Mal Posted February 4, 2008 To get a feel for Harold Roths approach to things, I am pretty sure he has some of his papers for free on the internet. For folks interested in the Zhuangzi (Chuang Tzu) he has done some of the best work available in english on that book. Take care, Brian Cool, Cheers Brian BTW Think I found an affordable copy is this the book? http://www.amazon.com/Original-Tao-Foundat...s/dp/0231115652 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sean Posted February 4, 2008 Here is a stab at a translation from a guy on alt.philosophy.taoism I posted a ways back: Neiye (Nei-yeh) - Inner Cultivation (Inward Training) Best, Sean Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gerard Posted February 4, 2008 There is also a page that offers all Taoist texts including that one. But I lost track of it. Maybe there is someone in here who knows and can link it in this thread. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pietro Posted February 4, 2008 Here is a stab at a translation from a guy on alt.philosophy.taoism I posted a ways back: Neiye (Nei-yeh) - Inner Cultivation (Inward Training) Best, Sean Sean Sean, quick, delete it. Or Brian will ban you ;-) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mal Posted February 4, 2008 Im also wondering about the "heart". In the comments the translator said that Xin means heart/mind more than heart. I'm told in traditional Chinese texts "heart" = western idea of "mind" or Consciousness Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pietro Posted February 4, 2008 I read the text Sean posted. Im wondering what is meant by "aligned". Is it like synchronisity? Like when you are at the right place at the right time? Being moved by the holy spirit or concepts like that? Or does the author mean something completely different that we cannot translate to other practices and other words? Anyone care to explain? ... My understanding is that aligned has different applications, respect to what context we are talking about. If we are speaking about the body, then you need to keep your body so that the energy flows freely through it. So that the push, from the hand goes to the wrist. From the wrist, goes to the elbow, from the elbow goes to the shoulder. And then down to the earth. Then of course there is being aligned to the earth, so the energy flows down all the way to the earth. But this is just the most basic form of being aligned. You can also being aligned at the emotional level, mental level, between the levels. And between your body and outside (respect to the earth, or respect to heaven, for example). Once you are aligned (not just physically) then yes, syncronicity might start to happen. But is that important? It looks more like the a fruit, not the root of the practice. Pietro Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Procurator Posted February 4, 2008 (edited) I read the text Sean posted. Im wondering what is meant by "aligned". Anyone care to explain? 正 means "correct". Edited February 4, 2008 by Procurator Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sheng zhen Posted February 4, 2008 One other thing Ive noticed in the comments is the translation to "faculties", or "senses". He say the word guan actually means "government". Wouldnt it then mean "how you govern yourself", the aspect of you that takes desicions, choose what to do and how to go about your life. To me it makes more sense to not "let the world confuse my government(making desicion, choosing)" than not to "confuce my senses, or faculties(whatever that means)" It also makes sense to me that my desicions should not confuse my heart. When my heart controlls(not the right word, please see beyond my bad english) my desicions, I am more at center than if my desicions would be products of external influences. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Taomeow Posted February 4, 2008 Thanks, Brian, for bringing it up, and Sean, for bringing it forth! Nice indeed. As for "aligned": "can't be defined, can be described" -- here's a few examples (out of an infinity of possible ones) that it immediately brought to mind. In a truly beautiful place, by the seaside overlooking some mountains in the distance, I once saw a mass of clouds build a landscape in the sky that replicated the shape of the mountains below in uncanny detail, including man-made details (a tall tower, some houses...) -- just like in that poem whose only line surviving in my memory goes, "the shape of the mountains reveals the shape of the wind." Or, in this case, the shape of the mountains determined the shape of the wind. The wind aligned itself to the mountains, themselves an outcome of having aligned to some ancient wind... Things (and creatures) create each other by noticing each other (by whatever means at their disposal -- sight, touch, chemical analysis -- by the tongue or the roots -- sound, color, vibration, electrical discharge, just "being there" as a whole...) -- and aligning to each other naturally. Whatever can't, or "doesn't want to," is off, misaligned, dislocated... Manhattan always looked crystalline to me from a distance -- very much like some mass of natural (strangely enough) crystals pushing upward, growing in a pattern of regular irregularity, order within variability, that one sees in natural mineral formations. It was with great satisfaction that I found out that it rests on a foundation of hard basalt rock -- I sort of figured that it grew the way it did propelled by an aligning force from below, unbeknownst to the human minds and hands building it under its influence. (Other cities that started building skyscraper landscapes all over the world then aligned themselves with this one I think -- because of its upward-pushing/condensing strong metal-fire yang power derived from its foundation.) My teacher says, "like those wooden name tablets they place on the altar in traditional Chinese homes when a relative dies -- upright, aligned with the earth below and heaven above, connecting them -- that's the posture of taiji." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
doc benway Posted February 4, 2008 There appears to be a less expensive paper back edition of this book. There are several for sale on www.abebooks.com. Steve Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
宁 Posted February 4, 2008 Yes, thank you Brian and Taomeow and others like them, for keeping our heads where they belong, and for the quality of the ideas and even guidance. TTB needs more like you Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gerard Posted February 5, 2008 (edited) Here's another good treatise on internal alchemy to supplement the Nei Yeh: http://www2.arts.ubc.ca/bcar/no12/articles/crowe/article.pdf Edited February 6, 2008 by durkhrod chogori Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Brian L. Kennedy Posted February 5, 2008 I am often quite guilty of saying Chinese word x means y and my wife gently scolds me about that. The reason being, most Chinese characters do not mean anything in the abstract. They are either part of set phrases or need to be seen in context. A good example is zheng. Just sitting on a piece of paper by itself the word means nothing. An example of some of the meanings and phrases that use zheng can be found here. http://www.mdbg.net/chindict/chindict.php?...eng&wdrst=1 take care, Brian Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hern Heng Posted February 5, 2008 "Original Tao" has a good translation. There are others as well, but i'm not sure what's available on Amazon.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
