Patrick Brown Posted December 12, 2018 I think the public might be beginning to realise that all this talk about a deal is balls! We didn't vote for a deal we voted to leave. Of course if our leaving can be facilitated for the mutual benefit of all parties then everybody would be happy, I'm referring to the EU here. If the EU want to take the piss then we drop them and of course we will suffer but not as badly as the EU which is close to imploding anyway. We will be trading with the rest of the world but the EU will be dealing with civil war and absolute chaos! Will we be blamed? Possibly but the EU are the ones not playing the game as they're basically trying to screw us and damage us as much as possible. Drop the EU now! As said piss takers! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Miffymog Posted December 12, 2018 (edited) hmmm - rumors currently are that she'll survive - we'll know for sure quite shortly... edit - and with the DUP supporting her (if not her deal) she could end up surviving a vote of no confidence from Labour. Edited December 12, 2018 by Miffymog 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Patrick Brown Posted December 12, 2018 (edited) Does seem to be support for here so she could get the numbers needed, unfortunately! Sky saying she's got 158 at the mo. Edited December 12, 2018 by Patrick Brown 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Patrick Brown Posted December 12, 2018 But Miffy you wanted to remain the other day? Or is just that May is driving you around the bend with her dithering? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Miffymog Posted December 12, 2018 This is seriously heading towards her getting her deal through. Because once this option has past, what can the Tories do if they no longer like her deal ... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Miffymog Posted December 12, 2018 3 minutes ago, Patrick Brown said: But Miffy you wanted to remain the other day? Or is just that May is driving you around the bend with her dithering? I am a remainer - however, I did want her deal to be voted on and was not happy when she postponed it. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Patrick Brown Posted December 12, 2018 Well they won't vote it through will they so it's stalemate! Not sure how we get out of this other than hard Brexit, which as you know I want anyway. Of course Parliament won't allow a no deal hard Brexit because of all their buSINess buddies! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Miffymog Posted December 12, 2018 From your point of view, yes - the chances of having a hard Brexit are quickly slipping away today. And I am sorry for you here. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Patrick Brown Posted December 12, 2018 1 minute ago, Miffymog said: From your point of view, yes - the chances of having a hard Brexit are quickly slipping away today. And I am sorry for you here. I remember now that you thought it was worth taking the current deal? I thought you wanted a no deal. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Miffymog Posted December 12, 2018 2 minutes ago, Patrick Brown said: I remember now that you thought it was worth taking the current deal? I thought you wanted a no deal. If May wins this, the Brexiter MPs will have no choice later but to support her deal as the closest thing to leaving as possible. I think Apech has said that this is something he can accept too. For me, I would rather remain than have her deal. But, as I've just said, if the Tory Brexiters have to support it, then that is also getting less likely. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Patrick Brown Posted December 12, 2018 (edited) Well I'm concerned that civil unrest will take hold if this deal goes through, maybe I'm even hoping for civil unrest! I suppose I shouldn't care as the EU is knackered anyway. Edited December 12, 2018 by Patrick Brown 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Patrick Brown Posted December 12, 2018 (edited) Well I'm going to predict that she won't win! My thinking is that a lot of MP's have just had enough of her! Then we'll have fun with the whole election process for the new PM. Well at least it'll be a change from all the other rubbish. Edited December 12, 2018 by Patrick Brown 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Apech Posted December 12, 2018 32 minutes ago, Patrick Brown said: Well I'm going to predict that she won't win! My thinking is that a lot of MP's have just had enough of her! Then we'll have fun with the whole election process for the new PM. Well at least it'll be a change from all the other rubbish. If it descends into chaos and another general election then Brexit will definitely be delayed - I can't see both going ahead. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Miffymog Posted December 12, 2018 There is a fair degree of deflation with the MP's on the television news. Originally, it seemed May was wrong to delay the vote on her deal. But it looks like she'll survive the leadership challenge and have extinguished the threat from Brexiters. The DUP are still saying they'll vote down her deal, and Labour will too. Where does this leave us? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Miffymog Posted December 12, 2018 Guess work puts it at 140 Tory MPs = 48% are against May at the moment So it is going close 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Patrick Brown Posted December 12, 2018 (edited) Farage on any second: Edited December 12, 2018 by Patrick Brown Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Miffymog Posted December 12, 2018 4 minutes ago, Patrick Brown said: there we go 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Patrick Brown Posted December 12, 2018 3 minutes ago, Miffymog said: there we go Well more chaos will follow as to what form it will take who can say? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Chang Posted December 12, 2018 Following tonights vote May is now a Dead Woman Walking, having stated her intention to stand down before the next election. She has however been given a mandate to do immeasurable harm to both her party and country between now and then. Plenty more laughs to come chaps. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Patrick Brown Posted December 12, 2018 Tis true so as she dies I may live. Still can't stand the mental bitch! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Patrick Brown Posted December 13, 2018 Well now the dust has settled, as it was a whirlwind vote, I have concluded that not only has May destroyed her credibility, one hundred percent, but she has also destroyed the conservative party! So in a bizarre way the people have a victory! Of course there's still no way the 'dodgy deal' is going though so what's next? A split of the conservative party perhaps? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Miffymog Posted December 13, 2018 14 minutes ago, Patrick Brown said: Well now the dust has settled, as it was a whirlwind vote, I have concluded that not only has May destroyed her credibility, one hundred percent, but she has also destroyed the conservative party! So in a bizarre way the people have a victory! Of course there's still no way the 'dodgy deal' is going though so what's next? A split of the conservative party perhaps? Been thinking about this myself this morning. The problem for May is that she lost her majority at the last general election and is now dependent on the DUP. They will never want something that can ever threaten separating NI from the UK in any way. Simply put, they would now rather remain than May's deal. Combined with the fact Labour care more about getting into power than Brexit, May's deal will sink. Now the hard Brexiters have been silenced by the last night's loss, I'm afraid for leavers, remain is becoming ever more likely. I prefer remain to May's deal, and it is slowly going that way. For a remainer, there is still a very long way to go, as there would have to be another referendum. The options on the ballot paper would be May's deal or remain, and the current polling is that this would still be a very, very close vote.... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Patrick Brown Posted December 13, 2018 (edited) 15 minutes ago, Miffymog said: For a remainer, there is still a very long way to go, as there would have to be another referendum. The options on the ballot paper would be May's deal or remain, and the current polling is that this would still be a very, very close vote.... Yes many have been saying this but we did vote to leave and not for a deal or to remain so put simply the governance of the UK is broken. The calls for civil war are getting louder and it might seem like silly talk but it's coming! Wouldn't surprise me if the conservative split happens sooner rather than latter because if the government go against the will of the people disaster will follow. Of course the EU are loving it as they're just trying to drag us down with them although they may well be deluded into thinking the EU can ride the storm? Edited December 13, 2018 by Patrick Brown 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Apech Posted December 13, 2018 i don't think remain is an option. There would be too much backlash against whoever came forward with that. May has repeatedly committed the govt. to leaving in march. The closer we get to that the choice will starkly be 'the deal' or hard Brexit. I think there's quite a lot of nervousness about hard Brexit and it has to be said it contains many unknowns. So the result would be unpredictable, no one really knows. It could be another Millenium Bug or it might be a 10 year recession. So there will be some creep towards living with the deal - because at least with that there is some certainty. So I think by January the vote to accept the deal (reluctantly) will toughen up a bit. Possibly not enough to get it through though. If she gets some kind a fix for the back stop - like an agreed protocol for unilaterally ending it - then she's got even more chance. Given English pragmatism the other possible scenario is delaying Art. 50 on the basis of a General Election. If as the European Court has said that UK can withdraw unilaterally from Art. 50 then it does give some options around how this goes forward. Maybe. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
