'Grasp the dream in the dream; behold the darkness within the darkness. Since I saw the face of the girl, I can happily view the paradise, Penglai, right in front of my eyes. This is precisely what I mean! The Neijing , furthermore, states: 'The three months of spring are the period of commencement; heaven and earth are born, and all living things are flourishing. Get up early in the morning, walk around in the courtyard, loosen your hair and relax your body. By doing so you will generate mental strength and act in harmony with the qi of spring, thus following the way of nourishing life. If you live contrary to this principle, you will harm your liver.' Everybody should be aware of this basic principle.

 

http://www.itmonline.org/5organs/liver.htm

 

Edited November 27, 2017 by Gerard

[Gerard]

Also run this flush at the end of spring, when the Wood peaks, every year in order to keep the liver and gb in good health:

 

https://healthybliss.net/gallstone-liver-flush-recipe-cleanse-info/

 

The first time I did it it was incredible, it took me 6 flushes to get rid of accumulated gallstones after living the life of an ordinary human.

 

Good luck, Wood Dog!

[MooNiNite]

11 hours ago, Gerard said:

Get up early in the morning, walk around in the courtyard, loosen your hair and relax your body. By doing so you will generate mental strength and act in harmony with the qi of spring, thus following the way of nourishing life. If you live contrary to this principle, you will harm your liver.' Everybody should be aware of this basic principle.

 

http://www.itmonline.org/5organs/liver.htm

 

 

Is he saying that if you dont wake up early, your liver will be damaged over time?

[Wayfarer]

The answer is easy...

 

Become a parent, have a few kids, have no time to practise Qigong, get kept up all night with various demands, problems, nightmares.  Wake looking like a bloodhound. Rush around getting breakfast and school things ready while dreaming about Zuowang sitting and forgetting.  Collapse in a chair - wake a few hours later wondering where the morning has gone.

 

Then you soon begin to realise how much sleep you need, and what's the healthiest way to do it...here is the answer...

 

Grab any you can get - hope it won't be interrupted - get through 7 hours full and jump with joy - healthiest way?  Close eyes, close ears, remove all distractions - sleep.

 

 

 

[Taomeow]

 

.

Edited November 28, 2017 by Taomeow

[silent thunder]

I wear an eye mask to cut ambient light the last few years as well. 

It's easier than getting thicker drapes and I love me my darkness.

(stupid cities and their endless night lights...)

[oak]

for me it works like a charm...

 

 

[KuroShiro]

On 11/24/2017 at 4:56 PM, thelerner said:

On the side is healthier then the back.  I've heard right side is better for the heart (it's up), on the left side is better for digestion (acids stays lower** and might be more for midday siesta digesting then sleep).  I don't know about teens, but for anyone incapacitated (read drugs, alcohol..) putting them on there side is very important to keep them from choking if they vomit.  (one of the many things learned from Breaking Bad)

 

 

I've read that one should sleep on the right side or on one's back. Sleeping on the right side is better (than left) for the heart because it's uncompressed and better for the liver too as it receives more blood.

 

 

 

On 11/25/2017 at 4:49 AM, Taomeow said:

3. The part the buddha got right is that he is positioned on a flat unyielding surface.  You won't be able to pull it off on a spring mattress, e.g.., the whole structure will sag and you won't be comfortable.  So, this is for a surface as firm as what the statue rests on.  Very little padding, only enough for you to have some buffer between the hard surface and your own bones so there's no uncomfortable pressure.

 

4. Instead of the arm under the neck/head, a sausage-shaped hard(ish) pillow goes under the neck, or the kind that supports both the neck and the head (indented in the middle, a bit toroid).  A Chinese immortal would in all likelihood just use a wooden log under the neck.  No need to be this extreme, but the pillow must have structural integrity and leave your face well alone.  Either a buckwheat husks or silk fiber stuffed pillow works well (and, in my experience, nothing else).    

 

 

 

 

 

3. I know that a spring mattress can be killer, this summer I woke up with pain on my spine while sleeping on my back on an hotel bed. However last year I've searched extensively in search of the perfect base to sleep on and I had settled on a Scandinavian type bed. Only natural materials and steel springs assembled to keep the spine straight while sleeping on one's side (don't know if it also works while sleeping on your back):

 

 

 

Now you're saying it's better to sleep on a flat unyielding surface inducing doubt again

 

Can you maintain a straight spine while sleeping (on the side) on a hard surface with very little padding?

 

 

4. Are you saying your face/head would be in an overhang while sleeping, with the head only supported in the neck?