CloudHands Posted May 10, 2019 (edited) Dao doesn't give a shit about human life. There is no hazard. Edited May 10, 2019 by CloudHands 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CloudHands Posted May 12, 2019 (edited) and being so, it (dao) is great, otherwise couldn't be... ultimate Edited May 12, 2019 by CloudHands Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rocky Lionmouth Posted May 14, 2019 Impossible for it to give a shit about anything, it is none of the Daos concern to care and especially not care more about something than something else, especially by human distinctions. It grinds the land like corn, and turns the stars over within a heartbeat and with no remorse. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
silent thunder Posted May 14, 2019 there are no accidents... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CloudHands Posted May 14, 2019 ultimately no accidents, no more than any human-based concept. Even the idea of "direction" may have no reality beyond what we expect practically in our daily life. After 2 millenniums scientists realized the Euclidean straight line appears to be the "improbable" case at a "universe" scale. Not all at the same time, Spring flowers in autumn fade, Pushed to wax until it wanes. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rocky Lionmouth Posted May 14, 2019 19 minutes ago, CloudHands said: ... no reality beyond what we expect practically in our daily life. Well said Cloud! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rideforever Posted May 20, 2019 Ask not what the Dao can do for you But what you can do for the Dao 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Stosh Posted May 22, 2019 On 5/10/2019 at 4:55 PM, CloudHands said: Dao doesn't give a shit about human life. There is no hazard. No contradiction..you could think it's ironic, or counterintuitive, but it's just a logically accurate view. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dawei Posted May 22, 2019 Dao is but a three letter word. Get over it 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CloudHands Posted May 23, 2019 (edited) On 22/05/2019 at 4:20 AM, Stosh said: No contradiction..you could think it's ironic, or counterintuitive, but it's just a logically accurate view. I may struggle a little with the idea of a pointless growth of that... size. When it comes from a philosophy/religion that puts so much emphasize on not doing too much, let's say the display is anything but minimalist. On 22/05/2019 at 4:44 AM, dawei said: Dao is but a three letter word. Get over it I think too much, is that what you think ? To my knowledge daoism brings nothing at the table about the outcome of all that life struggle it realizes effortlessly, neither the why(?!) question. Mostly... it's about the how(?), how things are and how to deal with it and that's quite something but sometimes I'm hungry for other('s) answers Edited May 23, 2019 by CloudHands 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Stosh Posted May 23, 2019 (edited) 15 minutes ago, CloudHands said: I may struggle a little with the idea of a pointless growth of that... size. When it comes from a philosophy/religion that puts so much emphasize on not doing too much, let's say the display is anything but minimalist. I think too much, is that what you think ? To my knowledge daoism brings nothing at the table about the outcome of all that life struggle it realizes effortlessly, neither the why(?!) question. Mostly... it's about the how(?), how things are and how to deal with it and that's quite something but sometimes I'm hungry for other('s) answers I propose that 'doing' in this context is not simply the enacting motion, or speaking words, its willfully fighting the objective tide. If I used colloquial speech I might tell somebody that they should "Behave reasonably",, but what the heck does that even mean! I might suggest following ones true instincts , but what the hell are your genuine instinct? Be yourself , but who are you? To define reason, genuineness, self, one must see that there is an objective truth from which one has diverged. And so the masters suggested one get back to the holistic and objective truth to have virtue. and such behavior is not a 'doing' since the events are propagating through one, un-self-impeded. . Edited May 23, 2019 by Stosh 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CloudHands Posted May 24, 2019 It's deeply linked to emotional balance : to master one's sensibility to avoid getting lost in it. That we all can agree on. The daoist practices meditation/qi gong/tai chi it's all good to me and it seems that I can't quit them anyway. Dao's manifestation is not a minimalist/economic system rather the contrary. If we take earth's life forms, it's something that tries and fails a lot, nurture and fight itself. It acts unlike something that knows were it goes but more like something that tries anything in every directions. If it favors nothing it is because it "desires" nothing. If it desires (wants) nothing, is it because it goes nowhere or/and because all is already set up. No accidents but DNA replication errors. So if you have somewhere inside you a question like "why is there something rather that nothing ?" or "what's the purpose of life ?" daoism will not answer it but dao let it appear. These questions can be extinct by a "shut up and feel", they can and maybe they should if they are to much weight to carry. Still I think they have their part of beauty and I have interest in them. Better have balanced doubts that a dubious balance ! 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rocky Lionmouth Posted June 11, 2019 I for one enjoy my dubious balance and balance my doubts against it. The trick about balance is to maintain it without killing the slight offset. Once it reaces perfection it becomes still and then there is only death. Which is often accompanied by voiding onse bladder and bowels soon after, i’d rather keep my pants unsoiled a while longer. When you’re very near that perfect balance it’s also when things get really hard to shift or lift, which takes a lot of effort and should that effort be excessive and/or misguided: voila! Soiled pants. Lets all agree that the Dao gives no shit and rightly so and that for us to follow in it’s footsteps on this as much as possible is a pretty decent idea. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
doc benway Posted June 11, 2019 On 5/10/2019 at 4:55 PM, CloudHands said: Dao doesn't give a shit about human life. There is no hazard. Hmmm... If that was the case would human life exist at all? I think that human life, all life, is a miraculous display of the infinite potential of the Dao. What it doesn't give a shit about is our expectation and desire to live forever - that's on us. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Starjumper Posted June 12, 2019 (edited) Tao doesn't give a shit about anything, it can't, it ain't got no steenkin' feelings, no brain, no hopes, nothing. Poor misunderstood Tao, it's only a set of operating instructions ... for the universe. No fucks given, none taken, all ok. Edited June 12, 2019 by Starjumper 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dawei Posted June 12, 2019 Zhuangzi said Dao is in shit... get over it... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
silent thunder Posted June 12, 2019 behold the field in which I grow tao. it is barren... or is it? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CloudHands Posted June 13, 2019 That's the thing, so much power and possibilities in that creation, myriad of lifeforms and treasures of ingenuity, an effortless push emulate countless lives struggling and the scene can stop in a fraction of seconds... while we still don't know if time counts ! this stage will shut down with the sun's last song without answering why the wheat grows maybe the try is to reach for the next breathable astral ballet maybe we just consciences born to contemplate Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rocky Lionmouth Posted June 13, 2019 On 2019-06-12 at 4:01 AM, dawei said: Zhuangzi said Dao is in shit... get over it... Shit does happen and oftentimes i am over it, at least in comparison to how often i find myself under it. I’m content not to soil my pants or get under my own shit any more often than strictly necessary. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rocky Lionmouth Posted June 13, 2019 On 2019-06-12 at 6:06 PM, silent thunder said: behold the field in which I grow tao. it is barren... or is it? Regardless it must be quite vast! You should see the field in which tao grows me, it’s ridiculusly small! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
silent thunder Posted June 13, 2019 Dog who shits in same spot daily, must soon seek new spot. As old spot inevitably overrun by flowers... 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CloudHands Posted June 13, 2019 I'm sorry ST , but no... that's not what will happen with dog shit 2 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
thelerner Posted June 13, 2019 (edited) I don't know much about the Tao, but maybe it treats us like straw dogs. and you know, straw dogs were traditionally used for ceremonies, they serve there purpose, some important, some not. Serving there purpose they are valued, when done they could be discarded. In Taoism even something as plain and common as straw can be appreciated. Are we important to the Dao? I think I am, because the warm sun is shining on me. Edited June 13, 2019 by thelerner 4 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dawei Posted June 13, 2019 Dao is just the process of emergence from nothing, unfolding to something, flourishing as one, and returning to the source (live and death). Dao does not partake in any of it. It is a kind of cosmic explanation for how life arises from nothing and returns to nothing. Being "One with Dao" is sensing and feeling and knowing this, while you live. This explanation may appear as somewhat mental but the core aspect is the heart sense of it. Here is another conundrum: What exactly is One[ness] ? 2 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
