God as Self, Atman

[Yosan]

Just testing out one of those crazy, far-fetched and unanswerable questions, as our brains so love doing.

 

Do you think it is possible for God to become a Self-Aware autonomous entity within you?

 

For a moment while meditating, I felt like I “retracted” into myself and remembered who I was. I then spoke to myself (in my own voice, in my own mind). The voice said (I said) “Hey, this is God. This is one of those rare moments that I’m aware of myself as God, as I remember that I chose to incarnate through you, this being.  Hehe. Anyway, back to being you!”  ..and Zoop, and it was over.

 

And there I was, thinking I had another one of those useless far-out moments. Then I thought, damn, here’s the thing. The truth is that this is actually pretty plausible (that I am God, that we all are).  We are all in a collective hallucination of pretending that we are not God.  The most important thing in our modern day culture is that people take themselves as absolutely seriously as they can in their separate identities.  While general quality of life for all has gone up, it seem to be more entrenched in maya (illusion) than ever.  People feel compelled to destroy each others lives over words and labels.  

 

If we could all see ourselves as God, there would be no more wars. However, the kind of shift in thinking is so radical, even if it is a closer approximation to reality than our normal, every day waking egos.  I don’t think we would stop taking ourselves seriously if we all knew this.

 

Seriousness has it’s place, however, we wouldn’t take taking things seriously so seriously.  It is thought that this is how people used to live in India a long time ago, as well as how people in tribal cultures still live.   Animals see reality more clearly than humans.  They don't have all of these competitive and hierarchical maps in their mind that makes them compulsively re-arrange their entire lives, and feeling neurotic because the world does not comply to the demands of their imagined world.  Animals don't have any problems. They are living in just one world. Us, we live in two worlds at once, the real world and the imagined world.

 

Side thought: we are addicted to our identities, regardless of what is going on in our life, good or bad. We do not want to let go of our identity, because there is always a pleasure aspect to it.  For instance, I get happy and giddy at the thought that “I am me”. I like how my body feels. I wouldn’t want to be suddenly torn into a billion pieces and returned to the collective energy field. I wouldn’t mind it, but I’m saying that i want to enjoy this thing here too while I’m here. That’s what God said, he said man, I just want to enjoy this thing while I’m there, and have a great old time. If I can’t do that, that’s fine too. Either way, it’ll be great when I wake up.  

 

The question is, how many times do you need to wake up?  Also, is there a dream that God himself must wake up from?

Thank you for taking the time to read. I love you and have an amazing day, if you can. If not, that’s okay too, you are still loved.

[wandelaar]

Replace God by Tao and you have it. As Tao is the foundation of everything it is also the foundation of you, and me and everybody. But there is no good or bad about it. Lots of enlightened people misused the power they had over their followers.

[Everything]

"Hey, this is God. This is one of those rare moments that I’m aware of myself as God, as I remember that I chose to incarnate through you, this being.  Hehe. Anyway, back to being you!"

 

Incase you forgot it, you have excellent memory and recollection. You said it, you are God. This permission slip, as are ALL tools and techniques; a permission slip, to allow yourself to be more of who it is you truely are.

 

You say can God become self aware, and the answer is no. That is why the answer seems unreachable. Because the answer is, that God is already that which is self aware. You are consciousness, non-physical vibrational being, a small part of which is focused through your physical body. And when you allow that consciousness to fully flow, as you just did allow yourself through this "permission slip" it is then that you fully feel the full nature of who it is you truely are, and you translate that as joy and love and well-being, and appreciation and empowerment and freedom and knowledge. So some people say you are created of Gods breath. This is a good analogy because breath is something that is very intangible, but still tangible enough for humans to recognize the subtle non-physical nature of it. So your soul, is like the breath of God, non-physical extension of consciousness of the greater consciousness of God. And this physical universe, again, also your physical body, an extension of the non-physical consciousness of who you are.

 

That which has no awareness of self, is existance itself. ALL that exists, physical, non-physical, for there is nothing outside of it to even compare itself to and thus recognize itself. But even all that exists can wake up, from the unconsciousness, into more of all that it is. For existance is infinite, eternally expanding, evermore. You are a vital part of this ever expansion. You can never exclude yourself from it. You are forever connected to your greater consciousness. That which you call Source, or God, always flows through you. Sometimes less, and you can feel in those cases, that you feel less good aswell. So you recognize you are capable of allowing your self to flow with the stream of your own summoning of your own energy of your own life force, your own breath, more fully more often, to allow it to flow through you more fully more often, more freely. As you then allow this physical extension of who you are to walk and blend hand in hand, a perfect blended being of physical and non-physical, like Jesus often was, or Buddha, or all those physical beings you recognize to have been fully aligned with their own greater non-physical Source of greater consciousness. Their physical being less resistant in nature more able to more allow the full flowing of their greater consciousness, that everyone is always eternally connected to.

 

In the past I had similar experiences as you had. And I was basically overjoyed, and when I seemingly lost it and forgot it, and could no longer make sense out of it, I thought I had lost everything. And I basically cried. All day long. Only to realize, I can never be disconnected. And then I had to let go of all those false ideas and believes that have nothing to do with my true nature. And I came to understand that everything and everyone is God. And it is ok if we forgot that. Because then you can come the joyoush experience of remembering all of it. And the amazing relief you feel in every step of remembering more and more of who it is you really are. And that you're never complete, always perfect, ever expanding, eternal, infinite. And that the joy is in the journey. Some people die in order to catch up with their full nature. You are capable of doing it right now as you're still alife. Because there is only life and more life. So all those people that are dead, they are still here and now, flowing through everyone and everything that is here, as non-physical consciousness, which you are mostly aswell. And this non physical consciousness, focuses on thought, thought that is focused upon long enough, by many, becomes thought form, and further, this thought turns into manifestation, that is the physical universe that you see here all around you, which has been thought into creation long before you were born, and the well being is so immense, that nothing can ever go wrong in this physical universe. Well-being abounds. And there is no source of evil. That is but thoughts, thought by humans, the spin off of mans thought, things that are thought upon long enough, become thought forms. And there are many thought forms, so these thought forms can appear real, but are not physical and real like the physical universe. But they can never become real, because they don't flow from your Source. When you align with the true energy that is you, you have pre-cognition, because you realize, that what you truely desire, will always come about in as real a way as your deliciously specific real reality around you. So it's no different from realizing that you are the creator of all of it. Because when you realize it, you realize it within and without. Thoughts can turn into things, if you align with your true nature and purpose as a co-creator of life and your life. You always create, with every thought that you think. Wether you know it or not. So instead of being a creator by default, you become a deliberate creator. You begin to feel for thought, and feel for the thought that your own soul, Source, God, whatever you wish to call it, is thinking right now. And some people find it hard to think pure positive thought. So they meditate, and find it easier to think no thought. What happens when you think no thought, your physical nature and mind begins to rise to its natural high state of pure positive vibrational energy, and awareness of your Soul's perspective begins to seep into your conscious awareness. So you can stay there on that high flying state of being of feeling pure positive energy and knowing and love and joy. And then translate your Soul's perspective into all that it knows for you. It is always focused upon your life and all that it is. And you can feel the relationship of your perspective with the current now perspective of your Soul or Source or God on the same subject of your attention. The worse you feel, the more different your perspective is of that of your soul's perspective on the very same subject you are then now focused upon. And the better you feel, the more in harmony and alignment your perspective is with that of your Soul or God or Source, on the very same subject you are focused upon. So this meditation and quiting of the mind, allows people to rise to their natural high flying vibrational state of being that is capable of translating the thought that is in harmony with your soul's greater knowing.

So a great and easy first step that a deliberate creator decides for itself, is that of "I care so much about how I feel, I will decide to feel better more of the time, unconditionally, meaning in any condition, meaning, regardless of the condition I am in. Wether I meditate or think a better feeling thought on this now experience that I am now focused upon, where all my power is in the now. To feel better anyway. For the purpose of my life is joy. And the basis of my life, is absolute freedom. So free, you can choose bondage. So then you realize, you made the choice, and you can always choose something better. You don't need to undo any creation. Just feel now, and think a better feeling thought and perspective now. How you do it, doesn't matter. I find that any subject can be brought back into alignment with your souls perspective, more in harmony with it, by defining how your current perspective feels in emotional or feeling terms right now, and how you would then want it to feel, feel that, and realize the truth of it by virtue of deliberate focus on what feels like that in your now experience of reality, in general broad capability of perceiving it right now, which then expands the feeling and capability of recognizing that general perspective that feels like that preferred emotion in alignment with the feeling and perspective of your soul more specifically unto the subject at hand. And it is an energetic alignment, so it happens through feeling. Feeling your way to the full allowing of the full consciousness of all that you are, regardless of what you are focused upon.

 

Edited October 28, 2018 by Everything

[Everything]

So to give an example of me in my now life coming to know myself more as "God" knows me and my life. 

 

I experience my life as, frustration, dissapointment, impatient maybe even sad. As the general emotional translation of my full experience now, into this simple general description. 

 

My specific perspective that allows me to feel this way:

"Where is all that I want. Where is all that I have wanted in my life! And still don't have... Where is all the good in this life? " 

 

I can imagine the pure desire. That everything that happens is good. That I can just enjoy my life. And then feel that I want to be constantly enjoying all that occurs in life as it is then good. And the liberating feeling of enjoying all that goodness that occurs as every moment is a good and another good moment and so happy and fullfilled constantly by life, so easily. Naturally, effortlessly. 

I can imagine that for the purpose of feeling it, by focusing on it more. To feel it more. To find the feeling place of it. And then I am capable of defining those general feeling states.

 

So as I know what I don't want, unfullfilled, I know more clearly what I do want aswell. Fulfilled. Reliefed. 

 

So then I take this general feeling and focus on it, making general statements that I already believe right now about my now life reality, that are a vibrational match to it. I can feel. And focus. Fulfilled. 

 

I am talking to you. There are people who look for God, like me. There are people who never let go of their eternal desire for the goodness they know they deserve. Every new generations becomes less tolerant for all that is not of the God they know and feel from within. Every generation comes to greater remembrance and realization. <---

I scrap that last thought, because it was too specific. I can feel my energy is not lined up. It doesn't feel like fulfillment to me, because my believe is that this expansion of the community around me is too slow going. So focusing on that community is to feel less fulfilled. So I zoom back out, more general more easy things that I believe right now that feels like fulfillment. 

I know I can feel my way to what my Source knows of me, and I know I will be overjoyed when I realize this guided and fully aligned perspective for myself. I don't have to wait for anyone in order to fulfill my own reason for being here. 

I know my Source of Being knows the direct path towards all that I want for me and is guiding me towards it right now. And I can feel my way to that guidance. My emotions are the fullfillment of all my desired. I love my emotions. My ability to feel and recognize. What I do want and what I don't want. 

I have already experienced the fulfillment of my desires in the past. 

If it were not for the joy, I would have never recognized it to be all that I want. 

It was effortless to allow myself to enjoy all of it. 

I still allow myself to enjoy it from time to time. 

As the person I love so much. That came into my life as I came into her life. 

The fulfillment of both our purpose in life for allowing ourselves to be with eachother, regardless of the distance between us. 

I know my connection to this person is not dissapeared. And wont ever dissapear. I know every relationship is eternal. I know everyone is our soulmate. And to allow myself to be with a specific person is nothing that is judged to be less by God. For God never judges anything! Otherwise we would feel good in our judgement aswell. 

I'm just gonna love this person and surrender to the natural fulfillment of my life. 

If we still love eachother, after so many years of running away from the love that we are, then I no longer have to run out of fear for losing that love. Cause I already realised it is what I want, because I wanted to never be able to lose that love. That is who I always have wanted to be. So I have no choice but to allow myself to be fulfilled in this way. And I know if this is what I want, then I no longer need to wait untill I die before I allow myself to believe that I deserve to be happy forever now. If this person fulfills my life so much, there is no reason on earth to resist that. So I am already fulfilled. Now I have to allow my fulfillment. And that is easy. I just stop dissallowing it, and the allowing naturally occurs. I feel eager to open my door to my love now that I know I deserve it. And I feel fulfilled by the love as the love that I have been given, and no longer judge it to be any less than any other love. I cannot help but be fulfilled in life, by life, as life. I am fulfilled. In this moment I feel fulfilled. 

 

So now I am more in harmony with the perspective of my soul. Huge relief and feel allot better and feel excited for what is next in my life. For I know it is the fulfillment of my lifes purpose. And now I am more capable of receiving the greater truth of all that I truely am, in this here and now moment, where all of my power always truely is. 

Did I allow God fully to flow through me, like Jesus did? No... But! Was I less like Jesus was, then I am now? Yes! And that is the point. For even God becomes more of that which is God. Did I reach full mastery? No... But did I reach more mastery in my allowing of my natural fullfillment in life, than I was when I disallowed that fulfillment? Yeah... Cause there is no completion. Every moment has never been before. And so will every moment of fullfillment be a moment of fullfillment unlike any that has ever been before. 

 

So what happens next is I go up to this old love, and learn that she is dead. Shocked. Griefed. And overjoyed. Why? Because I know now, if I feel bad, I am not fully allowing my Source's perspective to flow through me. So I am overjoyed that I have now come upon this experienced of tremendous grief. Why? Because that means this experience is UNLIKE ANYTHING I HAVE EVER EXPERIENCED BEFORE! So now I have to allow my knowing to expand beyond that which it has EVER BEEN BEFORE! Which is that my love was not for her. My love was through her. Her love was through me through her. Our love was through us. Our love can be through everything. Even through you. We are all of the same one consciousness. That is the greater consciousness of all that exists. Expanding forever more. Through all of us. Forever coming to a greater awareness of itself. Through us. We are the love that flows through us. We are the breath of God. We are the life force, the pulse of the well-being that is the dominant motion forward and eternal and infinite expansion of this entire universe.

I can love through everything and anything. I can allow myself to be love. And how I allow myself to be love will forever express itself in a different way, always here and now. In the neutrality of each new reality. That is a new opportunity, to experience myself in a new way. For the purpose of the love that is who it is I truely am made out of. As the loving light as the substance of all that exists in this creation. So to think that all has gone bad in her dying, is to dishonor what her love truely was. For her body was not her love for me. Her body is what flowed her love to me. But I don't need her to be in a body, a physical body, in order to allow myself to receive her love, through me, and feel for it as she exist here right now, in a boundless space, a timeless place. Of non physical vibrational expression of the ever unfoldment of what our ever expanding love has always become, now and forevermore. 

So to allow myself to feel loved, unconditionally, is to fully honor the love that both of us has allowed to unfold through both of us together. For the experience of that love is eternal. The physical proof however, is temporary. For it has never been about the physical manifestation. That is only secondary to our true nature. And thus then, we can allow this physical nature to always unfold oerfectly and naturally, in full harmony with all that we truely are, as love. 

Edited October 28, 2018 by Everything

[NeiGongJohn]

From wiki:

 

"According to Meher Baba, the aim of all beings in Creation, in fact, the very purpose of Creation, is the attainment of God-realization. A soul is God-realized when it has first traversed evolution, taking each successive form in Creation until it achieves full consciousness in the human form (the terminus of physical evolution), then has gone through successive human lives during reincarnation, then traverses the inner planes of consciousness during involution. Once past the inner planes, the soul achieves consciousness of its true original identity as God."

[s1va]

On 10/28/2018 at 3:37 AM, Yosan said:

Do you think it is possible for God to become a Self-Aware autonomous entity within you?

 

There is a small problem with that question itself.  It assumes a complete duality of a separate God and other entity (me) and then God appearing within me.  If we have to conceptualize a God, then that God is the one and the many in the world at the same time.  There is nothing that separates any of us or the God.

 

So, it is not possible for God to become self-aware as an autonomous entity within anyone.  But God can become self-aware, that is sort of what we call as Realization.  Then the little 'me' as a separate individual will disappear or become part of that one whole entity.

 

Thanks for the sharing and the questions.  Much Love

 

[ilumairen]

 The divine is always within, and we are 'infused' with divinity.. it's just a matter of awareness imo.

[3bob]

even God can't stop us from reaching God...

[wandelaar]

My information comes from following the news. But on the internet I found this article:

 

https://info-buddhism.com/Abuse_and_Buddhism-Behind_the_Smiling_Facade-Anna_Sawerthal.html

 

I haven't read it from start to finish (because I already know about it), but the article looks OK to get an impression of what I am talking about.

 

Edited October 31, 2018 by wandelaar

[wandelaar]

Yes - that's the usual way to avoid the issue by redefining enlightenment so as to exclude the ugly cases. I rather look the beast in the eye and acknowledge that cases of abuse also happen in the context of eastern religions. In fact everywhere where there is a hierarchy and a closed group structure we see the same thing happening, whether it is in churches, sects, the army, fraternities, show business, sports, private companies, etc.

 

But I am not going to waste my time on debating the issue. It's clear for all who want to see it, and those who think their very special branch of religion or activity is immune to the problem will always find ways to close their eyes to the problem.

[Everything]

On 1-11-2018 at 9:34 AM, wandelaar said:

Yes - that's the usual way to avoid the issue by redefining enlightenment so as to exclude the ugly cases. I rather look the beast in the eye and acknowledge that cases of abuse also happen in the context of eastern religions. In fact everywhere where there is a hierarchy and a closed group structure we see the same thing happening, whether it is in churches, sects, the army, fraternities, show business, sports, private companies, etc.

 

But I am not going to waste my time on debating the issue. It's clear for all who want to see it, and those who think their very special branch of religion or activity is immune to the problem will always find ways to close their eyes to the problem.

You are in that case not only no different than they are, you are actually identical to them in your practice of your strict views on life. Those strict identities that are defensive and argue for their own limitations such as you are doing aswell, could benefit allot from easing up on themselves. Because if you wanna be enlightened, simply lighten up on yourself. You can demand yourself to carry the weight of the world on your shoulders and at the same time think that you can ever be of even the slightest benefit to anyone in the whole universe. Not even yourself is allowed to benefit from yourself, by your argueing for your own limitations. So if you're not allowing yourself to simply be yourself, in the natural way that you were created, which means, the person who you are which has not been designed to solve the problems of this world, except the problems which you only create for yourself of arrogance and ignorance.

If you are trying to give rise to the sun, you will always feel tired from working yourself to oblivion all night long, for absolutely no other reason than accomplishing your own unnecessary exhaustion, that only serves to limit you and drain the people around you who then also have to now help you recover from your own stupidity, as you are still arrogantly holding on to your ego that thinks you are a hero and saving people, when in reality you are a perpetual and chronic victim of your own arrogance and ignorance. 

 

I know you would like to blame other people for who you have become. But that doesn't change who you now are. Except, it causes you to realize that who you now are, is not fully allowing yourself to he who it is you really actually are, or want to be at the very least. If you can even remember who you are. God knows how long you've been asleep in this never ending dream of arrogance and ignorance. You might aswell, start going back to elementary school and relearn life. Years of education. And you'd most likely still get even more stupid in the process.

Untill you begin to realize, that no one cares. And they are kind to you anyway. So maybe you will realize that you can be kind aswell. Regardless of who someone else is. And in so doing you begin to receive actual true value into that dense head of yours. To learn what actually matters in life. And stop being so arrogant, maybe for the first time ever in your life. But that's up to you. You can still choose to limit yourself. Untill you see the pattern of this take shape over several years, and then desire to see a different pattern, that is more free and more in alignment with your actual true nature. And eventually, you can't blame anyone but yourself. No matter how much you want to. Because blaming others will always continue your trajectory into more self limitation, even to the degree of being limitted to further limit yourself. Thus, it makes absolutely zero difference to all of creation, what you decide to choose for yourself. That is not cruel. That is freedom. And you can never destroy it, except for yourself. 

I know it sucks. But you cannot get sick enough to make other people better. You just have to let all of that go. And accept the natural well being. 

That is what it means to not be arrogant. To accept what you deserve, because you are not different from anyone else in that you deserve to naturally abbundant well being of life. No matter who you are or where you are or what you are. Isn't that easy? To acknowledge this ease is wisdom and knowledge. To lighten up on yourself is enlightenment. And you will always be free to choose it and be free to deserve it unconditionally. No matter how many years you practice the strict believe that says otherwise. And so stop caring so much about other people business. You came here to live your own unique you life that you are forever blessed to be and live now and be now. Who you naturally easily and effortlessly are as a good feeling free nature of who it is you have always actually been. 

Edited November 5, 2018 by Everything

[wandelaar]

Strangely the posts that disputed the possibility that enlightened people could abuse their disciples have now disappeared, so now my reactions appear to be unrelated to anything else. 

[Michael Sternbach]

It's not that God isn't aware of being you. It's you who aren't aware of being God.

[3bob]

30 minutes ago, Michael Sternbach said:

It's not that God isn't aware of being you. It's you who aren't aware of being God.

 

umm, being a once upon a time "you" that does not remain... 

[Michael Sternbach]

8 minutes ago, 3bob said:

 

umm, being a once upon a time "you" that does not remain... 

 

I beg to differ. God is the creator of individuality, not its destroyer. And the realisation of its divinity  expands the self, but doesn't destroy it either. (There is the danger of ego inflation there, but that would be a topic of its own.)

[3bob]

a once upon a time you does not remain being that it was a composite of mental/personality factors and identification, whereas if you mean the soul or spirit you that realizes it is not a mental/personality composite then I agree with your drift...

Edited November 5, 2018 by 3bob

[Everything]

On 5-11-2018 at 4:17 PM, 3bob said:

a once upon a time you does not remain being that it was a composite of mental/personality factors and identification, whereas if you mean the soul or spirit you that realizes it is not a mental/personality composite then I agree with your drift...

You can think yourself seperate from your soul, but your soul will never enter this thought/perspective with you. Yes your soul knows, like you may know, that some thoughts only serve to limit you, but this thought of seperation from your own soul is just one of those thoughts! Thus people feel disconnected and negative emotion. Because your soul is forever eternally connected to you. And your heart can always instantly feel if you go counter to your very own greater truth that you always have eternal connection to. Otherwise you would feel nothing. And if you think you are a powerless victim stuck in a physical body as a prison, you block your own life force from fully and naturally flowing. Thus you feel less than good. Untill you give up the fight and just surrender. Ok... I am eternal. I am not stuck, I am not complete, I am forever becoming more. And mostly, I'm here to have fun. That is what people find so hard to understand. They think eternity is bad, because they forgot their reason for being here. Just to have fun. Nothing to proof, ever. Nothing to accomplish except the enjoying of the journey. You create your life the way you want it to be. You do this with the help of your soul. This soul is just a higher non physical aspect of the more complete more TOTAL YOU! You you you and you! So your soul knows all is well. Knows all that you want. And knows your path towards all that you want. But what you want is not a destination. There is no such thing as a destination. There is no frozen snapshot of life. Your ultimate destination is the joyous journey of the ever expansion that is your true reason for being here. To just have fun and come to new preferences and allow yourself to be inspired by life to move beyond that which you have ever experienced, forever more. Forever becoming.

And no matter how much you create this forgetfulness of your true nature of who you truely are. It is not everlasting, because it requires allot of persistent effort to continue that illusion of forgetfulness and limitation and it is always exhausting and temporary. But you're so good at it that it may take some realization of what you're actually doing. Cause it's so easy so obvious it's become oblivious. And eventually, and always, things happen to disturb the illusion and forgetfulness, small simple experience that unveil the obvious in one extatic moment of ellation after another. And you feel and experience true value and then wanna wake up. Cause you are that true nature that you seek. But since your mind cannot understand because it doesn't have an open channel for comprehending or relating the understanding, at first, except maybe a few. You need persistent faith in your hearts perfect nature to feel your way beyond the current mind to the higher truth of who you actually really are now, always have been and always will be, which exists in a truth that is different from what your mind has been trained to perceive and observe and translate. Because your heart is all of that right now and always. You don't have to look for the truth outside of yourself. Because your perception determines how you look. And your truth is in the way you look and why you look. You truth is in core values. And you can feel that through your heart. So it is infinitely times more simple then you can ever imagine. Otherwise it would not be eternal and infinite if your truth was a heavy complicated substance. It would crumble instantly under its own weight. The highest truth of all that you are is non physical and subtle. And all of that, you in your physical body can feel. What is more specific and lucid than an emotional feeling about something? You can never enjoy a painful emotion and nor are you suppose to. So its perfect. Do you want your mind to explode? Or do you just wanna enjoy life. Not a difficult answer. That you have to feel before you can recognize those higher frequency thought patterns and perceptions. And THEN they will become visible to you. Once you train your mind to perceive thoughts and things and perceptions that feel good, then more you can more effortlessly uncover the simple truth that is so expansive in nature. And so enlightening! Because it feels so light and easy! So effortless, so free. And then you will know what you need to know when you need to know it, always in harmony with your reason for being here. Not to gather endless information. But just to have fun and know that all is well. And that you deserve all of the wellness of all these physical and deliciously specific physical and truely valuable life experiences. That fulfill your reason for being here in the joy of the experience and the launching into the new and even greater experience that all of this will always forever inspire within you. That is why dead people don't go away. They stay here. Because this is where all the fun is at. Right here and now. And your soul is focused entirely upon you. And loving you. And if you love yourself, you feel the joy of tye agreement with your soul. And if you hate yourself, you feel the pain of the unnecessary disagreement with your soul. So its perfect that it doesn't feel good. Because you can never be disconnected from your full unconditional acces to your very own soul. Cherrish that. Love that. Bless that feeling of your heart. It is eternally valuable. For even in the greatest pain, you will realise, the truth you perceive feels bad, because YOU KNOW! DEEP DOWN INSIDE, YOU KNOW! That something greater exists. Otherwise this woulden't feel less than the greatest, most fully expanded now version of the greatest truth, and now and now. Forever feeding off on your relationship with all that exists, in the thoughts you think and feeding them right back to you in emotion, realization, full blown life experiences, of whatever you offer. You are eternally and infinitely worthy like that. You can never get lost, because you will always be right here and right now. As all that exists always exists here and now. Simple, easy, fun. Infinitely blessed and loved and worthy of whatever you so truely and purely desire. 

Edited November 6, 2018 by Everything

[3bob]

umm, not to have the kind of fun of fulfilling 10,000 questionable desires, but to fulfill the one true desire of Self Realization.

 

I don't know about anyone else here but you often post faster and farther than I normally have the time or commitment to fully  read,

guess I'm just a skimmer at a couple of paragraphs to get the gist of what a poster is saying.

[Sol]

21 hours ago, Everything said:

 And if you think you are a powerless victim stuck in a physical body as a prison, you block your own life force from fully and naturally flowing. Thus you feel less than good. Untill you give up the fight and just surrender. Ok... I am eternal. I am not stuck, I am not complete, I am forever becoming more. And mostly, I'm here to have fun. That is what people find so hard to understand. They think eternity is bad, because they forgot their reason for being here. Just to have fun. Nothing to proof, ever. Nothing to accomplish except the enjoying of the journey.

 

I know there tends to be a wall of text with Everything's responses, so here is the critical part from this answer.

 

If you reached the height of heights and absolute understanding, and turned around to look back, this is generally what you see.

It may be hard for the intense cerebral peeps to grasp, but its all right there...

[Michael Sternbach]

On 5.11.2018 at 4:17 PM, 3bob said:

a once upon a time you does not remain being that it was a composite of mental/personality factors and identification, whereas if you mean the soul or spirit you that realizes it is not a mental/personality composite then I agree with your drift...

 

I would agree to this as far as it goes...

 

However, it seems to speak to a certain lack of respect for our empirical self, typical of some spiritual traditions. Whereas others (which I feel more in tune with) uphold its uniqueness and eternal validity.

[3bob]

7 hours ago, Michael Sternbach said:

 

I would agree to this as far as it goes...

 

However, it seems to speak to a certain lack of respect for our empirical self, typical of some spiritual traditions. Whereas others (which I feel more in tune with) uphold its uniqueness and eternal validity.

 

ok, that assumption of connotation is plausible...so instead lets say there is nothing wrong with the roots of lotus flower being in the mud. (which has somewhat of a different drift)

 

[Patrick Brown]

For the intellectuals there's "The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind" By Julian Jaynes, although I've never read it but the ideas it puts forward are often discussed at cocktail parties or high-table, apparently!

 

For your regular Joe's there's Clozapine! or Alcohol or Both!!! 

 

For frightened people there's Religion!!!!!

 

For the rest of us there's:

 

 

[Marblehead]

I'll pass, thank you.

 

[Michael Sternbach]

23 hours ago, 3bob said:

 

ok, that assumption of connotation is plausible...so instead lets say there is nothing wrong with the roots of lotus flower being in the mud. (which has somewhat of a different drift)

 

 

I am not quite sure how this ties in with the question of how the spiritual self relates to the empirical self - is the former the lotus flower in your view, and the latter the mud?

 

At any rate, I do think that this analogy has its use, and indeed, every so often it seems like our self is some kind of transformational mechanism endlessly pumping up 'karmic' (?) stuff that needs to be processed and refined. - This is actually a pretty strong picture.

 

That said, the way I look at this model, there are no dividing lines within the self, and it is the empirical self itself which is refined and becoming the spiritual (or 'higher') self in this process.

[3bob]

4 hours ago, Michael Sternbach said:

 

I am not quite sure how this ties in with the question of how the spiritual self relates to the empirical self - is the former the lotus flower in your view, and the latter the mud?

 

At any rate, I do think that this analogy has its use, and indeed, every so often it seems like our self is some kind of transformational mechanism endlessly pumping up 'karmic' (?) stuff that needs to be processed and refined. - This is actually a pretty strong picture.

 

That said, the way I look at this model, there are no dividing lines within the self, and it is the empirical self itself which is refined and becoming the spiritual (or 'higher') self in this process.

 

Agreed that that is a pretty strong picture. And surely most will agree that there is a two way street so to speak going on,  which is indicated to some by Solomon's six pointed star.  But I also differ on the idea that an empirical human self becomes the spiritual or higher self in the process implied...being that I see the human self as becoming a refined vehicle or matrix for an already existent spiritual self to manifest through.