The Brexit Thread

[Patrick Brown]

As there is a similar battle for freedom going on in the UK i.e. Brexit I thought I'd give it a little soapbox here. 

 

Currently we're at the crossroads and either Theresa May will soon be booted or something serious, one way or the other, will transpire. 

 

Quote

Multiple cabinet ministers expressed significant doubts about the prime minister's preferred Brexit plan from the start, the BBC has learned.

 

Parts of Theresa May's plan were described as "worrying", "disappointing" and "concerning" by members of her top team back in July.

 

Mrs May is struggling to broker an agreement on Brexit with ministers.

Two ministers have told the BBC they believe there is little chance the deal would get Parliament's backing.

Source: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-46175150

 

And:

 

Quote

BREXIT LIVE: May has 48 HOURS to save deal - Barnier summons EU leaders as D-DAY arrives  

 It comes as Mrs May cancelled an emergency Cabinet meeting to approve a Brexit deal, which was scheduled for Monday. The Prime Mininster's former Foreign Secretary believes Mrs May’s plans for leaving the EU are “a recipe for continued strife”,  accusing Mrs May of being on “the brink of total surrender” to Brussels. Arch-Brexiteer Mr Johnson’s attack on the Prime Minister comes just days after his Brother Jo Johnson - A Remainer - quit a transport minister.

Souce: https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1044025/brexit-news-boris-johnson-theresa-may-chequers-michel-barnier

 

So chaos as normal over here! 

[Marblehead]

I still think that issue should go to the people for vote.  In politics there's too many power and money issues for it to be a decision in the best interest of the people.

 

If England exits I'm sure Germany won't be too far behind.  And that will be the end of African and Middle Eastern countries controlling the people of Europe.

 

[Patrick Brown]

2 minutes ago, Marblehead said:

I still think that issue should go to the people for vote.  In politics there's too many power and money issues for it to be a decision in the best interest of the people.

 

If England exits I'm sure Germany won't be too far behind.  And that will be the end of African and Middle Eastern countries controlling the people of Europe.

 

 

Germany will be the last to leave as in effect they are the EU hence all the jibes about third time lucky. The only concern people have about a second vote, other than it's not democratic as we've already voted, is that it could be fixed this time around. To be honest if we did have a second vote, it'll never happen, the leave camp would win by an even greater margin! There's a lot of propaganda by the remoaners and the majority of the press is on board but very few of the public are buying the snake oil. 

 

The problem at the moment is simply that the government are incompetent especially the prime minister and seem incapable of figuring out our exit strategy. The terms "vassalage" and "vassal" have been brought into play to describe Theresa May! Yes I had to look them up. 

 

More and more people are thinking a "Hard Brexit" is the way forward which may be slightly more risky but at least we will be free and not constrained in any way by the EU.    

[Patrick Brown]

The media are currently suggesting that a no deal meaning hard Brexit, possibly by the end of the week, is the most likely outcome. If this happens a lot of people will wonder why we didn't just didn't jump 2 years ago! Most people in favour of Brexit wanted us to just get out ASAP!

 

Quote

Theresa May will trigger no-deal plans unless there is a Brexit deal this week

LONDON — Theresa May is on the brink of officially triggering contingency plans for a no deal Brexit with the chances of negotiators in Brussels agreeing on a withdrawal deal this week looking increasingly slim.

 

Thursday, November 15 is reportedly the deadline for the UK government to confirm no deal measures like the hiring of boats for importing vital products plus the stockpiling of medicines and pharmaceutical goods.

 

This means that unless May is unable to put a provisional Withdrawal Agreement before ministers at the Cabinet's next meeting on Tuesday, there almost certainly won't be an EU summit this month to finalise the UK's exit.

 

A no deal Brexit would cause severe disruption across multiple facets of day to day British life. New border checks could lead to shortages of food and medicines, ministers have warned, while planes could be grounded.

source: http://uk.businessinsider.com/theresa-may-trigger-no-deal-plans-unless-there-is-a-brexit-deal-this-week-2018-11

 

Anyway fingers crossed as we might, don't hold your breath, know what's happening by the end of the week!  

 

Edited November 12, 2018 by Patrick Brown

[Marblehead]

Well, even with the exit, it shouldn't be that difficult to establish new trade agreements.  Suppliers will still want to sell their products.  England is a consumer.  (Unless politics prevents it from happening.)

 

[dawei]

While there is a lot of talk on how folks like tradition or practice diversity on the site, I have really liked the geographic diversity and hearing about the EU or Brexit or asian countries has been a great, free history and current events lesson.  Its good to hear voices from across the pond    Thanks for this. 

 

[Patrick Brown]

The Nigel Farage show live in about 10 minutes:

 

 

[rene]

Ditto what dawei said, Patrick.

Thanks for the thread & keep it coming.

Going to watch the Farage vid now.

 

[Patrick Brown]

Well a deal is on the table, albeit a draft, and if accepted we could get tied into the EU for years to come. People are saying we don't know what's in the deal but parts have been leaked and they say we're be stuck in  a customs union which may also mean we're stuck with the current open boarder situation regarding migration! 

 

Here's what the BBC say, although they are biased towards remain in most peoples opinion: 

Quote

UK and EU officials have agreed the draft text of a Brexit agreement after months of negotiations in Brussels.

 

A cabinet source told the BBC that the document has been agreed at a technical level by officials from both sides after intensive discussions this week.

 

A special cabinet meeting will be held at 14:00 GMT on Wednesday as Theresa May seeks ministers' backing.

The PM is meeting ministers in Downing Street for one-to-one talks as they are given sight of the draft agreement.

 

The pound surged against the dollar and the euro - but analysts warned it could be short-lived, with the cabinet and Parliament yet to agree to the plans.

 

The EU said it would "take stock" on Wednesday, and the Irish government said negotiations were "ongoing and have not concluded".

Source: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46188790

 

Here's the view from a more pro Brexit news service:

Quote

With the Brexit deal thrashed out between the UK and EU negotiating  teams, Theresa May now faces the political battle of her life - getting her Cabinet to support it.

 

Her team of senior ministers is finely balanced between Brexiteers and Remainers, as the PM has had to walk a tightrope to keep both wings of her party on board. 

 

And after many months of wrangling and careful compromises, she now must convince her team to row in behind her and support the Brexit plan.

 

But Brexiteer Cabinet ministers are under massive pressure to face down the PM and force her to abandon the deal, which critics say will leave the UK a 'slave' to the EU.

 

As the ministers are called into Number Ten one by one to be briefed by the PM on the plan, many will be weighing up whether they can - or want to - support it.

 

If Mrs May is hit by a fresh wave of resignations, it will be hard to see how her Brexit plan - or her premiership - will survive.

Source: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6385757/Who-Cabinet-ministers-resign-Brexit.html

 

 

Edited November 13, 2018 by Patrick Brown

[rene]

Listened to it all, very interesting! Sounds like you have your own rendition of the 'swamp' and Brexit might help drain a big part of that.. or perhaps not."Civil Service" rules here too.. only our version of Yes, Prime Minister (the old tv show) is lethal and never funny.

Hard Brexit should have come within 30 days of the vote, imo.

There are always ways.

Just slip out the back, Jack.

 

 

Thanks again.

[Patrick Brown]

Very big day for democracy here in the UK! Will the PM do what the people voted for or be be toppled, will the draft EU leave deal be accepted and will party members resign? Well as we can all see Theresa May isn't doing what the people voted for so the 'proverbial' should hit the fan, big time! Anything could happen so it'll be an interesting day.

 

Quote

Brexit deal: Theresa May to face cabinet showdown

Theresa May faces a crunch cabinet meeting later as she tries to win colleagues' support for a draft Brexit agreement between the UK and EU.

 

Senior ministers will gather in Downing Street at 14:00 GMT amid calls to reject the deal from both senior Brexiteers and some Remain supporters.

 

The PM is also continuing one-to-one briefings with ministers on the plans.

 

Some cabinet members have "deep reservations", BBC political editor Laura Kuenssberg says.

 

But the draft is seen as a significant moment in the negotiations between the UK and Brussels.

Source: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46203425

 

Quote

‘I can’t think of ANYTHING worse’ - Jacob Rees-Mogg savages Theresa May's Brexit deal

PROMINENT Brexit supporter Jacob Rees-Mogg launched an impassioned attack on Theresa May’s proposed EU exit deal, describing it as “completely incompetent” and claiming “it’s hard to think of anything that could be worse”.

Source: https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1045043/Brexit-news-deal-Jacob-Rees-Mogg-Theresa-May-EU-exit-deal-Brussels

 

[Patrick Brown]

This is why many of us in the UK like Farage but because he stands up and speaks the truth! This was him speaking at the EU yesterday (check Merkel's face, she hates him):

 

 

Edited November 14, 2018 by Patrick Brown

[Patrick Brown]

Tons of really interesting, up to the minute, live comments here:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2018/nov/14/brexit-deal-theresa-may-conservatives-meet-decide-cabinet-politics-live

 

EDIT...

 

And here's the BBC live timeline:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-politics-46200010

 

Edited November 14, 2018 by Patrick Brown
Added the BBC timeline link

[Marblehead]

Well, I just hope, for the British common people, this doesn't end up with Britain kissing up to the New World Order.  That would actually cause Trump more headaches.

 

[Patrick Brown]

Farage LIVE any minute:

 

[Patrick Brown]

Well all I can say is that the 'shit-has-hit-the-fan'! It's going to be chaos for weeks, probably months, here in the UK. 

[Marblehead]

Well, now you know first hand what America is experiencing.

 

[Patrick Brown]

Here's the draft agreement which the cabinet has given the first nod to although it's doubtful it will get through Parliament:  https://ec.europa.eu/commission/sites/beta-political/files/draft_withdrawal_agreement_0.pdf

 

Leaks have already stated that it will keep us tied into the EU until 2030!! Project May-hem is in effect here in the UK and I think the British people will be making moves very soon. Of course May could be forced out but we'll have to wait and see. 

[Apech]

8 hours ago, Marblehead said:

Well, I just hope, for the British common people, this doesn't end up with Britain kissing up to the New World Order.  That would actually cause Trump more headaches.

 

 

 

there's nothing common about us! 

[Patrick Brown]

Seven page outline of what's going on: https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/756378/14_November_Outline_Political_Declaration_on_the_Future_Relationship.pdf 

 

 

[Patrick Brown]

The lies are coming out already! Theresa May stood outside number 10 Downing street and said the cabinet had agreed to accept the draft agreement (only the first stage of many before it goes into effect) although this was not true! Apparently it's coming out that there were some major shouting and arguments and at least 10 ministers were not agreeing with the draft which is around half of the cabinet!!! See attached pic from the BBC front-page. Here's the article which shouldn't change: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46215930

 

So our Prime Minister, the leader of the UK, stood there and lied to the whole of our country on live TV!!!! Here it is (If you can get the BBC web page in the above link the clip is on there and the sound is much better, shouts and all from the public in the background!):

 

 

Edited November 14, 2018 by Patrick Brown

[Patrick Brown]

I can't see her surviving as it will just look so, so corrupt and she will be outed as a lackey of the EU and a shill! She didn't win any battle she just ignored her cabinet ministers and did what she liked! 

 

[Patrick Brown]

Live on Sky News, the facts are that there was no agreement, cabinet split:

https://news.sky.com/story/brexit-lock-in-keeps-cabinet-battling-over-agreement-11553725 

[Patrick Brown]

UK citizens can sign this petition to force the political leaders to have a TV debate of the EU withdrawal agreement draft:

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/228572

[Marblehead]

Won't go.  It says only UK or British citizens can sign the petition.