the wall, part of trumps insanity

[3bob]

from a rep who  lives near the border:

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/border-towns-safer-than-any-city-trump-has-lived-in-says-texas-congressman/ar-BBTooc8?li=BBnb7Kz

[Jonesboy]

San Diego built a wall and it dropped crime 95%.

 

It is delusional to think barriers don’t work.

 

It was a wall that stopped people from the last caravan from entering the U.S , a strong wall. If you remember a weak wall didn’t stop them from entering Mexico and people were hurt.

 

There are laws and people can’t just enter any country they want just because they want too.

[3bob]

the rep was not talking about SD and Tijuana , he laid out areas where trump's brainwashing for the wall does not stand the light of day or sanity...

 

lets not be fools and suckers for a madman on one of the greatest and sickest ego trips ever seen by mankind. 

[thelerner]

To me, its best to allow the locals to study and figure out what kind of barrier they need.  I just looked up pictures of the barrier, it looks like 12 or 13 foot fencing topped with a thick round layer of barb wire.  Its in no way a 30 or 40 foot cement wall that Trump envisions as The Great wall of Trump.

 

San Diego being near the Tijuana peninsula is particularly vulnerable.  Homeland security should and probably has done studies on what fencing would do best where.  But its become a political football.  

 

I'm for a secure border but strongly dislike the old game of vilifying refugees.  There is an intelligent area between letting everyone in and letting groups of the most needed who will make good citizens.  We are a nation of immigrants and to call them drug dealers and human traffickers is playing to our worst instincts. 

 

The solution is listening to experts who with locals input can create intelligent fencing around our borders. 

 

If you do a reality check, the last major wall push was twice as expensive as planned.  So Trump would get 115 miles or maybe less for his 5.7 billion.  We need something secure and cheap to upkeep, economical and ecological. 

 

Trump knows more about war then the generals, more about taxes then accountants and knows all the best words.  But his demand for a needlessly expensive <120 miles of walls when other solutions make more sense because he's creating on populist emotional sentiment.  A good Republican President would listen to experts, call the bill Border Security and get it passed with bi-partisan support. 

Edited February 10, 2019 by thelerner

[Stosh]

Two anti-Trump threads isn't enough?

[3bob]

how about a whole site for starters?

[Chang]

12 hours ago, 3bob said:

the rep was not talking about SD and Tijuana , he laid out areas where trump's brainwashing for the wall does not stand the light of day or sanity...

 

lets not be fools and suckers for a madman on one of the greatest and sickest ego trips ever seen by mankind. 

 

Let me ask you a simple series of questions 3Bob.

 

1. Why are you so in favour of mass immigration into the USA?

 

2. If such immigration is to continue unimpeded then how many migrants are to be accepted and integrated into North American society. Thousands,  tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands, millions or tens of millions?

 

3.Trump was democratically elected as President and an election pledge was to build this damn wall. That he should keep his election pledge is a given. Do you agree with this?

 

4. Lastly I must ask you to admit that you are in fact opposed to democracy and wish to see a Marxist tyrany descend upon both America and the rest of the world. No need to waffle on like a Soy Boy over this one Bob. A simple yes or no will suffice, though to be fair we all know the answer already.

Edited February 11, 2019 by Chang

[3bob]

better yet hundreds of sites, one for every big traitor trump lie, so he  can be revealed for what he is in the greatest possible and undeniable detail.

[Chang]

1 hour ago, 3bob said:

better yet hundreds of sites, one for every big traitor trump lie, so he  can be revealed for what he is in the greatest possible and undeniable detail.

 

You appear to have missed my post Old Fruit. Here it is once more. Should you choose to ignore it again it will simply mark you down for the scoundrel that you are.

 

2 hours ago, Chang said:

 

Let me ask you a simple series of questions 3Bob.

 

1. Why are you so in favour of mass immigration into the USA?

 

2. If such immigration is to continue unimpeded then how many migrants are to be accepted and integrated into North American society. Thousands,  tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands, millions or tens of millions?

 

3.Trump was democratically elected as President and an election pledge was to build this damn wall. That he should keep his election pledge is a given. Do you agree with this?

 

4. Lastly I must ask you to admit that you are in fact opposed to democracy and wish to see a Marxist tyrany descend upon both America and the rest of the world. No need to waffle on like a Soy Boy over this one Bob. A simple yes or no will suffice, though to be fair we all know the answer already.

 

[Stosh]

6 hours ago, 3bob said:

how about a whole site for starters?

Go right ahead ,start a site for it. 

Bye

 

[rideforever]

14 hours ago, thelerner said:

Trump knows more about war then the generals, more about taxes then accountants and knows all the best words

 

Ha ... but maybe it's true, in some ways anyway.   You do have to be a mean old tough shrewd grizzly bear to get where he's got.

He's a pretty straight shooter though, follows the Tao in the sense that he works, he builds, he creates, and doesn't give a f***.   
Then he tells everyone to read the Bible.
Well, I've heard worse instructions.

 

Hell, Obama got 15 Nobel Peace prizes just for using the WH toilet, that's pretty amazing, well done.   Now he makes his money on the circuit, how much is it ... $1,000,000 per speech.   What a really nice guy.

 

Or you become an expert in building stuff, condos, hotels, resorts, golf courses,, you can even get Trump chocolate bars.
Choose your poison, personally I'll stick close to the ground, it's pretty messy down here, but it's still ... the ground.

 

[Chang]

20 hours ago, 3bob said:

from a rep who  lives near the border:

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/border-towns-safer-than-any-city-trump-has-lived-in-says-texas-congressman/ar-BBTooc8?li=BBnb7Kz

 

I oft times wonder at your sanity 3Bob but even I must admit a grudging admiration for your audacity.

 

The "Rep" you quote represents the Democrats. He is also of Mexican ancestry.

 

He can therefore be assumed to be anti Trump, pro Wetback and ergo anti wall.

 

Please attempt at least to be a little less worthy of ridicule.

 

I am still awaiting answers to my questions.

 

1. Why are you so in favour of mass immigration into the USA?

 

2. If such immigration is to continue unimpeded then how many migrants are to be accepted and integrated into North American society. Thousands,  tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands, millions or tens of millions?

 

3.Trump was democratically elected as President and an election pledge was to build this damn wall. That he should keep his election pledge is a given. Do you agree with this?

 

4. Lastly I must ask you to admit that you are in fact opposed to democracy and wish to see a Marxist tyrany descend upon both America and the rest of the world. No need to waffle on like a Soy Boy over this one Bob. A simple yes or no will suffice, though to be fair we all know the answer already.

Edited February 11, 2019 by Chang

[Patrick Brown]

2 hours ago, Chang said:

scoundrel

 

 

PMSL 

[thelerner]

2 hours ago, rideforever said:

 

Ha ... but maybe it's true, in some ways anyway.   You do have to be a mean old tough shrewd grizzly bear to get where he's got.

He's a pretty straight shooter though, follows the Tao in the sense that he works, he builds, he creates, and doesn't give a f***.   
Then he tells everyone to read the Bible.
Well, I've heard worse instructions.

 

Hell, Obama got 15 Nobel Peace prizes just for using the WH toilet, that's pretty amazing, well done.   Now he makes his money on the circuit, how much is it ... $1,000,000 per speech.   What a really nice guy.

 

Or you become an expert in building stuff, condos, hotels, resorts, golf courses,, you can even get Trump chocolate bars.
Choose your poison, personally I'll stick close to the ground, it's pretty messy down here, but it's still ... the ground.

 

When you say he's a pretty straight shooter.. you realize he lies.. alot, a phenomenal amount.  I think when people say 'he's a straight shooter', what they mean is he speaks his mind.  And the hope is that people listening either won't fact check or don't care about the truth of what says.

 

For an expert he's gone bankrupt alot.  While he's the only modern American President who won't release income information, the last one that was partially leaked showed an $916 million dollar loss.  American banks having financial information would generally not do business with him.  When he says he's worth 10 Billion dollars what he's doing is he's lying.  But people are captivated by reality show reality, buy into it.

 

That's not to say he hasn't be successful, but his methods are wine, dine, and duck out of bills.. in that after making deals, he often claimed substandard work and refused to pay the contracted amount.  You accepted his new offer or face his lawyers and years of litigation.   Most business men don't work that way.

 

There's also a good chance that as president he's setting a new low as far as actually working.  Spending most of his mornings watching Fox news, and chatting with friends and advisors who'll echo what he says. 

 

Obama didn't deserve the Nobel prize, but he didn't apply for it either.  Its a European award and was given in the hopes that he'd be the anti-Bush, ie clean up the war mess left by Bush administration.  Which he didn't have much success at. 

 

For better or worse most presidents do a round of high paying speeches.  What they don't do is make millions off there coronation.  Seems like Trumps election party costs over a hundred million dollars, twice Obama's.  With $100,000's paid to friends and $40 million not accounted for.  That is on DAY ONE.  Trump being Trump and increasing his coffers by tens of millions purely by instinct. 

 

Trump is a narcissist and compulsive liar.  He's a solid to middling, if somewhat unethical business man.   The truth will come out about him.  We're already learning some of it in books by his friends and enemies, though they often tend on the same list.  Because he talks in hyperbole, you can get Trump quotes on how smart and honorable, and how dumb and despicable his staff is, often flowing back and forth.  He may not be the most mentally stable and two more years on the job may not improve his equilibrium.   

 

 

P.S the chocolate bars (Gold Bouillon bar) from the Trump Store which requires your phone number and email, cost $10 for two 1 1/2 oz bars.  Not a particularly smart deal, especially when you figure in the $7.99 charge for shipping.  So they kinda rip you off on the bars, then even more so on the shipping.   You can buy better quality chocolate locally for half the price but then you won't get the gold colored tinfoil on it. 

Edited February 11, 2019 by thelerner

[rideforever]

22 minutes ago, thelerner said:

you realize he lies.. alot, a phenomenal amount. 

 

No, he never lies, that's the best thing about him.
But ... of course I am not talking about what comes out of his mouth !!!

You can always tell exactly what he thinks and what he's gonna do.  

 

The main thing is that his agendas are natural, following Nature, for the most part.

Look at his family, his family photos you have a lot of people there, happy people, healthy people, no nutcashes or weirdos.
And they are confident well spoken take responsibility,l his ex-wife loves him.
So what's not to like ?   It's perfect, that speaks well of him.

 

He is not really creative in inventing strange ways to live, he's a boring man.

His dad was a business man, and he's a business always working etc..

5 years military school, never touched a drop of alcohol ..... who can say that ?   

He has internal discipline and a cause.

 

Is he a dirty businessman ?  Hmm ... well I imagine it's not so straightfoward to build in Manhattan.   You have to learn the ways, see how the river winds down the valley.   And he did that.   He didn't complain or ask for human rights.   He just worked with what was there.  On wikipedia they estimate him to be about $5bn.  And yeah he almost went under, but didn't.

Plus his businesses are rock solid, build on land, he is grounded person.
He is not a mental chatter dotcom bubble person, he is real.

Some of his buildings and hotels are beautiful, and sort of classic'ish.   

Not ugly cr** in Dubai.

Also his wives are pretty nice to listen to, not offensive, not airheads, actually interesting people.

 

Did he twist everybody's arms to get a better deal ?  Probably.   

But then, he's been in business for a long time, and everybody knows who's coming, so they choose to work with him or not.

 

Plus the best thing is you call him up on the phone and he's willing to make a deal, like N.Korea.
When he arrived in the office, Obama's imminent WW3 with Russian in Syria just vanished, was all made up.

 

Simple normal hardworking experienced, a bit dumb and stupid mouth ... but there are worse things.

The basics at least are upright.

 

And the world is degenerating so ... who gets in the office next.

Maybe it'll be the t-Kardashian.

 

 

 

 

[3bob]

8 minutes ago, rideforever said:

 

No, he never lies, that's the best thing about him.
But ... of course I am not talking about what comes out of his mouth !!!

You can always tell exactly what he thinks and what he's gonna do.  

 

The main thing is that his agendas are natural, following Nature, for the most part.

Look at his family, his family photos you have a lot of people there, happy people, healthy people, no nutcashes or weirdos.
And they are confident well spoken take responsibility,l his ex-wife loves him.
So what's not to like ?   It's perfect, that speaks well of him.

 

He is not really creative in inventing strange ways to live, he's a boring man.

His dad was a business man, and he's a business always working etc..

5 years military school, never touched a drop of alcohol ..... who can say that ?   

He has internal discipline and a cause.

 

Is he a dirty businessman ?  Hmm ... well I imagine it's not so straightfoward to build in Manhattan.   You have to learn the ways, see how the river winds down the valley.   And he did that.   He didn't complain or ask for human rights.   He just worked with what was there.  On wikipedia they estimate him to be about $5bn.  And yeah he almost went under, but didn't.

Plus his businesses are rock solid, build on land, he is grounded person.
He is not a mental chatter dotcom bubble person, he is real.

Some of his buildings and hotels are beautiful, and sort of classic'ish.   

Not ugly cr** in Dubai.

Also his wives are pretty nice to listen to, not offensive, not airheads, actually interesting people.

 

Did he twist everybody's arms to get a better deal ?  Probably.   

But then, he's been in business for a long time, and everybody knows who's coming, so they choose to work with him or not.

 

Plus the best thing is you call him up on the phone and he's willing to make a deal, like N.Korea.
When he arrived in the office, Obama's imminent WW3 with Russian in Syria just vanished, was all made up.

 

Simple normal hardworking experienced, a bit dumb and stupid mouth ... but there are worse things.

The basics at least are upright.

 

And the world is degenerating so ... who gets in the office next.

Maybe it'll be the t-Kardashian.

 

 

 

lots of smiling happy people around Hitler, Stalin, and Mussolini  in the 30's and early 40's...you show absolutely no discrimination linked to dharma or recognition of trump as the twisted, sick, wana-be dictator that he is.

[Chang]

25 minutes ago, 3bob said:

 

lots of smiling happy people around Hitler, Stalin, and Mussolini  in the 30's and early 40's...you show absolutely no discrimination linked to dharma or recognition of trump as the twisted, sick, wana-be dictator that he is.

 

Calm yourself down 3Bob and at least make the attempt to think in a rational manner. An American President can only stay in place for two terms of office. Are you suggesting in your buffoonery that Donald will abolish elections and set up a Tyrany?

 

Yours are the ramblings and ravings of a disordered Marxist mind and I just wish that you could pull yourself together sufficiently to answer my questions.

 

1. Why are you so in favour of mass immigration into the USA?

 

2. If such immigration is to continue unimpeded then how many migrants are to be accepted and integrated into North American society. Thousands,  tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands, millions or tens of millions?

 

3.Trump was democratically elected as President and an election pledge was to build this damn wall. That he should keep his election pledge is a given. Do you agree with this?

 

4. Lastly I must ask you to admit that you are in fact opposed to democracy and wish to see a Marxist tyrany descend upon both America and the rest of the world. No need to waffle on like a Soy Boy over this one Bob. A simple yes or no will suffice, though to be fair we all know the answer already.

[rideforever]

37 minutes ago, 3bob said:

lots of smiling happy people around Hitler, Stalin, and Mussolini  in the 30's and early 40's...you show absolutely no discrimination linked to dharma or recognition of trump as the twisted, sick, wana-be dictator that he is.

 

Well I just don't see it at all.

He doesn't really need anything nor want anything.

He doesn't even want to rule the world, he is just withdrawing US power.   

Obama type people just want to have more Presidential Meetings with Important People all over the planet so they can flaunt their balls and brainless agreements to everyone.
Trump can not be bothered.
And you know why ?
Because he spent his life building real buildings with real people out of real bricks.
Jesus, I can imagine him toying with blowing his brains out before going to another political chat-attack-world-meeting.

At least when he is in Singapore with Kim Jong Un, the rest of the worlds cream of elite swine asskissers aren't there.

I really feel sorry for him, now he knows just how corrupt power is.

And then you've got the military industrial complex, the bankers and all that.   

Difficult to find a clean glass to drink out of.

I'm sure he'd like to get back to construction a.s.a.p.

[thelerner]

1 hour ago, rideforever said:

 

No, he never lies, that's the best thing about him.
But ... of course I am not talking about what comes out of his mouth !!!

 

?? 

sorry I was thinking of what came out of his mouth.  Those things, his words, statements are often a multitude of lies.  Easily checked.  His speeches do get applause, but they're filled with false statistics, seemingly made up on the spot.  People aren't sure whether he believes them or not.  Even when clearly wrong, he moves on, never acknowledging or apologizing.  It works for the yokels, but constant compulsive lying is not what you want in a leader.  You overlook and forgive it, at great peril.

 

Question, when he agrees to a budget deal then reneges like because Ann Coulter and Fox news calls him a spineless wimp, is that about what he says, agreeing to a budget or something he 'does'?  To me its showing his character, he's easily manipulated by praise.  Thus tyrants get it and kiss his ass but leaders of the free world tend to see him clearly and not trustworthy. 

 

Throughout the world America's standing has dropped dramatically.  Except and this was a very old poll, only two countries didn't have a much lower opinion on the U.S under Trump, they were Russia and Israel, both gained, but it was an old poll so those numbers could be down too. 

[rideforever]

6 minutes ago, thelerner said:

Throughout the world America's standing has dropped dramatically. 

Well ... that's not going to be very easy to reverse now is it.   Maybe if there was a big earthquake in California it could happen but ...

 

That's why he likes the wall, he can at least go visit and get some fresh air, and remember the glory days of building high rise !!!

[dawei]

laozi already answered this... Water will seek lower ground... it moves along the path of least resistance... 

 

Plug off every border area with wall, security, tech, etc... don't do some security in just one section of Mcallen, TX... and they'll soon be screaming for help.    That will become the path of least resistance.   

 

I think these towns live in a bubble like the movie Pleasantville...  the students asked:  'what is outside of Pleasantville' and they get silence from the teacher...   Wait till that is the only section not secured and we'll see how pleasant it all is.

[thelerner]

56 minutes ago, dawei said:

laozi already answered this... Water will seek lower ground... it moves along the path of least resistance...

I'd say there's some truth to that.  Boarder security has to be holistic effort.  Starting with myriad laws, that provide security and justice and financing.  The best way to start isn't with hysteria.. ie they're drug dealers and when doesn't work, they're human traffickers. 

 

Lets talk about Laws.  The reality is the US has a long tradition of hypocrisy, when it comes to borders.  We look the other way because immigrants pick our crops, clean our houses.. build our houses.. take care of our elderly (this I have personal experience with, Haitians who did wonderful work with my mother).   Moving this towards Trump his golf courses hired 100's of illegal immigrants.  Only recently was there a mass firings.  Similarly his building firms hired dozens (or 100's) of illegal Polish workers.   Two of his wives visas were semi-illegal but thats getting a little picky. 

 

There have been several known attempts by known terrorist cross into the U.S border, but those were from Canada, and as all know it'd be insane to build a 2,000 mile boarder with them.   It doesn't take a genius to know that if you want to enter the U.S illegally, all you have to do is enter legally and over stay the visa.  That's how the majority of illegals do it. 

 

The Federal and State level have to work together to find the right solution there population and terrain.  Create the guidelines, set up the time frame, set up the financing and get the ball rolling.  It can't be from a politicians call for 30 foot wall, no a 40 wall.  How about 5.7 billion for 213 mile section of wall?  Which in Fed speak is 107 miles. 

 

If we had a plain speaking, honest man for president, compromise would be easy.  I get the feeling simply calling the funding, Boarder Security, would move things along fine.  Getting much more then Trumps original 1.6 Billion agreed on.  Probably close to the 5 billion, but he needs the word Wall attached to it and is willing to shut the government for that one word. 

 

Trumps creates obstacles by his immediate use fiery insulting 3rd grade rhetoric, first on the the Republicans running against him, then using similar childish names and calling to lock up and fire those on the other side.   If there's Trump Derangement Syndrome, it's because Trump is a bit deranged, childish, petulant, vindictive.. turns allies into enemies and gets into petty Tweet wars weekly.

 

He's up at 3, 4 5 am, posting in all CAPS like child.  Venting his rage. 

[Jonesboy]

10 minutes ago, thelerner said:

I'd say there's some truth to that.  Boarder security has to be holistic effort.  Starting with myriad laws, that provide security and justice and financing.  The best way to start isn't with hysteria.. ie they're drug dealers and when doesn't work, they're human traffickers. 

 

Lets talk about Laws.  The reality is the US has a long tradition of hypocrisy, when it comes to borders.  We look the other way because immigrants pick our crops, clean our houses.. build our houses.. take care of our elderly (this I have personal experience with, Haitians who did wonderful work with my mother).   Moving this towards Trump his golf courses hired 100's of illegal immigrants.  Only recently was there a mass firings.  Similarly his building firms hired dozens (or 100's) of illegal Polish workers.   Two of his wives visas were semi-illegal but thats getting a little picky. 

 

There have been several known attempts by known terrorist cross into the U.S border, but those were from Canada, and as all know it'd be insane to build a 2,000 mile boarder with them.   It doesn't take a genius to know that if you want to enter the U.S illegally, all you have to do is enter legally and over stay the visa.  That's how the majority of illegals do it. 

 

The Federal and State level have to work together to find the right solution there population and terrain.  Create the guidelines, set up the time frame, set up the financing and get the ball rolling.  It can't be from a politicians call for 30 foot wall, no a 40 wall.  How about 5.7 billion for 213 mile section of wall?  Which in Fed speak is 107 miles. 

 

If we had a plain speaking, honest man for president, compromise would be easy.  I get the feeling simply calling the funding, Boarder Security, would move things along fine.  Getting much more then Trumps original 1.6 Billion agreed on.  Probably close to the 5 billion, but he needs the word Wall attached to it and is willing to shut the government for that one word. 

 

Trumps creates obstacles by his immediate use fiery insulting 3rd grade rhetoric, first on the the Republicans running against him, then using similar childish names and calling to lock up and fire those on the other side.   If there's Trump Derangement Syndrome, it's because Trump is a bit deranged, childish, petulant, vindictive.. turns allies into enemies and gets into petty Tweet wars weekly.

 

He's up at 3, 4 5 am, posting in all CAPS like child.  Venting his rage. 

 

The people in trumps hotels were fired after it was found out they used forged documents. They were  suppose to be seasonal workers which everyone is for but lied and were fired. The fact it happened in his hotels shows how bad the problem really is. Not that he is trying to cash in on low skilled workers and pay.

 

The reason immigration reformed has failed every time is because republicans don't trust democrats on security. It was like the last big push, dem's said they would allocate 25 billion for security, allocating is not the same as funding. That is a big reason why it failed.

 

The wall needs repair and installed in additional areas, that is just a fact. The discussions are failing now because the dem's only want so many beds in immigration centers. This is an attempt to control the number of people that can be process and removed.

 

Also, I don't see Trump venting any rage, just stating facts of what is really going on.

Edited February 11, 2019 by Jonesboy

[3bob]

the tweetly disgusting, disgraceful, dishonorable, diseased liar and traitor which trump has repeatedly proven himself to be in public never states facts without him twisting them up or completely denying them to suit his narcissistic megalomaniac ego... 

[MooNiNite]

All you need is an angle grinder to get through Trump's wall, which is not hard to get.

Edited February 11, 2019 by MooNiNite