I consider it a translation error.(The secret of the golden flower)

[dosa]

I consider it a translation error.(The secret of the golden flower)

 

original(text) link: http://thesecretofthegoldenflower.com/ch1.html

 

 

1. 

chapter 1
10. Therefore you have only to turn the light around; that is the deepest and most wonderful secret.
各司其事。諸子只去回光

 

chapter 3

12.What the sages have passed on has not departed from inner illumination. Confucius called it: ultimate knowledge, Buddha called it: the observing mind, Lao-tse called it: inner observation, it is all the same

聖聖相傳，不離反照。孔云：“致知”，釋曰：“觀心”，老云：“內觀”，皆此法也

聖聖相傳，不離反照:  [反照] is passed down from saint to saint.

回光: the light around --> Focusing on dantian
回光返照: It's a short moment when you come back to your senses and act before you die.

In Buddhism, it also means to spirituality in your mind without relying on language or letters.

 

So it means Focusing on dantian, not turning the light around

 

 

 

2.

chapter 1
The Confucians call it the empty dwelling in the middle; The Buddhists call it the terrace of the spirit; The Taoists call it the ancestral land, the yellow court, the mysterious pass or the prenatal opening.     

”儒曰：“虛中”；釋曰：“靈台”；道曰：“祖土”；曰“黃庭”、曰“玄關”、曰“先天竅”。蓋天心猶宅舍一般，光乃主人翁也。

These words mean dantian .

3. 

chapter 1
The Golden Flower is light. What is light? It is symbolized by a golden flower, which hides the word light in it. It is the true energy of the prenatal Taiyi. 
金華即光也，光是何色？取象於金華，亦秘一光字在內，是先天太乙之真氣

The Golden Flower is light = 先天太乙之真氣 = gi = not sunlight = Can’t see! = Can feel = it's like a warmth. 

 

4.

chapter 3

1. Master Lu (Dongbin) said, what is the origin of the term 回光? It began with the 文始真人. When the light is turned around, the energies of heaven and earth, yin and yang, all congeal. will it become spirit-fire(真陽real yang), suddenly a millet pearl is born by itself, just as an embryo forms from the intercourse of a man and a woman. 光之回(Just watch, You cannot turn around of the light), 即火候也(This is firing process)

回光之名何昉乎？ 昉之自文始真人也。回光則天地陰陽之氣無不凝, 光中自然一點真陽，忽生黍珠，如夫婦交合有胎 光之回，即火候也。

火候也(This is firing process)=回光(Just watch, You cannot turn around of the light)

 

There were accidents in many other places.

 

Edited October 3, 2018 by dosa

[Taoist Texts]

5 hours ago, dosa said:

that is the deepest and most wonderful secret.

indeed

[yuuichi]

49 minutes ago, Taoist Texts said:

indeed

 

So you agree that turning the light around  means focusing on the lower dantian? You never mentioned it before?

[Taoist Texts]

No, it does not mean that, its kinda sorta related to that, but is not that. Besides, if the author wanted to say 'focus on LDT' he would go and say that. Plenty of texts say that directly, with no need to say something else while meaning the focusing on LDT.

[dosa]

6 minutes ago, Taoist Texts said:

No, it does not mean that, its kinda sorta related to that, but is not that. Besides, if the author wanted to say 'focus on LDT' he would go and say that. Plenty of texts say that directly, with no need to say something else while meaning the focusing on LDT.

 

Okey, that's right

But i think

回光 :  It means to shine as a spirit. (Just watch!!)

 

 

[Mudfoot]

9 hours ago, dosa said:

 

 

2.

chapter 1
The Confucians call it the empty dwelling in the middle; The Buddhists call it the terrace of the spirit; The Taoists call it the ancestral land, the yellow court, the mysterious pass or the prenatal opening.     

”儒曰：“虛中”；釋曰：“靈台”；道曰：“祖土”；曰“黃庭”、曰“玄關”、曰“先天竅”。蓋天心猶宅舍一般，光乃主人翁也。

it's dantian.

 

Since you are in a translating frenzy: is terrace of the spirit a translation of ling tai? 

 

Never mind, mbdg. net gave me the answer. 

 

Edited September 28, 2018 by Mudfoot

[Mudfoot]

If you check out previous threads on the subject, many interpret turning the light around as referring to the Light of Awareness. 

 

And around a year ago there was a classic Nei Dan thread about the mysterious pass, that will cover more of the quoted subjects in the original post. 

[yuuichi]

Does anyone know if ancient daoist writings ever talk about whether turning the light around (or equivalent practices) involves just the Hun (魂) spirit, or both the Hun (魂) and Po (魄) spirits?

[dosa]

2 hours ago, Mudfoot said:

If you check out previous threads on the subject, many interpret turning the light around as referring to the Light of Awareness. 

 

And around a year ago there was a classic Nei Dan thread about the mysterious pass, that will cover more of the quoted subjects in the original post. 

 

Thanks for the heads up on the subject
I've done a lot of reading on the subject, such as 黃庭經, 慧命經, 悟真篇, 山人壺雲禪師述 劉一明 道書十二種  and so forth[on]
There are some translated ones. 
turnning the light around and 小周天 are different.

[dosa]

44 minutes ago, yuuichi said:

Does anyone know if ancient daoist writings ever talk about whether turning the light around (or equivalent practices) involves just the Hun (魂) spirit, or both the Hun (魂) and Po (魄) spirits?

 

There are many theories 
I think it's not that different and I am also an old hand at the game 

Edited September 28, 2018 by dosa

[yuuichi]

1 hour ago, dosa said:

There are many theories 

Interesting, could you provide quotes of these theories please? I’ve never heard of them.

[dosa]

1 hour ago, yuuichi said:

Interesting, could you provide quotes of these theories please? I’ve never heard of them.

 

Okey,

Please, I just need a little time.
I want to take two days off on a picnic

 

[yuuichi]

1 minute ago, dosa said:

 

Okey,

Please, I just need a little time.
I want to take two days off on a picnic

 

 

Please feel welcome to take as long as you like. Enjoy your picnic!

[Shubin]

4 hours ago, dosa said:

 

Thanks for the heads up on the subject
I've done a lot of reading on the subject, such as 黃庭經, 慧命經, 悟真篇, 山人壺雲禪師述 劉一明 道書十二種  and so forth[on]
There are some translated ones. 
turnning the light around and 小周天 are different.

 

Hope you enjoy the time off and have a perfect picnic.

BTW,  about one of your reading subjects, 山人壺雲禪師述, it is an article? or "山人壺雲禪師述 劉一明 道書十二種" is a book?

I searched with Google, but only found a copy of 山人壺雲禪師述  in Korean,  https://plus.google.com/+Iamtalker/posts/F9Ep4g7eV5o 

Do you have a copy of 山人壺雲禪師述  in Chinese?

Thank you.

 

Edited September 29, 2018 by Shubin

[dosa]

2 hours ago, Shubin said:

 

Hope you enjoy the time off and have a perfect picnic.

BTW,  about one of your reading subjects, 山人壺雲禪師述, it is an article? or "山人壺雲禪師述 劉一明 道書十二種" is a book?

I searched with Google, but only found a copy of 山人壺雲禪師述  in Korean,  https://plus.google.com/+Iamtalker/posts/F9Ep4g7eV5o 

Do you have a copy of 山人壺雲禪師述  in Chinese?

Thank you.

 

 

Thank you very much for your time.
It's book
I've posted it on my site and then some in s.korea

https://cafe.naver.com/ArticleList.nhn?search.clubid=29197303&search.menuid=13&search.boardtype=L

 

Edited September 29, 2018 by dosa

[Mudfoot]

What is your opinion on the possibility of doing an actual relevant translation of a chinese text? 

 

If just "ling tai" is translated:

1) Pedestal of Awareness 

2) Terrace of the spirit 

3) Numinous terrace 

 

And these are just three examples. The possible number of permutations of a text is swindling. 

[dosa]

1 hour ago, Mudfoot said:

What is your opinion on the possibility of doing an actual relevant translation of a chinese text? 

 

If just "ling tai" is translated:

1) Pedestal of Awareness 

2) Terrace of the spirit 

3) Numinous terrace 

 

And these are just three examples. The possible number of permutations of a text is swindling. 

 

I am in favor of your opinion

Thanks

[Shubin]

20 hours ago, dosa said:

 

Thank you very much for your time.
It's book
I've posted it on my site and then some in s.korea

https://cafe.naver.com/ArticleList.nhn?search.clubid=29197303&search.menuid=13&search.boardtype=L

 

 

Thanks for answering my question. 

It looks like that 大道密印歌  匡庐山人 壺雲禪師述 came from this book,  http://blog.daum.net/kimunsa .

Edited September 29, 2018 by Shubin

[dosa]

On 2018. 9. 29. at 9:20 AM, Shubin said:

Do you have a copy of 山人壺雲禪師述  in Chinese?

Thank you.

 

It is a translation of a 山人壺雲禪師述 . Thank you.

[dosa]

18 hours ago, Shubin said:

 

Thanks for answering my question. 

It looks like that 大道密印歌  匡庐山人 壺雲禪師述 came from this book,  http://blog.daum.net/kimunsa .

 

大道密印歌 and 仙佛家眞修語錄 are  different.   Thank you.

[dosa]

On 2018. 9. 29. at 7:00 AM, yuuichi said:

Interesting, could you provide quotes of these theories please? I’ve never heard of them.

 

道教

三魂七魄，是中國道教對於人魂魄的說法，謂人身有三魂七魄。三魂即胎光、爽靈、幽精；七魄計有屍狗、伏矢、雀陰、吞賊、非毒、除穢、臭肺。

The three mind seven spirit:  Chinese Taoism is a sermon on human spirits. There are three mind and seven spirit in a human.

The three mind: 胎光 embryo light, 爽靈 cool soul, 幽精 deep semen, 
The seven spirit: 屍狗、伏矢、雀陰、吞賊、非毒、除穢、臭肺。

 

Link :https://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/三魂七魄

Thank you.

Edited September 30, 2018 by dosa

[yuuichi]

34 minutes ago, dosa said:

 

道教

三魂七魄，是中國道教對於人魂魄的說法，謂人身有三魂七魄。三魂即胎光、爽靈、幽精；七魄計有屍狗、伏矢、雀陰、吞賊、非毒、除穢、臭肺。

The three mind seven spirit:  Chinese Taoism is a sermon on human spirits. There are three mind and seven spirit in a human.

The three mind: 胎光 embryo light, 爽靈 cool soul, 幽精 deep semen, 
The seven spirit: 屍狗、伏矢、雀陰、吞賊、非毒、除穢、臭肺。

 

Link :https://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/三魂七魄

Thank you.

 

But this doesn’t mention anything about the practice of turning the light around! It’s just a description of the Hun and Po

[dosa]

19 minutes ago, yuuichi said:

 

But this doesn’t mention anything about the practice of turning the light around! It’s just a description of the Hun and Po

 

 Yes, that’s right

[yuuichi]

1 minute ago, dosa said:

 

 Yes, that’s right

 

But I asked whether turning the light around affects the 3 Hun or the 7 Po. You said there are many theories. I asked you to mention those theories, but you just gave a description of the 3 Hun and 7 Po. 

[dosa]

12 minutes ago, yuuichi said:

 

But I asked whether turning the light around affects the 3 Hun or the 7 Po. You said there are many theories. I asked you to mention those theories, but you just gave a description of the 3 Hun and 7 Po. 

 

Oh, my mistake. I can't tell you know sorry I am
It is complicated to explain.
All I know is enlightenment. 

 

三一神誥
哲止感調息禁觸 一意化行改妄卽眞 發大神機 性通功完是

The soul is freed from bondage.

Edited September 30, 2018 by dosa