My NLP experiment and book recommendations please

[Oolong Rabbit]

There's really something to this stuff. I watched a clip of a guy breaking down what Derren Brown did to get this man on the streets to hand over his wallet etc. How he used a bottle of water to break his current thought process and then used it as an anchor. Interesting, but maybe the guy was just a schill and the whole thing was staged. Well, yesterday I had to discipline my 5 year old son and took away his video game for the rest of the day. A 45 minute temper tantrum ensued and he was relentless. I remembered the NLP explanation of what Deren Brown had done, and tried the same techniques. He was crying and screaming, so I handed him a little picture. I said "Here take this". He sort of snapped out of it, look puzzled and said why. About 15 seconds later, he started up again and set the picture down. I talked in a normal voice. Picked up the picture, handed it back to him and said "Take this and calm down". It was literally like flicking a switch. He instantly stopped crying and screaming. A calmness came over him and he kind of sat there staring at the picture almost as if entranced. That was the end of the tantrum and I had my sweet little buddy back.

 

This was so effective that it actually bothered greatly. It bothered me that these techniques could be used to manipulate unwittingly. It made me wonder if the same techniques could be used on myself. Normally I consider my self to be a pretty strong willed person, but is a strong will a defense against people fucking with your mind using NLP.

 

Anyhow, I am curious if some you guys could help me understand these techniques, and what we can do to defend against them. Surely the advertising industry and government are using these against us on a daily basis. Can anyone offer some book suggestions that would help me with this?

 

FYI the clip is here:

[thelerner]

Like understanding a magic trick, what you don't see is more important then what you do. You don't see the multiple takes and videos of the failures. Darren may have tried that trick 8, 10, 20 or 100 times before finding the perfect pigeon and conditions. Hitting someone over the head and taking there wallet may be a faster and more time effective way of getting peoples money

 

His stuff is real, but without a rough idea of how many tries it takes to succeed, its probably not the super power it appears to be. Magicians practice dozens of hours to develope a trick that takes 30 or 40 seconds.

 

 

Michael

[Pero]

Actually, the things is, that he isn't using NLP only. It's a front. He's a mentalist (next to being a NLPer & hypnotist), he uses tricks. So it's not neccessarily true that we didn't see all the failures, there might not have been any at all. If he were using NLP alone there would be failures if he tried to do the exact same thing on everyone, or at least it wouldn't go down as smoothly.

 

As for having strong will, I doubt it matters. The way I understand it, this works in a subtle way, your mind wouldn't detect it, unless you're very aware and know what to look for.

 

Freeform:

Most PU people don't have enough interest or patience in developing the level of awareness necessary to be able to do this in a sufficiently predictable way.

 

While we were talking about something else, this applies here as well IMO. The average Joe won't invest enough time into it, to be able to successfully manipulate people all the time.

[Buddy]

As well, NLPers have been known to rid folks of phobias very quickly. Tony Robbins ripped this stuff off for his NACS. Like Pero says, Derren is using more than just NLP and he's upfront about it in his book.

[Pero]

Not really on topic I guess, but I'm just watching one of Bandler's videos.. He's a really funny guy.

 

"See, when I met schizophrenics, they were much like my neighbours. I couldn't really tell the difference. And as far as I could tell, the only real difference between a psychiatrist and a schizophrenic, is that a schizophrenic stood a chance of getting well."

 

As well, NLPers have been known to rid folks of phobias very quickly. Tony Robbins ripped this stuff off for his NACS. Like Pero says, Derren is using more than just NLP and he's upfront about it in his book.

 

Are you talking about Tricks Of The Mind (I forgot which book has a section on NLP)? How did you like it? Did you find something practically useful in it?

[Buddy]

I haven't read it yet but I'd like to. I was talking to someone online who's reading it.

Edited February 10, 2008 by Buddy

[Oolong Rabbit]

Like understanding a magic trick, what you don't see is more important then what you do. You don't see the multiple takes and videos of the failures. Darren may have tried that trick 8, 10, 20 or 100 times before finding the perfect pigeon and conditions. Hitting someone over the head and taking there wallet may be a faster and more time effective way of getting peoples money

 

His stuff is real, but without a rough idea of how many tries it takes to succeed, its probably not the super power it appears to be. Magicians practice dozens of hours to develope a trick that takes 30 or 40 seconds.

Michael

 

Good point, but it worked for me my first time, with very little knowledge of what I was doing. Granted it was on a 5 yr old, but I was still pretty amazed.

 

Actually, the things is, that he isn't using NLP only. It's a front. He's a mentalist (next to being a NLPer & hypnotist), he uses tricks. So it's not neccessarily true that we didn't see all the failures, there might not have been any at all. If he were using NLP alone there would be failures if he tried to do the exact same thing on everyone, or at least it wouldn't go down as smoothly.

 

As for having strong will, I doubt it matters. The way I understand it, this works in a subtle way, your mind wouldn't detect it, unless you're very aware and know what to look for.

 

My analysis is that my son's mind was running on autopilot (as most people are most of the time). When I handed him the picture out of the blue, it was like a logical anomaly to his mind. It had to break from the current thought prgram, and allocate resources to figure out what was going on. Why was I handed this picture? What is the meaning? Maybe strong will wasn't the best choice of words. How about a keen awareness?

 

While we were talking about something else, this applies here as well IMO. The average Joe won't invest enough time into it, to be able to successfully manipulate people all the time.

 

No, but I am willing to bet that advertising companies and the military industrial complex would and have. That's the scary part.

[Pero]

My analysis is that my son's mind was running on autopilot (as most people are most of the time). When I handed him the picture out of the blue, it was like a logical anomaly to his mind. It had to break from the current thought prgram, and allocate resources to figure out what was going on. Why was I handed this picture? What is the meaning?

 

I think this is what is called a pattern interrupt.

You did this, and then induced a command - calm down. I guess.

 

 

Maybe strong will wasn't the best choice of words. How about a keen awareness?

 

That's a big difference. Like I can be aware of many things that need doing, but not neccessarily have a will to do them. I think knowing how it's done goes a long way in "defending" against it. I wish Freeform would write something.

 

No, but I am willing to bet that advertising companies and the military industrial complex would and have. That's the scary part.

 

Yeah... I don't remember if you watched Zeitgeist, but I think in there was an interesting observation how American media bombarded the people with the word terrorist...

[Buddy]

Thanks folks. Nice clear conversation, what this site (IMO) should be about.

[MASTERforge]

Of course business and the military use NLP. I have a degree in business and we covered this topic briefly but it is basically the foundation for all sales technique. I was quite disgusted with it so rejected a career in the corporate world. I am waiting to start my new job as a support worker in a Hostel. Its far more rewarding.

 

Business and military use mainly pattern interrupts and anchoring. I will give and example:

 

Car commercial:

handsome bloke driving along a road surrounded by mountains - already this gives the association of car = freedom, exploration and liberation. Because mountain regions are normally only visited on holiday or people dream of seeing them.

 

Then he has a bit of a flirt with some dolly bird who likes his style and they drive off into the distance - association with sex is one of the strongest motivators to purchase. car = bird = getting laid.

 

Sex is probably the easiest anchor because its a strong motivator. That's why magazines have so many scantly clad women in them. Its a motivator to purchase. It also makes you frustrated and willing to work harder and do longer hours in the hope that it will make you more appealing to the opposite sex.

 

This is why working class newspapers have so much sex in them. They make a male frustrated and promise them success if they buy this or that product. So they work harder and longer hours to buy the products they need and believe will help them to get laid.

 

With middle class people money is a better motivator sometimes. So the newspapers normally tout fear of financial ruin and exotic holidays to impress the ladies.

 

I don't know if it has all been carefully orchestrated by sinister people or gradually developed from trials. But pretty much all media is designed to create opinion and stimulate economic growth. What Derren does is a bit of NLP and magic. NLP on that scale is a bit hit and miss. But on national or global scale its far more effective.

 

I also used to work in a call centre and used NLP with some pretty good success. It made me feel like crap using it to take peoples money. So I got out.

 

Its basically a tool for excellent communication and persuasion.

[freeform]

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Edited December 18, 2019 by freeform

[Buddy]

Might want to check this one out:

http://www.thefreenlp.com/

[三江源]

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Edited August 31, 2015 by 三江源