Fraudulent teacher?

[Guest]

On 18/02/2019 at 9:49 PM, escott said:

I just remind myself of all my past successes and tell myself I can do it again.

 

That’s great. Sounds like a winning method and I’m glad it’s working for you

 

On 18/02/2019 at 9:49 PM, escott said:

a good website is really helpful

 

Thanks for the advice, you’re right. There are some really unbelievable websites out there. Sometimes I think they’re made to test a potential student’s worth by making it almost impossible to find out where and when classes are held.

 

I came across one where you had to search click through multiple areas then download a pdf file and scroll through multiple pages to find out class times. Unnecessarily complicated!

[Apech]

On 2/14/2019 at 5:14 PM, AboveGround said:

.....

 

Now I feel totally lost. Not only had taijiquan and qigong been my passion for all these years, to the point that I chose dedication to my teacher over time spent with family and friends, but it had also become my profession after being gently pressured into quitting my job and becoming a teacher. Teaching was a huge source of inspiration and motivation and gave me a real sense of purpose in life, being convinced I was really making a positive change in this world but I was forced into handing over my business when I left (long story) and wasn’t even able to tell my students why, some of whom had been training with me for many years.

 

I’ve been trying to find new interests and jobs but keep coming to the same conclusion... I’d like to return to teaching, but all I know was taught to me by someone who I consider a fraud and all that I’ve learned has been taken from other teachers without their knowledge. If I go back to teaching then I’m no better than my previous teacher, and also I honestly have no idea what to say if someone asks me my lineage.

 .....

 

Thanks,

Ag

 

For what it's worth my thoughts on this are that if you have learned effective practices and techniques through taiji and qi gong then why shouldn't you pass them on?  If you are asked about your lineage then just answer honestly that you have learned these techniques and practiced them and they work.  This is more important than some fancy exotic lineage - as you have found out.  The motivation for 'creating' a lineage is probably just marketing so you can charge more etc.  But I guess it may have the positive effect of building confidence among those who expect a teacher to be a lineage holder - but this is in essence smoke and mirrors.

 

Lineages are used in eastern traditions to preserve authenticity - and within some cultural systems they are given great stress and importance.  In this sense they are helpful to prevent deterioration and loss of energy in a system.  But it is not necessarily the case (though often may be) that the lineage holder is the most knowledgable or accomplished person in the room.  In the west, in mystical systems the lineages are much looser and most western masters were one off 'geniuses' who left little behind in the way of lineage, apart of their contributions to the culture generally.

 

I don't see any reason you should not teach if there are people who wish to learn what you have to offer.  This also does not preclude getting new teachings from others as you go.  This way, your development will help the development of your students.  Just be honest and explain what you are doing, study hard yourself and be helpful to as many as can.

 

 

[Aetherous]

If you think the methods are beneficial to people, and you enjoy sharing them, then you should do that. And be honest about how you learned, and where you think the methods truly come from. Honesty is the best policy.

[Equilibrium]

Yeah fraudsters are big problem, most people think what we are doing is "bullshido" because of them. 

 

Who would you guys recommend for me to learn more Qigong from and who to avoid?

Learn it online from courses or something like that, since in my country people don't even know about this.

Edited March 2, 2019 by Equilibrium

[thelerner]

Can a person be both?   Real and a fraud?  I'm thinking Osho, many spit after his name, he did some bad things, yet some of his writings seem profound, others eh.  Seems to me he was bi-polar.  At times saintly other times self serving fraud. 

 

I've been watching Sadhguru videos and fine him very wise.  Yet there are times he's wrong.  Cultural conditioning and strong bias has him state as fact things that aren't correct.  Like Bruce Lee was a vegetarian.  Course you constantly give speeches on every subject under the sun, you're bound to misspeak.  Nor does he have google with him for every fact.  Thus certainly not a fraud, but not perfect, which may be a general human condition even amongst the saintly.

[Fa Xin]

I'm a big fan of teachers who teach you to find your own answers.  

[liminal_luke]

What is a teacher?

 

Someone who can assess a student´s spiritual progress and make specific recommendations tailored to their particular level?

 

Someone with a wide knowledge base about qi gong and spirituality in general?

 

Someone self-realized (awakened) to the point where their very presence radiates spiritual energy that ready students can pick up?

 

or just....

 

Someone whose learned something valuable and is willing to share with others?

 

Several here have mentioned honesty.  Honesty is the best insurance against fraud.  Nothing wrong with teaching something without being a Daoist Wizard as long as you don´t mislead people about your own abilities and knowledge.  I started to learn piano from my elementary school teacher when I was in third grade.  She was great.  She knew the basics and was happy to pass them on for a fair price.  When it was clear that I was serious and had absorbed what she had to give she sent me to another teacher.  That´s the way it should be.

 

 

[thelerner]

Often but not always a Fraud and $$ are intimately connected. 

 

I think a great teacher can slip into fraud, ie be brilliant one on one, or in small classes, then comes the irresistible urge to expand into books and videos.  Then comes fame, then comes shoddier material and teaching things best taught in person with feedback. 

[Guest]

On 02/03/2019 at 3:31 PM, thelerner said:

Can a person be both?   Real and a fraud? 

 

I think this touches on the earlier post about the “imposter complex”. Personally I believe we are all ultimately imposters, in that all titles are ultimately empty.

 

But we live in a society and we need titles to play the game and make systems work. My problem is with anyone who portrays themself as a “one and only” (eg. Only I know the hidden lineage and the secret teachings within it).

 

A boxer may boast they are the greatest of all time etc. and that’s fine, we realise it’s part of that game and it doesn’t affect our day to day life, but some spiritual leaders behave the same way and do affect lots of peoples’ lives (most hopefully for the better) but certainly many have done horrendous things behind the scenes.

 

In the end we have to remember just because someone says wise things doesn’t mean they are any different from a boxer training hard for countless hours to promote themselves as being the best at something. Some gurus spend years studying ancient texts overflowing with mind altering wisdom, so we shouldn’t be too surprised that someone like Osho, who had a vast library of books, said some remarkable things. Can we be certain he didn’t draw those words/ideas from something he read or heard from another and just applied an allegory with modern references to help people understand (queue laughter from a gullible crowd, surprised that this wise old man is so hip to pop culture).

 

In my situation I’ve come to realise I was won over not by the wisdom of my previous teacher, but their ability to source obscure texts (obscure to my poorly educated self anyway!) and pass them off as their own wisdom. 

 

So now I am no longer impressed by any wise person, only the wise words they speak, because in the end they are just human and riddled with “faults” and anyway the wisdom belongs to the Tao, not to any one person.

 

When I was young a friend told me his dad said “do like Christ but don’t be a Christian” and I didn’t really understand but it makes more sense now...

[Guest]

On 02/03/2019 at 3:33 PM, Fa Xin said:

I'm a big fan of teachers who teach you to find your own answers.  

 

This certainly wasn’t the case for me. More like “without me you’ll never figure it out” and “the world outside is insane and dangerous, stick with me and I’ll protect you”.

[Guest]

On 02/03/2019 at 4:12 PM, liminal_luke said:

What is a teacher?

 

Really good points.

 

Edited March 16, 2019 by Guest

[Guest]

On 02/03/2019 at 9:58 PM, thelerner said:

Often but not always a Fraud and $$ are intimately connected

 

Exactly! 

 

 

Edited March 16, 2019 by Guest

[Taoist Texts]

35 minutes ago, AboveGround said:

“the world outside is insane and dangerous

word