Are Secrets Really Necessary . . . (?)

[exorcist_1699]

Blaming modern Taoists of hiding  the secret for  attaining immortality is not so fair,  at least books  written in the Ching  Dynasty and the Nationalist period ( 1911-1949 ) are already very explicit . That means,  most of original secrets are now  in black and white ;  the  prevailing   reproach  from the West is  somewhat biased or  mainly due to the fact that most of  these  books are  either  unknown to the West or have not been  translated into English , which then is not solely the responsibility of  the Chinese Taoists.  Notice  that these books are mostly written in classical Chinese, and they are , of course ,  much better than any books published in the West in recent decades  ( students of acupuncture or  traditional Chinese medicine likely understand  what I claim..) ;  anyway ,  apart from  those  books from the Wu-Liu schools and those from Zhao Bi Chen,  which are known to some members of this forum ,  the following books are worthy of paying attention  to :

 

- 大成捷要 ( Da Cheng Jie Yao)

 

- 補虧正法

 

- 地仙玄門秘訣

 

- 養真集

 

- 樂育堂語錄

 

You can 'baidu ' them to get a copy .

[KuroShiro]

6 hours ago, exorcist_1699 said:

Blaming modern Taoists of hiding  the secret for  attaining immortality is not so fair,  at least books  written in the Ching  Dynasty and the Nationalist period ( 1911-1949 ) are already very explicit . That means,  most of original secrets are now  in black and white ;  the  prevailing   reproach  from the West is  somewhat biased or  mainly due to the fact that most of  these  books are  either  unknown to the West or have not been  translated into English , which then is not solely the responsibility of  the Chinese Taoists.  Notice  that these books are mostly written in classical Chinese, and they are , of course ,  much better than any books published in the West in recent decades  ( students of acupuncture or  traditional Chinese medicine likely understand  what I claim..) ;  anyway ,  apart from  those  books from the Wu-Liu schools and those from Zhao Bi Chen,  which are known to some members of this forum ,  the following books are worthy of paying attention  to :

 

- 大成捷要 ( Da Cheng Jie Yao)

 

- 補虧正法

 

- 地仙玄門秘訣

 

- 養真集

 

- 樂育堂語錄

 

You can 'baidu ' them to get a copy .

 

Can you please translate the titles and tell us who wrote them?

Are they available to be read online even if it's only in Chinese?

Do you know how many books did Zhao Bi Chen write?

 

Didn't know baidu thanks, it's Chinese search engine?

Edited April 28, 2018 by KuroShiro

[9th]

Books could provide you with perhaps about the final 5% of what you need to actually accomplish such a task.

 

The vast majority is not revealed by the study of texts unless it is under direct supervision of someone who has already accomplished what you are trying to do.

[exorcist_1699]

On 29/04/2018 at 6:01 AM, KuroShiro said:

 

Can you please translate the titles and tell us who wrote them?

Are they available to be read online even if it's only in Chinese?

Do you know how many books did Zhao Bi Chen write?

 

Didn't know baidu thanks, it's Chinese search engine?

 

"Baidu "  ( "百度") is  the Chinese Google. Its name likely comes  from the  famous poem  : "  眾裏尋他千百度.. ".

 

Although Zhao Bi Chen is said to have written several books,  the only one we can now find  is " 性命法訣明指" .

All mentioned books can be  found online as said.

Edited April 30, 2018 by exorcist_1699

[9th]

Books are the dead trappings of a living teaching.  Dust on the road, so to speak.

 

Lets get back to the topic of OWN-ER-SHIP... shall we?

[blue eyed snake]

those who know own,

those who don't know often want ' secrets' for free.

 

knowledge comes through training.

[liminal_luke]

43 minutes ago, blue eyed snake said:

those who know own,

those who don't know often want ' secrets' for free.

 

knowledge comes through training.

 

succinctly and beautifully said

[Mig]

On 4/10/2018 at 7:27 PM, 9th said:

 

I dont agree with this perspective.  In most martial arts of todays world, the exclusively traditional ways are very few and far between.  Actual fighting techniques have continued to evolve along with the fighters that practice them, incorporating various ideas and knowledge from many forms.  Thats why MMA is so popular - it is literally the future of martial arts.  Bruce Lee is still the most popular modern example.

 

 

Is that really a fight? It was better than the kumite type but not close to a fight or street fight

[DaoKeeper]

On 4/27/2018 at 1:40 PM, Michael Sternbach said:

Instructor: "Because they are too dangerous."

Me: "Well, they are hardly more dangerous than a gun. And that's something that, in a number of states, any of his students could buy at Walmart!"

Instructor: "Hmm, yes, but he would not be the one who sold it to them."

 

Okay, fair enough. The question of personal liability.

Hello Michael.
Thank you for this story.
I'd like to notice that knife fighting technique might not only include work with the knife. It may also keep more internal aspects of self-cultivation. And THESE might be really dangerous for other people.
Like for instance the behavior of that person would change so that he will become dangerous regardless if he has a knife

[Michael Sternbach]

44 minutes ago, DaoKeeper said:

Hello Michael.
Thank you for this story.
I'd like to notice that knife fighting technique might not only include work with the knife. It may also keep more internal aspects of self-cultivation. And THESE might be really dangerous for other people.
Like for instance the behavior of that person would change so that he will become dangerous regardless if he has a knife

 

Hi DaoSeeker

 

Self-cultivation in martial arts - the way I understand the term - should lead to you becoming a more balanced and considerate individual overall. Quite the opposite of a loose gun.

 

But maybe you refer to the kind of conditioning that makes you react to a certain stimulus in a particular way. While this is a crucial aspect of functional self-defence training, it can indeed be problematic, not only in regards to knives and other weapons, but even to empty-handed techniques. E.g., it is irresponsible for an instructor to drill a neck break as an automatic reaction to a grab to the wrist. Only under the most dire of circumstances such a technique becomes viable.

 

Some might say, "we only do that kind of thing as a method of practice, we are aware that in real application, this wouldn't be acceptable". The problem with that way of thinking is that, in a self-defence situation, when split seconds count, even experienced martial artists don't necessarily react in the most reasonable manner, but tend to default to what they have trained the most. (Trust me on this, I speak from personal experience.)

 

So also with a knife, you should only train methods that are adequate for the level of threat present in a given scenario. Bearing in mind that there are non-lethal ways to use a knife as well.

 

[DaoKeeper]

On 9/15/2018 at 4:11 PM, Michael Sternbach said:

But maybe you refer to the kind of conditioning that makes you react to a certain stimulus in a particular way. While this is a crucial aspect of functional self-defence training, it can indeed be problematic, not only in regards to knives and other weapons, but even to empty-handed techniques

Yes, that is exactly what I was saying.
I was talking also about the things which are preferred to be kept as a secret in the MA Schools. AFAIK not a single true martial artist who attained Master Skill will teach ALL the secrets he knows. Always keeping something which makes him more powerful than the students 
Why is that? Well, too simple - to not allow bastards to steal the techniques.
Only after the disciple is "tested" it is possible for the Teacher to hand over the Tradition.
---
IMHO all the above