No More Mister Nice Guy, NMMNG

[rideforever]

Came across this book, think it's very good for me and possibly others as well.  Also available on audible.

 

In short : many men are raised in a way to not be comfortable in their own smelly flawed skin, and spend life adjusting themselves in order to be liked which doesn't work; although sometimes people advise you to be "nice" it's all BS.   
What works is being what you are period.

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/No-More-Mr-Nice-Guy/dp/0762415339

[Lost in Translation]

You may enjoy re-browsing my thread on the advantage of evil from a few months ago.

 

 

[thelerner]

Is getting what one wants worth turning into an asshole? 

 

I think its good to be what you are, but don't buy that many guys aren't naturally nice.  I think it gets into a false dichotomy.  One that can be just as guilty about changing a mans nature.   You can be nice and get what you want, wealth love, sex, etc.  Cooperation, coordination, building networks and trust can be as powerful as ruthlessness.   In truth strategies should be thought of as tools in ones bucket and not define us. 

 

I'm sure there's middle ground.   One can be assertive and nice.  Be empathetic yet not be walked on.  Being balanced doesn't mean being timid.  Taking chances and putting ourselves out there does not mean we have to be aggressive. 

 

There may be value in some of the PUA (Pick Up Artist) stuff out there, but much of it is easily seen through manipulative garbage that isn't playing the long game. 

[rideforever]

I see this book creates a great deal of imagination in people !!!!
What can you do !?

[Nungali]

That seems a type of 'competitive get what you want from other people' .....  mhe .

 

I have got what I want ....  what I really want  and need  ...  from other sources , and I didnt have to be 'Mr Uniceguy' to get it .  Getting what one wants via other people is like getting energy from others .  Why would I want to do that ; get energy that is tainted by others, when I can gather my own from an untainted source.

 

[Nungali]

.... but then again ....

 

I dont have 'smelly flawed skin'  .

 

[ben kaf]

2 hours ago, rideforever said:

In short : many men are raised in a way to not be comfortable in their own smelly flawed skin, and spend life adjusting themselves in order to be liked which doesn't work; although sometimes people advise you to be "nice" it's all BS.   
What works is being what you are period.

Not to dismiss your/writer's idea, just my two cents:

 I don't think there is any real being versus false being. Even what people consider their true being is actually a conditioned being on some deeper level. Moreover being a nice guy sometimes can make us and others happier than getting what we want

[rideforever]

Wow, I am finding the lack of comprehension of what the book is about ... amusing !!!!

 

Edited December 4, 2018 by rideforever

[Lost in Translation]

It's about knowing yourself.

 

People who know themself don't lie (to themself) about themself. 

 

People who don't know themself are stuck in the middle, unhappy and unable to please others. It's a bad place to be. 

[rideforever]

3 minutes ago, Lost in Translation said:

It's about knowing yourself.

People who know themself don't lie (to themself) about themself. 

People who don't know themself are stuck in the middle, unhappy and unable to please others. It's a bad place to be. 

 

Bingo, and for some being taught to be Nice gives them a false understanding of the situation and leads them into a false life.

[Stosh]

The selling principle of the book, I presume, is that since some, maybe many  men, and women , are not happy with the consequences of behaving in the manner to which they have been conditioned to act, both reflexively , and philosophically. 
This is why Daoism avoids promoting virtue as being either all light or all dark,( the .. polemic , or dual-istic , attitude ) , somewhere in-between there is a balance which is right for an individual - IN the circumstance in which they find themselves. 

 

[rideforever]

Daoism refers to impersonal existence, this books works on the personal, which in my case has some severe disharmonies that I would like to decondition because it will be much faster to work on both personal and impersonal levels.
It is in my opinion incorrect approach (or low effectiveness approach) to just work on impersonal dimension, it's escape into spirituality without taking care of what is here now.

[Lost in Translation]

It's important to understand that not everyone will like you, and you will not like everyone - and that's normal. Don't waste your time trying to please people you can't please, and don't waste your time surrounding yourself with people you don't like. That's just crazy making.

[Stosh]

8 minutes ago, rideforever said:

Daoism refers to impersonal existence, this books works on the personal, which in my case has some severe disharmonies that I would like to decondition because it will be much faster to work on both personal and impersonal levels.
It is in my opinion incorrect approach (or low effectiveness approach) to just work on impersonal dimension, it's escape into spirituality without taking care of what is here now.

I very much disagree about this impersonal existence thing , I cant even picture what that means. Your, my , life- spirituality is very much a 'personal' matter. 

But I do like the terms decondition and disharmonies , as properly descriptive. 

[thelerner]

1 hour ago, rideforever said:

Wow, I am finding the lack of comprehension of what the book is about ... amusing !!!!

 

Are you assuming we've all immediately gone and read the book??? 

how amusingly droll..  let me stick up my pinky and make a face.  there. done. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

maybe i've been too much British tv..

 

Edited December 4, 2018 by thelerner

[rideforever]

What is the need to have a giant footnote under every post ? !

[Stosh]

This is a summary of No More Mr. Nice Guy by Dr. Robert Glover. 

WHY A NICE GUY ISN’T A NICE GUY

Before we really get started, let’s define for our purposes what typical Nice Guy symptoms are. Often, a Nice Guy is a giver, fixer, care-taker, approval seeker and conflict avoider. The Nice Guy will go to great lengths to hide mistakes and flaws and will always seek the “right” way to do things.

He often represses his feelings and has difficulties making his needs a priority while making his partner his emotional center. The interesting thing is, a nice guy is defined not by his actions, but by his beliefs!

Nice Guys believe, that if they are good, giving and caring they will be happy and fulfilled. Unfortunately, this often isn’t true. And when a Nice Guy doesn’t get anything back on his investments, he becomes resentful.

So far, so good. But why aren’t Nice Guys nice? There are other traits that characterize a Nice Guy:

~He is dishonest and says what he believes people want to hear.
~He hides his true intention.
~He uses manipulations instead of asking for what he wants directly.
~He is controlling.
~He only gives to get and gets frustrated when he isn’t appreciated.
~He is passive-aggressive and full of rage.
~He can’t set boundaries and say “No!”

These traits make it impossible for a Nice Guy to live a fulfilled life. And as you can expect, it is very unlikely that any partner will be happy in a relationship with a Nice Guy for very long.

So how do you get out of your not so nice ways?

BECOME AN INTEGRATED MALE!

A very common pattern when we want to change a situation is to do the exact opposite of what we’ve done before. This is why Nice Guys often go through a phase of douchebaggery where they become a complete jerk.

 

"The selling principle of the book, I presume, is that some, maybe many  men, and women , are not happy with the consequences of behaving in the manner to which they have been conditioned to act, both reflexively , and philosophically."

My comment still fits 

 

 

Edited December 4, 2018 by Stosh

[Nungali]

On 05/12/2018 at 7:18 AM, rideforever said:

Wow, I am finding the lack of comprehension of what the book is about ... amusing !!!!

 

 

Maybe some of us just    CAN   '  safely and openly be themselves ' .   And the nice part is NOT faked at all .

 

It might be a cultural problem in the USA though ?  I have worked with a lot of Yanks like that,   OVERLY fake nice and polite , but different under the skin when the pressure is on .  They seemed a little shocked at some Aussies, who dont give a fuck about that ; not actually 'nice' and certainly not politely fake '   .

 

Then again  .... in USA   you never know who has a handgun under their shirt  .... so maybe fake niceness is a good idea ? 

 

 

 

 

[Nungali]

22 hours ago, rideforever said:

What is the need to have a giant footnote under every post ? !

 

Yeah  but look what it said   !   ( I never bothered to read it until you mentioned it )

 

Seems in line with what I just wrote about niceness at the threat of gun fire   ;   "    Occasionally my conscience will put a gun to my head to clean up bad attitude.  "

 

 

[shortstuff]

It's true that nice guys are not nice.

Nice guys aka beta males... the orbiters of hot women, who orbit her, compliment her, be lovely to her, with the dream or expectation of sex from her in return... does that sound like a nice person to you?

Karma deals with it though. She uses them for attention or money, they suffer... The problem is they never learn. This is why Earth sucks right now, people are making the same mistakes over and over and never learning from them.

[Lost in Translation]

2 minutes ago, shortstuff said:

This is why Earth sucks right now

 

Does it really?

[Nungali]

I thought that was ' gravity' ?

[rideforever]

I seem to be in the middle to surrendering lock stock to God, but at the same time these books are taking my interest - strange combination

 

What is masculinity? Ask ten men and you'll get ten vague, conflicting answers. Unlike any book of its kind, The Way of Men offers a simple, straightforward answer-without getting bogged down in religion, morality, or politics. It's a guide for understanding who men have been and the challenges men face today. The Way of Men captures the silent, stifling rage of men everywhere who find themselves at odds with the over-regulated, over-civilized, politically correct modern world. If you've ever closed your eyes and wished for one day as a lion, this book is for you..

 

 

[dawei]

On 12/4/2018 at 12:49 PM, rideforever said:

Came across this book, think it's very good for me and possibly others as well.  Also available on audible.

 

In short : many men are raised in a way to not be comfortable in their own smelly flawed skin, and spend life adjusting themselves in order to be liked which doesn't work; although sometimes people advise you to be "nice" it's all BS.   
What works is being what you are period.

 

That may be true on some level... on what works... but he didn't foresee the #metoo  movement and its effect on the workplace  

 

https://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-metoo-workplace-camaraderie-20180128-story.html

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-12-03/a-wall-street-rule-for-the-metoo-era-avoid-women-at-all-cost

 

https://business.financialpost.com/executive/why-metoo-is-not-a-positive-development-in-the-workplace

 

 

[thelerner]

On 12/4/2018 at 3:40 PM, rideforever said:

What is the need to have a giant footnote under every post ? !

You mean the signature.  You're right, too long and distracting, I've been meaning to erase it but too lazy.**

 

 

 

 

 

**it is erased.

 

i miss it though.  it had certain dreams and ideals in it.  read or not they'd percolate in my subconscious when viewing.

Edited January 9, 2019 by thelerner