nCov19 Development and Prevention Discussion Only

[Earl Grey]

This thread is for coronavirus discussion with the specific request that there will be no discussion on how it originated, whether we presume it's a bioweapon or dismiss it as overly hyped by the media--NO CONSPIRACY THEORIES HERE.

 

Strictly focus only on prevention, development of the outbreak, and updates if any of you are potentially affected so that we can support one another. 

[ralis]

Johns Hopkins map for COVID-19. It is an interactive map and I find it works better on a mobile device.

 

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/map.html

[ralis]

I stopped by Walgreen's yesterday to buy some baby wipes and no wipes were on the shelf. I imagine that is the case in every drug store in town. There were people with carts full of paper towels and toilet paper. Hoarding no less.

 

I thought instead of running around town to find baby wipes I would come up with another plan to wash my hands when I am out and about.

 

I take a clean washcloth, a plastic bowl with a lid, fill it with soapy water and hand washing is available when I need to wash my hands. Hand washing has become a bit of an obsession. these days.

 

Amazon is all out of baby wipes and when available in a few weeks, the price will go up.

Edited March 10, 2020 by ralis

[cheya]

 Deadly Viruses are no match for plain old soap.
 The article includes the science behind the claim. Probably way more than you want to know about it, but an interesting read as far as you get. Hooray for SOAP!
 

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/deadly-viruses-are-no-match-for-plain-old-soap-heres-the-science-behind-it-2020-03-08?reflink=mw_share_facebook&fbclid=IwAR3cDTXOsqjlqkznYMVIjn70VBTufFcY2jQyIut2kJ7BaEU5hl6VSqJ-5Xs

[ralis]

12 minutes ago, cheya said:

 Deadly Viruses are no match for plain old soap.
 The article includes the science behind the claim. Probably way more than you want to know about it, but an interesting read as far as you get. Hooray for SOAP!
 

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/deadly-viruses-are-no-match-for-plain-old-soap-heres-the-science-behind-it-2020-03-08?reflink=mw_share_facebook&fbclid=IwAR3cDTXOsqjlqkznYMVIjn70VBTufFcY2jQyIut2kJ7BaEU5hl6VSqJ-5Xs

This virus is enveloped with a coat of oil and soap and water will break down the protective coating. 

[ralis]

There are a few drugs being considered as a treatment, but a vaccine is far off.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/10/hopes-rise-over-experimental-drugs-effectiveness-against-coronavirus

[Earl Grey]

https://www.rappler.com/nation/254066-tourists-japan-singapore-south-korea-coronavirus-philippines

Severely downplayed here and unprepared...

[Miffymog]

Three days nothing.

 

Three days body aches, high temperature, farts you can't trust.

 

Three days washed out.

 

DONE.

 

edit - 5000 dead this season in the UK due to normal flu / 3 due to nCov19

Edited March 11, 2020 by Miffymog

[Earl Grey]

Only a few hours since my last post and another jump!

 

https://www.rappler.com/nation/254134-doh-confirms-new-cases-coronavirus-philippines-march-11-2020

[Earl Grey]

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/03/online-yoga-homeschooling-life-quarantine-italy-200311110233444.html

 

Life is moving home. I feel sorry for food delivery workers. 

[Miffymog]

Good article about why it's hit Italy so hard.

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8100291/Why-people-dying-coronavirus-Italy.html

 

Here's a summary...

 

WHY IS CORONAVIRUS SO BAD IN ITALY? 
By Ben Spencer and Mario Ledwith for the Daily Mail 

 

HOW BAD IS CORONAVIRUS IN ITALY?

Italy is the worst-hit country other than China, with 366 deaths and 7,375 confirmed cases of the virus [subs: please update figures later]. The country has imposed the most restrictive measures since World War Two, with 16million people now needing permission to travel.

 

HOW DID IT GET SO BAD?

On January 22 stringent protocols were introduced which said anyone should be swabbed coronavirus if they have alarming symptoms.

But apparently these were lifted on January 27 to only include people who had travelled to China.

Critics say this is down to Italy’s false sense of security because it believed it had put up robust border defences against the virus.

The country had stopped all direct flights from China - the only EU country to do so.

It had also introduced temperature-screening at airports – despite its highly questionable effectiveness.

While politicians in other countries - including Britain - conceded from the start that it was ‘inevitable’ coronavirus would arrive, and started to put protocols in place to cope with it, Italy had focused on putting up barriers in a bid to stop it entering the country.

 

WHAT HAPPENED NEXT?

By the time Italian politicians realised the virus had arrived in their country, it was too late to control it.

The first case was a 38-year-old Italian man who had never been to China - known as ‘paziente uno’ or ‘patient one’.

He arrived at a hospital in Codogno near Milan on February 18 but was not initially tested for coronavirus.

Before he even got to hospital, he had infected his pregnant wife, a friend he went running with, and three elderly people in a bar he frequented.

In hospital he saw doctors four times before he was tested for the virus. He was eventually tested and diagnosed on 20 February – but even then there was a three-hour delay before he was put in isolation.

By then he had infected several staff members and patients.

 

SO WHO INFECTED PATIENT ONE?

Doctors are still to find out how he was infected. The implication is that the virus had been circulating in the community for weeks before ‘patient one’ was even infected.

 

WHAT DID THAT MEAN FOR ITALY?

Other countries adopted an early strategy of ‘containing’ the virus - by identifying symptomatic people arriving from China and other affected countries, isolating them if they had symptoms, treating them in secure units if they tested positive, and tracking down anyone they had been in contact with.

This ‘track and trace’ strategy – which has been effectively used around the world to control the Sars, Ebola and Mers virus outbreaks in recent years - is essential to stop imported cases from becoming ‘endemic’ within a country.

In Britain that phase of the coronavirus strategy is just coming to an end in Britain as the virus is now being transmitted within the community.

But in Italy the virus had escaped before they knew it was even in the country.

 

WHAT OTHER MISTAKES HAVE BEEN MADE?

Critics say once the decision was made to ‘lock down’ the virus, the implementation of protocols across the nation was left up to regional governments - and the way it was handled was patchy at best.

For example in San Marco in Lamis, in the Apulia region in south-east Italy, the body of a 74-year-old man who died was released by health authorities before he was tested for coronavirus.

It later transpired he had already infected his wife and daughter, who met dozens of relatives and friends at his funeral. Seventy of them are now in quarantine.

The episode has been described as ‘a catastrophic mistake’.

 

BUT WHY IS THE DEATH TOLL SO HIGH?

The rising number of deaths may in part be explained by Italy’s elderly population.

Around 23 per cent of Italians are aged over 65, making it the second oldest country in the world after Japan.

Initial data suggests the elderly and those with underlying health conditions are more likely to die if they contract the virus.

Public health officials in Italy have been keen to stress that the average age of fatalities there is 81, with the vast majority aged over 65 and already ill.

 

HAS IT CREATED A POLITICAL ROW IN ITALY?

Tensions have threatened to boil over concerning how Lombardy, Italy’s richest region, reacted to the outbreak.

In the early days of the outbreak, authorities there carried out widespread testing, even on those who displayed no symptoms.

The approach was described as ‘exaggerated’ by Italian Prime Minister Giuseppe Conte, who said the measures ‘would end up dramatising the emergency’.

Government officials suggested that the positive results for those with no symptoms could cause panic.

The blame game then saw officials in Lombardy hit back at Mr Conte for his refusal to adopt a proposal in February calling for the mandatory quarantine of students returning from China.

Attilio Fontana, president of the region, said: ‘They told us it was a racist behaviour.’

 

WILL ITALY’S LATEST RESPONSE WORK?

On paper, the Italian Government’s draconian decision to place 16 million in quarantine, could curtail the rampant spread of the virus.

But it remains entirely unclear if the measures are adequate given the virus is now in every region of the country.

The rules, which affect a quarter of Italy’s population, are too wide in scope to be strictly enforced by the authorities, leaving people to police themselves.

Though failure to comply with the measures can result in a small fine or three-months in jail, the measures are still being seen as advisory.

 

 

[Hannes]

How does one know if one has the virus versus regular flu without the test?

I'm asking because I had two days of fever now and while I'm over the worst I wonder what I have/had?

 

It probably is the regular flu. But what if it wasn't? There are barely test kits available in the whole of the US.

[anshino23]

You won't know.

 

Self-isolate. Stay inside until you're completely symptom free. 

[ralis]

23 minutes ago, Hannes said:

How does one know if one has the virus versus regular flu without the test?

I'm asking because I had two days of fever now and while I'm over the worst I wonder what I have/had?

 

It probably is the regular flu. But what if it wasn't? There are barely test kits available in the whole of the US.

Blame the Trump admin for shortage of tests which will not be in vast supply for some time. 
 

Have you called your Doctor? Please do so and take good care! Hopefully, it is just the flu. 

[doc benway]

49 minutes ago, Hannes said:

How does one know if one has the virus versus regular flu without the test?

I'm asking because I had two days of fever now and while I'm over the worst I wonder what I have/had?

 

It probably is the regular flu. But what if it wasn't? There are barely test kits available in the whole of the US.

 

Do you have a cough or shortness of breath?

Any known or suspected exposure to someone who may be infected?

If you are feeling better and not short of breath you will likely be fine.

Secondary pneumonia is the biggest threat, symptoms are worsening cough, fever, and shortness of breath.

I agree with anshino23 and ralis, best to self-quarantine until you feel completely back to normal and fever is gone.

No work, no school, minimize contact with others.

Call before going to doctor's office, urgent care center, or ER.

[ralis]

Tom Hanks and his wife just announced they tested positive for the virus. It can happen to anyone.

[Earl Grey]

1 minute ago, ralis said:

Tom Hanks and his wife just announced they tested positive for the virus. It can happen to anyone.

 

What's worse is that I meet people saying that "people get better anyway" and the media is exaggerating it, so it's bad for their business. With the WHO raising it to epidemic and outbreak, I wonder what the next comments will be...

[thelerner]

<<add on breaking news. From Bloomberg Headlines.  Trump says he's restricting travel from Europe for 30 days.  & NBA suspends season after player tests positive for Covid-19.

 

Steve copied a pretty sobering and informative article about the virus on another thread. 

 

 

Edited March 12, 2020 by thelerner

[Earl Grey]

A lockdown might happen here!

 

In a IATF/Cabinet Level meeting now presided by Sec Duque at Camp Aguinaldo, the Task Force approved a recommendation to declare Code Red Sub Level 2 for PRRD’s approval in a meeting to be held 5pm today. Consequence of Code Red Level 2 declaration: no mass gatherings, work suspension and extension of suspension of classes. 

 

Other specific recommendations still being worked out in an ongoing discussions are: 

 

1. School suspension to continue for additional 4 weeks

2. Strictly no mass gatherings

3. LGU decides on specific localised strict lockdown

4. Work with skeletal force, most work from home

5. NCR lockdown

 

Extreme measures are favored to contain COVID19 and avoid reaching levels as seen in Italy, South Korea, Japan, US. Goal is containment before it gets out of hand.

[Cheshire Cat]

10 hours ago, Miffymog said:

WHY IS CORONAVIRUS SO BAD IN ITALY? 

 

Italy made more than 36.359 tests and they found a large number of positives, while other European countries like Germany and France don't even have an official number: according to Der Spiegel, in Germany it's around 11.000 and it's just media rumors. No official data released yet. 

 

There's a statistical correlation between tests made and positives found. 

[Earl Grey]

Anyone who wants to pitch in some questions, I'll be doing a session from submissions from others and what I have come up with through Akashic for us to know about coronavirus. 

 

If I have enough questions from others and relevant things to learn, I'll post them here. 

 

@Nungali want to cross-check questions with tarot after submissions are in too?

[thelerner]

On 3/12/2020 at 2:58 AM, Earl Grey said:

A lockdown might happen here!

 

In a IATF/Cabinet Level meeting now presided by Sec Duque at Camp Aguinaldo, the Task Force approved a recommendation to declare Code Red Sub Level 2 for PRRD’s approval in a meeting to be held 5pm today. Consequence of Code Red Level 2 declaration: no mass gatherings, work suspension and extension of suspension of classes. 

 

Other specific recommendations still being worked out in an ongoing discussions are: 

 

1. School suspension to continue for additional 4 weeks

2. Strictly no mass gatherings

3. LGU decides on specific localised strict lockdown

4. Work with skeletal force, most work from home

5. NCR lockdown

 

Extreme measures are favored to contain COVID19 and avoid reaching levels as seen in Italy, South Korea, Japan, US. Goal is containment before it gets out of hand.

So..  Italian lock down for example, you can still leave the house, go shopping, visit friends, even go to verified needed work- as long as you don't have the virus.  So its strict but imo not full on draconian..yet.  Long term this will be economic disaster because so many people live paycheck to paycheck or a few weeks from it.  

 

With the genie out of the bottle my thinking is the lock down is to slow the rate of infection, with the hopes of more hospital beds available for the very sick, then if the contagion moved faster.  But.. even slowed down, without a vaccine, it may end up part of our global reality, ie a severe, deadlier pneumonia and we'll learn to deal with it. 

 

The colleges my kids go to have extended spring break by 2 weeks and there's a scramble to get classes online.  Much to my wife's chagrin a business meeting with 270, now 230 people was not called off and is meeting in Miami this Friday. 

 

<<actually what I wrote may not be correct.  I read a report saying restaurants and stores were being closed.. Yet people gotta eat and get supplies.  The situation may be changing or different areas in Italy have have different interpretations.>>

 

 

Edited March 13, 2020 by thelerner

[moment]

https://community.aafa.org/blog/coronavirus-2019-ncov-flu-what-people-with-asthma-need-to-know

[Earl Grey]

53 minutes ago, thelerner said:

So..  Italian lock down for example, you can still leave the house, go shopping, visit friends, even go to verified needed work- as long as you don't have the virus.  So its strict but imo not full on draconian..yet.  Long term this will be economic disaster because so many people live paycheck to paycheck or a few weeks from it.  

 

With the genie out of the bottle my thinking is the lock down is to slow the rate of infection, with the hopes of more hospital beds available for the very sick, then if the contagion moved faster.  But.. even slowed down, without a vaccine, it may end up part of our global reality, ie a severe, deadlier pneumonia and we'll learn to deal with it. 

 

The colleges my kids go to have extended spring break by 2 weeks and there's a scramble to get classes online.  Much to my wife's chagrin a business meeting with 270, now 230 people was not called off and is meeting in Miami this Friday. 

 

 

As of 15 March no one will be allowed to enter Metro Manila by land, sea, or air, nor can they leave it. Even nearby provinces. There are talks or community quarantine too.

 

https://www.rappler.com/nation/254101-metro-manila-placed-on-lockdown-coronavirus-outbreak

Edited March 12, 2020 by Earl Grey

[Starjumper]

The secret Ninth Brocade!