A Comprehensive Guide to Daoist Nei Gong

[Chang]

To be published in a few days time and is a follow on to his previous works on the subject. Whilst I am something of a critic of Mitchell, feeling that his system is somewhat eclectic and a mish mash of diverse schools and systems his writing is still of interest and value. Well worth a look.

 

"This book provides a unprecedented insight into the entire Nei Gong process, expanding upon the foundations laid in the author's previous widely read book, Daoist Nei Gong, to provide a deeper and more comprehensive understanding of the practice.

 

Going into unparalleled detail whilst remaining accessible, it explains the philosophy at the heart of Nei Gong , and the steps whereby transformation is achieved. A foundational knowledge of Chinese medicine will help the reader appreciate the explanation more deeply, but is not required for understanding. Essential reading for anyone seriously interested Qi Gong, Chinese martial arts, and the Daoist tradition, the book will also be an invaluable resource for practitioners of Chinese medicine, or advanced meditation."

 

 

[ronko]

got mine today  and its dense ¬ seriously

gonna take me ages to get through this and take it all in

[vonkrankenhaus]

In the last 3 years I have been reading many current books about Qigong and Neigong.

 

I had never seen these before, and had not ever really looked for them.

 

I only knew of Chinese books about this since the early 1970s.

 

I have study and practice these for about 48 years. I learned in a traditional school setting.

 

I did not find Damo Mitchell book posted above to be very comprehensive. Has basic mistakes too.

 

I think even a free PDF of the Charles Luk book "Taoist Yoga", despite its own errors and omission, combine with maybe a few web sites about basic Taoist philosophy, might be more informative.

 

Also Yang Jwing Ming "Root of Chinese Qigong" has some beginner information, but also some bad guesses about magnetism and electricity.

 

 

 

 

 

-VonKrankenhaus

[ronko]

hi , what was the basic mistakes ?

 

[Wilhelm]

I'm about halfway through this book.  So far it is a plain-language breakdown of principles for practitioners of Daoist arts that could also be enjoyed by an interested non-practitioner.  It started with a chapter on comprehensive definitions of all the pinyin terms you see most commonly on boards like these, then moved to principles of aligning the body and regulating the breath and mind.  It's called comprehensive because those four chapters took up over 200 pages!

 

Right now I'm on the chapter about the nature of jing, and the later chapters seem to be talking about the middle and later stages of Nei Gong.  I am enjoying the book very much.

[rideforever]

When it says it goes into unparalleled detail does that mean he is enlightened and beyond suffering and death ?
If not how can you know it's detail means anything ?
And if the old man is not beyond death, why follow him, as his fate will become your fate ?

[idquest]

1 hour ago, rideforever said:

When it says it goes into unparalleled detail does that mean he is enlightened and beyond suffering and death ?
If not how can you know it's detail means anything ?
And if the old man is not beyond death, why follow him, as his fate will become your fate ?

 

'Unparalleled detail' in this context means the detail of the practice have not be described with such accuracy and precision before. Which is obviously a subjective point of view. It has nothing to do with being enlightened or not. Just a description. I'd say somewhat fair criticism.

[rideforever]

14 minutes ago, idquest said:

 

'Unparalleled detail' in this context means the detail of the practice have not be described with such accuracy and precision before. Which is obviously a subjective point of view. It has nothing to do with being enlightened or not. Just a description. I'd say somewhat fair criticism.

 

I really like his guts to get into the texts and make his own sense of them, not fear them or think they are distant wisdom that cannot be understood.   I like that.
But ... the question is where do these instructions get you.   Anywhere ?   For instance in interviews he talks of having a healthy lifestyle.   Does that mean he personally still feels bound to the body ?

[idquest]

You perhaps should ask Mitchell about this? On a different level I feel your question is rather about what should be a priority, ming or xing practice. If so, you know very well everybody has their own opinion on this. I think they should be practised  at the same time and that you can't really separate xing cultivation from ming. But this is my opinion.

[rideforever]

Well the answer is that you can't clean yourself with dirty water.   Therefore you should prioritise the awakening of that inside you which is clean, your real self or real consciousness.   And that normally occurs with transmission and the embodying of that transmission.

Working with the lower self is practical for many reasons and so should be done as well.

However the one thing that has to be placed firmly in your intelligence is that you cannot clean yourself with dirty water, and that awakening is not a step by step process.   Because the light is always light, there are no shades in it.

The lower self can be sorted out so that it is reasonably harmonious.   
But then again as few people are able to gauge how clean or dirty a person is then this kind of approach is a bit silly.   
If you can't judge how clean you are what is the point of cleaning ?
Well there is a point, it is common sense and responsible.

In my opinion in every case I have seen awakening was a result of transmission landing on fertile ground.
And for many seekers once they arrived, they threw away all their books and theories and often regarded them as wasted time.
And then there is the question of how you prepare yourself as fertile ground ?
Often those stuck in books are intellectualising the path in combination with hiding and physically abusing themselves, coupled with the delusion that having multiple energetic mink-coats is going to help them.
But then again there are those who are sincere and have good hearts and do the practical lower self work quite nicely.

Oh yes, lest I forget.   The ego-self can in no way understand self-realisation as ego-self is just a completely shattered corrupted mess with no practical connection to the light.   So one thing the ego-self does is try to create step-by-step paths up the mountain but they lead nowhere.   You see this everywhere, with the reading of books Christianity, or the numbers game in Buddhism, or the X number of limbs of yoga, or the many deity levels of tantra and so on.

 

Here are some important questions :

> How can I prepare myself as fertile ground for self-realisation ?
> Where can I get transmission from ?

> Is my energy work coming from the soul, or just a souped up false-self ?

> If I die tomorrow in a car accident, will I realise that I have wasted my life as I take my last breath ?

 

Edited September 4, 2018 by rideforever

[kyoji]

On 2018-09-04 at 10:14 AM, rideforever said:

When it says it goes into unparalleled detail does that mean he is enlightened and beyond suffering and death ?
If not how can you know it's detail means anything ?
And if the old man is not beyond death, why follow him, as his fate will become your fate ?

If you know a man like this please point me in the right direction, my brother.

[Mudfoot]

On 2018-09-04 at 7:07 PM, rideforever said:

Well the answer is that you can't clean yourself with dirty water.   Therefore you should prioritise the awakening of that inside you which is clean, your real self or real consciousness.   And that normally occurs with transmission and the embodying of that transmission.

Working with the lower self is practical for many reasons and so should be done as well.

 

Quote

However the one thing that has to be placed firmly in your intelligence is that you cannot clean yourself with dirty water, and that awakening is not a step by step process.   

 

Here are some important questions :

> How can I prepare myself as fertile ground for self-realisation ?
> Where can I get transmission from ?

 

Some would say that a step-by-step approach is preparing yourself as fertile ground, and getting transmissions without doing extensive work on yourself on multiple levels might lead to.... illusion. 

 

But, if you have found your path, cool 😎. 

But you have a bitter way of expressing it. Do you feel no Joy in your practice? 

Edited September 8, 2018 by Mudfoot
Autospelling

[Mudfoot]

Slightly more than half way in, I feel that this book might start another Mo Pai thread. 

 

And the content is not only useful as a viritual bat against @Ilovecoffee, I would say that Mitchell supports some of the ideas that the w Mo Pai group have stood for over the years.

Good for you! 

 

I would also recommend this book for you that doesn't care about mo pai threads (doesn't include you that already know everything) because it is a good read. 

[GreytoWhite]

Really great information in here - had to get further than page 400 to get to stuff related to my current practice. Lots of facets of my foundation to revisit and I want his neidan book White Moon on the Mountain Peak now.

[vonkrankenhaus]

On 8/22/2018 at 7:11 AM, ronko said:

hi , what was the basic mistakes ?

 

For one, he mixes up the 8 extraordinary meridians with the 12 organ channels.

For another related error, he mixes up arm and leg channels.

 

People who cannot spot such errors, do not have the medical knowledge to do so,  maybe should not be using that book to think they will develop their Neigong.

 

-VonKrankenhaus

ADDENDUM: I thought you meant "Taoist Yoga", but now I see you meant Damo Mitchell book. THAT book has too many basic errors to get into.

Edited November 8, 2018 by vonkrankenhaus

[Zen Pig]

Thanks for all the info, just found Charles Luk book "Taoist Yoga" in PDF and down loaded.  So far read a few pages, and while,  many of the references hits it on the head for me, so to speak, from my personal experience,  and can be very helpful, I am still unsure of some ethereal aspects of Taoist Yoga, much like many kinds of spiritual paths, it , at times seems to be a kind of self centered attempt to gain something for ones self at the experience of living a full life, of giving to others without regard to what i can receive in return.  Much like the passages of not ejaculating in order to store the vital energy for ones self so he can obtain eternal life. Not having a family, spending your life trying to slip under the wire of the mortal coil.  From many viewpoints, including my own, (and I do some neigung meditation as part of my daily sitting, so not trying to bash all of this stuff),  It could be equated in the western world as dark magic, as in, magic/power/energy one uses for there own personal advances, and not for the benefit of others,   but then again, maybe the subtle things are lost in translation. 

[vonkrankenhaus]

41 minutes ago, Zen Pig said:

It could be equated in the western world as dark magic, as in, magic/power/energy one uses for there own personal advances, and not for the benefit of others

 

I think that would be a misunderstanding if anyone does conclude that.

 

I'm not so sure those are even "relevant" issues to the technicalities of Neigong or Qigong.

 

Or even to the reasons for undertaking these, except for people taking up something that they don't really know what it is.

 

 

 

 

-VonKrankenhaus

[Zen Pig]

well, thanks.......

 

Edited November 9, 2018 by Zen Pig

[ronko]

On 08/11/2018 at 9:15 PM, vonkrankenhaus said:

ADDENDUM: I thought you meant "Taoist Yoga", but now I see you meant Damo Mitchell book. THAT book has too many basic errors to get into.

so can you give us a couple of them ?

[vonkrankenhaus]

5 hours ago, ronko said:

so can you give us a couple of them ?

 

There are too many.

 

He writes about "the energy of the Dao".

 

He thinks he is working with "various energetic substances" of the body.

 

He writes about "the nature of the power known as Wuji".

 

He writes that Taiji "moved outwards from the center of Wuji and began to divide the spiritual power of Wuji into two extremes known as yin and yang".

 

This stuff is just what's in the beginning of the book. It goes on and on. Many errors.

 

People may not know, but all of this is incorrect. So he is not understanding Daoism. You cannot learn Daoism and YinYang from this book.

Qigong he is teaching is like warm up exercises.

 

Book is like the book of a guy studied basic exercises and making up guesses about them. I really do not know who is teaching him mistakes like this (if he didn't make them up like most people actually do, if you look).

 

 

 

 

 

-VonKrankenhaus

[ronko]

thanks for the reply , but surely , he has progressed quite well judging by his nei dan book ?

[vonkrankenhaus]

8 hours ago, ronko said:

thanks for the reply , but surely , he has progressed quite well judging by his nei dan book ?

 

Building on the incorrect "foundation" of the other one?

He doesn't understand Daoism.
Doesn't understand what Qi is.

Doesn't know what YinYang is.

And he is teaching people who don't know these either.
 

 

-VonKrankenhaus

[Taoist Texts]

3 hours ago, vonkrankenhaus said:

He doesn't understand Daoism.
 

Absolutely. His books are garbage.

[wandelaar]

Is there an orthodox form of Daoist Nei Gong? Or are there only different interpretations and guesses?

[ronko]

any suggestions in which direction to look in regards to books ?

 

or practices even ?

Edited December 8, 2018 by ronko