The Brexit Thread

[Patrick Brown]

Well they're still talking about JC forcing a general election! Yes some kind of 'add-on' legal document about the backstop might cause MP's to cave in and accept the deal. 

 

I'm going to turn off for a couple of days as all this uncertainty it's too much for my delicate sensibilities!  

[Miffymog]

19 minutes ago, Apech said:

i don't think remain is an option.  There would be too much backlash against whoever came forward with that.  May has repeatedly committed the govt. to leaving in march.  The closer we get to that the choice will starkly be 'the deal' or hard Brexit.  I think there's quite a lot of nervousness about hard Brexit and it has to be said it contains many unknowns.  So the result would be unpredictable, no one really knows.  It could be another Millenium Bug or it might be a 10 year recession.  So there will be some creep towards living with the deal - because at least with that there is some certainty.  So I think by January the vote to accept the deal (reluctantly) will toughen up a bit.  Possibly not enough to get it through though.  If she gets some kind a fix for the back stop - like an agreed protocol for unilaterally ending it - then she's got even more chance.

 

Given English pragmatism the other possible scenario is delaying Art. 50 on the basis of a General Election.  If as the European Court has said that UK can withdraw unilaterally from Art. 50 then it does give some options around how this goes forward.  Maybe.

 

 

 

hmmm - what you say makes sense

 

[Miffymog]

2 minutes ago, Patrick Brown said:

Well they're still talking about JC forcing a general election! Yes some kind of 'add-on' legal document about the backstop might cause MP's to cave in and accept the deal. 

 

I'm going to turn off for a couple of days as all this uncertainty it's too much for my delicate sensibilities!  

 

This will have to wait until she's got the deal back in front of parliament, so after Jan the 21st at this rate...

 

Taking a break from this for while is a GOOD idea

[Patrick Brown]

If JC forces a general election I would probably vote Labour just to punish May and the conservatives, I'm not joking! Although I can't stick Labour or JC  something has to be done.

 

Theresa May is out of control and should be put down, she's mental! 

[Apech]

2 hours ago, Patrick Brown said:

If JC forces a general election I would probably vote Labour just to punish May and the conservatives, I'm not joking! Although I can't stick Labour or JC  something has to be done.

 

Theresa May is out of control and should be put down, she's mental! 

 

Turning and turning in the widening gyre
    The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
    Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
    Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
    The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
    The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
    The best lack all conviction, while the worst
    Are full of passionate intensity.

 

[Chang]

5 minutes ago, Apech said:

 

Turning and turning in the widening gyre
    The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
    Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
    Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
    The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
    The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
    The best lack all conviction, while the worst
    Are full of passionate intensity.

 

Surely some revelation is at hand;
Surely the Second Coming is at hand.
The Second Coming! Hardly are those words out
When a vast image out of Spiritus Mundi
Troubles my sight: somewhere in sands of the desert
A shape with lion body and the head of a man,
A gaze blank and pitiless as the sun, 
Is moving its slow thighs, while all about it
Reel shadows of the indignant desert birds.
The darkness drops again; but now I know
That twenty centuries of stony sleep
Were vexed to nightmare by a rocking cradle,
And what rough beast, its hour come round at last,
Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?

[Apech]

2 minutes ago, Chang said:

Surely some revelation is at hand;
Surely the Second Coming is at hand.
The Second Coming! Hardly are those words out
When a vast image out of Spiritus Mundi
Troubles my sight: somewhere in sands of the desert
A shape with lion body and the head of a man,
A gaze blank and pitiless as the sun, 
Is moving its slow thighs, while all about it
Reel shadows of the indignant desert birds.
The darkness drops again; but now I know
That twenty centuries of stony sleep
Were vexed to nightmare by a rocking cradle,
And what rough beast, its hour come round at last,
Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?

 

 

Or slouches towards Brussels?????

[Chang]

2 hours ago, Patrick Brown said:

If JC forces a general election I would probably vote Labour just to punish May and the conservatives, I'm not joking! Although I can't stick Labour or JC  something has to be done.

 

Theresa May is out of control and should be put down, she's mental! 

 

A Labour vote, whilst punishing May and the Conservatives would in fact punish the good and decent people of the U.K. for you would be voting for Marxist maniacs.

 

In her own mind May is still very much in control but what exactly she is in control of is a matter of conjecture. And last but not least she is not mental but simply a representative of the Establishment - The Empire of Nothing.

[Apech]

Quote

We couldn’t have asked for clearer proof of the Conservative Party’s political disarray and intellectual paucity than Theresa May’s survival of the confidence vote. Her victory, by 200 votes to 117, is not down to any vision or decisiveness on her part, but rather speaks to the absence of ideological dynamism and even basic courage in any other wing of the Conservative Party. May survives by default – the default being Tories’ supine unwillingness to do anything that might shake up politics for fear that it would expose their own internal, existential confusions.

 

https://www.spiked-online.com/2018/12/12/this-is-the-death-of-the-tory-party-as-we-know-it/

[Chang]

20 minutes ago, Apech said:

 

https://www.spiked-online.com/2018/12/12/this-is-the-death-of-the-tory-party-as-we-know-it/

 

Good article which defines the problem perfectly but fails to offer future hope. I am still of the opinion that we are drifting inexorably towards a Corbynista regime and two lines from Yeats pretty well sum things up:-

 

"   The best lack all conviction, while the worst
    Are full of passionate intensity. "

 

This fits perfectly with my personal philosophy of the 90% rule. In an given population of people you will find that 80% are idiots, 10% are arseholes and 10% are more or less alright. The odds are not looking good but there will still be plenty of laughs along the way chaps.

 

 

[Apech]

6 minutes ago, Chang said:

 

Good article which defines the problem perfectly but fails to offer future hope. I am still of the opinion that we are drifting inexorably towards a Corbynista regime and two lines from Yeats pretty well sum things up:-

 

"   The best lack all conviction, while the worst
    Are full of passionate intensity. "

 

This fits perfectly with my personal philosophy of the 90% rule. In an given population of people you will find that 80% are idiots, 10% are arseholes and 10% are more or less alright. The odds are not looking good but there will still be plenty of laughs along the way chaps.

 

 

 

 

... and they all have the vote

[Chang]

7 minutes ago, Apech said:

 

 

... and they all have the vote

 

They do.

 

So in a democracy the 80% of idiots will vote for the 10% of arseholes and the 10% of more or less decent folk will be powerless through lack of votes.

 

In a tyrany the 10% of arseholes will already be in power. The 80% of idiots are incapable of altering the situation and the 10% of more or less alright folk will be lodged in the gulag.

 

Only one thing is certain. Lucks a chance but troubles sure.

[Patrick Brown]

18 minutes ago, Chang said:

Lucks a chance but troubles sure.

 

Does this mean I'm allowed to start a riot?  

[Apech]

14 minutes ago, Patrick Brown said:

 

Does this mean I'm allowed to start a riot?  

 

never start what you can't finish.

[Patrick Brown]

7 minutes ago, Apech said:

 

never start what you can't finish.

 

Well if I can't even finish 'The Sun' crossword I should probably leave the rioting to professionals!  

[Patrick Brown]

LOL I didn't even realise that the same thing is going on in France!

 

Quote

 

The French National Assembly holds a vote of no confidence on Thursday, December 13. Earlier this week French president Emmanuel Macron declared a "state of economic and social emergency" in reaction to weeks of violent protests sparked by proposed hikes in fuel prices.

 

 

[Chang]

Of course the E.U. is put together in such a manner that the democratic process in individual nations is of no matter. The European tyrany just continues to roll along like a juggernaut.

 

One can well imagine Jean-Claude Juncker sat in his bath singing-

 

"And this is law, I will maintain

Unto my dying day, Sir

That whatsoever King may reign,

I will be Vicar of Bray, Sir!"

 

[Patrick Brown]

7 minutes ago, Chang said:

Of course the E.U. is put together in such a manner that the democratic process in individual nations is of no matter. The European tyrany just continues to roll along like a juggernaut.

 

Yes but even though I'm a bit thick I would be right to say that the EU looks in pretty bad shape at the moment. There's other shit going on that I can't even keep up with but there's several countries, if they are allowed to be called that anymore, which are in just as much chaos as we. It's amazing the press aren't pointing this out, do we want to stay in something that's doomed? 

[Patrick Brown]

 

[Patrick Brown]

If May doesn't threaten the EU with a no deal Brexit now then she's a idiot and worse than a traitor! If the EU won't bend then we're allowed to go to financial war! We, apparently, still have cards up our sleeves which May is shy of using because she's a weak leader! If they won't bend force them and if they can't bend they will be broken! Who's the stronger? We are by a mile! Why? Because the vast majority of the people believe in this country.

 

Fuck the EU! As said piss takers! 

Edited December 14, 2018 by Patrick Brown

[Miffymog]

2 minutes ago, Patrick Brown said:

If May doesn't threaten the EU with a no deal Brexit now then she's a idiot and worse than a traitor! If the EU won't bend then we're allowed to go to financial war! We, apparently, still have cards up our sleeves which May is shy of using because she's a weak leader! If they won't bend force them and if they can't bend they will be broken! Who's the stronger? We are by a mile! Why? Because the vast majority of the people believe in this country.

 

Fuck the EU! As said piss takers! 

 

A no deal Brexit is a little closer now ...

 

This does all seem to be heading to another referendum - the question is, of course, what goes on the ballot paper as the polling says the outcome would still be really close.

 

Is it

 

Mays Deal / Remain

 

Hard Brexit / Remain

 

Hard Brexit / Mays Deal / Remain

 

The triple option interestingly splits the vote.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[rideforever]

What is the world going to think if the EU beats the UK into submitting like lamb to slaughter.   Who will be cheering ?   Truth is even the EU wanted the UK to win, because everyone likes the sound of freedom not matter what work they happen to be doing.

[Patrick Brown]

There is a strong suggestion that a no deal Brexit will not be on offer in a vote/referendum which I personally think is outrageous. If the option to leave without a deal isn't on the ballot slip I'm not voting although I may riot!  

 

 

[Patrick Brown]

2 minutes ago, rideforever said:

What is the world going to think if the EU beats the UK into submitting like lamb to slaughter.   Who will be cheering ?   Truth is even the EU wanted the UK to win, because everyone likes the sound of freedom not matter what work they happen to be doing.

 

If the UK threatened the EU with restrictive banking and other financial chaos, not to mention not giving them a penny, then we may not be liked by many but we would be respected. What else can we do? It's not the EU or even the government that are the bad guys here it's Theresa May! Those MP's that voted for her are a disgrace to British Politics and ironically the MP's that voted against her are heroes but of course the media distorts the picture as normal. 

 

The riots are getting closer by the minute! 

[rideforever]

Hmm ... somehow I think people are too weak for rioting or standing up for themselves.