Fa Xin Posted June 7, 2018 (edited) Furthermore, while I do feel that residing in this awareness is the key to the unfolding we’re talking about.... it can take a long time for it to stabilize... but this just brings us back to the age old “sudden vs gradual realization” debate among Buddhists and others (my personal opinion is both are experienced at various points). Since we are all awareness, though... none of it really matters... we all return there eventually 🙂 Edited June 7, 2018 by Fa Xin 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dwai Posted June 7, 2018 (edited) 10 hours ago, Fa Xin said: Furthermore, while I do feel that residing in this awareness is the key to the unfolding we’re talking about.... it can take a long time for it to stabilize... but this just brings us back to the age old “sudden vs gradual realization” debate among Buddhists and others (my personal opinion is both are experienced at various points). Since we are all awareness, though... none of it really matters... we all return there eventually 🙂 Yes....it is a matter of abiding and residing as this awareness. That's why awakening is not that big a deal. Not falling back asleep can be avoided if we stay vigilant. But staying vigilant is not "hard work" per se. Once the identification with the awareness is done, it becomes progressively effortless to remain in abidance imho. That's why the sages all say "do nothing". From the perspective of awareness there is no effort needed at all. Only the personality-body-mind feels it has to put in effort. Another great misconception about "No Mind" is that the expectation is that the mind will stop (as in Kevala Nirvikalpa samādhī). Once cannot stay in that ceased mind state forever. The mind of the jnani is a free mind, unentangled and unencumbered. It is the non-grasping mind. The mind is not separate from awareness -- in fact, nothing is separate from awareness. The Ego is not separate from awareness. They both rise from and sink back into awareness. Edited June 7, 2018 by dwai 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jetsun Posted June 8, 2018 I read an article about Nisargadatta the other day about how all the students would go and sit with him for meditation sessions where they sat as awareness, nothing do be done once you have moved beyond the I-AM except reside. But then also Nisargadatta would do devotional singing and Bhajan sessions which the Westerners often wouldn't attend, but those who did attend knew that it was in the active sessions in devotion where you got all the juice, and both types were important. How to bring the peace of our true nature into all the deep pockets of separation within us is the question, sometimes that does involve activity and intention in my experience, Bhajans and devotional singing appears to be a time honoured way to help this. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dwai Posted June 8, 2018 4 hours ago, Jetsun said: I read an article about Nisargadatta the other day about how all the students would go and sit with him for meditation sessions where they sat as awareness, nothing do be done once you have moved beyond the I-AM except reside. But then also Nisargadatta would do devotional singing and Bhajan sessions which the Westerners often wouldn't attend, but those who did attend knew that it was in the active sessions in devotion where you got all the juice, and both types were important. How to bring the peace of our true nature into all the deep pockets of separation within us is the question, sometimes that does involve activity and intention in my experience, Bhajans and devotional singing appears to be a time honoured way to help this. Devotion is a natural outcome of awakening imho. It is pure and unconditional love. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jetsun Posted June 8, 2018 37 minutes ago, dwai said: Devotion is a natural outcome of awakening imho. It is pure and unconditional love. In one sense devotion is easier before awakening, because you have a separate object to be devoted to. Awakening in an annihilation of this duality so in one sense devotion is absurd from that perspective as you are basically worshipping yourself, yet it seems to be what goes on. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dwai Posted June 8, 2018 (edited) 3 hours ago, Jetsun said: In one sense devotion is easier before awakening, because you have a separate object to be devoted to. Awakening in an annihilation of this duality so in one sense devotion is absurd from that perspective as you are basically worshipping yourself, yet it seems to be what goes on. Agreed. However, given that true devotion is unconditional love, there is that aspect to think of too. If a devotee is able to love his/her object of devotion with unconditional love, they will wake up Edited June 8, 2018 by dwai Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cueball Posted June 9, 2018 (edited) On the subject of nothing to do, no one to do it after experiencing an 'awakening'... the situation could be quite the opposite: Quote "Look at someone like Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche. No-one would question that his realisation was higher than anyone’s, and yet day and night he would recite prayers and mantras and do his practice. And he was inseparable from Vimalamitra! Look at the kind of effort that he put into his practice. Then there are others who just don’t do very much of that at all. They just sit there with their mouths open.On one occasion, I asked Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche, “Is it necessary for someone with realization to recite prayers and mantras?” And he replied, “Someone who has that kind of realisation is like space. What harm could recitation possibly do to space?” And he continued, “To recite even a single mani mantra, or to recite the Vajra Guru mantra a few times, is only going to help. It’s not going to hurt, is it?”Orgyen Tobgyal Rinpoche Edited June 9, 2018 by Cueball 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
