The Current Atmosphere

[lifeforce]

The Dao Bums has been a wonderful place in all the years I've been here. The stuff that I've learned through the sharing of knowledge and wisdom is incomparable. Lately though, the energy of this place seems to have changed. Or maybe I have changed, but I see a lot of aggressive posts, people not being courteous and polite, and downright abusive. The need to be right, instead of valuing a different perspective, is rearing it's ugly head. 

A lot of members have left, or have been banned. Members that were the spine of the place. Sad really.

 

Edited September 7, 2018 by lifeforce

[Marblehead]

I can't "Like" your post because I disagree with your observation but I do understand where you are coming from.

 

There is a side (restricted) conversation going on right now concerning what you have presented.

 

Yin and Yang will alternate over time; sometimes more Yin, other times more Yang.

 

The concept is "good will".  When we make a post are we trying to be helpful or hurtful?  I would immediately respond that we should try to be helpful.

 

But from who's perspective are we going to judge "helpful"?

 

And if only helpful comments can be made then this would be a form of censorship, wouldn't it?

 

Dao follows a natural flow,  We too should follow our natural flow.  Sometimes something someone else says will irritate us.  But maybe that person was really trying to help but because of the baggage we carry around with us we see what they said as being harmful.

 

True, members will come and go.  Well, except for Marblehead.  That doesn't say anything directly about DaoBums.  All it indicates is that one member has decided to move on.

 

American society has become more confrontational lately.  We will see that from the Americans who post here.

 

But I think we are still holding very well to t large and diverse membership here and as I mentioned a few days ago, I find it inspiring to look at the "online user" list and see that there is more than one page of members on line at the time.

 

 

[oak]

I thanked both posts...

[Stosh]

Because I am tolerant, and can handle the prospect that others may not validate my own opinion , I dont feel the need to toss about generalized accusations that everyone else is not up to my standards. 

[Aetherous]

I've been consistently visiting this site since 2005. Every once in a while a longer term member will make this same observation - that the place has changed in a bad way.

I just say: look to see the good here. Is there anything new to learn? Are you still interested in the various subjects discussed here? Could a new subject be added into the mix, which no one has discussed yet, but which you're enthusiastic about? Are there new members who could use your help? Longer term members are potentially a resource of information, usually due to having more experience in the subject matter here. Can you learn something from the fresh perspective that new members bring? Is there some subject you might have previously ignored, but which is now becoming more apparent?

I've always viewed this forum as a jumping off point for learning, where we can find tidbits of information about something...let's say we see someone talking about Sufism, and it strikes us as seeming interesting...then we can go do our own research, find a lineage, get some real experience for a number of years. And our discussions can benefit from it...as a result, more accurate ideas can be shared with the bums, so that we all help each other out. Our learning becomes more efficient and effective. We get on better spiritual paths. We learn how to be healthier.

We improve our lives, and the world around us.

If there are people who are negative, perhaps their behavior will improve simply from being here and seeing how the long term bums operate. Or they will get on a path that transforms them, so they no longer feel the need to be rude.

For the record...there was never a time when the forum was civil. If we're thinking the forum has changed into a really unpleasant place, perhaps that's just because we've personally become a more pleasant person and are suddenly more aware of the world we were already living in, and how different from it we've become.

[Marblehead]

8 minutes ago, Aetherous said:

For the record...there was never a time when the forum was civil. If we're thinking the forum has changed into a really unpleasant place, perhaps that's just because we've personally become a more pleasant person and are suddenly more aware of the world we were already living in, and how different from it we've become.

Great comment.  Thanks for your awareness.

 

 

[Stosh]

I dont see how complaining about other peoples discussions indicates that a person is becoming nicer, it could be that theyre becoming spoiled. 

To my eyes it seems that the interactions have been becoming ever more civil and well considered. The variety of topics is trending more broadly too

[Gerard]

All that we are is the result of what we have thought. 

 

He insulted me, hit me, beat me, robbed me" — for those who don't brood on this, hostility is stilled.

 

(The Dhammapada).

 

 

"...you project your own energy out to form the physical world. Therefore, to change your world, it is yourself you must change. You must change what you project."

 

(Seth Speaks).

 

Take care

[liminal_luke]

I agree that there`s a lot of unnecessary negativity here and also a lot of truly wonderful posts and posters -- and that it`s always been this way.  Unfortunately, pointing out the negative parts and complaining about them doesn`t change anything.  God knows I`ve tried.

Edited September 7, 2018 by liminal_luke

[Marblehead]

1 minute ago, liminal_luke said:

God knows I`ve tried.

That caused me a belly laugh.  Thanks.

 

[silent thunder]

It's interesting and informative to notice what draws my attention, retains my focus and elicits emotional responses over time.  Patterns emerge.

 

I often notice it in the manner in which I currently tell my most often retold stories.

The feel of each retelling shifts, reflecting the tones of my life at the time of the retelling.  Certain aspects of a story may be left out entirely, or glossed over, in favor of other details that suit my current flavoring and mood.  It's like this with things that draw my attention.

 

Invariably, whatever peaks my interest, or draws my attention is what is resonating within.

 

Like sympathetic vibration in tuning forks... strike an A fork on one side of a room and any other A forks in the room will pick up the resonance and vibrate as well, without being struck.

 

What draws me without, is what resonates within.  Where there is sympathetic vibration, conscious awarenes is drawn.

 

In a river, with no stones or logs as blockage, no waves manifest even in great flow.

So too within awareness, with no occlusions, what is there to resonate and resist within?

 

What stands out without, seems to be what resonates within...

 

all that said... I feel the shift here.

Edited September 8, 2018 by silent thunder
changed wording in a sentence.

[Lost in Translation]

1 hour ago, silent thunder said:

In a river, with no stones or logs as blockage, no waves manifest even in great flow.

So too within awareness, with no occlusions, what is there to resonate and resist within?

 

Brilliant!

 

I would change the second line ever so slightly: "So too within awareness, with no occlusions can one yet be aware?"

[silent thunder]

20 minutes ago, Lost in Translation said:

 

Brilliant!

 

I would change the second line ever so slightly: "So too within awareness, with no occlusions can one yet be aware?"

Nice!

[Geof Nanto]

Huge topic, good discussion. Some words from Carl Jung on an aspect of this complex subject pertinent to those of us who value inner cultivation........ 

 

Speaking of the fatal human tendency to see the devil elsewhere than in one’s own territory, Jung said in an interview with the B.B.C in the immediate aftermath of World War II: 

 

If, for instance, the French-speaking Swiss should assume that the Alemanic Swiss were all devils, we in Switzerland could have the nicest civil war in no time, and we could also discover the most convincing economic reasons why such a war was inevitable. Well—we just don’t, for we learned our lesson more than four hundred years ago. We came to the conclusion that it is better to avoid external wars, so we went home and took the strife with us. In Switzerland we have built up a so-called “perfect democracy” in which our warlike instincts spend themselves in the form of domestic quarrels called “political life.” We fight each other within the limits of law and constitution, and we are inclined to think of democracy as a chronic state of mitigated civil war. We are far from being at peace with ourselves: on the contrary, we hate and fight each other, because we have succeeded in introverting war. Our peaceful outward manners merely serve to protect our internal dispute from foreign intruders who might disturb us. 

 

Thus far we have succeeded, but we are yet far from the ultimate goal. We still have enemies in the flesh, and we have not yet managed to introvert our political disharmonies into our personal selves. We still labour under the unwholesome conviction that we should be at peace within ourselves. Yet even our national mitigated state of war would come to an end if everybody could see his own shadow and begin the only struggle which is really worthwhile, the fight against the overwhelming power-drive of our own shadow. We have a tolerable social order in Switzerland because we fight among ourselves. Our order would be perfect if people could only take their lust of combat home into themselves. Unfortunately even our religious education prevents us from doing this, with its false promises of an immediate peace within. Peace may come in the end, but only when victory and defeat have lost their meaning. What did our Lord mean when He said: “I came not to send peace, but a sword”?

[lifeforce]

Points taken on all the above. I thank you for your participation in the thread.

Best wishes to everyone.

[CloudHands]

4 hours ago, Yueya said:

 Our peaceful outward manners merely serve to protect our internal dispute from foreign intruders who might disturb us.

 

 

[Aetherous]

10 hours ago, Yueya said:

Our peaceful outward manners merely serve to protect our internal dispute from foreign intruders who might disturb us. 

 

The definition of family.

[Daemon]

Certainly, if it's a dysfunctional family.

 

☮️

 

[Marblehead]

1 hour ago, Daemon said:

Certainly, if it's a dysfunctional family.

 

☮️

 

We have our effective times though when we have a majority of agreement.

 

[Lost in Translation]

On 9/7/2018 at 10:43 AM, lifeforce said:

The need to be right, instead of valuing a different perspective, is rearing it's ugly head. 

 

I stumbled across this TED video quite by accident. It's amazingly relevant. I know it's long-ish -- about 19 minutes - but it's worth watching. I'll place it in a spoiler so those who want to ignore it can easily do so.

 

-Lost

 

Spoiler

 

 

[Gerard]

I always loved the Monkey Reaching for the Moon analogy:

 

...grasping soul of humanity.

 

From this very moment: grasping in our mother's womb, our hands and fingers have the damn tendency to touch things! 

 

This in essence the reason we are all on this physical plane projecting into matter and we all have a point of view, hence that's why we argue.

 

To let go of everything and be *content with nothing, this is the ultimate goal. 

 

*Contempt incorrect term. Content is the one as noted after this post.

 

 

Edited September 10, 2018 by Gerard

[Marblehead]

5 hours ago, Gerard said:

and be contempt with nothing

Contempt?  How about Content?

 

[Gerard]

Yes. Wrong word.:)

 

Pleased. 

[3bob]

On 9/8/2018 at 11:21 PM, Gerard said:

I always loved the Monkey Reaching for the Moon analogy:

 

...grasping soul of humanity.

 

From this very moment: grasping in our mother's womb, our hands and fingers have the damn tendency to touch things! 

 

This in essence the reason we are all on this physical plane projecting into matter and we all have a point of view, hence that's why we argue.

 

To let go of everything and be *content with nothing, this is the ultimate goal. 

 

*Contempt incorrect term. Content is the one as noted after this post.

 

 

 

and what if the proverbial lotus flower lets go of its roots in the mud - no more flower 

[windwalker]

On 9/9/2018 at 2:28 AM, Marblehead said:

We have our effective times though when we have a majority of agreement.

 

 

a relative new comer.

 

Actually I find the opposite, its through disagreement that we become more effective in understanding ourselves and others. 

 

The motive for disagreement can come from within or with out.  Being able to understand this while still expressing a view point is IMO a good growth experience.  

 

 

 

The site has its own vibe with unique people possessing and sharing a wealth of information not commonly found or shared openly.   

 

 

Edited September 10, 2018 by windwalker