Students of Jerry Alan Johnson

[Earl Grey]

3 minutes ago, Zork said:

Too late moron. I already have a life.

Now stfu and get out of the thread. You don't know anything about christ and you have no authority to speak on behalf of taoism.

YES, NOW LET US RESPECT THE OP AND STAY ON TOPIC ABOUT JAJ INSTEAD OF THE GARBAGE EVERYONE HAD TO ENDURE THE PAST COUPLE PAGES.

[Zork]

Why does JAJ have a seven year program? What does the curriculum include?

It is a significant amount of time and money to invest. One could get a degree and postgraduate studies in that time.

[silent thunder]

11 minutes ago, Zork said:

One could get a degree and postgraduate studies in that time.

That sounds exactly like what Jerry offers in the seven year program.

Postgraduate level focus in the arts of his lineage.

[Taomeow]

1 minute ago, Zork said:

Why does JAJ have a seven year program? What does the curriculum include?

It is a significant amount of time and money to invest. One could get a degree and postgraduate studies in that time.

 

1.  Because he can.  He is in a rather unique position, a native English speaker willing and able to offer an authentic in-depth taoist program, organized into a step by step curriculum and taught in English -- something no institution or individual is currently offering at this scale and depth.  Also because it is a massive program impossible to complete in a shorter period.  In fact, seven years is pretty high pace -- a more realistic time frame would be 20 or 30 years.

 

2. The curriculum is posted on his site if I remember correctly. 

 

3. Yes, one could get a degree and postgraduate studies in that time, absolutely.  Nearly everybody who will undertake a serious investment into a serious education will do just that.   Exceedingly few will be able to invest the time and money into JAJ's program. But nothing authentically taoist has ever been a quickie-mart mass-produced endeavor.  It is geared toward the rare individual who is willing, able and predestined -- but even among those, there will be dropouts, for various personal, interpersonal, financial, emotional, ideological reasons or for reasons they may not predict until they are face to face with them.  So, not a very realistic option to complete the program for someone merely "interested to learn more" who is not being dragged into the thick of it by the hand of destiny.   

[Zork]

@Taomeow

I am not being critical but 7 years is a long time because, you know, "life happens" and things get unpredictable.

Life isn't only about time and money.

11 hours ago, silent thunder said:

Postgraduate level focus in the arts of his lineage.

And how do you know who is at graduate level then?

 

[Taomeow]

2 hours ago, Zork said:

@Taomeow

I am not being critical but 7 years is a long time because, you know, "life happens" and things get unpredictable.

Life isn't only about time and money.

 

 

Yeah?  And what else?  

 

Yes, of course, not just time and money, I mentioned that.  Here's one scenario, e.g.: what if someone commits to becoming a master of, say, healing qigong only to realize down the road that healing is not her thing really?   Not in terms of skill, level, commitment etc. but in terms of what calls out to her heart, "come, let's do it, you want to be doing just that"?..  Say she has had some success helping herself, helping people close to her who are open to being helped in this way (not everybody is, not even among the loved ones), and that's what caused her to decide to learn healing qigong and invest time and money and uncertainty and everything else one might have to invest --- and then -- she is educated and trained and not interested anymore, not ready to keep doing this outside a dire emergency.  What is she going to do with her mastery?  Go through the motions?  I'm not describing a hypothetical scenario, I know a very high level master  who can, but won't, heal anyone.  He'll teach someone healthy, he'll help someone unwell to learn to help themselves -- but he won't lift a finger, much less his qi, to do any external qigong for anyone.  (The opposite scenario -- someone can't do shit but wants to do "whatever" regardless, wants "me-doing-it" admired -- I find a lot more disturbing and way more prevalent.) 

 

On the other hand, who knows how deep any rabbit hole of this nature might prove.  "The road is overcome by the one walking it."  I, e.g., never knew, when I started taiji and just took it one day at a time along with whatever else life kept throwing at me (and it kept throwing more than anyone's fair share) that fifteen years later l would always feel I've only just began "getting it," still won't lose that kid in a candy store vibe.  If it's hard work and uncertainty and what not, that's fine -- but if it's hard work and uncertainty and no awe, then it's not worth it.  Whatever it is.  If you don't feel in your very bones it's awesome, it's not worth the commitment.  Nothing is worth doing if it's not done for its own sake rather than for the sake of "me doing it."  

[Zork]

1 hour ago, Taomeow said:

Yes, of course, not just time and money, I mentioned that. 

It could be anything really, from changing jobs, to changing partners, to having kids. to losing relatives. Anything can happen.

 

1 hour ago, Taomeow said:

Not in terms of skill, level, commitment etc. but in terms of what calls out to her heart, "come, let's do it, you want to be doing just that"?..  Say she has had some success helping herself, helping people close to her who are open to being helped in this way (not everybody is, not even among the loved ones), and that's what caused her to decide to learn healing qigong and invest time and money and uncertainty and everything else one might have to invest --- and then -- she is educated and trained and not interested anymore, not ready to keep doing this outside a dire emergency.  What is she going to do with her mastery?  Go through the motions?  I'm not describing a hypothetical scenario, I know a very high level master  who can, but won't, heal anyone.  He'll teach someone healthy, he'll help someone unwell to learn to help themselves -- but he won't lift a finger, much less his qi, to do any external qigong for anyone.  (The opposite scenario -- someone can't do shit but wants to do "whatever" regardless, wants "me-doing-it" admired -- I find a lot more disturbing and way more prevalent.) 

Losing motivation is common. It doesn't necessarily come from lack of character. Personalities change in time. That is normal. Yours truly hasn't changed that much but i can't say that i am the same person i was 7 years ago so.....

 

1 hour ago, Taomeow said:

On the other hand, who knows how deep any rabbit hole of this nature might prove.  "The road is overcome by the one walking it."  I, e.g., never knew, when I started taiji and just took it one day at a time along with whatever else life kept throwing at me (and it kept throwing more than anyone's fair share) that fifteen years later l would always feel I've only just began "getting it," still won't lose that kid in a candy store vibe.  If it's hard work and uncertainty and what not, that's fine -- but if it's hard work and uncertainty and no awe, then it's not worth it.  Whatever it is.  If you don't feel in your very bones it's awesome, it's not worth the commitment.  Nothing is worth doing if it's not done for its own sake rather than for the sake of "me doing it."  

You know i had a conversation with my teacher a few days ago on how to judge if one makes progress.

When training alone it is very easy to feel that one isn't making progress.

The magic won't be there every day. I am happy that for you it is there.

Speaking for myself all i have seen the last 2 years are some real WTF moments but nothing linear or expected.

[silent thunder]

11 hours ago, Zork said:

<snip>

And how do you know who is at graduate level then?

 

I don't... and I suggest leaving that to Jerry, the one offering the teachings, to vet potential of prospective students.

Unless speculation is your entertainment... then... enjoy!

Edited November 20, 2019 by silent thunder
edit out unrelated quote material

[Zork]

12 hours ago, silent thunder said:

I don't... and I suggest leaving that to Jerry, the one offering the teachings, to vet potential of prospective students.

Unless speculation is your entertainment... then... enjoy!

hmm maybe i wasn't clear. Post graduate makes a division between graduates and post graduates by definition.

What leads you to make that division in the first place?

The way i view qigong or energy work in general has no similarity to rigid separation of disciplines like that. If you have reason to believe otherwise please share your thoughts.

[silent thunder]

Hey Zork.

 

It was an analogy.  A direct comparison.  There are as I experience it, many similarities in the pursuit of long term study within a lineage and in a bachelor/master's/ph.d program.  Comparing the depth of commitment and dedicated study required to master a deep and complex topic, no matter the subject is similar in many aspects.

 

The particulars, complexities and subtleties of Neigong and Weigong are myriad even from my admittedly limited exposure.  These are broken up into many areas of study with some being prerequisite of mastery before the next levels are unveiled, just as in bachelor's study prior to Masters and Doctorate... this is essential in my opinion and experience in energetic pursuits primarily for safety of student and the world at large, for in the process of mastering the fundamentals, the student's mental and subtle body landscape restructures and is revealed in its essence.  This seems two fold in that the prep, lays the foundation for the more intense and complex energy work to come with mastery levels and in my opinion, most importantly it is a manner to uncover the nature of a student's heart and mind to unveil the true character of student and their intentions by the teacher before unveiling practices that will result in abilities that could be harmful to the student, or the world they are unleased on. 

 

Master Wang Li Ping for example, in his book Daoist Internal Mastery outlines clear deliniations of the various aspects, areas and levels of study, which ones must be mastered before others are explored to create the foundation to support the paradigm structures to come.

[dawei]

I studied in his Medical Qigong Program but under a different teacher.   This teacher tended to push Sufism instead of christianity.  I just listened and decided what made sense towards the teaching they wanted to promote.   Most editorial opinions should be ignored if they do not align to a useful teaching.