Sinai Posted March 25, 2019 4 minutes ago, Mudfoot said: True, does that mean Chia's material originated with the Celestial Masters? no no it means they have originated from same source that's what is i am talking about ... the microcosmic orbit and Macrocosmic orbit are foundations for other practices maybe further you will find some practices with a little differ name but nearly the same in procedure and origin 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Abzu Posted March 25, 2019 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Sinai said: Dear Abzu i have no prejudice or bias about any system i just asked about some techniques and OK i found that those are the techniques which i don't know their real traditional name ... those basics which you mentioned must be somewhere and believe me I've read enough of encyclopedia or books to understand this ... thanks for the help but the main topic reason here is to share not confusing each other and remove obstacles and fake paths so we can reach our goal which all you dear good friends are doing so believe me everyone find the path if we continue to share everything we know ... nice friends and community you miss my point. the things that are hidden are probably not able to be translated orally or written, because they are specific to the practitioners body. the things that aren't, everyone knows. mulha locks, holding the diaghram down, non-thought, relaxing in the dantian, allowing a microcosmic orbit. everyone does these things. I suspect, because I am the same way, your body wants to do things, and you are suppressing it no practice will stop you from being a burden to your self. the body already knows how it works. Edited March 25, 2019 by Abzu 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Abzu Posted March 25, 2019 16 minutes ago, Sinai said: Dear Abzu i have no prejudice or bias about any system i just asked about some techniques and OK i found that those are the techniques which i don't know their real traditional names ... those basics which you mentioned must be somewhere and believe me I've read enough of encyclopedia or books to understand this ... thanks for help but the main topic reason here is to share not confusing each other and remove obstacles and fake paths so we can reach our goal rather, the source you are expecting to come to you delivering this information, is the being inside of you you are currently staring at 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sinai Posted March 25, 2019 Just now, Abzu said: you miss my point. the things that are hidden are probably not able to be translated orally or written, because they are specific to the practitioners body. the things that aren't, everyone knows. mulha locks, holding the diaghram down, non-thought, relaxing in the dantian, allowing a microcosmic orbit. everyone does these things. I suspect, because I am the same way, your body wants to do things, and you are suppressing it right i agree many masters even who are using martial arts or Qi gong told me that ... yes every body has their own needs which must be taken care with proper practices and exercises ... like mantras which should be taken from a guru by practitioner ... yes these are details that we must be aware of them Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Abzu Posted March 25, 2019 look cook the egg, let it set, be the egg the shell is destroyed I have chanted mantras just to see why I felt weird about chanting them. a great practice, but, it is a trick, to distract one part of the mind, so that the other may take over, as all things are 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sinai Posted March 25, 2019 1 minute ago, Abzu said: rather, the source you are expecting to come to you delivering this information, is the being inside of you you are currently staring at yes yes Dear Abzu thanks you very much , you are right and i am thoroughly aware of it ... As below, So above ...yes and Rumi poems ... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mudfoot Posted March 25, 2019 32 minutes ago, Sinai said: if we continue to share everything we know ... nice friends and community That will not happen. Look back at all previous nei dan threads on TDB. Insults shared. Plattitudes shared. Methods? Nah. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sinai Posted March 25, 2019 1 minute ago, Mudfoot said: That will not happen. Look back at all previous nei dan threads on TDB. Insults shared. Plattitudes shared. Methods? Nah. Oh man it shouldn't be suppose like this... OK then so i will be the first here to share methods ... feel free to ask me or PM me if you need more details or anything else ... i got depression .. all chakras crashed Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Abzu Posted March 25, 2019 (edited) it isn't even what to do as much as it is doing it. start breathing right,NOW, you know how. don't be needy with your energy. don't be needy with your thoughts. any one technique will become THE technique with time the body is smarter than the one thing you tune in to 11 minutes ago, Sinai said: Oh man it shouldn't be suppose like this... OK then so i will be the first here to share methods ... feel free to ask me or PM me if you need more details or anything else ... i got depression .. all chakras crashed Edited March 25, 2019 by Abzu Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mudfoot Posted March 25, 2019 9 minutes ago, Sinai said: Oh man it shouldn't be suppose like this... OK then so i will be the first here to share methods ... feel free to ask me or PM me if you need more details or anything else ... i got depression .. all chakras crashed That's ok, you'll get used to it. Most already have the books, many also have methods, quite a few have methods learned from teachers. Some will claim that you don't need a teacher if you have the right book, others will claim that without the proper transmission you will fail. Quite a mess actually 😁 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sinai Posted March 25, 2019 4 minutes ago, Mudfoot said: That will not happen. Look back at all previous nei dan threads on TDB. Insults shared. Plattitudes shared. Methods? Nah. OK for the first technique to share anyone with Prof johnson's method follow this method : If I were to suggest anywhere to start with this system - I would suggest finding a copy of Prof. Johnson's Neigong and Alchemy Book. For that stuff to be possible you have to train the foundation first -The first reading that you want to do is from the beginning up until the end of the 18 rules of posture. -When you get through that, you are going to want to start with the "Old Man in Tidepool Exercise" -You will make this the main practice for some time, purifying the organs, channels, and emotions. -As the Body/Energy/Mind empties out and becomes clean, you will practice the 1-10 meditation. This is also in the recent editions of this very same Neigong book. -This 1-10 practice is very very very powerful and connects your system to heaven and earth. You will make this the main practice for some time to develop good energy skill and maintain attention in the present moment and with a open flow of higher creative energy coming through you. ( take it really seriously ) -Next you will want to train the Daoist 5 Qigong (which Prof. Johnson has in the same book, but also had recorded as a "qigong workout empowerment" dvd back in the 90s.) -This should be enough to get you going.. .what comes next is the beating and drumming and the celibacy practices. - Start with the 1-10 and 3 Invocations, 100 day Celibacy practice, and twice daily beating a drumming the Qi practice others with master chia system : - start with simple chi kung exercises - then do Inner Smile and Cosmic Healing sounds ( which is similar to 18 rules of posture not in practices but in results which makes the organs channels and emotions clean and healed - then go microcosmic orbit and macrocosmic orbit in JAJ in celestial clouds system it is like : Lower Dantian Training -> Microcosmic Orbit -> Macrocosmic Orbit -> Fusion of the Bagua -> Cycling the Five -> Microcosmic Orbit Water -> Microcosmic Orbit Wind Cycle Training Progression in master chia's UHT it is like : simple chikung --> inner smile --> six healing sounds --> microcosmic and macrocosmic orbit --> Fusion of 5 elements --> Cosmic Fusion --> fusion of 8 psychic channels ( which all these 3 are similar to Fusion of Bagua ) --> lesser Kan & Li --> Practice of Greater Kan & Li --> Greatest Kan & Li --> Sealing of 5 senses --> congress of heaven and earth ( reunion of Kan and Kun ) --> Reunion of heaven and earth OK i am waiting about your desires Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sinai Posted March 25, 2019 1 minute ago, Mudfoot said: That's OK, you'll get used to it. Most already have the books, many also have methods, quite a few have methods learned from teachers. Some will claim that you don't need a teacher if you have the right book, others will claim that without the proper transmission you will fail. Quite a mess actually 😁 unfortunately due to some reasons i have no access to JAJ alchemy and Neigong book and i am not able to get it in any way ... but i share what ever i know you may check this you certainly will be happy to see it :https://daoist.academy/baguaonline/ I can't access to JAJ materials due to sanctions in my country for international cards and banks transactions ... so by the way despite i know no one helps me like my past 11 years or even when i was high school student , still i am here to help you ...comment or PM if you need anything Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vonkrankenhaus Posted March 25, 2019 4 minutes ago, Sinai said: Lower Dantian Training -> Microcosmic Orbit -> Macrocosmic Orbit -> Fusion of the Bagua -> Cycling the Five -> Microcosmic Orbit Water -> Microcosmic Orbit Wind Cycle Training Progression in master chia's UHT it is like : simple chikung --> inner smile --> six healing sounds --> microcosmic and macrocosmic orbit --> Fusion of 5 elements --> Cosmic Fusion --> fusion of 8 psychic channels ( which all these 3 are similar to Fusion of Bagua ) --> lesser Kan & Li --> Practice of Greater Kan & Li --> Greatest Kan & Li --> Sealing of 5 senses --> congress of heaven and earth ( reunion of Kan and Kun ) --> Reunion of heaven and earth All I am seeing in modern books so far stops at Fire/Water basics. It is clear that the writers have not even fully work this stage. People eating refined modern foods and drinking fluoride water and ever taking antobiotics or chemical and hormone medications cannot even understand or do Iron Shirt. Marrow Washing will be disturbed - not possible. Where to go from that? Learn Chang Ming Shu, learn to discern what build and what destructs Body, and then study Iron Shirt again. No normal body functioning means no Iron Shirt and no Marrow Washing and means no going anywhere further. Good traditional Gongfu has all basics and Iron Shirt - so start there is okay. -VonKrankenhaus 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mudfoot Posted March 25, 2019 2 minutes ago, Sinai said: unfortunately due to some reasons i have no access to JAJ alchemy and Neigong book and i am not able to get it in any way ... It is very full with examples of techniques. Confusingly full. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mudfoot Posted March 25, 2019 18 minutes ago, Sinai said: 100 day Celibacy practice, Have you gone through the threads about this, in Fuxi? They are a delight, and some of them are classic Nei Dan threads. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sinai Posted March 25, 2019 1 minute ago, Mudfoot said: Have you gone through the threads about this, in Fuxi? They are a delight, and some of them are classic Nei Dan threads. Unfortuantely dear friedn no , i am not aware of it you must seek a teacher and Prof Johnson's book Alchemy and neigong book , i got them from a disciple of Prof JAJ ... i cant guide you in this ... but many ahve the books and training you may ask them .... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sinai Posted March 25, 2019 5 minutes ago, vonkrankenhaus said: All I am seeing in modern books so far stops at Fire/Water basics. It is clear that the writers have not even fully work this stage. People eating refined modern foods and drinking fluoride water and ever taking antobiotics or chemical and hormone medications cannot even understand or do Iron Shirt. Marrow Washing will be disturbed - not possible. Where to go from that? Learn Chang Ming Shu, learn to discern what build and what destructs Body, and then study Iron Shirt again. No normal body functioning means no Iron Shirt and no Marrow Washing and means no going anywhere further. Good traditional Gongfu has all basics and Iron Shirt - so start there is okay. -VonKrankenhaus Thank you so much dear Master VonKrankenhaus for your help yes those procedures are aonly for beginning , tomorrow i will post the master Chia's guideline thoroughly ... but JAJ system it is yes incomplete also ... 13 minutes ago, vonkrankenhaus said: It is clear that the writers have not even fully work this stage. well that's my fault , i will post the UHT guideline tomorrow for sure ... 14 minutes ago, vonkrankenhaus said: People eating refined modern foods and drinking fluoride water and ever taking antobiotics or chemical and hormone medications cannot even understand or do Iron Shirt. Marrow Washing will be disturbed - not possible. yes it also calcify Pineal gland and we must de-calcify it also 15 minutes ago, vonkrankenhaus said: Learn Chang Ming Shu how dear master ? from which resource ? i don't see any traditional kung fu schools here in my city or country ... unfortunately please guide me dear master .... which resources or books would you suggest and recommend ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mudfoot Posted March 25, 2019 Fuxi is in the Garden, on this forum. I am one of the arrogant bastards here that already have a method, so I am content with that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sinai Posted March 25, 2019 (edited) 3 minutes ago, GSmaster said: Oh, I have to say one thing, it is clearly impossible to write advanced practice into books, as they are advanced. You can write practice like 1. do this 2. do that 3. do this 4. tighten your butt (c) Mantak Chia 5. do that But, advanced level practice has no logic, no actions to do, nor they could be understood by linear mind. How would you explain something in words, that is out of this world. i can i can Edited March 25, 2019 by Sinai Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sinai Posted March 25, 2019 5 minutes ago, GSmaster said: Oh, I have to say one thing, it is clearly impossible to write advanced practice into books, as they are advanced. You can write practice like 1. do this 2. do that 3. do this 4. tighten your butt (c) Mantak Chia 5. do that But, advanced level practice has no logic, no actions to do, nor they could be understood by linear mind. How would you explain something in words, that is out of this world. yes you are right dear GSmaster ... but have you saw Bihar School of yoga books by swami Santayana ? believe me you will change your mind and of course , again read 道藏 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Taoist Texts Posted March 25, 2019 1 hour ago, Sinai said: start with the "Old Man in Tidepool Exercise" no no, you gotta use the full title, otherwise its just wrong Plant-Based Lifestyle: Part 3 – We Qigong “The Old Man Searching for the Reflection of the Moon at the Bottom of the Tide Pool” Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vonkrankenhaus Posted March 25, 2019 42 minutes ago, GSmaster said: Advanced practice that I am talking about is beyond human mind, human words and human understanding, Only relative to people today. But goal of training is not abstract or devoid of logic or meaning, and is not beyond understanding. It is actually simple. Obscured language, but not so obscure technically. Part is like "mind training", and yes, this transcends linear causality and also most fake ideas about what is a human and what life is. But nobody is suddenly in that situation. In years of development, each stage is able to see the next, so this is "progress". Who today needs no-powerful power? Teachers are looking for students. Students are looking for something they saw on TV or in magazine. How much does Reality cost today? What would people do with it? Techniques developed from purpose. What is the purpose people have in mind so as to need these techniques? Is that what they developed from, or are made to solve or facilitate? Not being aware of the techniques - then how does anyone know the answer to this? What would you do with these techniques? What will you "get"? -VonKrankenhaus 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vonkrankenhaus Posted March 26, 2019 1 hour ago, GSmaster said: Not necessarily, 2d being may never be able to percieve 3d reality. A 3d being cannot grasp 4d world.There is a powerful barrier which you cannot pass without dramatically changing oneself. Whenever you practice 10 years, 30 years, or 55 years like Mantak Chia, it is possible to be forever stuck, while doing all the "right practices" reading all the "right books" and thinking you are already grandmaster of tao. Simply because you have done everything and cultivated qi for 55 years. I do not agree with that idea about beings and dimensions. It doesn't describe reality. The stuff about 10, 30, 55 yrs - In traditional training this is not possible. Each stage, starting with Gongfu, is difficult, and sorts out what progress is and isn't. Teachers and mentors guide this and inspire it. Carrying us bags of grain, how do we know who is too weak to carry very far and who is not? Problems come up - How do we know who cannot solve these and who can? We want to go somewhere - How do we know who actually knows the way and who does not? So one question is - What are people trying to do with Neigong, and why? And based on what? What examples? Traditional way, the teachers are the examples. Easy. -VonKrankenhaus 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Abzu Posted March 26, 2019 (edited) only good way to train the mind is to remove it. every thought that causes the body to suffer. the good techniques are only good if you're willing to shed your entire ego and point of view I can go to sleep and have whatever siddhis I want. I can also induce a permanent hallucination in which this is the case, and never know the difference. and yes, impossible to decompress the zip drive without having the disk space, which is why the mind must be removed. if one cannot directly access the zip drive from someone, a master, for whatever reason, then I guess they'd need to sit down and see what is being transmitted, and see what can be discerned from it, piece by piece. faster to format your entire disk, and have a master download it all to you. but, just as feasible to empty out completely and do it yourself. the human body itself is "open source." both require the entire shedding of the ego. we all know what thoughts are hurting us. releasing them is the difficult part. and, if one sheds enough, I gather it'd be required for them to have SOME zip drive from some master, because otherwise, there is no balance. ie, if the ego of the master is even somewhat existent, it will fill in the empty disk that is available. between all the 7 billion humans on this planet, surely we have all that we need Edited March 26, 2019 by Abzu Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Abzu Posted March 26, 2019 1 minute ago, GSmaster said: We have filled this thread with some ultimate alchemy, indeed. But did you know that voice in your head could be used as a service function? It can be programmed? Surely, you have phone with Siri / Bixby / Alexa HA! I knew there was something I was forgetting to do Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
