Apech Posted November 24, 2019 6 hours ago, Nungali said: * Ka Ba Srh ** ** " If all the rites, ceremonies, and preservation rituals for the ẖt were observed correctly, and the deceased was found worthy (by Osiris and the gods of the underworld) of passing through into the afterlife, the sꜥḥ (or spiritual representation of the physical body) forms ." (if Apec is around might he want to re-arrange or correct this , I cant find the diagram I used before to show this ) Hmmm. This is Thelemic rather than trad Egyptian. The ht is the physical body and the sah is the magically reconstituted body in the form of the mummy. Here it is presented as the union of the ka and the ba, which is also 'correct' - but the ba is male and sometimes drawn in glyphs as a penis which doesn't quite sit right with identifying it with Isis (Auset). In fact I would be tempted to reverse the correspondences of ka and ba - but hey. I think the triad of father, mother and child in relation to the right angled 3/4/5 triangle is fine - but I can't recall ever seeing an ancient Egyptian version of this - which is why I say its Thelemic. 1 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ilumairen Posted November 24, 2019 For @ralis Hierophant HGA https://imgur.com/gallery/4UJ52he I took a pic for you. It's the Thoth Hierophant and some pertinent text regarding the HGA. If you're uncomfortable with the link (the only option I have while on a phone), I'll boot up the computer (which should provide more options for image sharing) for you. I simply prefer sitting in the open air while posting here. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted November 24, 2019 (edited) 11 hours ago, Apech said: Hmmm. This is Thelemic rather than trad Egyptian. The ht is the physical body and the sah is the magically reconstituted body in the form of the mummy. Here it is presented as the union of the ka and the ba, which is also 'correct' - but the ba is male and sometimes drawn in glyphs as a penis which doesn't quite sit right with identifying it with Isis (Auset). In fact I would be tempted to reverse the correspondences of ka and ba - but hey. I think the triad of father, mother and child in relation to the right angled 3/4/5 triangle is fine - but I can't recall ever seeing an ancient Egyptian version of this - which is why I say its Thelemic. I thought physical body was the Khat ... the dead smelly fishy thing ? Anyways, I might have got ka ba around the wrong way, yes. And the resultant was , I thought 'Sahu' (running of memory here ) . Point was, I was thinking that the similarities are that a ' form of the soul' ( that is, that function that transcends death - Crowley baulked at using the term 'soul' here , too general a term, this aspect he refereed to as 'The Immortal Osiris' ) needs to be developed between a relationship of forces - it is 'developmental' as opposed to other traditions where it seems their concept of the 'soul' or parts of us that 'transcend ' we 'inherit' . A lot of this is 'Thelmic neo-Egyptian' though, as you pointed out ( that is it is 'Thelemic Philosophy' using ancient Egyptian metaphors . The triangular image I use to use for this, I cant find on the internet any more ( damn internet ! ) , it wasnt 'Thelemic' , it might have been 'Theosophical' ex De Lubics , or someone like that . I thought it showed , ka, ba , and sahu (?) as the hypotenuse ? I should check ......... hang on ....... 'Immortal soul' https://ancientegyptonline.co.uk/sahu/ Physical body https://www.britannica.com/science/death/Ancient-Egypt Khat is corruptible body in some sourcs but some seem to be saying its; khat > kha > ka ??? Its also a type of simple headwear / cloth ? and also " CAIRO – 7 April 2019: Two days after thwarting an attempt of smuggling more than 2 tons of drugs, worth LE 2 billion [$115,5 million] on board a ship in the Red Sea, security forces arrested two people trying to smuggle 295 kilograms of Khat, according to a Saturday statement. ...... I found it ! while looking up a hiero for 'khat ' ... woop woop ! I was remembering it wrong , of course. " Thanks to the Ka, the Ba of Unas, or Unas himself, transforms to become omnipotent ("truly efficient"), unfailing. The Ka of king Unas is fed by millions of recurrent offerings, and his magic is sustained by the everlasting efficiency of the sacred spells. Even if the offerings in the temple above stop, and the Ka cannot derive power from these rituals, the "heka" of the hieroglyphs is unfailing and lasts as long as they exist. By itself, the Ka is a field of power, an accumulation of efficient magical (unstoppable) energy. On its own, this Sa-field of power is quite useless, but to feed the deities and to interact with their Bas, it allows the latter to become very efficient. During life, the Ka (or vital principle) is linked with the Khat or physical body. Death releases the Ka and initiates the journey of the Ba in the Duat. The energy of the Ka derived from the spirit world, held by the ancestors. The Ba is gratified by the offerings made to the Ka, and these offerings temporarily substitute the body and allow the Ka to remain near the mummy. Then, encountering the Ka in the afterlife, the transformation of the Ba happens. http://www.sofiatopia.org/maat/wenis_commentary.htm Not 3 principles but 4 ! ... and I should have known from my own ' interaction of 3 always gives a 4th' principle (3/4)' Edited November 24, 2019 by Nungali 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted November 24, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, ilumairen said: For @ralis Hierophant HGA https://imgur.com/gallery/4UJ52he I took a pic for you. It's the Thoth Hierophant and some pertinent text regarding the HGA. If you're uncomfortable with the link (the only option I have while on a phone), I'll boot up the computer (which should provide more options for image sharing) for you. I simply prefer sitting in the open air while posting here. * * some people cut off the borders of their Thoth deck for new look ... looks pretyy good imo. Edited November 24, 2019 by Nungali Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Apech Posted November 24, 2019 2 hours ago, Nungali said: ...... (snip) I found it ! while looking up a hiero for 'khat ' ... woop woop ! I was remembering it wrong , of course. " Thanks to the Ka, the Ba of Unas, or Unas himself, transforms to become omnipotent ("truly efficient"), unfailing. The Ka of king Unas is fed by millions of recurrent offerings, and his magic is sustained by the everlasting efficiency of the sacred spells. Even if the offerings in the temple above stop, and the Ka cannot derive power from these rituals, the "heka" of the hieroglyphs is unfailing and lasts as long as they exist. By itself, the Ka is a field of power, an accumulation of efficient magical (unstoppable) energy. On its own, this Sa-field of power is quite useless, but to feed the deities and to interact with their Bas, it allows the latter to become very efficient. During life, the Ka (or vital principle) is linked with the Khat or physical body. Death releases the Ka and initiates the journey of the Ba in the Duat. The energy of the Ka derived from the spirit world, held by the ancestors. The Ba is gratified by the offerings made to the Ka, and these offerings temporarily substitute the body and allow the Ka to remain near the mummy. Then, encountering the Ka in the afterlife, the transformation of the Ba happens. http://www.sofiatopia.org/maat/wenis_commentary.htm Not 3 principles but 4 ! ... and I should have known from my own ' interaction of 3 always gives a 4th' principle (3/4)' I agree with this part more or less. Unas is one of the texts I studied for years The h in ht is a hard h - maybe like the ch in German as in 'nicht' - and hence it is often transliterated as 'khat' - so that's the same word. In fact it is sometimes rendered khatu - i.e. plural as in 'body parts'. So the physical body which the Egyptians understood anatomically quite well was seen sometimes as a collection of organs. The ka is something like the etheric or bio-magnetic body (qi body ?) which cocoons the physical body in life - at death it separates as you say as the first stage in death. It is fed (in life) by food, sex and attention - and could be compared with the Greek charisma - there was such a thing as a royal ka which kings acquired at coronation - so status is a factor here - hence why powerful men are sexy (to some). The ba is a word which is interchangeable with neter or god - so its you divine nature - it is seen as luminous and creative in that it can project images of itself - a bit like William Blake's use of the word imagination - literally image making. The ba unlike the ka does not accompany the body but is free to fly where it pleases. If things go well it will fly to the East at dawn to witness the sunrise = creation. There is another important aspect to the self which is the 'swt' or shadow - which is a conceptual mental body - it also is free to move about. The physical body protected by mummification becomes magically reconstructed and is a kind of energetic facsimile of the living body - this is the sah. When the elements or different bodies which separate at death are magically reassembled through the processes described in the various texts they form a being called the 'akh' which means 'effective spirit' - or 'horizon dweller' - this is a spiritual entity - your true self if you like which is immortal and survives both death and the second death. Becoming akh is the purpose of Egyptian practice and the texts are sometimes called 'akhifiers'. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ilumairen Posted November 25, 2019 3 hours ago, Nungali said: * Thank you! 3 hours ago, Nungali said: Regarding the kerubim of the upper corners, I'm going to type out a quote from the book I keep referring to: Quote The four Kerubic beasts represent the four fixed signs of the zodiac: Leo (the fixed sign of fire, symbolized by the lion), Scorpio (the fixed sign of water, symbolized by the eagle), Aquarius (the fixed sign of air, symbolized by a man or angel), and Taurus (the fixed sign of earth, symbolized by the bull). Tarot decks, reaching back to the earliest packs, have traditionally displayed the Kerubic beasts in the corners of various trumps (most often the Wheel of Fortune and the World). The placement of thr four beats on these old decks is almost universally consistent - the lion of Leo is in the lower right corner; the eagle of Scorpio is in the upper right; the man or angel of Aquarius is in the upper left; and the bull of Taurus is in the lower left. This is the natural order of the fixed signs as appear on the zodiacal belt, and the logical place to put them. In the Thoth Tarot, however, Harris appears to break with this tradition in her placement of the Kerubic beasts in the Hierophant and the Universe trumps. The bull and lion dutifully occupy the traditional corners, but the angel and the eagle have switched positions. Could it be that she was ignorant of the order of the signs of the zodiac and that Crowley let her get away with it in two important cards? Could it be that in the Aeon of Horus the signs of the zodiac have been rearranged? The answer to both of these questions is "no." In the New Aeon, it's not the position of the zodiac signs, but the symbol of the Kerubs that have changed. In Crowley's vision of the twenty-third Enochian Aethyr, it is revealed that the emblem for fixed-air Aquarius is now the eagle, and the emblem for fixed-water Scorpio is now the angel: [Reference page 67 of Crowley's the Vision and the Voice] What you've shared maintains the old designations. 3 hours ago, Nungali said: * some people cut off the borders of their Thoth deck for new look ... looks pretyy good imo. I couldn't do it.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted November 25, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, Apech said: I agree with this part more or less. Unas is one of the texts I studied for years The h in ht is a hard h - maybe like the ch in German as in 'nicht' - and hence it is often transliterated as 'khat' - so that's the same word. In fact it is sometimes rendered khatu - i.e. plural as in 'body parts'. So the physical body which the Egyptians understood anatomically quite well was seen sometimes as a collection of organs. The ka is something like the etheric or bio-magnetic body (qi body ?) which cocoons the physical body in life - at death it separates as you say as the first stage in death. It is fed (in life) by food, sex and attention - and could be compared with the Greek charisma - there was such a thing as a royal ka which kings acquired at coronation - so status is a factor here - hence why powerful men are sexy (to some). The ba is a word which is interchangeable with neter or god - so its you divine nature - it is seen as luminous and creative in that it can project images of itself - a bit like William Blake's use of the word imagination - literally image making. The ba unlike the ka does not accompany the body but is free to fly where it pleases. If things go well it will fly to the East at dawn to witness the sunrise = creation. There is another important aspect to the self which is the 'swt' or shadow - which is a conceptual mental body - it also is free to move about. The physical body protected by mummification becomes magically reconstructed and is a kind of energetic facsimile of the living body - this is the sah. When the elements or different bodies which separate at death are magically reassembled through the processes described in the various texts they form a being called the 'akh' which means 'effective spirit' - or 'horizon dweller' - this is a spiritual entity - your true self if you like which is immortal and survives both death and the second death. Becoming akh is the purpose of Egyptian practice and the texts are sometimes called 'akhifiers'. Excellent ! This is the process Crowley was trying to describe and the correct terms ( he used 'Immortal Osiris', astral body, 'that which perishes, 'astral death', etc . (in .... hmmmm <thinks> Liber Aleph ? Magick Without Tears ? ) Would have been a lot easier if he just wrote what you did ! Edited November 25, 2019 by Nungali 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted November 25, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, ilumairen said: Thank you! Regarding the kerubim of the upper corners, I'm going to type out a quote from the book I keep referring to: What you've shared maintains the old designations. I couldn't do it.. Its a difficult process . Best tried on a new deck anyway ; One value of this with the Thoth deck is they fit together better ( that is, 'themes' in some card's design, line work {'projective synthetic geometry'}, colour, symbols , etc , fit next to above or below other cards , like a jigsaw puzzle ) - have fun hint ; overlap some cards to see the design carry from one card to another . Edited November 25, 2019 by Nungali Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ilumairen Posted December 23, 2019 (edited) @Nungali or @Apech I was watching a Great Courses lecture on hieroglyphs in which a comment was made regarding the "t" sound ending a name/word indicating the name/word is feminine. If this is accurate, then why does Nuit's complimentary Hadit end with a "t"? Is it meant to indicate "he" as the ever center only moves through "her" the unboundaried circumference? Something to do with their union, and in turn "sex magic" (in it's "purist"/"highest" sense) as creative/manifesting source? Or is this only an odd Crowleyism which I'm reading to much into? It's a present curiosity, so I thought I'd simply ask - instead of waiting for some answer to come from somewhere. Edited December 23, 2019 by ilumairen 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Apech Posted December 23, 2019 8 hours ago, ilumairen said: @Nungali or @Apech I was watching a Great Courses lecture on hieroglyphs in which a comment was made regarding the "t" sound ending a name/word indicating the name/word is feminine. If this is accurate, then why does Nuit's complimentary Hadit end with a "t"? Is it meant to indicate "he" as the ever center only moves through "her" the unboundaried circumference? Something to do with their union, and in turn "sex magic" (in it's "purist"/"highest" sense) as creative/manifesting source? Or is this only an odd Crowleyism which I'm reading to much into? It's a present curiosity, so I thought I'd simply ask - instead of waiting for some answer to come from somewhere. It is correct that in Ancient Egyptian the 't' ending denotes the feminine. But both Nuit and Hadit are Thelemic deities - the sky goddess in Egypt was Nut and her counterpart was the earth Geb. The circle and the centre business sounds a little like Bruno or one of the Hermetic doctrines to me. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted December 23, 2019 (edited) 18 hours ago, ilumairen said: @Nungali or @Apech I was watching a Great Courses lecture on hieroglyphs in which a comment was made regarding the "t" sound ending a name/word indicating the name/word is feminine. If this is accurate, then why does Nuit's complimentary Hadit end with a "t"? Well, that isnt classical Egyptology or language , its 'Thelemic neo-Egyptology' . The word appears in variations ; Ch 1 1. Had! The manifestation of Nuit. 6. Be thou Hadit, my secret centre, my heart & my tongue! I am not even sure it has a name in Egyptian ... probably several names - these things often change in meaning and name (combinations) depending on time period and or location in ancient Egypt ; " The winged sun is one of the oldest Egyptian icons and symbols that appeared as early as the Old Kingdom. It is usually a symbol of royalty, divinity and power not only in Egypt but also in the whole Near East including the countries of Mesopotamia, Persia and Anatolia. In Egypt, it is a symbol of the soul and its eternity. It is often placed in temples as a memento to the people of their eternal nature. During the Middle Kingdom, it evolved into a symbol of protection and became a popular protective amulet during the Ptolemaic Period. Because of its solar reference, it has been connected with the sun god, Ra. However, it has been known as the Behdety, an ancient god later assimilated by Horus. With Horus, it became the Horus of Behdet.... ( this seems the closest form to the Thememic idea and Wiki cites ; Horus of Behdet (Edfu), Haidith in Greek. ) ... Similarly, it was known as the Great Flyer, which, in female form, was the cow goddess, Hathor. The idea of winged solar disc existed even during the prehistoric times in the form of a falcon wings spread all over the world. It used to be a solar barque that was attached to these wings, which later, in the Fifth dynasty, became the solar disc. During this time, it became the symbol of heavens and a solar symbol as well. At this time, Behdety became an aspect of Horus, who was then the protector of the kingship and the personification of the divine ruler of the whole Egypt. In the New Kingdom, Horus in the form of the solar disc is usually flanked by the uraeus on both sides (Nekhbet and Wadjet) when in flight towards battle. In one legend from the Ptolemaic period, Set and his allies attacked Ra after he defended Horus. This story is depicted in a grand pharaonic manner using dates and descriptions of the heroic feats and movements of armies headed by the divine ruler. In the battle of Edfu, Horus takes this form as he battles hid utmost enemy Set. It is believed that Thoth, with the aid of his wisdom and magic, turns Horus Behdety into this sun disc with the majestic outstretched wings. " http://egyptian-gods.org/egyptian-symbols-winged-sun/ I suppose we would have to look at Crowley's reason for the spelling .... Kabbalah and numerical values and all that . We also Have Nu and Nuit . And RHK is spelled in different form , with or without the 't' ending - Khu or Khut Liber NV for 'Nuit' even https://keepsilence.org/the-equinox/1.7/liber-nv.pdf Quote Is it meant to indicate "he" as the ever center only moves through "her" the unboundaried circumference? Something to do with their union, and in turn "sex magic" (in it's "purist"/"highest" sense) as creative/manifesting source? Or is this only an odd Crowleyism which I'm reading to much into? I think its an odd Crowley ism to do with 'gematria' , but your 'indication' seems valid . It is something to do with their union but in the highest - ie. on the plane of 'philosophical physics' - all manifestation must occur within the time space continuum . Quote It's a present curiosity, so I thought I'd simply ask - instead of waiting for some answer to come from somewhere. Hmmmm ..... Apech and I are somewhere ( in the time-space continuum ) , arent we ? Edited December 23, 2019 by Nungali 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
manitou Posted December 23, 2019 59 minutes ago, Nungali said: 6. Be thou Hadit, my secret centre, my heart & my tongue! What a beautiful allusion to self realization. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kyoji Posted December 23, 2019 On 11/11/2019 at 12:28 PM, Mskied said: There is no such a thing as bad poetry, or bad music, or bad art. You people are monsters. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted December 23, 2019 1 hour ago, manitou said: What a beautiful allusion to self realization. " ... These are real, these illusion: I am of them, false or frail, True or lasting, all is fusion in the spirit's shadow-veil, Till the Knowledge-Lotus flowering hides the world beneath its stem; Neither I, nor God life-showering, find a counterpart in them. As a spirit in a vision shows a countenance of fear, Laughs the looker to derision, only comes to disappear, Gods and mortals, mind and matter, in the glowing bud dissever: Vein from vein they rend and shatter, and are nothingness for ever. ... " 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Apech Posted December 24, 2019 17 hours ago, Nungali said: Well, that isnt classical Egyptology or language , its 'Thelemic neo-Egyptology' . The word appears in variations ; Ch 1 1. Had! The manifestation of Nuit. 6. Be thou Hadit, my secret centre, my heart & my tongue! I am not even sure it has a name in Egyptian ... probably several names - these things often change in meaning and name (combinations) depending on time period and or location in ancient Egypt ; " The winged sun is one of the oldest Egyptian icons and symbols that appeared as early as the Old Kingdom. It is usually a symbol of royalty, divinity and power not only in Egypt but also in the whole Near East including the countries of Mesopotamia, Persia and Anatolia. In Egypt, it is a symbol of the soul and its eternity. It is often placed in temples as a memento to the people of their eternal nature. During the Middle Kingdom, it evolved into a symbol of protection and became a popular protective amulet during the Ptolemaic Period. Because of its solar reference, it has been connected with the sun god, Ra. However, it has been known as the Behdety, an ancient god later assimilated by Horus. With Horus, it became the Horus of Behdet.... ( this seems the closest form to the Thememic idea and Wiki cites ; Horus of Behdet (Edfu), Haidith in Greek. ) ... Similarly, it was known as the Great Flyer, which, in female form, was the cow goddess, Hathor. The idea of winged solar disc existed even during the prehistoric times in the form of a falcon wings spread all over the world. It used to be a solar barque that was attached to these wings, which later, in the Fifth dynasty, became the solar disc. During this time, it became the symbol of heavens and a solar symbol as well. At this time, Behdety became an aspect of Horus, who was then the protector of the kingship and the personification of the divine ruler of the whole Egypt. In the New Kingdom, Horus in the form of the solar disc is usually flanked by the uraeus on both sides (Nekhbet and Wadjet) when in flight towards battle. In one legend from the Ptolemaic period, Set and his allies attacked Ra after he defended Horus. This story is depicted in a grand pharaonic manner using dates and descriptions of the heroic feats and movements of armies headed by the divine ruler. In the battle of Edfu, Horus takes this form as he battles hid utmost enemy Set. It is believed that Thoth, with the aid of his wisdom and magic, turns Horus Behdety into this sun disc with the majestic outstretched wings. " http://egyptian-gods.org/egyptian-symbols-winged-sun/ I suppose we would have to look at Crowley's reason for the spelling .... Kabbalah and numerical values and all that . We also Have Nu and Nuit . And RHK is spelled in different form , with or without the 't' ending - Khu or Khut Liber NV for 'Nuit' even https://keepsilence.org/the-equinox/1.7/liber-nv.pdf I think its an odd Crowley ism to do with 'gematria' , but your 'indication' seems valid . It is something to do with their union but in the highest - ie. on the plane of 'philosophical physics' - all manifestation must occur within the time space continuum . Hmmmm ..... Apech and I are somewhere ( in the time-space continuum ) , arent we ? ... 17 hours ago, Nungali said: Ah ok so Hadit is Bedheti ... I don't think Hadit is an Egyptian word. According to Griffiths (I think) the name Bedhedti is spelt with a glyph of a moveable throne - because this was originally a god of the North which moved South to Edfu. But I'm not sure everyone accepts this. I read a very interesting paper on the winged disk but unfortunately I can't find it so I can't link to it. The winged disk was essentially a protective deity often placed on door lintels and the like to ward off bad influence. Essentially it is a kind of fusion of Horus and Ra - or indeed the eye of horus/ra (although the ye was female !?). hadit sounds a little Hebrew to me - is that where he got it from? I would suggest the Nuit/Hadit thing is about the idea of the unified being (the one) in the continuum of consciousness = the star filled sky???????? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted December 24, 2019 Depends on what mood he was in . Sometimes Nuit is seen as 'all the stars and the night sky ' - " I am the naked brilliance of the voluptuous night-sky." and at others , a 'void' with each star is 'an Hadit' or 'the core of every star' or Nuit as 'all / infinite space and stars' (all the stars and matter of the Universe) and Hadit as 'motion' or the motion of all the matter - the 'force of going' - ' the God force is in the going - not the 'being' (static) The Sexual Duality Of The Universe "Had! The manifestation of Nuit." In its first sentence, the magickal Book of the Law, or Aleister Crowley's great Liber Al vel Legis, suggests a sexual duality in the universe. This will be shocking news to the slaves of religious systems that teach male dominance and project the figure of a single masculine God. Nuit, the feminine side of the great intelligence we recognize as creation, states in verse 21: "I am nothing: they do not see me. They are as upon the earth; I am Heaven and there is no other God than me, and my lord Hadit." She goes on to say in Verse 22: "I am Infinite Space, and the Infinite Stars thereof . . ." Hadit identifies himself in Chapter 2, Verses 2-4: "I, Hadit, am the complement of Nu, my bride. I am not extended, and Khabs is the name of my House. In the sphere I am everwhere the centre, as she, the circumference, is nowhere found. Yet she shall be known & I never." Crowley, in his comments in The Law Is For All, notes that: "Nuit is matter, Hadit is motion . . . They are the Tao and Teh of Chinese philosophy. . . Our central truth--beyond other philosophies--is that these two infinities cannot exist apart." That life is the result of the union of these two energies is stated in the collection of declarations by Nuit, all found in the first chapter: "I am above you and in you. My ecstasy is in yours. My joy is to see your joy "They shall gather my children into their fold; they shall bring the glory of the stars into the hearts of men. "And the sign shall be my ecstasy, the consciousness of the continuity of existence, the omnipresence of my body... "For I am divided for love's sake, for the chance of union." Contemporary author Robert Anton Wilson notes in his remarkable work, The Cosmic Trigger, that the verses seem to support Timothy Leary's theory that higher intelligence is "divided." He wrote that Leary believed this intelligence sends "DNA seed to fertilize every womb-planet in the galaxy, 'for the sake of union,'" and return of the children after they have evolved into higher states of consciousness. The entire sentence, "Had! The manifestation of Nuit," must be studied along with the opening sentence in Chapter 2, which states: "Nu! The hiding of Hadit." Thus we have the statement that Hadit is involved in the revealing of Nuit. And that Nuit is linked to the hiding of Hadit. But what does this mean? Crowley explains that "Nu conceals Had because He is everywhere in the Infinite, and She manifests Him for the same reason . . . Every individual manifests the whole; and the whole conceals every individual. The soul interprets the universe; and the universe veils the soul. Nature understands herself by becoming self-conscious in her units; and the consciousness loses its sense of separateness by dissolution in Her." In this statement we have an understanding of the reason for human existence. That we were created so that our bicameral (two-part) brains could create a collective consciousness, or a warehouse of information assessable to all living creatures, is a way for nature, or the intelligence that we call God, to be conscious of itself. That we were created with dual parts; two halves of the brain, two eyes, two ears, two arms, two legs, should be a constant reminder that the universe looks upon life in a dual way. Why should it be a surprise that the universe portrays itself as both male and female? Nearly all of nature shows itself to us in twos. Most animals are either male or female. Like us, they have two eyes, two ears, two wings, two front and two hind quarters. And like humans, it takes a union of both male and female to produce offspring. Nuit identifies herself as the numbers six and fifty. She instructs us in verse 25: "Divide, add, multiply and understand." Thus we are presented one of the many mysteries within the Book of the Law. Crowley attempted to follow these instructions and concluded that his descriptions were not reaching the bottom of this puzzle. Crowley began by adding the numbers to reach 56. Then he divided 50 by 6 to get 0.12. He concluded that the "0" represented Nuit, or the circumference of the universe. The period "." was representative of Hadit. The meaning of the number 12 is more difficult to grasp. Crowley broke the numbers down to "1," saying he thought it represented Unity proceeding, or Ra-Hoor-Khuit; and "2" appearing as the Coptic H, representing the Arabic figure 2, representing the Breath of Life and Human Consciousness. "O Nuit, continuous one of Heaven, let it be ever thus; that men speak not of Thee as One but as None; and let them speak not of thee at all, since thou art continuous!" If you simply add the numbers 5 and 6 you get 11, a powerful number in occult circles. In Chapter 2, Hadit explains: "For I am perfect, being Not; and my number is nine by the fools; but with the just I am eight, and one in eight: Which is vital, for I am none indeed. The Empress and the King are not of me; for there is a further secret. I am the Empress & the Hierophant. Thus eleven, as my bride is eleven." Understanding the full extent of either Nuit or Hadit is like coming to a complete understanding of God. It may not be possible for mere mortals. Only through turning on both hemispheres of our brains can we hope to get close. http://perdurabo10.tripod.com/themindofjamesdonahue/id342.html 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted December 24, 2019 (edited) For more in depth analysis https://bethelkhem.wordpress.com/2016/12/24/notes-on-the-words-of-power-of-the-book-of-the-law/ - this guy seems pretty good https://bethelkhem.wordpress.com/2016/06/26/the-key-of-it-all/ " ...Putting all of this together, we get the following: The Way of Enlightenment consists in the mental self-unification (samadhi) that confers illumination by “stopping thinking” and thus transcending the intellectual faculty altogether. The True Will is realized and expressed in pure conceptless spontaneous action without intention, effort or attachment (cf. Laozi’s wu-wei). Realization is not passive, it is active and dynamic. This is the True or Enlightened Will. " The 'issue' with Crowley, in his day to day life, seemed to be a sometimes confusion between the above expressions and the expressions of his 'unresolved psychological complexes ' . Spoiler Edited December 24, 2019 by Nungali 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Apech Posted December 25, 2019 16 hours ago, Nungali said: In the sphere I am everwhere the centre, as she, the circumference, is nowhere found. That's a Bruno quote. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Apech Posted December 25, 2019 16 hours ago, Nungali said: For more in depth analysis https://bethelkhem.wordpress.com/2016/12/24/notes-on-the-words-of-power-of-the-book-of-the-law/ - this guy seems pretty good https://bethelkhem.wordpress.com/2016/06/26/the-key-of-it-all/ " ...Putting all of this together, we get the following: The Way of Enlightenment consists in the mental self-unification (samadhi) that confers illumination by “stopping thinking” and thus transcending the intellectual faculty altogether. The True Will is realized and expressed in pure conceptless spontaneous action without intention, effort or attachment (cf. Laozi’s wu-wei). Realization is not passive, it is active and dynamic. This is the True or Enlightened Will. " The 'issue' with Crowley, in his day to day life, seemed to be a sometimes confusion between the above expressions and the expressions of his 'unresolved psychological complexes ' . Reveal hidden contents I agree with this apart from the 'stopping thinking' thing. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
manitou Posted December 25, 2019 I think he's using the 'stop thinking' thing as the reward for years of meditation, where one has control over how much chatter is allowed. And a different type of chatter it is. As I see it, the only time wu-wei is effective is if ego is totally and temporarily removed, where you can see with real clarity, where your own conditioning doesn't come into play in how you see. 21 hours ago, Nungali said: " I am the naked brilliance of the voluptuous night-sky." and at others , a 'void' with each star is 'an Hadit' or 'the core of every star' or Nuit as 'all / infinite space and stars' (all the stars and matter of the Universe) and Hadit as 'motion' or the motion of all the matter - the 'force of going' - ' the God force is in the going - not the 'being' (static) The going and the being. This sounds so much like quantum physics to me. The particle (being) and the wave (going). 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted December 25, 2019 5 hours ago, Apech said: That's a Bruno quote. Is it ? “God is an infinite sphere, the center of which is everywhere, the circumference nowhere.” — Hermes Trismegistus or possibly Aristotle, Book of the 24 Philosophers, 12th Century “God is an intelligible sphere, whose center is everywhere, and whose circumference is nowhere.” — Alain of Lille “By God’s power, presence, and essence, God is the One whose center is everywhere and whose circumference is nowhere. God exists uncircumscribed in everything. God is, therefore, all inclusive. God is the essence of everything. God is most perfect and immense: within all things, but not enclosed; outside all things, but not excluded; above all things, but not aloof; below all things, but not debased. Finally, therefore, this God is all in all…. Consequently, from him, through him and in him, all things exist.” — St. Bonaventure, 13th Century “God is an infinite circle whose center is everywhere and whose circumference is nowhere.” — Nicholas of Cusa (1401 – 1464) “We can state with certainty that the universe is all center, or that the center of the universe is everywhere and the circumference nowhere.” — Giordano Bruno, 1584 “The soul is not a circle in the sense of the geometric figure but in that it at once contains the Primal Nature as centre and is contained by it as circumference [… We] hold through our own centre to the centre of all the centres, just as the centres of the great circles of a sphere coincide with that of the sphere to which all belong. Thus we are secure.” — Plotinus “The whole visible world is only an imperceptible atom in the ample bosom of nature. No idea approaches it. We may enlarge our conceptions beyond all imaginable space; we only produce atoms in comparison with the reality of things. It is an infinite sphere, the center of which is everywhere, the circumference nowhere. In short, it is the greatest sensible mark of the almighty power of God that imagination loses itself in that thought.” — Pascal “O God, thou art an intelligible sphere, whose centre is everywhere, whose circumference is nowhere but in thyself.” — Joseph Hall, sermon, 1600s “God is that Sacred Circle of All-Being, of Infiniteness, of Eternity, whose Center is everywhere, in the smallest Point of Things; whose Circumference is no where bounded.” — Peter Sterry, The Appearance of God to man, 1710 “God is a sphere whose center is everywhere and whose circumference is nowhere.” The Blessed and Boundless God, George Swinnock “O Zarathustra… to those who think as we do, all things themselves are dancing: they come and offer their hands and laugh and flee and come back. Everything goes, everything comes back; eternally rolls the wheel of being. Everything dies, everything blossoms again; eternally runs the year of being. Everything breaks, everything is joined anew; eternally the same house is being built. Everything parts, everything greets every other thing again; eternally the ring of being remains faithful to itself. In every Now, being begins; round every Here rolls the sphere There. The center is everywhere. Bent is the path of eternity.” — Friedrich Nietzsche, Thus Spoke Zarathustra, a Book for All and None (1884) “The origins of the metaphor of the infinite sphere have been traced to Empedocles through the writings of thirteenth century encyclopaedist Vincent de Beauvais, although it can no longer be found in the fragmentary remains of his poetry.” — Brian Parshall “The Library is a sphere whose exact center is any hexagon and whose circumference is unattainable.” — Jorge Luis Borges “Tao is always nameless. Small as it is in its Primal Simplicity, It is inferior to nothing in the world.” — Tao Te Ching “God is an intelligible sphere — a sphere known to mind, not to the senses — whose center is everywhere and whose circumference nowhere.” — Joseph Campbell, Power of Myth “By Me, in My unmanifested form, this entire universe is pervaded. All beings are in Me, but I am not in them. And yet everything that is created does not rest in Me. Behold My mystic opulence! Although I am the maintainer of all living entities and although I am everywhere, I am not a part of this cosmic manifestation, for My Self is the very source of creation.” — Bhagavad-Gîtâ “I am smaller than the atom. So also I am greater than the Universal Self.” — Kaivalya Upanishad “He is Atman within the heart, smaller than a grain of rice, smaller than a grain of barley, smaller than a mustard seed, smaller than a grain of millet; He is Atman within the heart, greater than the earth, greater than the mid-region, greater than heaven, greater than all these worlds.” — Chândogya Upanishad “The kingdom of heaven is like to a grain of mustard seed, which a man took, and sowed in his field: Which indeed is the least of all seeds: but when it is grown, it is the greatest among herbs, and becometh a tree, so that the birds of the air come and lodge in the branches thereof.” — Book of Matthew “Allah, in the same way as he is ‘the First one and the Last one’ (El-Awwal wa El-Akher), is also ‘the Outside and the Inside’ (El-Zâher wa El-Bâten), because nothing that exists can be outside of Him, and in Him only is contained all reality, because He is Himself the absolute Reality, the total Truth: Hoa El-Haqq.” — René Guénon “In its depths I saw internalized, bound with love in one volume, what through the universe becomes unsewn quires: substances and accidents and their modes as it were conflated together, in such away that what I describe is a simple light… In that Light one becomes such that it is impossible ever to consent to turn away from it toward any other sight, because goodness, the object of the will, is all gathered there, and what is perfect there falls short elsewhere… In the profound and clear Subsistence of the deep Light I saw three circles, of three colors and of one circumference, and one seemed refected from the other like a rainbow from a rainbow, and the third seemed fire breathing equally from both.” — Dante, Paradiso, Canto 33 “Thus God is the center of all, because He is so in all things that He is more internal to each thing than it is to itself. He is also the world’s circumference because, in existing outside all things, He so transcends all things that His dignity immeasurably excels the highest summit of each thing. Again, He is greatest of all in power to the extent He is least of all in quantity, if this is permissable way of putting it. As He is the center, He is in all, but as the circumference, He is outside all; in all, but not included because He is also the circumference; outside all too but not excluded because He is also the center. So what is God? One might call Him a spiritual circle whose center is everywhere, whose circumference is nowhere.” — Marsilio Ficino, Platonic Theology, XVII, 3 “Now, my friends, you may depart, and may that intellectual sphere whose centre is everywhere and circumference nowhere, whom we call GOD, keep you in his almighty protection.” — Gargantua and Pantagruel, Francois Rabelais “Our soul delighteth to disport itself and is well pleased in that frolic to take a review of its native country, which is the heavens, where it receiveth a most notable participation of its first beginning with an imbuement from its divine source, and in contemplation of that infinite and intellectual sphere, whereof the centre is everywhere, and the circumference in no place of the universal world, to wit, God.” — Gargantua and Pantagruel, by Francois Rabelais “But it is true without fail that she whose womb swelled understood more than Plato, for she knew from the time that she bore Him and rejoiced in doing so, that He was the wondrous sphere that can have no end, that shoots its center through every place and whose circumference has no fixed place. She knew that He was the wondrous triangle whose unity creates three angles, but whose three angles make only one whole. He is the triangular circle, the circular triangle who harbored in the virgin. Plato did not know as much as that; he did not see that the triple unity in this simple trinity, the sovereign deity clothed in a human skin, is God who is called Creator.” — The Romance of the Rose, Guillaume de Lorris and Jean de Meun, 1230-1275 “You are a wheel whose substance alone exists, the diameter of the circle without circumference creating a plane by its rotation around its median point. The substance of your diameter is a Point.” — Alfred Jarry, 1869 “God is the tangential point between zero and infinity.” –- Alfred Jarry, 1898. “There’s a crack in everything. That’s how the light gets in.” — Leonard Cohen. (It helps to know he was familiar with Lurianic Kabbalah.) “I had a feeling once about Mathematics, that I saw it all—Depth beyond depth was revealed to me—the Byss and the Abyss. I saw, as one might see the transit of Venus—or even the Lord Mayor’s Show, a quantity passing through infinity and changing its sign from plus to minus. I saw exactly how it happened and why the tergiversation was inevitable: and how the one step involved all the others. It was like politics. But it was after dinner and I let it go!” — Winston Churchill, My Early Life, 1930 “Nothing more exists, nothing more matters, for whom saw the darkness in the gap between the things.” — Jorge de Sena “That which permeates all, which nothing transcends and which, like the universal space around us, fills everything completely from within and without, that Supreme non-dual Brahman — that thou art.” — Sankaracharya “That in whom reside all beings and who resides in all beings, who is the giver of grace to all, the Supreme Soul of the universe, the limitless being — I am that.” — Amritbindu Upanishad https://www.clearhat.org/2018/02/20/god-is-an-infinite-sphere-the-center-of-which-is-everywhere-the-circumference-nowhere/ 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted December 25, 2019 26 minutes ago, manitou said: I think he's using the 'stop thinking' thing as the reward for years of meditation, where one has control over how much chatter is allowed. And a different type of chatter it is. As I see it, the only time wu-wei is effective is if ego is totally and temporarily removed, where you can see with real clarity, where your own conditioning doesn't come into play in how you see. The going and the being. This sounds so much like quantum physics to me. The particle (being) and the wave (going). A wave is just one particle saying goodbye to another Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kyoji Posted December 25, 2019 5 hours ago, Apech said: I agree with this apart from the 'stopping thinking' thing. what makes you disagree with the 'stopping thinking' ? in my experience, the more you can drop incessant egoic thinking, the more you can let a far greater intelligence work through you. no thinking required. thinking only inhibits this. curious to hear your perspective :-) 24 minutes ago, manitou said: The going and the being. This sounds so much like quantum physics to me. The particle (being) and the wave (going). Sounds like it to me too @manitou I am rather physics illiterate but so much of the little i have read gives me chills because of the almost uncanny similarities to things usually considered woo woo.. it is just a different language i am not quite familiar with yet ! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nungali Posted December 25, 2019 I think he means, that some thoughts are useful and we must think, otherwise we just zombies and loose the mental facilities Crowley (and many others) advocated a balanced perspective of the 4 powers , based on the elements ; fire water air earth, with air being rational and structured thought ; 16. To obtain Magical Power, learn to control thought; admit only those ideas that are in harmony with the end desired, and not every stray and contradictory Idea that presents itself. 17. Fixed thought is a means to an end. Therefore pay attention to the power of silent thought and meditation. The material act is but the outward expression of thy thought, and therefore hath it been said that “the thought of foolishness is sin.” Thought is the commencement of action, and if a chance thought can produce much effect, what cannot fixed thought do? 18. Therefore, as hath already been said, Establish thyself firmly in the equilibrium of forces, in the centre of the Cross of the Elements ... - Liber Librae 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Apech Posted December 25, 2019 2 hours ago, Nungali said: Is it ? “God is an infinite sphere, the center of which is everywhere, the circumference nowhere.” — Hermes Trismegistus or possibly Aristotle, Book of the 24 Philosophers, 12th Century “God is an intelligible sphere, whose center is everywhere, and whose circumference is nowhere.” — Alain of Lille “By God’s power, presence, and essence, God is the One whose center is everywhere and whose circumference is nowhere. God exists uncircumscribed in everything. God is, therefore, all inclusive. God is the essence of everything. God is most perfect and immense: within all things, but not enclosed; outside all things, but not excluded; above all things, but not aloof; below all things, but not debased. Finally, therefore, this God is all in all…. Consequently, from him, through him and in him, all things exist.” — St. Bonaventure, 13th Century “God is an infinite circle whose center is everywhere and whose circumference is nowhere.” — Nicholas of Cusa (1401 – 1464) “We can state with certainty that the universe is all center, or that the center of the universe is everywhere and the circumference nowhere.” — Giordano Bruno, 1584 “The soul is not a circle in the sense of the geometric figure but in that it at once contains the Primal Nature as centre and is contained by it as circumference [… We] hold through our own centre to the centre of all the centres, just as the centres of the great circles of a sphere coincide with that of the sphere to which all belong. Thus we are secure.” — Plotinus “The whole visible world is only an imperceptible atom in the ample bosom of nature. No idea approaches it. We may enlarge our conceptions beyond all imaginable space; we only produce atoms in comparison with the reality of things. It is an infinite sphere, the center of which is everywhere, the circumference nowhere. In short, it is the greatest sensible mark of the almighty power of God that imagination loses itself in that thought.” — Pascal “O God, thou art an intelligible sphere, whose centre is everywhere, whose circumference is nowhere but in thyself.” — Joseph Hall, sermon, 1600s “God is that Sacred Circle of All-Being, of Infiniteness, of Eternity, whose Center is everywhere, in the smallest Point of Things; whose Circumference is no where bounded.” — Peter Sterry, The Appearance of God to man, 1710 “God is a sphere whose center is everywhere and whose circumference is nowhere.” The Blessed and Boundless God, George Swinnock “O Zarathustra… to those who think as we do, all things themselves are dancing: they come and offer their hands and laugh and flee and come back. Everything goes, everything comes back; eternally rolls the wheel of being. Everything dies, everything blossoms again; eternally runs the year of being. Everything breaks, everything is joined anew; eternally the same house is being built. Everything parts, everything greets every other thing again; eternally the ring of being remains faithful to itself. In every Now, being begins; round every Here rolls the sphere There. The center is everywhere. Bent is the path of eternity.” — Friedrich Nietzsche, Thus Spoke Zarathustra, a Book for All and None (1884) “The origins of the metaphor of the infinite sphere have been traced to Empedocles through the writings of thirteenth century encyclopaedist Vincent de Beauvais, although it can no longer be found in the fragmentary remains of his poetry.” — Brian Parshall “The Library is a sphere whose exact center is any hexagon and whose circumference is unattainable.” — Jorge Luis Borges “Tao is always nameless. Small as it is in its Primal Simplicity, It is inferior to nothing in the world.” — Tao Te Ching “God is an intelligible sphere — a sphere known to mind, not to the senses — whose center is everywhere and whose circumference nowhere.” — Joseph Campbell, Power of Myth “By Me, in My unmanifested form, this entire universe is pervaded. All beings are in Me, but I am not in them. And yet everything that is created does not rest in Me. Behold My mystic opulence! Although I am the maintainer of all living entities and although I am everywhere, I am not a part of this cosmic manifestation, for My Self is the very source of creation.” — Bhagavad-Gîtâ “I am smaller than the atom. So also I am greater than the Universal Self.” — Kaivalya Upanishad “He is Atman within the heart, smaller than a grain of rice, smaller than a grain of barley, smaller than a mustard seed, smaller than a grain of millet; He is Atman within the heart, greater than the earth, greater than the mid-region, greater than heaven, greater than all these worlds.” — Chândogya Upanishad “The kingdom of heaven is like to a grain of mustard seed, which a man took, and sowed in his field: Which indeed is the least of all seeds: but when it is grown, it is the greatest among herbs, and becometh a tree, so that the birds of the air come and lodge in the branches thereof.” — Book of Matthew “Allah, in the same way as he is ‘the First one and the Last one’ (El-Awwal wa El-Akher), is also ‘the Outside and the Inside’ (El-Zâher wa El-Bâten), because nothing that exists can be outside of Him, and in Him only is contained all reality, because He is Himself the absolute Reality, the total Truth: Hoa El-Haqq.” — René Guénon “In its depths I saw internalized, bound with love in one volume, what through the universe becomes unsewn quires: substances and accidents and their modes as it were conflated together, in such away that what I describe is a simple light… In that Light one becomes such that it is impossible ever to consent to turn away from it toward any other sight, because goodness, the object of the will, is all gathered there, and what is perfect there falls short elsewhere… In the profound and clear Subsistence of the deep Light I saw three circles, of three colors and of one circumference, and one seemed refected from the other like a rainbow from a rainbow, and the third seemed fire breathing equally from both.” — Dante, Paradiso, Canto 33 “Thus God is the center of all, because He is so in all things that He is more internal to each thing than it is to itself. He is also the world’s circumference because, in existing outside all things, He so transcends all things that His dignity immeasurably excels the highest summit of each thing. Again, He is greatest of all in power to the extent He is least of all in quantity, if this is permissable way of putting it. As He is the center, He is in all, but as the circumference, He is outside all; in all, but not included because He is also the circumference; outside all too but not excluded because He is also the center. So what is God? One might call Him a spiritual circle whose center is everywhere, whose circumference is nowhere.” — Marsilio Ficino, Platonic Theology, XVII, 3 “Now, my friends, you may depart, and may that intellectual sphere whose centre is everywhere and circumference nowhere, whom we call GOD, keep you in his almighty protection.” — Gargantua and Pantagruel, Francois Rabelais “Our soul delighteth to disport itself and is well pleased in that frolic to take a review of its native country, which is the heavens, where it receiveth a most notable participation of its first beginning with an imbuement from its divine source, and in contemplation of that infinite and intellectual sphere, whereof the centre is everywhere, and the circumference in no place of the universal world, to wit, God.” — Gargantua and Pantagruel, by Francois Rabelais “But it is true without fail that she whose womb swelled understood more than Plato, for she knew from the time that she bore Him and rejoiced in doing so, that He was the wondrous sphere that can have no end, that shoots its center through every place and whose circumference has no fixed place. She knew that He was the wondrous triangle whose unity creates three angles, but whose three angles make only one whole. He is the triangular circle, the circular triangle who harbored in the virgin. Plato did not know as much as that; he did not see that the triple unity in this simple trinity, the sovereign deity clothed in a human skin, is God who is called Creator.” — The Romance of the Rose, Guillaume de Lorris and Jean de Meun, 1230-1275 “You are a wheel whose substance alone exists, the diameter of the circle without circumference creating a plane by its rotation around its median point. The substance of your diameter is a Point.” — Alfred Jarry, 1869 “God is the tangential point between zero and infinity.” –- Alfred Jarry, 1898. “There’s a crack in everything. That’s how the light gets in.” — Leonard Cohen. (It helps to know he was familiar with Lurianic Kabbalah.) “I had a feeling once about Mathematics, that I saw it all—Depth beyond depth was revealed to me—the Byss and the Abyss. I saw, as one might see the transit of Venus—or even the Lord Mayor’s Show, a quantity passing through infinity and changing its sign from plus to minus. I saw exactly how it happened and why the tergiversation was inevitable: and how the one step involved all the others. It was like politics. But it was after dinner and I let it go!” — Winston Churchill, My Early Life, 1930 “Nothing more exists, nothing more matters, for whom saw the darkness in the gap between the things.” — Jorge de Sena “That which permeates all, which nothing transcends and which, like the universal space around us, fills everything completely from within and without, that Supreme non-dual Brahman — that thou art.” — Sankaracharya “That in whom reside all beings and who resides in all beings, who is the giver of grace to all, the Supreme Soul of the universe, the limitless being — I am that.” — Amritbindu Upanishad https://www.clearhat.org/2018/02/20/god-is-an-infinite-sphere-the-center-of-which-is-everywhere-the-circumference-nowhere/ Obviously ... what I meant was everyone except Bruno!!!!!!!!! (I knew it was a quote though ). 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites