silent thunder Posted June 25, 2018 whole... part... all are one. For me the whole is reflected in each part... they are never separate. As above, so below... as within, without. Where our focus lies... determines what our conscious mind plays with and creates stories around... but we are never separate from Dao, no matter what we call ourselves, or what we call 'the dao'. Source is source. Dao/source in this light mirrors in a holographic presence in each particle of the manifest and the void of non-form. The ephemeral, gossamer, intangible source of all manifest and non manifest is everywhere saturated. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lost in Translation Posted June 25, 2018 56 minutes ago, silent thunder said: whole... part... all are one. "He he, he he. You said 'hole'." 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Limahong Posted June 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Lost in Translation said: You said w'hole'. Hi Lost in Translation, - LimA Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Slim Posted June 29, 2018 What do you guys/girls think about the traditional Chinese view that a Taoist is anyone who is working as a Taoist? It's vocational instead of philosophical. For example running a Taoist shrine would make you a Taoist. The folks showing up to offer incense or mediate would not be considered Taoist, no matter how into it they are. I'm not saying that none of us can call ourselves Taoists, just think it's interesting to consider Taoist identity from the historical perspective. And identity gets so messy. Often practitioners would themselves identify with their lineage/teacher more than being Taoist. I am a student of this or that guy more than being Taoist or Buddhist. And then the nature of Taoist identity is always changing through the ages. In the Tang Taoist identity is pretty tight, loosens in the Song/Yuan, then tightens up after that. For example Li Daochun a famous alchemist from the Song/Yuan era doesn't seem comfortable calling himself a Taoist; I'm just some dude who is interested in spiritual cultivation however defined. Then in the Ming/Qing it seems practitioners are more into the Taoist label. But still lineage is their central identifying characteristic. I guess it makes sense from the Chinese perspective to plop everyone down into their social network. The Chinese love family. So instead of coming up with a philosophical distinction they use a social one. Who I am is who I am related to and what I do for society. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lost in Translation Posted June 29, 2018 14 minutes ago, Nathan Brine said: What do you guys/girls think about the traditional Chinese view that a Taoist is anyone who is working as a Taoist? This just re-frames the question. Now one must ask "How does one work as a Taoist?", which further re-frames the question to "Who is authorized to grant work as a Taoist?" Pretty soon we're back where we started. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted June 29, 2018 I think that anyone who has the basic principles of Taoism as their personal philosophy, regardless of any other attachments, could be called a Taoist. 3 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lost in Translation Posted June 29, 2018 2 minutes ago, Marblehead said: I think that anyone who has the basic principles of Taoism as their personal philosophy, regardless of any other attachments, could be called a Taoist. Taoist: n; Anyone who self-describes as a Taoist. See Taoism. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Taoist Texts Posted June 29, 2018 9 hours ago, Nathan Brine said: What do you guys/girls think about the traditional Chinese view that a Taoist is anyone who is working as a Taoist? It is a correct view. Provided that the guy/girl in question is a traditional Chinese. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted June 29, 2018 13 minutes ago, Taoist Texts said: It is a correct view. Provided that the guy/girl in question is a traditional Chinese. Racist! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Limahong Posted June 29, 2018 10 minutes ago, Marblehead said: Racist! Hi Dada-da, A racist Taoist practises Taoism within a circle and four perfect squares? - LimA Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted June 29, 2018 But the perfect square has no corners. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Limahong Posted June 29, 2018 2 minutes ago, Marblehead said: But the perfect square has no corners. Hi Dada-da, My racist Taoist friend says there are 16 corners in his squared Taoism. Count yourself... - LimA Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted June 29, 2018 I can't count myself. I'm not square and I have no corners. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Limahong Posted June 29, 2018 5 minutes ago, Marblehead said: I can't count myself. Hi Dada-da, You are lucky - ignorance is bliss. My racist Taoist friend is color blind. - LimA 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Stosh Posted June 29, 2018 3 hours ago, Taoist Texts said: It is a correct view. Provided that the guy/girl in question is a traditional Chinese. Boooo , hisss 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wandelaar Posted June 29, 2018 There are no correct or incorrect definitions. But some definitions correspond to common usage and others don't. And common usage may vary from one country to another (or if one wants to be absolutely precise even from one person to another). So asking for the real Taoist to stand up is sure to end in chaos or heated debate. Better to define the different types of Taoists in rather broad categories and leave it at that. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Taoist Texts Posted June 29, 2018 (edited) 13 hours ago, Nathan Brine said: And then the nature of Taoist identity is always changing through the ages. In the Tang Taoist identity is pretty tight, loosens in the Song/Yuan, then tightens up after that. Some quotes would have been helpful. " For example Li Daochun a famous alchemist from the Song/Yuan era doesn't seem comfortable calling himself a Taoist; " Well, he was comfy enough to call himself "Pure Tao", so... Edited June 29, 2018 by Taoist Texts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted June 29, 2018 54 minutes ago, Taoist Texts said: Some quotes would have been helpful. " For example Li Daochun a famous alchemist from the Song/Yuan era doesn't seem comfortable calling himself a Taoist; " Well, he was comfy enough to call himself "Pure Tao", so... We will call that arrogance. Anything in the Manifest cannot be "Pure Tao". Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lost in Translation Posted June 29, 2018 1 hour ago, Taoist Texts said: Some quotes would have been helpful. " For example Li Daochun a famous alchemist from the Song/Yuan era doesn't seem comfortable calling himself a Taoist; " Well, he was comfy enough to call himself "Pure Tao", so... We're there any political reasons at that time where calling oneself a Taoist would have been unwise? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Limahong Posted June 29, 2018 (edited) 17 hours ago, Marblehead said: I think that anyone who has the basic principles of Taoism as their personal philosophy, regardless of any other attachments, could be called a Taoist. Hi Dada-da, For example - wu wei as attached. - LimA Edited June 29, 2018 by Limahong Enhance ... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted June 29, 2018 42 minutes ago, Limahong said: Hi Dada-da, For example - wu wei as attached. - LimA That's one of the principles. But yeah. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Limahong Posted June 29, 2018 9 minutes ago, Marblehead said: But yeah. Hi Dada-da, TGIF - a great weekend. - LimA 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted June 29, 2018 Yah, but some of us never appreciate the water that was in the well until after the well has gone dry. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lost in Translation Posted June 29, 2018 10 minutes ago, Marblehead said: Yah, but some of us never appreciate the water that was in the well until after the well has gone dry. This could be a discussion thread of its own. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
