Proposed simplification of forums

[wandelaar]

Well - when there is agreement we can now move on. Thank you.

[Earl Grey]

1 minute ago, wandelaar said:

Could the MoPai discussion please be held in a topic of it's own? 

 

Makes me wonder if a section just for Mo Pai should be made for all mentions and discussion of the topic to be there, all things considered. 

 

Anyway, moving forward...

[C T]

1 minute ago, Earl Grey said:

 

Makes me wonder if a section just for Mo Pai should be made for all mentions and discussion of the topic to be there, all things considered. 

 

Anyway, moving forward...

 

Good idea. Just please make it totally exclusive. Only the scores of genuine seekers who flock here regularly to learn Mopai get to access the room. Anyone outside of this space even think the word "mopai"  gets redirected there pronto. Any posts in the general area that even contains the letters M and O gets redirected there pronto. If it was mistakenly rerouted, then just edit and remove oneself out of there. Cheers and bye. 

[Earl Grey]

11 minutes ago, C T said:

 

Good idea. Just please make it totally exclusive. Only the scores of genuine seekers who flock here regularly to learn Mopai get to access the room. Anyone outside of this space even think the word "mopai"  gets redirected there pronto. Any posts in the general area that even contains the letters M and O gets redirected there pronto. If it was mistakenly rerouted, then just edit and remove oneself out of there. Cheers and bye. 

 

FYI I am not part of their group nor do I practice what they do (see on the side panel that I list my practices).

 

This thread is about trying new things for the forum and I was actually trying to suggest something as a means of allowing people to bury the hatchet with those guys and give them a playground for themselves here, and to avoid threads being derailed by the topic or people's reactions to them bringing it up.

 

I'm just brainstorming here while trying to outgrow old paradigms that led to unnecessary conflict before and also to maintain the focus of the site. 

Edited August 10, 2019 by Earl Grey

[MegaMind]

23 minutes ago, Earl Grey said:

 

FYI I am not part of their group nor do I practice what they do.

 

This thread is about trying new things for the forum and I was actually trying to suggest something as a means of allowing people to bury the hatchet with those guys and give them a playground for themselves here and to avoid threads being derailed by the topic or people's reactions to it, and I'm just brainstorming here while trying to outgrow old paradigms that led to unnecessary conflict before and also to maintain the focus of the site. 

 

From my perspective the vast majority of the members here are not interested in it, and are sick of seeing it "discussed". 

 

I think a moratorium on ALL Mo Pai discussion just like the right wing bs would be the best option here.

 

This way there is no discussion to annoy the majority of members here who do not want to hear about it, and our group does not have to refute the lies and disinformation spread about it.

Edited August 10, 2019 by MildMouse23

[Earl Grey]

1 minute ago, MildMouse23 said:

 

From my perspective the vast majority of the membership here are not interested in it, and are sick of seeing it "discussed". 

 

I think a moratorium on mo pai discussion just like the right wing bs would be the best option here.

 

This way discussion does not bother the majority of members here who do not want to hear about it, and our group does not have to refute the lies and disinformation spread about it here and annoy the membership in doing so.

 

I think this is actually a much better idea than the one I suggested, and probably one most people would be happiest with then. 

[C T]

2 hours ago, Earl Grey said:

 

FYI I am not part of their group nor do I practice what they do (see on the side panel that I list my practices).

 

This thread is about trying new things for the forum and I was actually trying to suggest something as a means of allowing people to bury the hatchet with those guys and give them a playground for themselves here, and to avoid threads being derailed by the topic or people's reactions to them bringing it up.

 

I'm just brainstorming here while trying to outgrow old paradigms that led to unnecessary conflict before and also to maintain the focus of the site. 

 

 Got it. I know, but no denying there's some traces of old karma lurking somewhere though. Exactly how old, and where, I'll leave that to the immortals to ascertain... jk 

[Walker]

Haven't read this all yet but here's one thing, please please pretty please change it:

 

"道家學說" doesn't make any sense, because a 學說 is a theory or doctrine, not a word that means, as its characters might suggest, to study and discuss. So in Chinese, for instance, if you see the term 陰陽學說 this means "the theory of tin and yang." This means that the banner up there kinda means "the theory of Daoism," which doesn't quite make sense.

 

And you know, I'm pretty damn sure the reason no beautiful woman in China has ever interrupted me to ask for my phone number while I've been surfing this site in cafes and tea houses is because they see that there banner and scoff at all of us. It's a serious problem!

 

Also, can we please use traditional characters in the forum titles that contain Chinese? Simplified characters, while they did play a noble role in increasing literacy back when people wrote everything by hand, are not useful in the digital age. However, the PRC government persists in forbidding almost all local publications and  websites from using traditional characters and promotes simplified characters in overseas education via Confucius Institutes in order to enforce their claim of "owning Chineseness." This is because it is ultimately a subversive act to refuse to publish using the writing system that was invented under Mao... the CCP interprets the rejection of their characters as, well, a rejection of their character, and therefore the Chinese in this country aren't free to publish using the traditional writing system, which is just as easy to type on a computer or phone!

 

Well, the communist party here killed and tortured a lot of Daoists in the 60s, continues to make life very hard for Daoists who aren't so lucky as to occupy temples needed by the tourist industry (see: Bitter Winter), and will cause unthinkable further damage to the Daoist tradition if they ever occupy Taiwan, which is a free and vibrant country where citizens can do all the wonderful Daoist things we're all interested in right in downtown Taipei if they like without worrying about going to prison or getting harassed by secret police. It is a small but meaningful act of resistance, I believe, to eschew with the PRC writing system which I hope you will all consider 😁

Edited August 11, 2019 by Walker

[Mskied]

Id like to say that, if Im not mistaken, the "New Age" movement is something that was devised by Crowley, as he set forth a turning of the cosmic calendar, declaring that the Age has turned, at least that is what I have seen in my research.  Crowley is all over the place, and so too then would the New Age movement.  This movement is not without benefice to older methods, as Crowley incorporated a lot of their wisdom and way into his own "new" system- which is actually just leading people to Qabalah.  In essence the "New Age" is retelling of Jewish mysticism molded around ritual and method of "magick" ceremony and meditative practice that incorporates everything it can get its hands on.  In light of this, it is great for a synthetic bridge between systems, but the system that Crowley actually and actively proposed was personal, so that means that things will be very messy.  That being said, it is probably best to keep western mysticism/occult-Golden Dawn/Thelema in a separate forum to allay any arguing with people of more established pathworking.

[Michael Sternbach]

8 hours ago, ilumairen said:

Have we just moved from simplification to expansion? 

 

It is a curious fact that trying to simplify things too much, you can end up with a lack of clarity and therefore excessive complexity. In other words, with a big mess... 

 

Whereas taking this topic through alternating stages of simplification and differentiation might take us to a feasible solution. 

[ilumairen]

False reasonableness.. 

 

On the surface everything looks kosher; yet when one is aware of what lies beneath it's anything but.

 

Simplification - leaving someone alone when they no longer wish to interact. Respect boundaries. 

 

[doc benway]

When the traffic gets going here, the topics can fly by in general discussion (so much more if all but Dao are focused there). Oversimplification could challenge accessibility. Pulling from my experiences as member and mod, having a few areas of concentration may be valuable to balance lively and flexible banter (general) with more detailed and nuanced examination (categorical); preserving access to the slower moving yet no less important ‘traditional’ studies. This model also helps insulate the ‘traditionalists’ from the freethinkers, should they feel a need. I think sean’s current iteration strikes a nice balance.

[Earl Grey]

1 hour ago, Walker said:

Haven't read this all yet but here's one thing, please please pretty please change it:

 

"道家學說" doesn't make any sense, because a 學說 is a theory or doctrine, not a word that means, as its characters might suggest, to study and discuss. So in Chinese, for instance, if you see the term 陰陽學說 this means "the theory of tin and yang." This means that the banner up there kinda means "the theory of Daoism," which doesn't quite make sense.

 

And you know, I'm pretty damn sure the reason no beautiful woman in China has ever interrupted me to ask for my phone number while I've been surfing this site in cafes and tea houses is because they see that there banner and scoff at all of us. It's a serious problem!

 

Also, can we please use traditional characters in the forum titles that contain Chinese? Simplified characters, while they did play a noble role in increasing literacy back when people wrote everything by hand, are not useful in the digital age. However, the PRC government persists in forbidding almost all local publications and  websites from using traditional characters and promotes simplified characters in overseas education via Confucius Institutes in order to enforce their claim of "owning Chineseness." This is because it is ultimately a subversive act to refuse to publish using the writing system that was invented under Mao... the CCP interprets the rejection of their characters as, well, a rejection of their character, and therefore the Chinese in this country aren't free to publish using the traditional writing system, which is just as easy to type on a computer or phone!

 

Well, the communist party here killed and tortured a lot of Daoists in the 60s, continues to make life very hard for Daoists who aren't so lucky as to occupy temples needed by the tourist industry (see: Bitter Winter), and will cause unthinkable further damage to the Daoist tradition if they ever occupy Taiwan, which is a free and vibrant country where citizens can do all the wonderful Daoist things we're all interested in right in downtown Taipei if they like without worrying about going to prison or getting harassed by secret police. It is a small but meaningful act of resistance, I believe, to eschew with the PRC writing system which I hope you will all consider 😁

 

Couldn't agree more about using traditional given that the simplified characters are a lazy effort considering that they decided after just a few hundred characters they decided not to do anything else for the rest instead of the plan to simplify everything. 

[manitou]

1 hour ago, steve said:

 This model also helps insulate the ‘traditionalists’ from the freethinkers, should they feel a need. I think sean’s current iteration strikes a nice balance.

 

Freethinkers   I love it.  I've finally found my category.  Sometimes I feel like all of it and none of it at the same time.

[Earl Grey]

14 hours ago, C T said:

 

 Got it. I know, but no denying there's some traces of old karma lurking somewhere though. Exactly how old, and where, I'll leave that to the immortals to ascertain... jk 

 

What I hope to communicate is that moving forward after the bullshit the past couple years that people can be welcomed here if certain boundaries are both elaborated and respected.

 

The problem before was those boundaries were not elaborated but rather interpreted and enforced in a manner that showed not only was the admin exhausted, but so was the forum itself, hence exodus for many people, either permanently or temporarily, myself included.

[C T]

33 minutes ago, Earl Grey said:

 

What I hope to communicate is that moving forward after the bullshit the past couple years that people can be welcomed here if certain boundaries are both elaborated and respected.

 

The problem before was those boundaries were not elaborated but rather interpreted and enforced in a manner that showed not only was the admin exhausted, but so was the forum itself, hence exodus for many people, either permanently or temporarily, myself included.

 

Exhaustion could arise when the notion of Non Doing is improperly primed in one's understanding. 

The literalness of it being the option taken, resulting in achieving the exact opposite of what was intended. 

[Wu Ming Jen]

I am surprised there is not a martial art section...Tao of the fist.  After all this is the broadsword (Dao) Bums.

Sword play anyone? I enjoy walking on the seven stars as the fairy points the way.

 

More Pie being mentioned is hilarious. Summer on TDB gotta love it. Conflict and struggle reign supreme at least nature is not conflicted or struggling itself over change.

[wandelaar]

Could be done this way:

 

The Dao Bums > Arts and Practices >  Martial Arts

 

[Hag]

About "Hindu discussion" becoming "Vedic" :

Vedic implies this is about the oldest tradition of Hinduism. What about Upanishads ? Sankara ?

What about Indian teachings unrelated to Hinduism (even if Hinduism itself tends to assimilate them) such as yoga, samkhya, or Indian martial arts ?

"Hindu" was more encompassing than "Vedic". If other Indian traditions are also to be discussed there, maybe calling the section "Indian" would be clearer.

 

[Taomeow]

3 hours ago, Hag said:

About "Hindu discussion" becoming "Vedic" :

Vedic implies this is about the oldest tradition of Hinduism. What about Upanishads ? Sankara ?

What about Indian teachings unrelated to Hinduism (even if Hinduism itself tends to assimilate them) such as yoga, samkhya, or Indian martial arts ?

"Hindu" was more encompassing than "Vedic". If other Indian traditions are also to be discussed there, maybe calling the section "Indian" would be clearer.

 

 

 Upanishads are parts of Vedas. Rig, Yajur, Sama and Atharva are the four Vedas. A Veda is divided into four parts, namely, Samhita, Brahmana, Aranyaka and Upanishad. 

 

I don't know what Sankara is though.  

[Nungali]

On 09/08/2019 at 10:00 AM, sean said:

 

No, my idea was that topics in any subforum not retained under new “Discussions On The Way” that are now part of current Daoist or General Discussion would get folded into main DOTW.

 

 

Ahh does current search suck? I’ve been meaning to build a custom search engine for this site for ever.

 

Sean

 

 

Either it sucks , or I suck  using it  ... someone's sucking .

[Nungali]

On 10/08/2019 at 6:36 AM, dwai said:

I'd suggest changing the "Vedic" to "Hindu"  as it is more apropos the topics currently there. 

 

Ceptin 'Hindu' ain't really a thing .

 

But I guess there are no traditionalist 'Indians' here to protest that .

[Apech]

1 hour ago, Taomeow said:

 

 Upanishads are parts of Vedas. Rig, Yajur, Sama and Atharva are the four Vedas. A Veda is divided into four parts, namely, Samhita, Brahmana, Aranyaka and Upanishad. 

 

I don't know what Sankara is though.  

 

Shankara = Advaita Vedanta?

Edited August 11, 2019 by Apech

[Apech]

Just now, Nungali said:

 

Ceptin 'Hindu' ain't really a thing .

 

But I guess there are no traditionalist 'Indians' here to protest that .

 

 

Hindu and Indian mean more or less the same thing - reference Indus (beyond the river).

[Nungali]

On 10/08/2019 at 6:42 AM, sean said:

 

Thanks. Yeah I keep fiddling with where these belong Currently Textual Studies is all Daoist. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

 

OK I'm a dumb dumb re: the correct terms here. I was hoping Vedic was a broader umbrella that could include both Hinduism and also older teachings. Is that not the case?

 

 

 

 

 

" In the last 11 years ever since I came back from my 20 years abroad, I realised that the British had coined a word called Hinduism. Like communism and Fascism. But unlike the latter two there was no such thing as Hinduism."

 

 

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/blogs/no-free-lunch/there-is-no-such-religion-as-hinduism/

 

" Fast-forward a few hundred years and highly intelligent westerners arrived on the scene. They noticed complete chaos, and various religions – Buddhism, Islam, Sikh. Not to mention that people were worshiping Shiva, and others worshiped Krishna, and others Vishnu, or  Hanuman, or Durga, or Kali, and the list goes on and on. To simplify things, we lumped all that together and invented a religion called Hinduism, which is now considered one of the 5 major world religions."

 

https://www.zingale.org/2011/12/there-is-no-such-thing-as-hinduism/

 

Hinduism was just a word the British colonials used to describe in a single word the vast kaleidoscope of different spiritual practices of an entire subcontinent. Unfortunately in trying to describe such a vast de-centralised plethora of ideas into a single ism, is a mischaracterisation, which imo has left many people myself included with an inaccurate view of the spiritual traditions in India and their vast diversity.

http://www.selectsmart.com/DISCUSS/read.php?33,717250

 

 

 

' So, Hindu religion is "Sanatan Dharma" and "Savrvatrika Dharma"
"Veda" is the first and supreme text of it so it's called "Vaidik Dharma"

 

ttps://www.quora.com/Hindu-is-not-a-religion-according-to-ancient-texts-So-what-is-the-religion-name-that-is-popularly-termed-as-Hinduism

 

... and so on