Omniscience. Game of Thrones.

[thelerner]

 

[JustARandomPanda]

I haven't read the GoT series past book 3 as GRRM, Patrick Rothfuss and Robert Jordan all convinced me to never start a series until the author has completely finished their series.

 

I have watched the TV show however up to season 6 via checking out the DVDs from the library (season 7 still has a monstrously long wait list).

 

However I stumbled across the following thread on Youtube spurred by the GoT fandom's angry reactions to how the series has ended. I'm posting the long back-and-forth because it's changed what I think of the 3 books I've read so far and (if the guy who keeps making the points he does is right - the tv show has gone so off the rails from the books that it very long ago became something that is only distantly "inspired" by the books).

 

I'll admit right now that if what this guy says it's a big spoiler for the end of the *novels* - not just the tv show. TV show GRRM outline for tv show + novel + published works history now makes me suspect GoT actually takes place in a Science Fiction future - *not* a Medieval Fantasy.

 

Read the following posts I'm C&P-ing at one's own peril of potential novel spoilers:

 

********************************C&P follows*****************************************

 

Anti-Federalist 1776 on the show and its trajectory:
1 day ago
It was wrong from the beginning... people just didn't know it, a Fantasy series based upon Science Fiction novels from one of the most prominent bronze era SciFi writers could never end well.
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Anti-Federalist 1776 says:
Because Jon isn't a Targaryen... he's a Stark & Dayne, possibly the true heir of Winterfell if Brandon & Ashara were married when he (Ned) was locked in the Black Cells. Dany Is Rheagar Targaryen & Lyanna Stark's daughter ... it's impossible for Dany to be the Mad King's daughter since she wouldn't have the right genetic legacy to telepathically nuture then hatch dragons eggs.
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jamesw6374 said:
G RR Martin has frequently said that fans guessing this threw a massive spanner in the works for his entire saga. Hence why the 'king is the one with the best stories' and who knows the future and the past (author egotism?)
Fan service would have had the hero Jon Snow defeating the 'the dark lord' character of the night king, winning the heart of the Queen and sitting on the Iron Throne Aragon-style. Never what GOT was about, Martin's subversion of fan expectations is actually secretly kind of brilliant.
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Anti-Federalist 1776 said:
pathetic show watchers... Rhaegar+Lyanna Stark =Jon Snow was widely considered to be such an obvious red herring that only morons would believe it before the show came out. So no... it is IMPOSSIBLE for Dany to be Rheagar's sister AND be a Dragonhatcher, that's not how GRRM uses a simplified Mendelian genetic modeling in any of his published works. The whole point of Rheagar chasing Lyanna was to create Dany... to attempt to substitute the Stark telepathic Warging gene for the Targaryen telepathic Dragon gene. In so doing creating the first XX Dragonhatcher in well over a century. The Faith & Citadel spent centuries to eliminate that capacity from the Targaryen bloodline, though some of the Westrosi Houses managed to snag & preserve it. Which conversely is even how Rheagar carried it... from his Blackwood grandmother are the Targaryen Civil War had the dragonless genetic lineage take prominence & then no more Dragons were hatched again.
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Someone objects that the tv show establishes Jon as a Targyren + Stark
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Anti-Federalist 1776 said:
nope... I don't care about the trash fanfic show that only morons would be entertained by, I checked out in season 4 because it was a disgrace. Though it would be horrific if Bran (the-3-Eyed-Raven) actually was crowned "King" since that means humanity lost & the Weirwoods won... they nuked themselves back into a literal Stone Age & plummeted into a millennia of post-apocalyptic interregnum in an effort to defeat the Weirwoods - the long fabled but never physically described Hrangain in the novels, that the Human Federal Empire destroyed itself fighting to achieve a pyrrhic victory against in the vast interstellar Double War.
I was a GRRM fan before I picked up GoT when it was originally released in paperback... so my view on the story is vastly different than your show watching opinion. You see "magic"... I just see all the telepathic abilities from GRRM's previous works, I mean he has a whole Corpse Handler trilogy which has his most autobiographical character of Turtle being an uber powerful corpse handler. I mean even Bran's "time travel" is done the exact same as previous as GRRM published work, with the same reasoning on how it doesn't violate the Paradox Rule by it being a conciousness transfer not a physical transfer (which is still bullshit but at least makes the attempt at justification.)
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Anti-Federalist 1776 said:
Ned+Ashara=Jon is just a shittier version of Brandon+Ashara=Jon... plus it has nothing to do with the way GRRM writes that involves cuckoldry & the "hero" being unloved. It also doesn't match up with the story in that Howland kept Ned busy during the Harrenhal tourney after bringing Ashara to Neds attention... then Ned also wouldn't have been around Ashara like Brandon was when he was locked up in the black cells & Ashara was one of the handmaidens of Princess Elia. Ashara "killed herself" when Ned brought Dawn back to the Daynes following the battle at the Tower of Joy... not 9 months after Ned was there. Jon is far too young to have been conceived at the tourney and there wasn't enough time after Ashara "suicide" to have conceived then gestated Jon following the return of Dawn.
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 Lily Connolly
23 hours ago said:
@Anti-Federalist 1776 I read the books and what you just wrote is again incoherent nonsense. If you didn't watch the show after season 4 don't come here with your bs. Jon's parents aren't even confirmed in the books so that adds to how stupid your message was.
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evbb
22 hours ago
@Lily Connolly I don't know if he's right or not, but frankly, you're the one in the wrong here, lol.
"Jon's parents aren't even confirmed in the books so that adds to how stupid your message was."
That's exactly what he's saying, do you not understand that?
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duprattcarol
20 hours ago Said:
He would have never been able to ride a dragon, engage in that aerial fight with the night king, or even be spared by Drogon when the dragon Dany dead.
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Anti-Federalist 1776
20 hours ago
@Lily Connolly okay... you read the books with the preconceived notions of the show in your mind, I read the books with the vast majority of GRRM work already read in my mind. So when the "Red Comet" was introduced... I just automatically assumed that it was an Ecological Engineering Corps starship like from the novella Plague Star, which made ASOIAF set in the Thousand Worlds universe. So when the Others or Thoros reanimate the dead... I just automatically assume that they are telepathic corpse handlers like the Corpse Handler trilogy set in the Thousand Worlds.

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[randompanda note: has anyone else read Plague Star? Did that novella indeed establish that the ASOIAF planet is part of Martin's Thousand Worlds SF universe?
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Jose Ramirez
20 hours ago
anti-federalist, they literally show us jon's parentage.... idk if ur trolling, or retarded...
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Anti-Federalist 1776
19 hours ago
@Jose Ramirez badly written tv-fanfiction doesn't qualify as canon... so the show counts for nothing even more so now that the show ends in worst possible way with humanity losing since a telepathic incorporated agent of the Weirwood Hivemind gets installed as King, which is the very worst possible outcome to me.
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 Jose Ramirez
19 hours ago
antifederalist, i agree with u there, first thing i thought was "so  3 eyed ravens r gonna be the king from now on.." i mean right? bran is gonna see his own death, pass the ability onto whoever he deems worthy/capable, and it goes on and on... and probably back to family ruling, cuz being a warg is in the family...and bran plotted to be king this whole time.. didn't help anyone but himself that prick.
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Anti-Federalist 1776
18 hours ago
@UCNhVx1crNX6COA0cMyDrTuw Jon is stabbed in the last book during a coup within the Nights Watch that wanted to remove him from being Lord Commander... he doesn't necessarily die, but Melisandre being there means that even if Jon does die than she can animate his corpse like Thoros did with Dondarren and now Lady Stoneheart.
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Eric Miller
19 hours ago (edited)
@Anti-Federalist 1776 LOL this can't be true.
R+L has to = J
Now granted it was so heavily hinted at you could argue this was an obvious red herring. I didn't need to come to the interwebz to get that one he laid it on thick.

 

But this would be the equivalent of hinting the butler did it then changing your mind as Martin said. Which is something he said he would not do. There may have been a time the Daynes were supposed to be more important in the story. But Martin seems to have cut them with the 5 year skip.
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Anti-Federalist 1776
18 hours ago
@Eric Miller nope... that's not how GRRM handles Mendelian genetic modeling, which means that it would be impossible for Dany to be a XX telepathic genetic Dragonhatcher if Aerys was her father & Rhella her mother. The entire POINT of Rhaegar in fulfilling "prophecy" was to *recreate* the Dragonhatcher genetic confluence of double recessive telepathic genes... whether Rhaegar was aware of what he was doing or not in those terms. Just cause the people in the story have forgotten their own history of being part of the interstellar Federal Empire & nuking themselves back into a literal Stone Age during their war against the Hrangain (Weirwoods)... doesn't make their opinion valid, the Sandship in Dorne is still a crashed Federal starship regardless of what the current inhabitants of Dorne "think" it is.
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Eric Miller

18 hours ago (edited)
@Anti-Federalist 1776 None of those things are confirmed

What is a dragon hatcher?
You're acting as tho he gives these detailed frameworks that don't exist. lol
Guy couldn't even pace his story correctly
With all the resurrection going on Jon has to come back. Plus why did we spend so much time foreshadowing his parentage if it didn't matter?
So you could be right about some topic Martin never put in the books directly? lol
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 Anti-Federalist 1776
18 hours ago
@Eric Miller A. Know the logical framework that GRRM writes from. & B. - Do an autistic sperg analysis of the Targaryen bloodline, then match up when Dragons were hatched & who the eggs were around before hatching. So GRRM has technically provided the information... just without context and you have to reverse engineer the outline that he created when he was thinking all this up.
It's why GRRM keeps pumping out all these "prequel" stories... cause he fully formulated the whole world that he then placed these characters in, which the story is developing around the characters. So while ASOIAF is an evolving character based storyline... the world and history they exist in is fully realized.
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Eric Miller
17 hours ago (edited)
@Anti-Federalist 1776
He has made a giant mess.
The concerns I posited are much more important than the geneology lining up.
You could fix that up on top of the tree and say "oh really X was his great great grandpa"
There done easy
THe problems I presented cannot be solved so easily lol.
Not saying there wasn't a time he set that up. But it's done now.
If he finishes John coming back and he's not gonna be a Dayne cuz the Daynes were cut out of the fucking story
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 Anti-Federalist 1776
16 hours ago
@Eric Miller how so...? Dorne in general is just about to fully enter the story when Arianna marries Aegon & call the totally intact banners which are waiting in the passes out of Dorne for her message. Personally... I think that the Septon with Aegon is Ashara, Dany stayed in Dorne for years after the baby swap happened until she was old enough to have memories of the "house with a red door" & "lemon trees" which don't grow in Bravos.

So at some point Doran's involvement with Illyrio/Varys shipped Dany over to Essos that way she could be used as the pawn she was supposed to be as a Dragonhatcher to spend the time needed around the eggs until the sorcerers of Assahi could hatch them... then the Dragons could be given to Aegon along with the Golden Company for the conquest of Westros. Drogo fucked up that plan by dying before the khalassar could reach Asshai because he refused medical treatment, then Dany accidentally hatched the dragon eggs & burn Mizi who was the 2nd/3rd most knowledge person in the entire world on dragons with only her master Maester Marwyn being the foremost dragon expert in the world.

I mean that fact that one of Maester Marywn primary disciples was in the absolute middle of nowhere with the Shepherd Men which just happened to be the path of khalassar which contained a Targaryen woman & 3 dragon eggs is beyond comprehension to the point of asinine to ascribe that chance/accident had anything to do with that.
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 Anti-Federalist 1776
15 hours ago
@Eric Miller sidenote- that's not how even the very simplified Mendelian method of genetic lineage that GRRM uses... we already have the legacy & which dragon eggs hatched after being around which women, so we know where the recessive telepathic Dragon gene resides unlike the Starks' clearly dominant telepathic Warg gene that was given to them from Bael the Bard.
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Anti-Federalist 1776
15 hours ago
@Jose Ramirez
yep... the Weirwoods are the true enemy in ASOIAF, which is easy to figure out because telepathic Communal Hiveminds are ALWAYS :like literally every fucking time: the enemies of Individualistic humanity in all GRRM stories. So... Bran being an incorporated aspect to the Weirwood telepathic Hivemind Conciousness will end with the subversion of all humanity into being incorporated into the Weirwood telepathic Hivemind like what happened in the GRRM novella Bitterblooms.
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 Eric Miller
15 hours ago
@Anti-Federalist 1776 The amount of assumptions in this one are just too many to start with.
Martin has given you loose ends that can never be tied up or proven
We're never gonna have time for a dany flash back that goes over where she was at as a baby.
How is that gonna matter to the overall plot? WHy would Martin tie that in?
You act like he's got 75 more years to live and 10 more books to write. . . . .
Insanity
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 Anti-Federalist 1776 15 hours ago
@Eric Miller i am using actual source material buttressed with GRRM's previous half century of writing themes & internal SciFi logical assertations... yet "im making it up" cause GRRM could possibly happen to change something in the your supposed future scenario??? Okay...
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Daniel Moir
15 hours ago
Anti-Federalist 1776 Ned Stark would not have needed to hide the identity of his legitimate nephew born from his older brother and a woman who wasn’t sitting the throne. Ned’s honor wouldn’t have allowed him to claim a lordship that didn’t belong to him. The origin you spell out makes no sense, since Ned would have served as Lord Regent until Jon came of age. The only reason Jon’s linage would have needed to remains secret is either if he is Ned’s bastard, or R+L=J were true, and Jon poses a threat to the Baratheon claim. I also hate to break this to everyone, but GRRM has said the major beats of the story will remain the same. The journey getting from beat to beat might differ, but major plot points like this will remain the same. Your fan theory isn’t going to work in the books at all.
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 Anti-Federalist 1776
15 hours ago
@Daniel Moir So... Ned was just going to give away Winterfell to Brandon's son??? Which is what happens in your whole "there is no need to hide Jons lineage" premise... that is a very pressing reason for Ned to obfuscate Jons parentage, that you are bypassing like it is nothing.
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kabukiman69
11 hours ago
seems like almost all of the story was ultimately for nothing to the story
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 Anti-Federalist 1776
11 hours ago
@kabukiman69 since the showrunners had absolutely no idea what the actual story was... then they were unable to actually show why Bran ending up as King is by far the worst possible outcome. THAT is the dire threat that they are facing... not the Others who are just genetically unstable telepathic humans, that the North stopped giving their bastards to 2 centuries ago when Good Queen Alsace ended the right of first night & closed down the Nightfort which had the Gods Gate in it. White Walker/Night King bullshit has nothing to do with the half century GRRM has been a novelist... that's some basic (((Hollywood))) storytelling, GRRM might be a leftwing hippy libtard but he still one of those (((people))) which his writing reflects.
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k4yser 8 hours ago
@Anti-Federalist 1776 why could Jon mount a dragon?
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Blake Hunt
4 hours ago
@k4yser
You mean why could Jon mount a Dragon in the show? Because the show is not canon. Its fanservice. Alot of the ideas they implemented in the show was just because people online would want to see it. There is no reason to think Jon will ride a dragon in the books.
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Anti-Federalist 1776
7 hours ago
@k4yser bringing up retarded show shit is invalid in discussing why the show is retarded & did retarded fanfiction things like using retarded Rheagar Targaryen + Lyanna Stark = Jon. Though it might be possible for Jon to "Nettle" a dragon like Quinton is trying to do with one of the two escaped dragons in Maureen that he let loose, since the whole point of Rheagar chasing Lyanna was to try to create Dany thus substituting the Stark telepathic Warging gene for the Targaryen telepathic Dragon gene.
Note: (In the novels Nettle was a bastard who through feeding a constant stream of lambs was able to get a dragon to accept her back during the Targaryen civil war where there were a few unclaimed dragons living in Westros & a lordship was offered by both sides to anyone who could claim one. Nettle being an orphan girl on Dragonstone would be easy to suspect that she was a bastard bloodline having the Targaryen telepathic Dragon gene but it isn't even implied either way... making it possible that anyone could actually ride a dragon if they can buy the dragons loyalty with food, though that seems the more unlikely of the two possibilities.)
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 Anti-Federalist 1776
@punker87 what "Theories" from outside the book universe am I mixing up? My whole premise is and always has been since about 100 pages into Game of Thrones when it was originally published in paperback +20 years ago... that ASOIAF was a Thousand Worlds series, when the "Red Comet" was introduced that I recognized as an Ecological Engineering Corps starship. So you have deny the Red Comet as a Ecological Engineering Corps starship from the novella Plauge Star, you have to deny that The Others & Thoros are telepathic Corpse Handlers from the Corpse Handler trilogy, you have to deny that the four limbed (not six limbed fantasy) dragons arent a gene engineered war animal that Tuf would created as part of the first Tuf Voyaging story, you have to deny the Sandship being described exactly like a Federal Empire starship, you have to deny that every "seat of power" in Westros is connected to deep subterranean levels that appear to be nuclear fallout shelters, you have to deny buildings like Storms End & the Citadel as being built by a very high technological society.

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 Anti-Federalist 1776

@Ryan Zibell GRRM has a +20 works involving exactly that exact premise... it's called The Thousand Worlds, I started reading GRRM with the Tuf Voyaging trilogy which is set in the Thousand Worlds universe. I then read all the other Thousand Worlds universe stories as well as most of the rest of GRRM writings before Game of Thrones was organized released in paperback. It's why I keep bringing up other books like Plague Star or Bitterblooms as well as the Tuf Voyaging trilogy & the Corpse Handler trilogy... these are all Thousand Worlds books that contain the exact same things as ASOIAF. Most of the interstellar Federal Empire fell into a deep interregnum following the pyrrhic victory in the Double War, after the Fydii got pulled down in their own two fronted interstellar war by the alien species to their galactic East & Humanity was able to beat the Hrangain back to their homeworld. The Children of the Forest would be the Weirwoods (Hrangain) telepathically controlled slave species that fought alongside the Hrangain... the Others are the genetically engineered humans from the war, which they are clearly genetically unstable. The whole North used to feed their bastards through the Godsgate for thousands & thousands of years until two centuries ago when Good Queen Alsace stopped it. So for millienia when the North was doing what Crastor did... there was peace but once the flow of new children stopped & never restarted, then now the Others have to invade but on a conquest for new genetic material not geographical territory otherwise they go extinct.

Edited May 21, 2019 by JustARandomPanda

[thelerner]

Some people get a little too involved.  Its about 6 or 8 shows over a year.  Well done, mostly.  Great acting, good writing, amazing production values.  So good that that it can be hard to appreciate how all the little details lure you in.  The costuming itself requires PHD's in Westerian history, Sociology and agriculture. 

 

I was wondering if anyone had listened to the book audios?   I've got a 4 or 5 day car ride ahead of me, and wondering if I should borrow them from the library?  Or any other audio book recommendation? 

 

I've found the right audio makes the time fly.  You don't even want to leave the car. 

 

[Aetherous]

8 minutes ago, thelerner said:

Some people get a little too involved.

 

Too bad there's zero real life reward for nerding out over fiction.

[alfheim]

On 5/14/2019 at 11:45 PM, thelerner said:

in some ways its all his fault.  He can 'warg' into other people and animals, take them over.  Thus he could potentially have 'warged' in Danerys (or her Dragon) and kept her from murdering 10,000s.  With great power comes great blame. 

In the show he didn't warg into any person beside Hodor which was a special case.  It suggests his ability wasn't that strong.

 

4 hours ago, Aetherous said:

I thought Arya doing it was brilliant.

Her doing it made sense but how she did it was bad. The whole faceless training and buildup went in a complete different direction. Being a master of silent kills was shoehorned in the last few episodes and doesn't really fit to how the faceless men operated or trained her.

[JustARandomPanda]

I posted that exchange because I did not realize GRRM had such an extensive SF novel/novella backlog. Has anyone read any of these other Martin SF works (not Wildcards, not Dunk & Egg, not ASOIF). It certainly sounds like he's doing a whole Brandon Sanderson Cosmere-thing with his Thousand Worlds Universe.

 

The whole Dragon-gene vs. Warg-gene thing reminds me of the Bene Geserit breeding program for the genetic Superbeing Kwisatz Haderach.

Edited May 21, 2019 by JustARandomPanda

[Pilgrim]

7 hours ago, dawei said:

My son was a die-hard follower... and don't even mention his Marvel Universe madness.

Ask him which he liked better an over powered Thanos without  the gauntlet or having a Mark Rufio persona and appearance dominate the Hulk through the whole movie? 

 

For that matter In Thor Ragnarok the Hulk would have cleaned old Purple Puss's clock. Thanos was never in his league when it came to power. 

 

Or how about  Disney Butching up Captain Marvels beautiful long hair and making her weaker again than Thanos when she was clearly one of the most powerful characters on the board. I mean seriously she rips through Battle Ships like they are made of tissue paper and traverses galaxies under her own steam. Errr no sale Disney.

 

Thanos has never been this powerful without the Gauntlet.

 

Next thing you know if the character makes an appearance she will have a Afro-American Hispanic / Chinese / Atheist / Left Wing  girlfriend.....   Yay Disney!!!! NOT!!!

 

Or how about a Thor who has more in common with a beer guzzling redneck than a God of Thunder.

 

Or how about how Captain America gave up his shield all so Disney can have a Captain Afro-American?

 

Or how about using weak story telling using Time Travel and even screwing that up? Geez whoever put that movie together is an idiot.

 

Lovely company with so many agendas can hardly wait to see how badly they destroy the next Star Wars.

 

In a way I am glad Disney ended things, they were ruining it horribly.

Edited May 21, 2019 by Pilgrim

[Pilgrim]

7 hours ago, ilumairen said:

I really want to know where Drogon went... 

Me too.

 

7 hours ago, dawei said:

Even the dragon seemed to give Jon a pass... that seemed telling on some level.

I got that feeling also beyond his heritage like the Dragon was not happy with the way he was made to serve. I thought well he is a Young Dragon but not a foolish one and has much to atone for as he grows older for his misdeeds even though misled. We may give him a pass but I get the feeling he will not give himself one.

 

I predict this is not the last we have seen of this Dragon.

 

7 hours ago, ilumairen said:

The author's writing style. 

 

He isn't plotted out, but 'following' the characters where their choices and inclinations lead. 

 

"Writing by the seat of his pants." 

 

He was along for the ride as much as his readers were, imo.

Well said I agree.

 

 

[thelerner]

Perhaps a worse tragedy then the painful senseless deaths of hundreds or thousands of innocent King's Landing children is that before hand, 1,000's of real children had been named Khaleesi.   A now poor decision seeing the last 2 episodes portray her as a mass murderer, killed ignominiously by her lover. 

 

On the other hand, it might help all the girls named Cersei.  Seeing their name sake, though a conscienceless murderess, has a lower body count.

[ilumairen]

17 hours ago, JustARandomPanda said:

I haven't read the GoT series past book 3 as GRRM, Patrick Rothfuss and Robert Jordan all convinced me to never start a series until the author has completely finished their series.

 

Still waiting on the 3rd Rothfuss novel myself. Was a fascinating series so far. 

 

Quote

However I stumbled across the following thread on Youtube spurred by the GoT fandom's angry reactions to how the series has ended. I'm posting the long back-and-forth because it's changed what I think of the 3 books I've read so far and (if the guy who keeps making the points he does is right - the tv show has gone so off the rails from the books that it very long ago became something that is only distantly "inspired" by the books).

 

Just two different "universes" that many book readers came to accept long ago.

 

Kinda like the Kelvin timeline in the Star Trek franchise. 

 

Quote

Anti-Federalist 1776 says:
Because Jon isn't a Targaryen... he's a Stark & Dayne, possibly the true heir of Winterfell if Brandon & Ashara were married when he (Ned) was locked in the Black Cells.

 

Conveniently overlooking that GRRM only gave the go ahead to the show runners when they were able to discern Jon Snow's parentage. 

[ilumairen]

17 hours ago, Aetherous said:

 

Too bad there's zero real life reward for nerding out over fiction.

 

I'm good with a little nerding out, hell I'm good at a little nerding out.. but there are limits as too how much time I'm willing to invest.

 

(And that was a very long copy/paste that quickly proved itself to be erroneous supposition and conjecture - at which point I stopped reading.)

Edited May 22, 2019 by ilumairen

[ilumairen]

16 hours ago, alfheim said:

In the show he didn't warg into any person beside Hodor which was a special case.  It suggests his ability wasn't that strong.

 

Except we're directly told by Jojen (in that scene) that there is no one else who can do that (warg into a human). And then there is the later scene where Hodor becomes "hodor" when he is told to hold the door and it ripples through his lifetime/timeline.. 

 

I'd say ripping through someone's timeline would suggest very strong ability. 

 

16 hours ago, alfheim said:

Her doing it made sense but how she did it was bad. The whole faceless training and buildup went in a complete different direction. Being a master of silent kills was shoehorned in the last few episodes and doesn't really fit to how the faceless men operated or trained her.

 

She wasn't a faceless man, and unable/ unwilling to give up her identity as Arya Stark - which actually fits like a custom made glove with her saving her brother from the Night King. 

[ilumairen]

17 hours ago, JustARandomPanda said:

I posted that exchange because I did not realize GRRM had such an extensive SF novel/novella backlog. Has anyone read any of these other Martin SF works (not Wildcards, not Dunk & Egg, not ASOIF). It certainly sounds like he's doing a whole Brandon Sanderson Cosmere-thing with his Thousand Worlds Universe.

 

Your sharing in this post is far more interesting than that drivel you shared from someone else's riotous mind. 

 

Did you catch how Arya sailing West of Westeros opened up the possibility of expansion of the GOT universe?

 

(Wait, are you the one who didn't watch?)

 

[thelerner]

2 hours ago, ilumairen said:

Did you catch how Arya sailing West of Westeros opened up the possibility of expansion of the GOT universe?

 

and theorized on world wide web is that the wise dragon (reincarnated 1st husband?), was flying Denarys to the current Red Priestess who would most likely resurrect her. 

 

I'd follow a show with a simple tandem story line of Arya's travel and Gendry's travails as newly minted noble.  

[manitou]

I just saw this morning that Kit Harrington and Igrit (the pretty red haired maiden wildling) actually got married to each other in real life.  I'll bet she tells him all the time, "Jon Snow, you know nothing".

[Pilgrim]

It has been confirmed.

 

George R.R. Martin says books won't end like Game of Thrones
Martin promises plot variations (and similarities) when The Winds of Winter and A Dream of Spring finally come out.

 

https://www.cnet.com/news/george-r-r-martin-books-wont-end-like-game-of-thrones-author-says/

[Aetherous]

 

There are five prequel shows involving Westeros etc in development.

[shazlor]

To quote the thread title  "Omniscience. Game of Thrones."

= G.R.R.M. official Bran retcon. SERIES FIN. 

Spoiler

@7.01 - 8.36 (ignore the rest of the video)

 

 

[mrpasserby]

On 5/14/2019 at 4:43 PM, Starjumper said:

I just had a volunteer here send me a link to the Game of Thrones series so I'm looking forward to starting in on the first one tonight.

I'll bet that those with Dragons and their enthusiasts are enjoying the movie star Dragon images.  

[alfheim]

On 5/22/2019 at 4:49 PM, ilumairen said:

 

Except we're directly told by Jojen (in that scene) that there is no one else who can do that (warg into a human). And then there is the later scene where Hodor becomes "hodor" when he is told to hold the door and it ripples through his lifetime/timeline.. 

 

I'd say ripping through someone's timeline would suggest very strong ability. 

Hodor isn't a normal human. He is at that point already the result of the ripping of his timeline. There isn't enough information to say for certain if bran could or could not do the same with a normal person under normal circumstances.

On 5/22/2019 at 4:49 PM, ilumairen said:

She wasn't a faceless man, and unable/ unwilling to give up her identity as Arya Stark - which actually fits like a custom made glove with her saving her brother from the Night King. 

Her being a faceless man or not doesn't change things. She was trained as faceless and got her face swap skill from them. From whom did she get the silent sneaking skill? Why even spend so much time to build up the whole faceless story when she doesn't use it in the end?

Edited May 23, 2019 by alfheim

[ilumairen]

 

3 hours ago, alfheim said:

Her being a faceless man or not doesn't change things. She was trained as faceless and got her face swap skill from them. From whom did she get the silent sneaking skill? Why even spend so much time to build up the whole faceless story when she doesn't use it in the end?

 

The "face" she wore would have been entirely inconsequential to the Night King, and to bring it into play would have been pointless. 

[Aetherous]

3 hours ago, alfheim said:

Why even spend so much time to build up the whole faceless story when she doesn't use it in the end?

 

Why does a plotline have to be so predictable? She got experience sneaking and killing...it fits. Would it have actually been more enjoyable to see her wear a zombie or white walker face? Would there even be time for her to prepare the face, in this context?

[manitou]

17 hours ago, alfheim said:

Hodor isn't a normal human. He is at that point already the result of the ripping of his timeline. There isn't enough information to say for certain if bran could or could not do the same with a normal person under normal circumstances.

Her being a faceless man or not doesn't change things. She was trained as faceless and got her face swap skill from them. From whom did she get the silent sneaking skill? Why even spend so much time to build up the whole faceless story when she doesn't use it in the end?

 

 

She kind of ripped them off, IMO.  Yes, she retained her identity but got all the goodies.  That's why I think an Arya spinoff would be terrific.  So many different possibilities with the faces.  Maybe I just want to see a little female empowerment.

 

And the male actor that played Drogo (I think that was his name - Khaleesi's husband)  I saw pictures of him and Amelia Clark together, in their real human state.  He is surprisingly hot, if you ask me....

Edited May 24, 2019 by manitou

[dawei]

There's talk that the Season 1 photo with the raven is an indication that Bran would be on the throne 

 

[joeblast]

On 5/22/2019 at 10:32 AM, ilumairen said:

Kinda like the Kelvin timeline in the Star Trek franchise. 

 

in other words, more non-canon nonsense dreamt up by egoist directors