Is it possible to feel the chi of other person?

[Scholar]

Im kind of skeptical about of the existence of chi. I do have sensations but I cant know if thats something of my head or its real.

 

But if I could feel it from other person, with my eyes closed, it would be real. 

 

Does anyone know any practice that involves doing that ?

[welkin]

If the other person was adept at moving energy, then you would be able to feel 'chi'. If the other person can't transfer that strongly, then it would also depend on how adept you are yourself at sensing it.

 

If you're asking if it is real, it is 100% real.

 

When i first started began experimenting with energy, someone i know said they couldn't feel it. I told them to relax and sleep. I was then able to slightly move their feet while touching their leg. That's what proved it to me.

 

As far as messing with that stuff, I'll tell you what i was told on here a while back. Chill out on it. We're talking about karma, transferring energy, health. Take your time and learn how to work with it.

 

 

[MegaMind]

4 hours ago, Scholar said:

Im kind of skeptical about of the existence of chi. I do have sensations but I cant know if thats something of my head or its real.

 

But if I could feel it from other person, with my eyes closed, it would be real. 

 

Does anyone know any practice that involves doing that ?

 

 

[Zork]

8 hours ago, Scholar said:

Im kind of skeptical about of the existence of chi. I do have sensations but I cant know if thats something of my head or its real.

Yes you can't. You will figure it out eventually after practicing. At first don't bother with the sensations.

8 hours ago, Scholar said:

But if I could feel it from other person, with my eyes closed, it would be real. 

??

How would you know that it isn't a sensation and it is the real thing?

Suggestion/hypnosis can make you feel things that aren't real.

A good conman can make you feel "qi".

Avoid seeking people just for the sake of proving to yourself that qi is real.

8 hours ago, Scholar said:

Does anyone know any practice that involves doing that ?

All qigong practices involve sensing qi at first.

It comes with practice.

[freeform]

17 hours ago, Scholar said:

I do have sensations but I cant know if thats something of my head or its real.

 

If you have doubts, then it's probably not Qi. Focused attention will make you feel all kinds of sensations - but that's normally just your nerves being stimulated - it's not Qi.

 

It's rare to feel Qi directly - and trying to feel it directly is not recommended and unnecessary (in the beginning). When we feel Qi, it's usually your body's reaction to Qi that you feel... It's not subtle, it's strong and obvious when it's real.

 

As you can see from the video above, these reactions are often in the form of muscle spasms or trembling - sometimes it feels like an electric shock, or like a strong pressure or intense heat - but it's not subtle, it's as obvious as someone squeezing your arm, or zapping you with an electric cattle-prod.

 

But it's also very rare to find someone that has developed their Qi Gong to the stage of being able to demonstrate these things (as well as having the willingness to demonstrate it to someone they don't know).

 

It's pointless to get into these arts just to find out if Qi is real - it's like getting into theoretical physics to find out if Dark Matter is real... it's a lot of hard work, for not much of a payoff

 

[Taomeow]

No one can have a toothache in someone else's tooth. -- Ludwig Wittgenstein

 

No one can feel someone else's qi.  -- Taiji Classics

Only someone else can feel your jin. -- Taiji Classics

 

To get someone else to feel your qi, you need to learn to focus and release it -- and as soon as you release it, it's no longer "your" qi.  You can shoot an arrow but you can't feel what the target it hits feels.  The martial way to do it is via fajin skill, the healing way to do it is via waigong skill.  A trained taiji or classical medicine or waigong practitioner can feel her own qi when it interacts with yours and interpret what she perceives, much like your mind is trained to interpret words said in a language you are fluent in.  If you are not fluent in that language, it doesn't mean it doesn't exist or constitutes meaningless noise.  It only means отсутствие владения грамматикой, словарём, произношением данного языка.    

Edited October 15, 2019 by Taomeow

[moment]

1 hour ago, Taomeow said:

No one can have a toothache in someone else's tooth. -- Ludwig Wittgenstein

 

No one can feel someone else's qi.  -- Taiji Classics

Only someone else can feel your jin. -- Taiji Classics

 

To get someone else to feel your qi, you need to learn to focus and release it -- and as soon as you release it, it's no longer "your" qi.  You can shoot an arrow but you can't feel what the target it hits feels.  The martial way to do it is via fajin skill, the healing way to do it is via waigong skill.  A trained taiji or classical medicine or waigong practitioner can feel her own qi when it interacts with yours and interpret what she perceives, much like your mind is trained to interpret words said in a language you are fluent in.  If you are not fluent in that language, it doesn't mean it doesn't exist or constitutes meaningless noise.  It only means отсутствие владения грамматикой, словарём, произношением данного языка.    

That is an interesting keyboard you have, what do you do? keep two or three ready or what? Also, I agree that it amounts to a lack of knowledge on at least two fronts.

Edited October 15, 2019 by moment

[voidisyinyang]

On 10/14/2019 at 5:42 PM, Scholar said:

Im kind of skeptical about of the existence of chi. I do have sensations but I cant know if thats something of my head or its real.

 

But if I could feel it from other person, with my eyes closed, it would be real. 

 

Does anyone know any practice that involves doing that ?

http://springforestqigong.com does phone healings - try one out to see if you can feel it - or close your eyes while on the phone! Or you can try http://guidingqi.com

[Taomeow]

1 hour ago, moment said:

That is an interesting keyboard you have, what do you do? keep two or three ready or what? 

 

No, just one keyboard, but three or four ways to do it.  On the phone, I can switch by just touching this sign under the keyboard -- 🌐 -- I pre-set mine to switch between the two languages I use.  On the computer, there's sites that let you type on your normal keyboard but the text will come out in Cyrillic.  The method is known as Translit, an informal romanization where you use English letters for sounds that have close enough Cyrillic counterparts, and a bunch of agreed-upon letters or signs instead of the ones that have no correspondences.  So there's basically two different types of qi I store in my fingers for the same keyboard, and they are different enough for anyone who knows only one to not recognize the other.   (Do I mention once again what I always like to point out about qi -- it is meaningful change, not mechanical "energy"?  )  

[moment]

4 hours ago, Taomeow said:

 

No, just one keyboard, but three or four ways to do it.  On the phone, I can switch by just touching this sign under the keyboard -- 🌐 -- I pre-set mine to switch between the two languages I use.  On the computer, there's sites that let you type on your normal keyboard but the text will come out in Cyrillic.  The method is known as Translit, an informal romanization where you use English letters for sounds that have close enough Cyrillic counterparts, and a bunch of agreed-upon letters or signs instead of the ones that have no correspondences.  So there's basically two different types of qi I store in my fingers for the same keyboard, and they are different enough for anyone who knows only one to not recognize the other.   (Do I mention once again what I always like to point out about qi -- it is meaningful change, not mechanical "energy"?  )  

I believe it is both. (and a third that is much harder to explain). But, I will let you take a stab at it.:)  I can at any time use Sodarshan Chakra Kriya to generate energy from the root.  Immediately afterwards, only 7 to 10 minutes of standing Zhan Zhuang with MCO can fill me with incredible amounts of energy that obliterates all negativity and on occasion will explode out of the top of my head in total bliss.  But, I can ground it almost immediately with sets of Tai Chi. I have gotten to the point where it is consistent, stable and predictable.  What kind of energy would you call that?

Edited October 16, 2019 by moment

[Taomeow]

1 hour ago, moment said:

I believe it is both. (and a third that is much harder to explain). But, I will let you take a stab at it.:)  I can at any time use Sodarshan Chakra Kriya to generate energy from the root.  Immediately afterwards, only 7 to 10 minutes of standing Zhan Zhuang with MCO can fill me with incredible amounts of energy that obliterates all negativity and on occasion will explode out of the top of my head in total bliss.  But, I can ground it almost immediately with sets of Tai Chi. I have gotten to the point where it is consistent, stable and predictable.  What kind of energy would you call that?

 

What I call it always.  Meaningful.  "Negativity," "bliss" -- those are your meanings for this energy, or this energy's meanings for you.   

 

Is it qi you're feeling?  Well...  What you are definitely feeling is whatever it is that gets you to interpret that energy as "obliterating all negativity" and "total bliss."  If that "whatever" is a reconfiguration of the pattern, the increase of a particular type of qi or decrease of a different type of qi or transformation of qi, then qi is involved -- as it is involved in absolutely everything else you do, feel or think.  What kind of pattern of qi in your system generates those sensations and those interpretations is a separate inquiry. 

 

There's many kinds of qi.   There's much fewer kinds of energy.  Energy without qi is meaningless.  Energy without change is impossible.  Qi is the medium and  message of meaningful change.  Energy depends on qi, qi does not depend on energy.  Qi is the kind of pattern that makes sense in a particular context, and is at the same time created by a particular pattern.  This process can increase or decrease energy or leave it well alone.  If your "obliterating all negativity" and "total bliss" were the outcome of taking a psychoactive substance -- e.g. cocaine -- it would be decreasing your energy while you'd feel it's being increased.  It would be entangling and depleting your qi and yet feel as blissful, or more so.  It all depends.  

Edited October 16, 2019 by Taomeow

[Taomeow]

5 hours ago, moment said:

I agree with you about Qi in everything. Though taking a substance and qi cultivation through meditation are hugely different things and frankly should not be thought of in the same breath.  I also totally disagree with your statement "Energy depends on Qi, Qi does not depend on energy". Qi is the director but, they need each other for any type of continual spiritual advancement.  I know this from personal Yoga, Tai chi and martial arts experience going back over 45 years. I think you wrap yourself up a little too tightly in your personal definitions.  But, we are using words so, what are we to do?  Be well!

 

Not my personal definitions.  I try not to define what the taoist tradition prefers to infer.  Merely trusting the tradition.  

 

Qi--energy interactions are harder to define than most think.  My statement about what depends on what was perhaps more linear than I would like it to be, but then, no linear statement about nonlinear phenomena can do them justice.  Some statements though, often repeated here and elsewhere, "qi=energy," "qi=particular sensations I feel," "qi=what one can make someone else feel," etc., are just plain wrong. 

 

Not that it matters much if whatever you do and whatever you call it benefits you and those around you.  I for one wouldn't be able to combine "qi" with "chakras," because the way my qi is educated (sic) does not include "chakra fluency," it relies on a different frame of reference.  Wouldn't know how to stick my dantiens in between chakras, and what for.  And not because I'm "wrapped up too tightly" or anything.  But because qi is systemically meaningful, and to someone not educated in a particular way (I don't mean just in the head) they are systemically meaningless.  Like I said, it all depends.  Be well yourself.    

[voidisyinyang]

11 minutes ago, Taomeow said:

 

Not my personal definitions.  I try not to define what the taoist tradition prefers to infer.  Merely trusting the tradition.  

 

Qi--energy interactions are harder to define than most think.  My statement about what depends on what was perhaps more linear than I would like it to be, but then, no linear statement about nonlinear phenomena can do them justice.  Some statements though, often repeated here and elsewhere, "qi=energy," "qi=particular sensations I feel," "qi=what one can make someone else feel," etc., are just plain wrong. 

 

Not that it matters much if whatever you do and whatever you call it benefits you and those around you.  I for one wouldn't be able to combine "qi" with "chakras," because the way my qi is educated (sic) does not include "chakra fluency," it relies on a different frame of reference.  Wouldn't know how to stick my dantiens in between chakras, and what for.  And not because I'm "wrapped up too tightly" or anything.  But because qi is systemically meaningful, and to someone not educated in a particular way (I don't mean just in the head) they are systemically meaningless.  Like I said, it all depends.  Be well yourself.    

the phrase "frame of reference" for qi is great to consider for Einstein's insight into relativity. He imagined being in an elevator at the speed of light - so that gravity can not be sensed at all. So that way there is no way to tell if someone is free falling - the qi - or not. So Qi has Shen within it. The shen is our spiritual ego but we turn the light around to build up the qi. The qi literally is spacetime as Yuan Qi. The yin qi and yang qi are different. Chapter 11 of the book Taoist Yoga goes into this - so the shen has to have Yuan Qi surrounding it - or else when the Shen leaves the body there is spacetime dizziness. So that is a kind of general relativity. When we work with Yuan Qi as the Emptiness we are literally changing spacetime! We create Negentropy energy which is reverse time energy. So qigong master Effie P. Chow explains how sometimes when someone decides to go get a qi healing from her - they are already feeling the qi energy before they even get the healing in "real time." The qigong master by turning the light around then has everything happening at the SAME time - Effie P. Chow explains this as well as Chunyi Lin. So by turning the light around then they are in that spacetime "zero/infinite" frame of reference" even though they are changing spacetime around them! So it is just like a black hole that increases and then sends out white light after taking in energy-matter.

 

Quote

 

That’s clearly not the case with electrical forces, for example, where inertial mass measures resistance to a change in motion but electrical charge measures the body’s ability to feel and exert electrical attractions or repulsions.

Einstein’s radical new answer to this old question is that inertial and gravitational mass are equal because they are, literally, one and the same property of a body.

 

https://www.thegreatcoursesdaily.com/einsteins-experimental-elevator/

Edited October 16, 2019 by voidisyinyang

[moment]

2 hours ago, Taomeow said:

 

Not my personal definitions.  I try not to define what the taoist tradition prefers to infer.  Merely trusting the tradition.  

 

Qi--energy interactions are harder to define than most think.  My statement about what depends on what was perhaps more linear than I would like it to be, but then, no linear statement about nonlinear phenomena can do them justice.  Some statements though, often repeated here and elsewhere, "qi=energy," "qi=particular sensations I feel," "qi=what one can make someone else feel," etc., are just plain wrong. 

 

Not that it matters much if whatever you do and whatever you call it benefits you and those around you.  I for one wouldn't be able to combine "qi" with "chakras," because the way my qi is educated (sic) does not include "chakra fluency," it relies on a different frame of reference.  Wouldn't know how to stick my dantiens in between chakras, and what for.  And not because I'm "wrapped up too tightly" or anything.  But because qi is systemically meaningful, and to someone not educated in a particular way (I don't mean just in the head) they are systemically meaningless.  Like I said, it all depends.  Be well yourself.    

Yes, much depends upon a particular/subjective education and training, up to a point.  Wellness, always.

Edited October 16, 2019 by moment

[MegaMind]

4 hours ago, GSmaster said:

 

I have held a hand of a mortal girl, and she felt very intense things, like burning sensation, heat, pressure. Later on she felt like she was recovering after extended physical exercise.

 

So you are not mortal?

[Miffymog]

10 minutes ago, GSmaster said:

 

No, high level masters are able to reincarnate with partially or fully recovered memories / personality. 

 

But what of the person's personality that has otherwise been taken over.

 

Now, I'm quite certain this innocent preformed personality is first asked about whether they are happy for someone else to reincarnate into them and give them their memories and personality fragments.

 

I'm sure both parties get to sit down and have a chat about the in's and out's / pros and cons / benefits and otherwise of such a procedure in a nice outer dimensional coffee shop. The person who's life is about be taken over is, I'm sure, told about how they are actually really privileged to be selected for such a thing and that they don't really need their own personality anyway when they get to have someone else's.

 

I know this happens not only from all the reincarnated people I personally know, but from my own experiences. YES - I was lucky enough to be selected as a reincarnated person. The problem is I now realise that that bloke was a bit of a knob - and I really don't like him. God damn it!

 

 

(sorry - I do know that there are many people who do believe in reincarnation, it's just something I have a moral problem with)

[Miffymog]

Yep - the basic example of the genetic memory of how birds know how to build their nests means that we are far more than just a blank/empty sheet when we are born.

 

It's like the inherited fear of spiders, really quite a beneficial trait, but how do on earth do you impregnate the image of a spider on an unborn consciousness - there are many things we really don't understand.

[senseless virtue]

On 10/16/2019 at 4:05 AM, voidisyinyang said:

http://springforestqigong.com does phone healings - try one out to see if you can feel it - or close your eyes while on the phone! Or you can try http://guidingqi.com

 

Oh, it's another attempt at telephone marketing. Why are you doing this to me? Can't have peace even on this forum now!

 

Do you even get a commission for bringing in new customers, or are you just one of those clueless chumps who thinks they are doing everyone a freaking favor?

Edited August 7, 2023 by senseless virtue
cleaner language

[senseless virtue]

Energy is resonance first and foremost.

Edited August 7, 2023 by senseless virtue
Unclear thinking.

[MegaMind]

17 hours ago, GSmaster said:

 

No, high level masters are able to reincarnate with partially or fully recovered memories / personality. 

 

So you have reached the level of spiritual immortality where you will keep your memories and personality upon reincarnation?

[Zork]

2 hours ago, MegaMind said:

 

So you have reached the level of spiritual immortality where you will keep your memories and personality upon reincarnation?

Since when do WMP believe in reincarnation?

Is the afterlife provable on camera before scientists and medical specialists?

[Earl Grey]

21 minutes ago, GSmaster said:

Some level of spiritual immortality, as I have not recovered all the memories and all the personalities.

Some are waiting for me to get much stronger.

 

Are you going to ask me to bring medical scientists and doctors, with voltmeters to the randomly chosen hotel room on afterlife plane to test for this.

 

I have started cultivation at the age of 6, when my peers, would sit in kindergarden and not be able to count to 20.

 

This reminds me of the memory inheritance in Gene Wolfe’s The Book of the New Sun. All memories and personalities passed on through eating a mixture of an animal extract mixed with the forebrain of the previous autarch to show it’s the same leader and lineage, but also the many individuals who assume the role becoming one in the same.

[MegaMind]

4 hours ago, Zork said:

Since when do WMP believe in reincarnation?

Is the afterlife provable on camera before scientists and medical specialists?

 

That is not a claim I am making.  

 

I am just merely curious about the claims gsmaster is making.

[Earl Grey]

Here's something for MegaMind that involves one doctor from Yale's approval of Flying Phoenix qigong, a system I am aware that does not meet his group's standards for testing. This was posted by Sifu Terry. 

 

Quote

 

And just this past Sunday, I was given the following scientific assessment of the efficacy of Flying Phoenix Qigong as a system of hygienics by  Dr. Yetsa Tuakli-Wosornu of the Yale School of Public Health and the Yale School of Medicine--with whom I became acquainted in April of this year:

 

   "The practice of Flying Phoenix Qigong elevates parasympathetic tone.

    The practice of this system of hygienics is truly restorative in real time and over time afterwards.”

                  -- Yetsa A. Tuakli-Wosornu, M.D., M.P.H., IOC Dip. Sp. Med.

 

                      Assistant Clinical Professor, Yale School of Public Health Department of Chronic Disease Epidemiology, International Olympic Committee (IOC) Working Group on the Prevention of Harassment and Abuse in Sport, World Obstacle Course Racing (FISO) Safeguarding Committee International Blind Sports Federation (IBSA) Medical Committee.   (Dr. Tuakli-Wosornu is a former All-American in track and field, when she was a Yale undergrad and also Olympic competitor in the long-jump for Ghana. She earned her medical degree from the Harvard Medical School and Masters in Public Health from Johns Hopkins University.)

 

 

Edited December 17, 2019 by Earl Grey

[Zork]

53 minutes ago, MegaMind said:

 

That is not a claim I am making.  

 

I am just merely curious about the claims gsmaster is making.

Asking him about whether he has achieved the preservation of personality through incarnations means a priori accepting it as a fact.

Otherwise you would just say he is an impostor/placebo seller because reincarnation doesn't happen according to science.