Limahong Posted July 18, 2018 12 minutes ago, Lost in Translation said: Are you implying that the sun is identical to yang and the moon is identical to yin? Hi Lost in Translation, I am implying nothing. I see the sun at sunrise ad the moon on moonlit nights. - LimA Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lost in Translation Posted July 18, 2018 4 minutes ago, Limahong said: I am implying nothing. I see the sun at sunrise ad the moon on moonlit nights. As do I... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Limahong Posted July 18, 2018 7 minutes ago, Harmen said: Personally I don't believe something like 'absolute yin and yang' exists. Hi Harmen, To each his/her/their own. But I am absolutely sure that I am a male - absolute yang. Whilst thinking of Yinny now, something lifted my pants... - LimA Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted July 18, 2018 20 minutes ago, Harmen said: Personally I don't believe something like 'absolute yin and yang' exists. I would likely have to agree with you. I doubt there are any absolutes within the bounds of the universe. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Harmen Posted July 18, 2018 "In terms of the structure and function of the universe, the foundational Daoist cosmology parallels that of pre-modern Chinese society and culture, and it centers on yin-yang and the Five Phases. This cosmology is not Daoist per se. It is best understood as “traditional Chinese cosmology” or part of the dominant “traditional Chinese worldview,” as it was the primary cosmological viewpoint in traditional China. This cosmology is based on the principles and forces of yin-yang, which we encountered above in the classical Daoist cosmogonic account. Etymologically speaking, yin 陰 depicts a hill (fu 阜) covered by shadows (yin 侌), while yang 陽 depicts a hill (fu 阜) covered by sunlight (yang 昜). At the root level, yin and yang are ways of speaking about the same place at different times or moments of the day. Yin and yang are not “polar opposites” or antagonistic substances; they are, in fact, complementary principles, aspects, or forces. As the characters suggest, yin and yang are used to represent different dimensions of the same phenomenon or situation. By extension, there are various associations: yin/female/earth/moon/dark/death/cold/moist/heavy/turbidity/ descent/rest/inward yang/male/heavens/sun/light/life/hot/dry/light/clarity/ascent/ activity/outward At times, “yin” is also used to designate “negative” or harmful aspects of life more generally (immorality, ugliness, disease, etc.), while “yang” becomes related to “positive” or beneficial aspects of life (morality, beauty, health, etc.). What must be emphasized is that these are relative associations, not absolute characteristics. They do not parallel conventional views of so-called “good” and “evil” as distinct ontological categories. Just because women are considered “yin” in one respect or in one context, it does not follow that they are also “immoral” or “turbid.” There are also varying degrees of yin and yang in every phenomenon, in each moment or experience, and in every being. So, certain men may be more yin than certain women, and vice versa. People in one context may be more yang (e.g. talkative or hot), while in another that same person may be quite yin (e.g. quiet or cold). Because the universe is understood as a transformative process, this also means that any negative or harmful pattern or manifestation may be transformed into a positive or beneficial pattern or manifestation. In the context of a classical Chinese worldview in general and Daoism in particular, life is seen as depending on the mutually beneficial interaction of yin and yang. Even when Daoists speak of entities like “demons” (mo) or “ghosts” (gui), “yin entities,” they generally understand them to be a momentary, unresolved energetic pattern capable of transformation into a more beneficial pattern. Generally speaking, such beings are not irrevocably lost or distorted. A skilled Daoist priest may assist their transformation. Here we should also note that yin and yang take on specific and alternative meanings in certain contexts. For example, in many internal alchemy (neidan) lineages, yin appears to be defined negatively, while yang appears to be defined positively. A distinction must be made between yin-yang as cosmological principles, and yin-yang as alchemical map, specifically as a map of alchemical transformation. That is, there are cosmological and alchemical interpretations and applications of yin-yang, with the associations varying depending on system and context. The cosmological dimension cannot be changed—it is the underlying structure of cosmos. However, on an existential and alchemical level, yin may designate mortality, defilements, delusion, and so forth; yang may designate immortality, purity, realization, and so forth. Internal alchemists thus frequently speak of transforming yin into yang, of becoming a yang-spirit, a pure yang being. This does not mean that one transcends the foundational cosmological harmony of yin and yang. In fact, classical Daoism and the foundational Daoist worldview urge one to “embrace the feminine,” understood as correlative with “yin qualities” (flexibility, passivity, receptivity, silence, etc.). Rather, it means that the internal alchemist works to become a perfected being in which all negative characteristics have been transformed into their positive counterparts. " - Louis Komjathy, Daoism. A Guide for the Perplexed, p. 90-92 4 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Limahong Posted July 18, 2018 1 hour ago, rene said: Precisely, gentlemen, and kinda puts a new light on all the needless debates. Howdy rene, Sunlight <= sun. Moonlight <= moon. New light <= ? - LimA Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Harmen Posted July 18, 2018 1 minute ago, Limahong said: Moonlight <= moon. Technically speaking there is no such thing as 'moonlight'... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted July 18, 2018 The only time I use negative and positive regarding Yin/Yang is when I am comparing it to energy. There must be both in order for there to be energy flow. Otherwise it is just potential. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Limahong Posted July 18, 2018 1 hour ago, rene said: Nice visual for how 'grey' is both at the same time; and perceived as one or the other, depending on context. Hi rene, 50 shades of grey... - LimA Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rene Posted July 18, 2018 8 minutes ago, Limahong said: Howdy rene, Sunlight <= sun. Moonlight <= moon. New light <= ? VIKING!! - LimA 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lost in Translation Posted July 18, 2018 10 minutes ago, Harmen said: At the root level, yin and yang are ways of speaking about the same place at different times or moments of the day. Yin and yang are not “polar opposites” or antagonistic substances; they are, in fact, complementary principles, aspects, or forces. Beautiful stuff. This brings to mind the notion that yang is the southern side of a mountain while yin is the northern side. Conversly yin is the southern side of a river while yang it its northern side. (Reversed in southern hemisphere). This is due to the nature of the sunlight upon these geographies. In light of this conversation that makes much more sense. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rene Posted July 18, 2018 3 minutes ago, Lost in Translation said: In light of this conversation that makes much more sense. A lot will for you now. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Limahong Posted July 18, 2018 1 hour ago, rene said: Sun would be Yin-ish while it is naturally diminishing over time - Moon would be Yang-ish to the little asteroids crashing into it! Westerners - English, Spanish, Scottish, Irish... sun sets in the West => yin? Easterners ~ No-lish ~ Indians, Chinese, Malays, Filipino, Thai... sun rises in the East => yang? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Limahong Posted July 18, 2018 (edited) 58 minutes ago, Harmen said: What is 'an absolute male Hi Harmen, I am an absolute male - not relative to whatever. You? LimA Edited July 18, 2018 by Limahong Correct errors. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Harmen Posted July 18, 2018 2 minutes ago, Limahong said: You? How can I answer that when I don't know what you mean by 'absolute male'? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lost in Translation Posted July 18, 2018 7 minutes ago, Limahong said: Hi Harmen, I am an absolute male - not relative to whatever. You? You may intend this comment to be lighthearted and joking but it has potential to be easily misunderstood. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted July 18, 2018 Absolute male indicates that he is straight and has no gay tendencies. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vonkrankenhaus Posted July 18, 2018 1 hour ago, Harmen said: Hmmm... I'm not sure if they 'have' it. After all, it is all relative and depends on the point of view. Currently I am sitting on my chair, not moving. And yet I am moving, because the Earth is moving (go away FlatEarthers.) So I am moving not-moving. "Thing" HAS YinYang - polarity. Doesn't depend on point of view. YOU have a Beginning and Ending, and many other polarities. And the Divisions of YinYang - also there. Yes, you and your chair are moving at almost 70,000 mph through space while sitting relatively still in relation to the Earth. This is not a puzzle. Some "thing" appears from Nothing. Dao produces One. That "thing" has YinYang and the Divisions of YinYang, inherently, by existing. All things that begin have an end. Once "you" are "here", you are NOT "there" and this is Polarity, YinYang. Even a "point" or "dot" that may appear, has YinYang and the Divisions of YinYang. That "point" is like the TaiJiTu. -VonKrankenhaus Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Limahong Posted July 18, 2018 39 minutes ago, Marblehead said: I would likely have to agree with you. I doubt there are any absolutes within the bounds of the universe. Hi Dada-da, Are yin and yang absolute in these symbols - Is your premise rooted in Taoism? - LimA Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Harmen Posted July 18, 2018 2 minutes ago, vonkrankenhaus said: "Thing" HAS YinYang - polarity. Doesn't depend on point of view. It seems we have a different point of view on this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Harmen Posted July 18, 2018 5 minutes ago, Marblehead said: Absolute male indicates that he is straight and has no gay tendencies. It is interesting that you can answer for someone else.... But okay, so 'absolute male' is defined by feelings & sexual orientation? There is no physical component part of the definition? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted July 18, 2018 6 minutes ago, Limahong said: Hi Dada-da, Are yin and yang absolute in these symbols - Is your premise rooted in Taoism? - LimA No because there is light in the dark and dark in the light. There is always a way of return to balance and harmonic yin/yang. My premise is rooted in the Tai Chi symbol itself. More often though I view the Tai Chi symbol as shades of grey as opposed to white and black. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted July 18, 2018 6 minutes ago, Harmen said: It is interesting that you can answer for someone else.... But okay, so 'absolute male' is defined by feelings & sexual orientation? There is no physical component part of the definition? Not interesting if one knows that he and I have discussed this concept in private and he made himself very clear when we spoke. He also stated that he would be cautious when discussions such as this became active and I am sure he was being cautious so that he would not offend anyone. I don't have that restraint when posting. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Limahong Posted July 18, 2018 57 minutes ago, Harmen said: "In terms of the structure... their positive counterparts." Hi Harmen, Too many, many, many... words. On 6/24/2018 at 8:11 AM, dawei said: Squares and corners spoken are not the eternalness [of squares and corners]. Check with dawei. - LimA Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Starjumper Posted July 18, 2018 1 hour ago, Limahong said: Whilst thinking of Yinny Do you have a picture of Yinny that you can share? 44 minutes ago, Limahong said: I am an absolute male - not relative to whatever. How about relative to a Viking? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
