No more right-wing bullshit.

[Miffymog]

3 hours ago, sean said:

I get that there's indignation in this topic that's unpleasant and we have started to veer into some brimstone ranting. It's only been about a week though, and for some it's the first time they've been able to express themselves without being brigaded for years. I would just ask that those of us on the fence with where this is all going be patient with your "captain" 😂 There will be some turbulence as I figure out how to even navigate this ship anymore. 🙏❤️

Sean

 

 

 

YES - YES - YES !!!

 

I completely and utterly agree with this statement and believe it to be true. 

 

 

 

But, talking like this to Rene when she made, in my eyes, a very rational statement of the obvious

 

3 hours ago, sean said:

 

I find the condescending pearl clutching of committed bothsidesism on the internet funny?

Sean

 

 

Was very, very poor.

 

Edited August 8, 2019 by Miffymog

[flowing hands]

On 8/6/2019 at 6:59 PM, escott said:

Let's ask a Taoist priest what they think:

 

As a priest, I believe my religion’s strength lies not in converting millions of new followers, but in respecting diversity.

 

...

 

Picture this: Everyone in China has converted to Taoism. They all wear long ocher robes, nobody eats beef, and state laws are replaced by Taoist scriptures. Temples where Taoist ceremonies take place line the busy streets, and the Daodejing is recited solemnly. There are no more scholars, soldiers, farmers, or any other professions at odds with Taoist philosophy. To me, it sounds like a dystopia.

 

Source:

https://www.sixthtone.com/news/1532/a-taoist-china%3F-not-for-me%2C-thanks

 

 

I am sorry this is nonsense. To be a Dao follower one actually doesn't even need to know that Dao exists one would simply  be   following a natural path of wisdom and equally there doesn't need to be Temples or people needing to wear robes. That's the whole point of Dao.

I've been a Holyman for 35 years, but I never wear robes, only on three very special occasions have I.

[Miffymog]

8 hours ago, Nungali said:

 

No it didnt .

 

It gave me the choice of electing from a range of local individuals  and THEY got together and voted in our PM .

 

Mhe .... its the way of things ... people accept much worse shit than that !     Like war, and high altitude carpet bombing  and locking up sick children behind razor wire .

 

Tell ya what , you work in refugee relocation and with torture victims and Amnesty International for a bit and then get back to me after that - about what people  'accept'  .

 

Its been explained more than once in various ways .

 

 

You are spewing anit-Trump vitriol - how long are you going to continue doing this for?

 

 

 

[wandelaar]

If Left and Right were all the same than we wouldn't have all the shouting, name calling and ranting. I don't think anybody is claiming that they are.

 

I have seen the term "bothsideism" used several times now, so please explain what exactly it is supposed to mean, and who the accused are... 

 

 

[Miffymog]

31 minutes ago, wandelaar said:

If Left and Right were all the same than we wouldn't have all the shouting, name calling and ranting. I don't think anybody is claiming that they are.

 

I have seen the term "bothsideism" used several times now, so please explain what exactly it is supposed to mean, and who the accused are... 

 

 

 

Politics is a highly emotive subject.

When you live in a country outside of a particular political debate, you naturally have less of an emotional response.

Then you become more capable of seeing 'both sides' of the argument ...

 

Get me on to Brexit and I'd be less of a "bothsider" ...

[wandelaar]

No doubt politics is an emotive subject, but that doesn't imply that one should demonize one's opponents or that one should categorically refuse to consider the sheer possibility that one's opponents could be right on some point or other. Getting one's facts right is too important to leave out possible sources of information, even if those sources lie beyond one's own political circle. Not talking about lunatic conspiracy theories or neonazi sites here, but about serious and decent right-wing people, sites and other media (yes they exist). If that is "bothsideism", so be it.

[doc benway]

7 hours ago, rene said:

Astonishing.

And very sad.

WTF is wrong with you people.

The spew from the right has been replaced with spew from the left.

The energy in your words is no less vile and destructive than the words of those you denegrate.

It is possible to clean your house without burning it down.

 

Best of luck, keep well, stay safe.

 

Peace Out.

 

 

I was practicing meditation with a group last night.

We practice together and then share our experiences, both on the cushion and off.

We discuss how we are using our practices to address the challenges we face in our lives.

 

One common theme is the degree of pain people are feeling in their daily lives related to our current conditions and leadership in the US. It really is considerable and destabilizing. My observation has been that the more empathetic people are, the more their hearts are open to others (especially those more vulnerable), the more they are struggling with this nightmarish situation we find ourselves in. After 3 years of this, we are now facing the very real possibility of another 4. 

 

I think it's healthy to be reminded that we continue to reify our story through giving voice to our pain. On the one hand, voicing can be cathartic and useful. On the other hand, if voicing doesn't lead to letting go and allowing the frustration to liberate, it is simply reinforcing and magnifying our pain. 

 

So I'd like to thank Spotless and a few others for giving voice to a lot of what I am feeling and struggling with. I'd also like to thank Rene and Wanderlaar and others for holding up a mirror and showing us how we look to others who are less wrapped up in the situation.

 

Trump really is that horrible and yet we need to find some way of preventing this horror from poisoning our hearts and minds. What is far more frightening to me than Trump is the fact that he has shown what is possible in this country and the next Trump may be far more intelligent, far more cunning, and far more malevolent.

 

[Apech]

8 minutes ago, steve said:

......

 

I think it's healthy to be reminded that we continue to reify our story through giving voice to our pain. On the one hand, voicing can be cathartic and useful. On the other hand, if voicing doesn't lead to letting go and allowing the frustration to liberate, it is simply reinforcing and magnifying our pain. 

 

So I'd like to thank Spotless and a few others for giving voice to a lot of what I am feeling and struggling with. I'd also like to thank Rene and Wanderlaar and others for holding up a mirror and showing us how we look to others who are less wrapped up in the situation.

 

Trump really is that horrible and yet we need to find some way of preventing this horror from poisoning our hearts and minds. What is far more frightening to me than Trump is the fact that he has shown what is possible in this country and the next Trump may be far more intelligent, far more cunning, and far more malevolent.

 

 

Thanks Steve,

 

From a Buddhist perspective I think it might be helpful to say that anger, fear, uncertainty, dissatisfaction and so on - in any situation - are indispensable aids to vajrayana practice.  By this I mean they give an opportunity for realising emptiness - because those emotions are fundamentally empty.  By saying this I am not saying they don't matter - or that the political situation doesn't matter - I don't want to fall into the nihilist trap of saying 'its all illusion, man'.  But it is very useful to use both good and bad situations for practice.  So when we find a good situation we are happy for the benefit that arises - when we find a bad situation we are 'happy' for the opportunity to realise that what we are experiencing is a flux of energy.

 

It must be true to say that whatever arises depends on causes and conditions - and this includes Trump.  If you attack Trump then you are attacking the appearance of Trump - but if you look to the causes and conditions which gave rise to his election and deal with them then he will literally disappear (yes really) since whatever supports him will no longer be there.  This is why I say that people voted for him because of dissatisfaction(s) in their lives - if you like, they were emotionally drawn to him (in sufficient numbers but not a majority) because they had needs.  Needs that were not being met by the alternative narratives being presented about what had happened and what will happen.  Perhaps you could say needs and aspirations - which I would say were born from (looking at the local time frame) chiefly the events since 9/11 when the USA was shocked into action/reaction leading to and through the 2008 financial crisis.  Violent acts have violent results.  Karma.  I think that is why Trumps main bad feature, to me anyway, is instability - he's angry, defensive and personal when he doesn't need to be.

 

I'm rambling now - but I hope you can see what I'm trying to say.

 

 

[liminal_luke]

Some months ago I told a leftist friend of mine that most of the forum members here were right-wing.  He couldn´t believe it.  Daoists for Trump?  Impossible!  Now it turns out that an equal number of us are left wingers, some of us radically so.  Who knew?  I sure didn´t.  Were we just hiding our politics under a bushel?  Did Sean´s unabashed revolutionary zeal gave us the courage to come out into the light?  Whatever the case, it´s been something of a revelation. 

 

As a conflict-averse peacekeeper type, I give you my anthem. 

 

 

Edited August 8, 2019 by liminal_luke

[doc benway]

2 hours ago, Apech said:

 

Thanks Steve,

 

From a Buddhist perspective I think it might be helpful to say that anger, fear, uncertainty, dissatisfaction and so on - in any situation - are indispensable aids to vajrayana practice.  By this I mean they give an opportunity for realising emptiness - because those emotions are fundamentally empty.  By saying this I am not saying they don't matter - or that the political situation doesn't matter - I don't want to fall into the nihilist trap of saying 'its all illusion, man'.  But it is very useful to use both good and bad situations for practice.  So when we find a good situation we are happy for the benefit that arises - when we find a bad situation we are 'happy' for the opportunity to realise that what we are experiencing is a flux of energy.

 

It must be true to say that whatever arises depends on causes and conditions - and this includes Trump.  If you attack Trump then you are attacking the appearance of Trump - but if you look to the causes and conditions which gave rise to his election and deal with them then he will literally disappear (yes really) since whatever supports him will no longer be there.  This is why I say that people voted for him because of dissatisfaction(s) in their lives - if you like, they were emotionally drawn to him (in sufficient numbers but not a majority) because they had needs.  Needs that were not being met by the alternative narratives being presented about what had happened and what will happen.  Perhaps you could say needs and aspirations - which I would say were born from (looking at the local time frame) chiefly the events since 9/11 when the USA was shocked into action/reaction leading to and through the 2008 financial crisis.  Violent acts have violent results.  Karma.  I think that is why Trumps main bad feature, to me anyway, is instability - he's angry, defensive and personal when he doesn't need to be.

 

I'm rambling now - but I hope you can see what I'm trying to say.

 

 

 

Very much so, and it was very well said.

Thank you

 

Similarly in Dzogchen, everything that elicits reactivity is taken as the path of practice.

I've had quite a lot of good stuff to work with!

 

Your comments about the genesis of Trumpism seem spot on to me.

The frustrating thing is to see my country-folk elect someone like this in spite of his violent and xenophobic rhetoric and abject lack of compassion.

 

 

[Apech]

23 minutes ago, steve said:

 

Very much so, and it was very well said.

Thank you

 

Similarly in Dzogchen, everything that elicits reactivity is taken as the path of practice.

I've had quite a lot of good stuff to work with!

 

Your comments about the genesis of Trumpism seem spot on to me.

The frustrating thing is to see my country-folk elect someone like this in spite of his violent and xenophobic rhetoric and abject lack of compassion.

 

 

 

 

Perhaps they feel threatened - I'm not sure.

[C T]

We need to be fully conscious that when something is felt to be off, and then, upon further reflection and patient observation, is confirmed to be not right, or something thats seen to be evil, it needs to be subjugated asap at that level of reality, i think its alright to call it for what it is. I can see the fair logic in Apech's post too, but remember, transmuting poison into nectar as a practice is a very personal endeavour... even a "secret" spiritual endeavour, that in some traditions has no compromising or mitigating cause to get that state of practice mixed up with mundane and conventional existence, for a number of obvious reasons (that seasoned practitioners will perhaps know well). As an example,  due to confusion, many teachers of ill-intent got away with serial abusive behaviours repeatedly, over long periods, and one of the compelling reasons why they managed to avoid being outed is that students, even senior ones, wasn't entirely sure how to separate the different layers of reality in relation to samaya vows and such. 

[dwai]

I was surprised to see a banner stating "No more Right wing Bull shit".  I don't visit the site very much these days (albeit I do resort to muscle-memory induced typing of thedaobums.com due to years of habit ).  I think its Sean's prerogative to guide his forum in a direction of his choosing. 

 

Personally I don't have an axe to grind either way. I do recognize that the ground realities are far more nuanced and complex than simple black or white positions when it comes to how people form their opinions etc about anything, be it left/right wing politics or which spiritual traditions they follow. The "rub", so to speak is in what we identify with, in terms of positions. The moment we take a position (and we all do from time to time), forms an "other", thereby polarizing our interactions in the world. It might sound idealistic, but really, imho, spiritual work is in eliminating those positions, little by little. 

 

However, there still are things that are wrong, simply due to the pain and distress they might cause to others. That is something we should avoid, as part of our spiritual practice (imho).  In that light, the point @ralis made about how damaging words can be, rings very true. I hope good sense prevails and the participants of this forum reclaim their spiritual objectives and work on self-improvement/cultivation (or "non-self" improvement  )...

 

Just wanted to say that I appreciate everyone on this forum. I learn from you all each time I come here, though off late I mainly learn to let go...

 

Love,

 

dwai 

[ilumairen]

3 minutes ago, C T said:

We need to be fully conscious that when something is felt to be off, and then, upon further reflection and patient observation, is confirmed to be not right, or something thats seen to be evil, it needs to be subjugated asap at that level of reality, i think its alright to call it for what it is. I can see the fair logic in Apech's post too, but remember, transmuting poison into nectar as a practice is a very personal endeavour... even a "secret" spiritual endeavour, that in some traditions has no compromising or mitigating cause to get that state of practice mixed up with mundane and conventional existence, for a number of obvious reasons (that seasoned practitioners will perhaps know well). As an example,  due to confusion, many teachers of ill-intent got away with serial abusive behaviours repeatedly, over long periods, and one of the compelling reasons why they managed to avoid being outed is that students, even senior ones, wasn't entirely sure how to separate the different layers of reality in relation to samaya vows and such. 

 

Even in navigating this, the instruction as I understood it as shared by TWR in a question and answer segment where a question regarding hateful speech of others came up, was to respond from what I'll call "center" when one is able. And in this, one will be more likely to be "a catalyst for change" - instead of just another voice in a sea of discord (my words - not his).

[dwai]

On 8/1/2019 at 9:02 AM, OldDog said:

On the value of having "other" discussions ...

 

One line of consideration that is emerging is whether TBD should have any discussions at all that are not directly relevant to the philosophic or spiritual traditions are interested in. That, in itself, has some interesting implications.

 

Many of these traditions are about selfrealization. They don't spend much time or attention on social issues. Yet, we all, to some degree or another, live in social contexts. So, the real question is whether anything we have learned in our individual pursuits can inform our social views. Or, do we, when dealing with worldly issues, simply revert to old habits, leaving our learning behind.

From a Hindu/Vedantic point of view, people whose objective is Self-realization spend time on serving in the world. Not so much about social issues and politics, but in the trenches, helping people, animals, nature. Some might do it in the form of teaching the wisdom traditions, others do it in form of humanitarian work. The objective is to serve with no expectations of anything in return whatsoever. 

 

A natural progression of developing in the Self-realization path is the awakening of genuine love and compassion, and selfless service. 

 

[C T]

3 minutes ago, ilumairen said:

 

Even in navigating this, the instruction as I understood it as shared by TWR in a question and answer segment where a question regarding hateful speech of others came up, was to respond from what I'll call "center" when one is able. And in this, one will be more likely to be "a catalyst for change" - instead of just another voice in a sea of discord (my words - not his).

 

If a teacher does wrong, and is repeatedly enabled by those he/she abused to continue in that vein, and at some point, someone calls him or her out, supported by valid cognitions of right and wrong, then thats not succumbing to hateful speech. Likewise, it will be difficult to remain at "center" when attempting to be reasoned & empathetic while confused about the real nature of something or someone. It is possible to identify evilness without ever being hateful of the conduit by which evil manifests. In fact, its imperative that one remains fully conscious of such manifestations, yet remain unaffected by those emotional attachments that leads to the displacement of one's center. There's such a thing as righteous anger; intention is the benchmark for how it channels. Anger can used as a salve to bring relief from suffering, but if it consumes one's being along the way and turns one into a monster, then the intent wasn't right to begin with. 

[ilumairen]

1 minute ago, C T said:

 

If a teacher does wrong, and is repeatedly enabled by those he/she abused to continue in that vein, and at some point, someone calls him or her out, supported by valid cognitions of right and wrong, then thats not succumbing to hateful speech. Likewise, it will be difficult to remain at "center" when attempting to be reasoned & empathetic while confused about the real nature of something or someone. It is possible to identify evilness without ever being hateful of the conduit by which evil manifests. In fact, its imperative that one remains fully conscious of such manifestations, yet remain unaffected by those emotional attachments that leads to the displacement of one's center. There's such a thing as righteous anger; intention is the benchmark for how it channels. Anger can used as a salve to bring relief from suffering, but if it consumes one's being along the way and turns one into a monster, then the intent wasn't right to begin with. 

 

 

I wasn't referring to the shitty ass manipulative teachers, but standard every day life. And I agree with there being a "time for action" - as I recently posted in another thread.

 

But please note, I said action and not reaction. 

 

I've seen alot of righteous anger in my life, and when it's tightly gripped and held it tends towards distortion imo. And yes, suppression distorts as well. So where is the "sweet spot" between these distortions?

 

[doc benway]

1 hour ago, Apech said:

 

 

Perhaps they feel threatened - I'm not sure.

 

I think that's part of it. 
I think they also feel disenfranchised, abused, and powerless.

Government in this country is by and for wealthy, corporate interests.

The people are simply a nuisance to be managed and manipulated.

People are fed up and for good reason.

The problem is their anger is misplaced by a very effective propaganda machine.

[C T]

2 minutes ago, ilumairen said:

 

 

I wasn't referring to the shitty ass manipulative teachers, but standard every day life. And I agree with there being a "time for action" - as I recently posted in another thread.

 

But please note, I said action and not reaction. 

 

I've seen alot of righteous anger in my life, and when it's tightly gripped and held it tends towards distortion imo. And yes, suppression distorts as well. So where is the "sweet spot" between these distortions?

 

 

The sweet spot can sometimes manifest as an exact location where someone needs a good whack to wake them up. 

Zen masters have no hesitation, why should we? Hesitate to wake up, I mean. 

[ilumairen]

Bothsidesism - the personal understanding of there being little difference in the derisive laughter and contempt I've experience due to my apparent ignorance on whatever subject the laughing party apparently has more information on, but is more inclined to ridicule (in regard to) than share.

 

And no, this isn't directed at Sean, who has been gracious with me, even if I'm using his term, but the individuals who'd rather insult than educate.

 

[Spotless]

From Apex:

 

"From a Buddhist perspective I think it might be helpful to say that anger, fear, uncertainty, dissatisfaction and so on - in any situation - are indispensable aids to vajrayana practice.  By this I mean they give an opportunity for realising emptiness - because those emotions are fundamentally empty.  By saying this I am not saying they don't matter - or that the political situation doesn't matter - I don't want to fall into the nihilist trap of saying 'its all illusion, man'.  But it is very useful to use both good and bad situations for practice.  So when we find a good situation we are happy for the benefit that arises - when we find a bad situation we are 'happy' for the opportunity to realise that what we are experiencing is a flux of energy."

 

This is fine - and both true and difficult work.

 

From Apex:

 

"It must be true to say that whatever arises depends on causes and conditions - and this includes Trump.  If you attack Trump then you are attacking the appearance of Trump - but if you look to the causes and conditions which gave rise to his election and deal with them then he will literally disappear (yes really) since whatever supports him will no longer be there.  This is why I say that people voted for him because of dissatisfaction(s) in their lives - if you like, they were emotionally drawn to him (in sufficient numbers but not a majority) because they had needs.  Needs that were not being met by the alternative narratives being presented about what had happened and what will happen.  Perhaps you could say needs and aspirations - which I would say were born from (looking at the local time frame) chiefly the events since 9/11 when the USA was shocked into action/reaction leading to and through the 2008 financial crisis.  Violent acts have violent results.  Karma.  I think that is why Trumps main bad feature, to me anyway, is instability - he's angry, defensive and personal when he doesn't need to be"

 

No - simply not - partial truth and certainly inarguable partial truth but imagine saying this about Hitler - seriously put it in those terms:

 

Trump became President partly because of dissatisfaction and attraction - but he was fundamentally elected on a pack of vitriol and hate and propaganda coming from he himself, from the Russian government, the religious right, the hate radio specialists, the "say anything you want against Hillary regardless of the truth" haters - his own birther myth about Obama - the anti-science crowd - the anti-women-choice crowd - and a great many organized Christian religions where in many cases the congregation was taught "that a vote for Hilary Clinton was a vote for the Devil". https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/politics/sd-me-church-bulletin-20161102-story.html.  

 

There was a reason well over half the nation threw up when they discovered the mistake that had taken place - that this mentally ill person was the head of The "United" States of America. 

 

It may come as a surprise to many here but I am not held in this web of hate or vitriol - I do however understand framing and the democrats have had a surprising lacking in the ability to frame an issue - though since Hitler Germany the world has not had a large western nation so under attack from complete and utter lies and propaganda - and the inertia's of complete Insanity.

 

The "Republican Party" is truly insane - and those that are still breathing some portion of reality are leaving or distancing themselves - like Christian's distancing themselves from nearly the entire bible and picking out what they like - and enjoying the momentum of centuries of Inquisitions, torture and mind control/fear/propaganda - its why so many are leaving but so few are stating why.

 

For those from other countries - it may be like hearing about a daughter being raped - it is horrible but not personal. 

When your own daughter is being raped and it is being done while you are held to watch - it is personal - doubly personal.

 

There is nothing about this President and his followers and the machine of hate that it spews that is normal politics - this is indeed nothing of the sort. 

 

In my previous posts I took a picture of what is happening - and put it into words - I was not in a frame of mind of hate - not in a frame of mind to spew - I was not in the inertia's of Democrat's ideology. 

 

Nazi Germany tactics - have found real root again - they have become the Way forward in the Republican Party. Repeat lies and with enough repetitions they become real (and simple people become the machines for our greatest tragedies).

 

On a clear day - it is easy to see smoke rising - and it is not opinion to say that the smoke is rising. One does not need to be mad in order to state the perils of a fire spreading to a town just downwind of the fire that is spreading. When trying to summarize in words a fire of hate and lies - it may appear that the person summarizing is lost in the fire - but I assure you I am as cool as a cucumber - and I stand firmly against the machine of "exclusiveness and agenda at all costs" and the nazi machine of the Republican Party.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 8, 2019 by Spotless

[ilumairen]

2 minutes ago, C T said:

 

The sweet spot can sometimes manifest as an exact location where someone needs a good whack to wake them up. 

Zen masters have no hesitation, why should we? Hesitate to wake up, I mean. 

 

I'm good with waking ourselves; I'm not always so sure about smacking others - I'm no Zen master.

[manitou]

Illumairen - nice post.  I think the sweet spot (my fellow tennis player!) is found in the realization that Trump is you, Trump is me.  And apparently we elected the leader we deserved.  That, to me, is the most urgent part of this.  That 'we' elected him and it's a direct reflection of the society that we have been become.  An alpha dog leading a pack of angry,  frightened, unaware people.  Trump can't help being what he is any more than we can.    The full extent of his sickness is yet to be known.  (Which has been a quandry for me for several years - can't we just diagnose this guy out of office?  Check first for psychopathy and narcissism?)  It isn't possible for a true narcissist to be able to see things from other people's position - to place themselves in the shoes of another.  How in the world can one be an effective leader with those character traits?

 

(Actually, I know what somebody is going to say.  That 'we' didn't elect him at all, the damned electoral college did).  But there's no denying the man has his followers, and they seem to be stuck on him with superglue. )

[C T]

5 minutes ago, ilumairen said:

 

I'm good with waking ourselves; I'm not always so sure about smacking others - I'm no Zen master.

 

Most tend to smack out of noble intent, not cruelty nor some perverted pleasure (hopefully). 

That was my point - to keep one's motivation in check at all times. 

 

I apologise if any condescension is felt by the things said. 

I too am no Zen master, and best i can do sometimes is to approximate an understanding, 

which then misses the sweet spot. (sigh)

 

Edited August 8, 2019 by C T

[doc benway]

3 minutes ago, Spotless said:

From Apex:

 

"From a Buddhist perspective I think it might be helpful to say that anger, fear, uncertainty, dissatisfaction and so on - in any situation - are indispensable aids to vajrayana practice.  By this I mean they give an opportunity for realising emptiness - because those emotions are fundamentally empty.  By saying this I am not saying they don't matter - or that the political situation doesn't matter - I don't want to fall into the nihilist trap of saying 'its all illusion, man'.  But it is very useful to use both good and bad situations for practice.  So when we find a good situation we are happy for the benefit that arises - when we find a bad situation we are 'happy' for the opportunity to realise that what we are experiencing is a flux of energy."

 

This is fine - and both true and difficult work.

 

From Apex:

 

"It must be true to say that whatever arises depends on causes and conditions - and this includes Trump.  If you attack Trump then you are attacking the appearance of Trump - but if you look to the causes and conditions which gave rise to his election and deal with them then he will literally disappear (yes really) since whatever supports him will no longer be there.  This is why I say that people voted for him because of dissatisfaction(s) in their lives - if you like, they were emotionally drawn to him (in sufficient numbers but not a majority) because they had needs.  Needs that were not being met by the alternative narratives being presented about what had happened and what will happen.  Perhaps you could say needs and aspirations - which I would say were born from (looking at the local time frame) chiefly the events since 9/11 when the USA was shocked into action/reaction leading to and through the 2008 financial crisis.  Violent acts have violent results.  Karma.  I think that is why Trumps main bad feature, to me anyway, is instability - he's angry, defensive and personal when he doesn't need to be"

 

No - simply not - partial truth and certainly inarguable partial truth but imagine saying this about Hitler - seriously put it in those terms:

 

Trump became President partly because of dissatisfaction and attraction - but he was fundamentally elected on a pack of vitriol and hate and propaganda coming from he himself, from the Russian government, the religious right, the hate radio specialists, the "say anything you want against Hillary regardless of the truth" haters - his own birther myth about Obama - the anti-science crowd - the anti-women-choice crowd - and a great many organized Christian religions where in many cases the congregation was taught "that a vote for Hilary Clinton was a vote for the Devil". https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/politics/sd-me-church-bulletin-20161102-story.html.  

 

There was a reason well over half the nation threw up when they discovered the mistake that had taken place - that this mentally ill person was the head of The "United" States of America. 

 

It may come as a surprise to many here but I am not held in this web of hate or vitriol - I do however understand framing and the democrats have had a surprising lacking in the ability to frame an issue - though since Hitler Germany the world has not had a large western nation so under attack from complete and utter lies and propaganda - and the inertia's of complete Insanity.

 

The "Republican Party" is truly insane - and those that are still breathing some portion of reality are leaving or distancing themselves - like Christian's distancing themselves from nearly the entire bible and picking out what they like - and enjoying the momentum of centuries of Inquisitions, torture and mind control/fear/propaganda - its why so many are leaving but so few are stating why.

 

For those from other countries - it may be like hearing about a daughter being raped - it is horrible but not personal. 

When your own daughter is being raped and it is being done while you are held to watch - it is personal - doubly personal.

 

There is nothing about this President and his followers and the machine of hate that it spews that is normal politics - this is indeed nothing of the sort. 

 

In my previous posts I took a picture of what is happening - and put it into words - I was not in a frame of mind of hate - not in a frame of mind to spew - I was not in the inertia's of Democrat's ideology. 

 

 The Nazi Germany tactics - have found real root again - they have become the Way forward in the Republican Party. Repeat lies and with enough repetitions they become real (and simple people become the machines for our greatest tragedies).

 

On a clear day - it is easy to see smoke rising - and it is not opinion to say that the smoke is rising. One does not need to be mad in order to state the perils of a fire spreading to a town just downwind of the fire that is spreading. When trying to summarize in words a fire of hate and lies - it may appear that the person summarizing is lost in the fire - but I assure you I am a cool as a cucumber - and I stand firmly against the machine of "exclusiveness and agenda at all costs" and the nazi machine of the Republican Party.

 

"The Republican Party is the most dangerous organisation in human history."

- Noam Chomsky