Can anybody scan my chakras please?

[cheya]

@ Ralis  OF COURSE I don't speak for all! What are you thinking????
 

I have read the entirety of this thread as it emerged.

And held my tongue.

Until I had to jump in, because it is so one-sided, and there is so much projection.

 

I don't deny people have had problems with Jeff's methods.

I just want to give voice to the "other" side.

[Limahong]

14 minutes ago, ilumairen said:

To be fair, I laughed as well, it was funny the way you wrote it.

 

Hi ilumairen,

 

I am trying to connect the dots in your current exchanges with cheya.

 

I am inclined to think that the exchanges between you both bespeak of perspectives that were experienced and felt.

 

Yes/no?

 

- Anand

 

[Limahong]

34 minutes ago, ilumairen said:

To some it has been only rose petals, to others the thorns..

 

Both rose petals and thorns come from ONE...

 

Something about to unfold for someone...?

 

 

 

 

- Anand

 

Edited February 11, 2020 by Limahong

[ilumairen]

48 minutes ago, cheya said:

 

@Ilum... expecting words of feminine wisdom from jeff misses the point.

 

Cheya, it was right on point for me. He made many claims, and I wanted some outward verification of these claims. 

 

Quote

It's the energy experience, not words.

 

Because you are not a "see'er," your interactions are reflective of his manner of responding to this. 

 

And as you've pointed out above, you are not privy to how he has interacted with others - including myself. 

 

For you it was the energy experience and not words, however with me he did paint with both images and words. And not being privy to the personal interactions you cannot (effectively for me) blanket my experience with the above assertion.

 

Quote

Viewing it as switching between transmitting ("male") and receiving ("female") helps me keep it straight, and staying with my own energetic experience, which Jeff facilitates, is the point for me.

 

Why would there be a need to keep this "it" straight (if it wasn't a bit twisty)?

 

I do agree with the practice of staying with one's own experience, but this whole inciting winds in others... you see it as facilitation, I see it as manipulation dependent upon a narrative you must apply effort to to keep straight. 

 

Quote

And no, it was never sex connection for me... and Jeff even says, it's a purely energetic experience which is so strong, most people's minds interpret it as sex.

 

I'm very familiar with this narrative, however one day while something not so pleasant was occurring in real life, Jeff wrote me asking about a particular sexual position he believed me to be enacting with his blonde.

 

There was no sex on my end, and no thought of sex. 

 

For myself, I tried to explain this away as his interpretation of lower chakra life stuff...

 

But this speaks to his mind interpreting things as sex.

 

And it happened more than once. 

 

Quote

I never did female deity consort work, but met some amazing female deities. Female power!  Actually another member did stronger deity work with me than Jeff. I have seen people who work with him grow energetically.  I don't just mean in  "power".

 

So with you female deities were not limited to consorts, or they were still only serving to help others grow energetically?

 

I'm not sure you've answered my questions, but I'm not sure you understand them either, and I'll take the blame for this, while saying I don't know how else to ask.

 

Quote

But I do understand how people can be put off by his methods, at least in how they appear, and how they can tap into deep issues... which is actually a lot of the point!

 

I believe with some his interactions create issues, and sometimes the issues are his own.

Edited February 11, 2020 by ilumairen
wrong "your"

[ilumairen]

34 minutes ago, ralis said:

 

I don't see any amusement regarding my experience with Jeff!

 

My apologies dear ralis; if you had experienced what I did, you may find laughter occasionally bubbling up as well.. 

 

One day he messaged me to ask if I was finding amusement in giving him huge breasts and making him try to walk in heels while he was in a business meeting. 

 

I laughed then too.

 

BTW This was, once again, his image - not mine. 

[doc benway]

30 minutes ago, cheya said:

@ Ralis  OF COURSE I don't speak for all! What are you thinking????
 

I have read the entirety of this thread as it emerged.

And held my tongue.

Until I had to jump in, because it is so one-sided, and there is so much projection.

 

I don't deny people have had problems with Jeff's methods.

I just want to give voice to the "other" side.

 

Thanks cheya

I appreciate that you are trying to broaden the perspective on this. 

I never feel comfortable when seeing what looks like wolf-pack mentality.

We are all adults (I hope, otherwise it becomes a much bigger problem) and bear responsibility for engaging in these practices.

On the other hand, when multiple, rational and intelligent people are having negative experiences I feel it is important they be acknowledged, given voice, and their issues addressed with sensitivity and accountability.

 

[Limahong]

8 minutes ago, ilumairen said:

Cheya, it was right on point for me. He made many claims, and I wanted some outward verification of these claims.

 

Hi ilumairen,

 

Honest experiential exchanges points to some verification?

 

I sense some clarity in you and cheya based on my own personal experiences.

 

- Anand

 

[Limahong]

13 minutes ago, steve said:

wolf-pack mentality

 

Hi steve,

 

Such mentality applies only to wolves in their natural environment.

 

Not...

 

 

 

- Anand

 

Edited February 11, 2020 by Limahong
Enhancement

[cheya]

I'm off to work, so can't respond more now....

But I appreciate what feels like a change in the the feel of the conversation.

[Limahong]

2 minutes ago, cheya said:

I'm off to work

 

Hi cheya,

 

"What you seek is seeking you."

                             ~ Rumi

 

Good day!

 

-  Anand

[Starjumper]

3 hours ago, SirPalomides said:

Behold everyone the sagely utterance of a true cultivator.

 

It looks like you come from a land far far away, where all the cultivators and adepts are sweet talking smiley guys who wear tai chi costumes.  Here in the real world, Lao Tzu said that true words are not pretty.  Real people may not act pretty for your benefit either.  In fact you say lots of slithery scummy things, in a more or less passive aggressive manner.  Sweet talking smiley guys and passive aggressive behavior.  Maybe you would prefer going back to your dreamland, far, far, away?

 

I'm somewhat empathic and can feel your energy, it makes me feel a little ill, if you catch my drift.  No doubt real men make you sick too, therefore I assume you're another Dumbocrat.

[Starjumper]

2 hours ago, ilumairen said:

I.e. stop discussing or duking it out or whatever it is you're doing which has diverted your attention from me..

 

look at me, look at me

 

:pats star on the head:

 

Yes, dear, I'm right here.. it's ok, you haven't ceased to exist because people weren't paying attention to you. 

 

You bored and naughty little boy calling people names again. 

 

You're friggin' blind as a bat.  I was asking for feedback on pricing a video I'm working on, and I wanted it sooner rather than later.

 

You may continue with your stupid projections about me.  You know, your projections show something about your soul.

 

Ya'll can continue with your stupid projections about the situation at hand too, it shows some souls in turmoil.

[ralis]

1 hour ago, cheya said:

@Ralis

Amazing you can so clearly see and label other people's experience.

 

From my perspective, you clearly don't know what you are talking about, so much so that I find it amusing.

 

I have found much "utilitarian function" in my work with Jeff.

 

And totally fine that it's not your cup of tea.

 

But you actually can't know what it is for other people.

 

My experience with Jeff means I have no idea what happened or am not qualified to talk about it?

[SirPalomides]

10 minutes ago, Starjumper said:

 

It looks like you come from a land far far away, where all the cultivators and adepts are sweet talking smiley guys who wear tai chi costumes.  Here in the real world, Lao Tzu said that true words are not pretty.  Real people may not act pretty for your benefit either.  In fact you say lots of slithery scummy things, in a more or less passive aggressive manner.  Sweet talking smiley guys and passive aggressive behavior.  Maybe you would prefer going back to your dreamland, far, far, away?

 

I'm somewhat empathic and can feel your energy, it makes me feel a little ill, if you catch my drift.  No doubt real men make you sick too, therefore I assume you're another Dumbocrat.

 

Still raining, is it?

[ilumairen]

3 minutes ago, Starjumper said:

 

You're friggin' blind as a bat.  I was asking for feedback on pricing a video I'm working on, and I wanted it sooner rather than later.

 

Yes star, I got the whole "pay attention to me NOW" bit ..

 

Couldn't really miss it..

 

Mommy is going to work now, try to be a good boy. 

[liminal_luke]

@cheya

 

I´m glad you spoke up about your experience too.  Clearly people have had varied experience with Jeff´s work.  Jeff is right that all deep work stirs up "shit" and that´s part of the point.  Issues of sex and gender, in particular, go very deep for many; great care needs to be taken, in my opinion, by those who would stir these waters.  

 

It´s good that Jeff asks permission before scanning and, as far as I can tell, all energetic work is on an asked-for basis. But is this enough of a safegaurd?  Many people will ask for things that they aren´t ready for.  I believe that a teacher ought to be able to assess readiness and kindly withhold potentially troubling practices from people who aren´t likely to benefit.  I´m interested in tummo and would love to take a tummo workshop, but the teacher I would like to learn from only offers the practice in person.  This is for my safety.  Or perhaps out of respect for the power of what´s transmitted.  Master teachers don´t offer teachings to students who aren´t ready.  

 

Some people appear to have benefitted greatly from their work with Jeff.  Others have had troubling experiences.  I have great respect for some Bums (and former Bums) from both groups.  Given the potential for harm, I´d urge a more careful approach.

 

Just my two cents,

 

LL

[ralis]

7 minutes ago, liminal_luke said:

@cheya

 

I´m glad you spoke up about your experience too.  Clearly people have had varied experience with Jeff´s work.  Jeff is right that all deep work stirs up "shit" and that´s part of the point.  Issues of sex and gender, in particular, go very deep for many; great care needs to be taken, in my opinion, by those who would stir these waters.  

 

It´s good that Jeff asks permission before scanning and, as far as I can tell, all energetic work is on an asked-for basis. But is this enough of a safegaurd?  Many people will ask for things that they aren´t ready for.  I believe that a teacher ought to be able to assess readiness and kindly withhold potentially troubling practices from people who aren´t likely to benefit.  I´m interested in tummo and would love to take a tummo workshop, but the teacher I would like to learn from only offers the practice in person.  This is for my safety.  Or perhaps out of respect for the power of what´s transmitted.  Master teachers don´t offer teachings to students who aren´t ready.  

 

Some people appear to have benefitted greatly from their work with Jeff.  Others have had troubling experiences.  I have great respect for some Bums (and former Bums) from both groups.  Given the potential for harm, I´d urge a more careful approach.

 

Just my two cents,

 

LL

 

Jeff is not a master! Only some self appointed person who may have had an experience or two and wants to display his ego for whatever reason. 

 

Later on I will share my experience with energy work which was extremely manipulative. I am not referring to my experience with Jeff. My post will be prefaced by a caveat!

[liminal_luke]

1 minute ago, ralis said:

 

Jeff is not a master! Only some self appointed person who may have had an experience or two and wants to display his ego for whatever reason. 

 

 

I won´t contradict your statement, Ralis.  This whole thread is very strange.  I worked with Jeff for just a day or two and don´t have any basis to say whether he´s a master or not.  Either way, work that stirs sexual issues needs to be approached with appropriate caution as the potential for harm is high.  That´s my only point.

[Starjumper]

36 minutes ago, SirPalomides said:

Still raining, is it?

 

No, now it's too hot and sunny     But ya, I may get off my ass now, no guarantee ... but wait ... first

 

Edited February 11, 2020 by Starjumper

[Starjumper]

5 minutes ago, liminal_luke said:

I worked with Jeff for just a day or two and don´t have any basis to say whether he´s a master or not.

 

I only worked with him once, and I have no idea if he's a master or not, and what does it matter anyway.  Or does everyone think a master is supposed to be 'safe'?  One thing is clear, he is good at scanning people's energy from far away, and that's what he offers.  The busty blond thing, and hugging a guy while imaging a hot girl were a little too kinky for me.  That is all.

[Starjumper]

Once, some fundamentalist Buddhist idiot talked me into chanting Nam Yoho Renge Kyo.  That was after I had been doing my chi kung for awhile.  I did the chanting for a minute or so and felt like I could hear hundreds of immortals, from one end of hell to the other (heaven) laughing at me.  Maybe that's how some people who worked with Jeff feel?

 

Edited February 11, 2020 by Starjumper

[thelerner]

5 minutes ago, liminal_luke said:

 

I won´t contradict your statement, Ralis.  This whole thread is very strange.  I worked with Jeff for just a day or two and don´t have any basis to say whether he´s a master or not. 

Same here.  I believe I met him for coffee about two years ago.  We talked, he seemed a nice guy.  I don't follow him here, but when I've occasionally read his posts nothing registered as a red flag.  I haven't read most of his posts, and I'm not up on the Jeff controversies.  What I have is my own experience, where he seems fine.   Which is limited and could be wrong.

 

I did a seminar with Max Christenson, ie Kunlun.   I found him fascinating and strange; imo he had the juice.  I liked the simplicity of his spontaneous gi-gung system, but long term it wasn't my cup of tea.  Many liked it, some had bad psychic reactions to it.  Very bad.. see Yoda's reaction where his kid and he had some bad visions.  So did a few others, but for most it was fine.  I'd recommend it but go in aware of possible problems.  That's valid here too.   

 

My point is..with energetics we may be peeling off parts of the onion/psyche that have rot behind them.  Its not necessary the systems fault, though if they were in a traditional student teacher relationship, the teacher would be there to head it off or help handle the consequences but instead its a 'seminar' world, caveat meditator.  

 

 

[SirPalomides]

9 minutes ago, Starjumper said:

I did the chanting for a minute or so and felt like I could hear hundreds of immortals, from one end of hell to the other (heaven) laughing at me.  

 

So the chanting opened your ears for a minute or so.

[liminal_luke]

31 minutes ago, Starjumper said:

 

 The busty blond thing, and hugging a guy while imaging a hot girl were a little too kinky for me. 

 

Yeah, I´d prefer to hug Jeff when he´s not in drag.  Just a personal preference.

[ralis]

So called energy work as defined by some here obviously has a continuum of effects ranging from negative to positive. In my discussion with the late Dr. Valerie Hunt, the range of human energy frequencies are part of a complex system which is both coherent and incoherent. Or, order and chaos in which both are active simultaneously.  E.g. consider heart rhythms. A healthy heart will always have a slight incoherence  which is not a problem. If the heart rhythm becomes too complex, cardiac arrest can be the result. 

 

What I generally see with unskilled persons who have not done any personal work is that when one claims to be an energy work transmitter what is being transmitted is the part of the field that is not coherent, or is chaotic.

 

The usual excuse that one is going through illness, purification, whether emotional or physical is generally the fault of the one that is transmitting a chaotic/incoherent frequency field. Emotional disturbances, physical maladies, appear as what one needs to experience as lessons or so the purveyor of so called energy work suggests. The classic case is victim blaming as anyone reading this thread already knows. The purveyor or guru takes no responsibility. Why? No self awareness!

 

A few things to consider.

 

So called transmitting is nothing but a New Age buzz word. What is occurring  is an interaction between two persons, one with a strong intention with an underlying incoherence coming from a so called energy worker, which can and will interact in a profound negative way. There are exceptions to this. There are a few masters around that have an extremely strong coherent field that is easily felt and are accomplished healers. 

 

What is energy? Most likely a continuum of EM frequencies, not some Theosophical idea that layers of subtle bodies exist as was believed over 100 years ago. It is time to update old ideas!

 

More to follow.