Basic circles of pakua

[Brian L. Kennedy]

As is obvious pakua is largely about circles of movement, and for me at least pakua is basically about standup grappling (I hold the same view regarding taiji). I drew these two diagrams to help illustrate this to a friend of mine and I thought they might be of some interest to folks here as I saw the other pakua threads.

 

This one shows the three core circles, they are routes to project force, (much like xingyi 5 forms are routes to project force). They also correspond to the first three forms in stock Cheng style.

 

 

This second one is the circles in relation to an opponent.

 

 

To give respect and credit to where I got this approach, it was from the writings of Tim Cartmell and the videos of Eric Luo.

 

For me, pakua is basically about your ability to spin around an opponent (not walk around him like you are walking the circle, but pivot out of his attack) and about your ability to get in tight against an opponent (and mitigate his ability to nail you with a punch/elbow/knee). I do not subscribe to an idea that pakua is "deep" or "unlearnable" by the masses. {warning: inflamatory statement following} Everything that is in pakua is in standard Iowa college wrestling....everything. Pakua just puts it in an "exotic" package. Let me be quick to add, I love pakua, I practice it several times a week, I hope to teach it someday but movement is movement so to speak.

 

Take care,

Brian

[Wun Yuen Gong]

Thats why bagua has linear and circle stepping cover all ranges!

 

Thanks for posting your thoughts....

[wudangspirit]

Brian,

 

I agree with your approach to Bagua. Bagua is a martial art and deals with the interchange of energies between you and your opponent. Traditional Bagua contains the elements of Xing Yi, Tai Chi and Liang Yi. Using those elements in connection with Bagua theory combined with explosive "Fa Jing" movements, Bagua is a fantastic combat art.

 

You should take a look at Wudang Bagua on youtube. At Wudang all the internal arts are explosive and combative...not just form.

 

Wudangspirit

 

 

 

As is obvious pakua is largely about circles of movement, and for me at least pakua is basically about standup grappling (I hold the same view regarding taiji). I drew these two diagrams to help illustrate this to a friend of mine and I thought they might be of some interest to folks here as I saw the other pakua threads.

 

This one shows the three core circles, they are routes to project force, (much like xingyi 5 forms are routes to project force). They also correspond to the first three forms in stock Cheng style.

 

 

This second one is the circles in relation to an opponent.

 

 

To give respect and credit to where I got this approach, it was from the writings of Tim Cartmell and the videos of Eric Luo.

 

For me, pakua is basically about your ability to spin around an opponent (not walk around him like you are walking the circle, but pivot out of his attack) and about your ability to get in tight against an opponent (and mitigate his ability to nail you with a punch/elbow/knee). I do not subscribe to an idea that pakua is "deep" or "unlearnable" by the masses. {warning: inflamatory statement following} Everything that is in pakua is in standard Iowa college wrestling....everything. Pakua just puts it in an "exotic" package. Let me be quick to add, I love pakua, I practice it several times a week, I hope to teach it someday but movement is movement so to speak.

 

Take care,

Brian

[Buddy]

I think Luo Laoshi would add:

Both you and opponent circling around a common center.

[Brian L. Kennedy]

Good Morning Buddy,

Yeah, I should have remembered that from Luo Laoshi's teaching. On a broader note, let me say Happy Chinese New Year to you and your family. I know we had our cyber-fights before but one of my resolutions for the new year was to (try) and cool it with the cyber screaming matches and to patch things over with people I have gotten into it with before.

 

Truth be told I can not actually remember what we first were arguing about, but I do remember it got nasty. If I remember right it was over on George Wood's old forum, although it may have been Empty Flower. In any event I apologize for the past trouble and appreciate talking with you.

 

Take care,

Brian

[Buddy]

Back to you and yours Brian. It's water under the bridge (a Daoist reference?) My apologies back.

 

Cheers,

 

Buddy

[Procurator]

As is obvious pakua is largely about circles of movement,

he he , things are always what they seem arent they?

 

 

I do not subscribe to an idea that pakua is "deep" or "unlearnable" by the masses.

but of course....

 

Everything that is in pakua is in standard Iowa college wrestling....everything. Pakua just puts it in an "exotic" package. Let me be quick to add, I love pakua, I practice it several times a week,

no you dont. you practice college wrestling. not that there is anything wrong with that....lol

[thelerner]

You're in top form Proc.

 

Why do I get the feeling Brian would be your total superior in Pakua??

 

 

Love. He loves it and has made it his own. He can 'think' in it. Its not a mysterious eastern mistress to him. Its a buddy.

 

 

Michael

[Buddy]

You mean...pal, bro, cuz, chum...? Buddy is taken!

[Brian L. Kennedy]

Right, Buddy is taken.

 

I remember well back when I started pakua back in California back in 1983, that pakua was viewed as some "super mystical", "special" martial art that was supposed to be kind of the "PhD. of chinese martial arts". And I remember white guys "ohhhing and aaaahing" when they first saw it and heard all the talk about the I-Ching and vortexes of chi and all the rest.

 

And let me be quick to add, I was one of those white guys with his mouth hanging open in amazement. But then the years go by and it becomes quite obvious that it is human movement, and that is that.

 

Here in Taiwan it is just another Chinese martial art. No one views it as being much different than any other traditional Chinese martial art. In an interesting side note, one of the things that is supposed to make pakua so "deep, profound and mysterious" is the use of the Yi Jing symbols but in fact that way of talking about things is used in other martial arts including the Northern Shaolin art of 3 Kings Cannon Pounding (an art favored by bodyguards of the late Qing) and by Taiwanese Crane Boxing.

 

I should take a moment and give thanks and praise to someone. This guy is often kicked and kicked pretty hard by the martial arts forums but I owe him a big thanks, so I will send it through cyberspace right here and now. I send thanks and praise to Bruce Kumar Frantiz. He learned from Wang Shu Jin and then he taught the guy (Dirk Johnson) who taught me. If I remember right Buddy studied under the guy too, so Buddy knows him.

 

take care,

Brian

[Wun Yuen Gong]

Ive heard that there is daoist chanting whilst walking the circle i actually drum the I ching and walk the circle or Yin Yang which is very trancy and the yin yang vibrations go through you.

[Procurator]

You're in top form Proc.

 

Why do I get the feeling Brian would be your total superior in Pakua??

errr, you mean in college wrestling just exotically packaged ?I am sure he is.......Now superior or not that is not the issue, lets not make this personal shall we? I am really greatfull to Brian. It is a really valuable piece of info that in Kumar's lineage bagua is akin to college wrestling. Its interesting that Buddy is of the same lineage.

[Buddy]

While I am often critical of the current situation, I owe a LOT of what I have to Kumar. He taught me how to see the truth.

[minkus]

Ive heard that there is daoist chanting whilst walking the circle i actually drum the I ching and walk the circle or Yin Yang which is very trancy and the yin yang vibrations go through you.

 

Lets me remember something i read about hermits in the mountains of China doing nothing all day but walking in a circle and chanting 1 particular mantra to come in a certain state of mind.

[mYTHmAKER]

Kumar. He taught me how to see the truth.

 

Could you elaborate on that.

[Wun Yuen Gong]

Minkus,

 

Do you know any of the chants walking the bagua? Ive read it i think in a book on Taoist magic???

 

regards

WYG

[minkus]

Nopez, i dont know a specific chant these hermits used although i guess its not that black and white and yust as people use several mantra's for several purpose i assume they also had many diffrent ones.

[Wun Yuen Gong]

Maybe repeating the name of each bagua or hexigram from the I ching?

 

Thanks

WYG

[minkus]

Walk the circle for an hour a certain day, no or not many palmchanges.

 

Walk the circle for an hour another day, no or not many palmchanges but with a ipod on with the song you absolutely like best in the whole world, repeat that same song for 1 hour.

 

See the diffrence

Edited February 5, 2008 by minkus

[Buddy]

"It is a really valuable piece of info that in Kumar's lineage bagua is akin to college wrestling."

 

Miro,

Care to site your source? BTW I'm Yizong.

 

"Could you elaborate on that."

 

 

I could, but my views are unpopular.

[Procurator]

"It is a really valuable piece of info that in Kumar's lineage bagua is akin to college wrestling."

 

Miro,

Care to site your source? BTW I'm Yizong.

 

Buddy the quote above is mine and source is Brian in this thread.

[Buddy]

Miro,

I'd be happy to show you some "collegiate wrestling." You clearly didn't understand Brian's reference and once again in your phony monk passive aggression, merely want to stir the shit. What's the matter, begging at the temple ain't making enough to buy cigarettes?

[Procurator]

Miro,

I'd be happy to show you some "collegiate wrestling." You clearly didn't understand Brian's reference and once again in your phony monk passive aggression, merely want to stir the shit. What's the matter, begging at the temple ain't making enough to buy cigarettes?

Buddy i am not Miro but i know Miro, so lets share a smile. I remember him as a straight shooter not at all like passive aggressive myself. i did not know he smoke..

[Buddy]

Too late, you're found out.

[Brian L. Kennedy]