Proposed simplification of forums

[dwai]

5 minutes ago, sean said:

What if "Discussions On The Way" becomes the new "General Discussion" with a new forum to house "Focused Traditions".

 

THE COURTYARD

 

- Welcome!

  - Newcomer Corner
- Discussions On The Way (previously "General Discussion")
- Focused Traditions
  - Daoist (previously top level "Daoist Discussion")
    - 道家学说
    - Interviews
    - Textual Studies
  - Buddhist
  - Vedic
  - Occult
- The Rabbit Hole (merges "The Rabbit Hole", "Off Grid". Basically an off topic forum to talk about whatever, but not an "anything goes")
- Meta-Talk (merges Forum and Tech Support, Moderation Logs, Rules and Use)
 
PRIVATE GARDENS

- Personal Practice (still has everyone's private subforums under this)
- Gender Gardens
    - Nonbinary (for nonbinary, gender questioning and intersex)
    - Women (for women and female identified)
    - Men (for men and male identified)
- Group Studies
- Lending Library
- Local Meetups and Events (merges Local Meetups and Upcoming Events)

 

Sean

 

I'd suggest changing the "Vedic" to "Hindu"  as it is more apropos the topics currently there. 

[sean]

4 minutes ago, Jeff said:

Are interviews and textual studies both supposed to only be subsets of Daoist?  Maybe move both up a layer?  Or at least interviews.

 

Thanks. Yeah I keep fiddling with where these belong Currently Textual Studies is all Daoist. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

1 minute ago, dwai said:

I'd suggest changing the "Vedic" to "Hindu"  as it is more apropos the topics currently there. 

 

OK I'm a dumb dumb re: the correct terms here. I was hoping Vedic was a broader umbrella that could include both Hinduism and also older teachings. Is that not the case?

 

Neatly categorizing the 10,000 things in language is hard y'all. 😆

 

Sean

 

[sean]

Also now I'm already feeling torn at the idea of relegating the Daoist tradition to one subforum on a site called "The Dao Bums". 😳

 

Sean

 

[Jeff]

5 minutes ago, sean said:

 

Thanks. Yeah I keep fiddling with where these belong Currently Textual Studies is all Daoist. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

 

We have also discussed many texts from Kashmir Shaivism and things like the Gospel of Thomas. 

[ilumairen]

12 minutes ago, sean said:

Also now I'm already feeling torn at the idea of relegating the Daoist tradition to one subforum on a site called "The Dao Bums". 😳

 

Sean

 

 

Then please don't. 

 

I find it quite appropriate that it has it's own area with it's own subforums.

[dawei]

18 minutes ago, Jeff said:

Are interviews and textual studies both supposed to only be subsets of Daoist?  Maybe move both up a layer?  Or at least interviews.

 

8 minutes ago, sean said:

 

Thanks. Yeah I keep fiddling with where these belong Currently Textual Studies is all Daoist. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

1 minute ago, Jeff said:

 

We have also discussed many texts from Kashmir Shaivism and things like the Gospel of Thomas. 

 

Currently:
Daoist Discussion

-- Daoist Textual Studies

 

General Discussion

-- Buddhist Discussion

---- Buddhist Textual Studies

-- Hindu Discussion

---- Hindu Textual Studies

-- Esoteric and Occult Discussion

---- Agrippa Textual Study

 

So each of the four have a sub-forum for a textual study.   The idea was that the main level was general and then a textual study was a specific teaching or book.    I know... this overlaps a bit with Systems and Teachers of.   I think this latter could absorb into a higher level.

 

So what was raised before, was if there was going to be ONE textual study, then all of those sub-forums (textual studies) would get into ONE place... but it shows now as just under Daoist.    The Agrippa was simply to stay parallel but you can see it is quite dated.   

 

Maybe there needs to be NO General ?     Maybe there is Daoist Discussion ... and Focused Traditions (for others) ?

 

For the record, I was not trying to argue to keep Newcomer Corner, just pointing out the permission issue.  I think those could go into Welcome or General (which i just suggesting nixing ! LOL).

 

And I think these two could go into the Private:

  - 道家学说
    - Interviews

 

or combine several of them under a heading.

 

[C T]

This feels like a way-ty topic. 

 

Speaking for myself, Im good with any outcome once the reformatting is done. 

As long as the affinity with TDB lingers, I too shall linger on. 

 

Affinity's nature is likened to water... it seeks no contention... makes allowances, and yields to any empty spaces. 

 

Endlessly, for the years i've been here, again and again, I see gaps appearing from those sincerely seeking answers, followed almost instantly by some very authentic, genuine and compassionate responses, that, like water, simply flows forth to fill those gaps. 

 

Those who respond are the luminaries of that moment, the light bearers whose light only shines in particular darknesses, who demonstrate the meaning of affinity without any pretentiousness on their part, and who claim not that their light shines in all darkened places. And when their work is done, without so much as a squeak, they fade into the background in the most unassuming manner. Waiting. But sometimes they leave. Perhaps a journey beckoned. Yet, they depart gratified in the knowledge they've shared their light with others. Thats the only meaningful reward sought. No pomp, no gaiety, no fanfare, no claims to greatness, no expectations. 

 

Juice or no juice, the interpenetrating nature of such forums, to a large enough degree, hinges on affinity. Thousands have come and gone, and perhaps thousands more will line up to hop on the TDB carousel, on the next available vacancy. Most leave when the ride comes to an end, delighted having had their dose of a little entertainment, a pleasant diversion from an otherwise mundane existence. Like any fair ground, there are always a few who choose to stick around for a bit longer. Maybe the place felt comfy, familiar, convivial, even welcoming. Maybe they find familiarity with some of the others who also chose to hang around. But, without exception, at the back of the minds of all those who linger on, there's a sort of awareness and resignation of understanding that its only a temporary, transitory arrangement. With this in mind, one can come and go with ease. Dont overburden with the concern of accumulating an abundance of juice. It can be a detriment when its time to leave. A Way-ty one. 

 

Edited August 9, 2019 by C T

[rene]

16 minutes ago, sean said:

Also now I'm already feeling torn at the idea of relegating the Daoist tradition to one subforum on a site called "The Dao Bums". 😳

 

Sean

 

 When I first found this site 11 years ago, the spirit and the energy, especially with the Tao Bums title, conveyed that Dao was everywhere - not just in the perfect or the pleasant or the polite or the politicly correct.

 

Yes, more often than not, it was a disrespectful rowdy and sometimes ugly place. But isn't Dao in all of that also?

 

TDB is 180 from what it began as. I think if you want to change the name of this site it would be fine and perhaps more reflective of what it is now, or what you wish it to become.

 

[ralis]

2 minutes ago, rene said:

 When I first found this site 11 years ago, the spirit and the energy, especially with the Tao Bums title, conveyed that Dao was everywhere - not just in the perfect or the pleasant or the polite or the politicly correct.

 

Yes, more often than not, it was a disrespectful rowdy and sometimes ugly place. But isn't Dao in all of that also?

 

TDB is 180 from what it began as. I think if you want to change the name of this site it would be fine and perhaps more reflective of what it is now, or what you wish it to become.

 

 

By your reasoning, the Dao is also about "no more right-wing bullshit."

[ilumairen]

With a course being set with a less laissez faire attitude toward "governance" does the reasoning behind newcomer corner still exist?

[C T]

Courtyard to The Way-In Rooms? 

as a moniker to the inner journey. 

 

just a passing thought. 

[sean]

31 minutes ago, rene said:

 Yes, more often than not, it was a disrespectful rowdy and sometimes ugly place. But isn't Dao in all of that also?

 

TDB is 180 from what it began as. I think if you want to change the name of this site it would be fine and perhaps more reflective of what it is now, or what you wish it to become.

 

I think you may underestimate how impolite, politically incorrect and rowdy us dirtbag leftists can be. 😜 I want things to get more weird around here. Just with less punching down.

 

Sean

 

[rene]

14 minutes ago, ralis said:

 

By your reasoning, the Dao is also about "no more right-wing bullshit."

 

Of course! Is there anywhere Dao is not?

 

8 minutes ago, sean said:

 

I think you may underestimate how politically incorrect and rowdy us dirtbag leftists can be. 😜 I want things to get more weird around here. Just with less punching down.

 

Sean

 

Ohhh I don't underestimate that at all, lol. You might have missed the middle three hundred plus pages in the Trump thread where the non-leftists were totally thumped on... motivating the right to rise up, etc. I just watched the natural swing back & forth, kinda boring after a while, same shit over and over, both sides. 

 

IMO, if you want less punching, you'll need to ban ALL political debate - or, plan on babysitting 24/7... and it's unreasonable, again imo, to expect Mods to control it for you. Been there done that.

 

I don't have a dog in this hunt. What bows my neck is a lack of integrity - from any source.

 

You want more weirdness? Keep singular control over your site and follow your own nature. It doesn't get more interesting than that. 

[doc benway]

8 hours ago, Zork said:

On the contrary, New Age, is an umbrella term that encompasses true and tried systems and crackpot theories and novelty non-effective systems created for marketing purposes. Shouldn't we differentiate? All systems out there aren't equal and the line should be drawn somewhere if this site attempts to give out information to people during their "baby steps" in esoteric systems.

 

I don't see the site as having the intention of giving out information.

I think of it more as hosting a relatively open forum where people can share.

Allow us to be your spiritual guide at your own risk!

[Apech]

20 minutes ago, steve said:

 

I don't see the site as having the intention of giving out information.

I think of it more as hosting a relatively open forum where people can share.

Allow us to be your spiritual guide at your own risk!

 

 

I think the interviews give out information and I have always wanted a 'Resources' section where useful links, book reviews and other info on systems could be held - maybe Textual Studies could be under 'Resources' ????????  Maybe practitioners of different systems could write short outlines of their stuff and provide signposts for interested folks.

 

Just a thought.

 

 

[manitou]

2 hours ago, sean said:

Also now I'm already feeling torn at the idea of relegating the Daoist tradition to one subforum on a site called "The Dao Bums". 😳

 

Sean

 

 

 

  And the Dao has completed its reversion...

 

I generally post in the General Discussion area because I don't consider myself an -ist at all.  But I have subsequently discovered the Unread Content button and I find that I don't look at where it came from, I just respond to whatever jumps out at me.  Maybe that's the source of any cross-pollination anyone might be worried about - that particular button.

 

 Personally, I think cross pollination is a good thing; otherwise we're all stuck in separate little stalls.  I'd rather be out in the corral mixing it up.  The various traditions that are represented on this forum all seem to end up in the void, or at least that's how I've seen it.  Words are different, stories are different, but the Truth is one.

[dwai]

2 hours ago, sean said:

 

Thanks. Yeah I keep fiddling with where these belong Currently Textual Studies is all Daoist. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

 

OK I'm a dumb dumb re: the correct terms here. I was hoping Vedic was a broader umbrella that could include both Hinduism and also older teachings. Is that not the case?

Hinduism is a relatively modern umbrella term used for multiple traditions, of which six are the primary schools of philosophy that originated in India. Of these, two are considered Vedic - Purva Mimamsa aka Mimamsa which deals with the ritual parts of Hindu tradition, and Uttara Mimamsa, aka Vedanta (which is what I primarily practice). The others are Samkhya , Yoga, Nyaya and Vaisheshika. Also included under the Hindu umbrella are the Tantras (including Kashmir Shaivism, which seems to have some followers here). 

2 hours ago, sean said:

 

Neatly categorizing the 10,000 things in language is hard y'all. 😆

 

Sean

 

 

[dwai]

2 hours ago, sean said:

Also now I'm already feeling torn at the idea of relegating the Daoist tradition to one subforum on a site called "The Dao Bums". 😳

 

Sean

 

If it were in reference to folks like myself, I think The Dao's bum would be apropos  

[doc benway]

4 hours ago, manitou said:

 

Really interesting question, Steve.

 

I don't call myself a Daoist, but I try my best to live within the dynamics of the DDJ.  I have never studied with a legitimate lineage holder.  I have studied many comparative religions and walked their paths sometimes.  When I discovered the DDJ it was as though I had always been looking for it.  The principles aligned with what my inner self knew to be true.

 

Do you think it's absolutely mandatory to have a legitimate lineage to understand  the Dao?

 

Can one understand the Dao?

 

Like Jeff, I guess I hoped my subtext would be obvious - a challenge to the suggestion that we somehow segregate "serious" Daoists from "New Age" stepchildren. I suspect the majority of people who pass through here do not have a connection with a lineage, or a teacher. Not everyone wants or needs such a connection. Not everyone is fortunate enough to have opportunity even if they do. I hope all are equally welcome in any forum. The important thing is simple civility and respect for each other. 

 

And to finally answer your question, no.

[liminal_luke]

1 hour ago, steve said:

 

Like Jeff, I guess I hoped my subtext would be obvious - a challenge to the suggestion that we somehow segregate "serious" Daoists from "New Age" stepchildren. 

 

This place attracts a vibrant mix of people.  We´ve got sages and scholars, scoundrels and (occasional) saints.  There are a few here that are diligently trying to see past their egos, and more than a few that are trying to build their egos up. Not everybody is equally worth listening to but everybody gets the same chance to speak.  Just like in everyday life, it´s up to each of us to decide where we want to put our attention.  Can a person mess themselves up here taking the wrong advice?  Absolutely. The Dao Bums is wonderful and dangerous, a garden with the most ambrosial edible flowers and a few brilliantly colored poisonous plants, all growing together in a gorgeous wild heap.   I wouldn´t want it any other way. 

Edited August 10, 2019 by liminal_luke

[manitou]

1 hour ago, steve said:

 

Can one understand the Dao?

 

 

 

 

To understand the Dao is to not-understand the Dao.  

[ilumairen]

 

39 minutes ago, liminal_luke said:

Can a person mess themselves up here taking the wrong advice?  Absolutely. The Dao Bums is wonderful and dangerous, a garden with the most ambrosial edible flowers and a few brilliantly colored poisonous plants, all growing together in a gorgeous wild heap. 

 

What a visual!

 

Consider the beauty of oleander... 

 

[ralis]

55 minutes ago, ilumairen said:

 

 

What a visual!

 

Consider the beauty of oleander... 

 

 

And Datura! 

[voidisyinyang]

6 hours ago, sean said:

 

I think you may underestimate how impolite, politically incorrect and rowdy us dirtbag leftists can be. 😜 I want things to get more weird around here. Just with less punching down.

 

Sean

 

are the moderators "paid"? I'm not interested in being one. I just wonder how they are "picked" - I'm sure  it's in some fine print technical link somewhere. But looking at your new collapsing of previous subforums. Yes after posting for what - ? 15 years on this site - and doing my own research of course - I have discovered that the "three gunas" - the oldest philosophy of India - are equivalent to yin-yang-Emptiness of Daoism - and in turn these are from music theory going back to the original human culture, the San Bushmen. So what I've discovered transcends the supposed sub-forums while also going beyond them.

 

People tend to get too close-minded due to categorizations like Leftist or rightist or Buddhist or Daoist (taoist) or Hindu or Vedic. Modern biological humans are from 70,000 years ago and so we neglect the 90% of the ice berg below the water - to our own disadvantage. The truth is quite simple yet also very radical.

 

I have SAIC regularly reading my blog - that contractor for the CIA on paranormal research. Also a lot of professors read my blog and I have corresponded with a lot of quantum physicists, etc. So I'm not trying to brag - I'm just saying that this website was more like a "peanut gallery" for me. There really is no excuse for not just doing the meditation or qigong training (standing or sitting exercises). The website to me seems to be controlled by a certain group of people ACROSS the spectrum of ideologies, a group that are essentially addicted to left brain conceptual reality. This is, of course, hard-wired to the medium of writing itself.

 

So to just collapse the sub-forums may not solve any organization problems - I composed a music piece called "Eclectic Soup" and then my next music composition was a Fugue called "Troll Dance" - that was in 1991. You can have that reality or you can choose to look deeper at a simpler more radical reality.

 

 

[moment]

9 hours ago, moment said:

 

No

Since earliest times, human thought has been characterized by an awareness of man's close relationship with nature and a cyclical view of time and the universe..

Taoism, Hinduism and Buddhism all operate within this ancient worldview and incorporates many of its concepts.  There has been sages/ adepts in all three ways without prior lineage.  Of course, It is usually easier and better for most to learn from a teacher with credible lineage, but it is not impossible to discover it on your own.

Edited August 10, 2019 by moment