Bill Maher is right- The wet markets plus the Wuhan lab

[KuroShiro]

34 minutes ago, dawei said:

 

Recently, someone posed as her to suggest she was still around.  Even with a mask on, it was easy to see it was not her... 

 

LOL

 

Another one that is missing is Huang Yan Ling.

Worked at the Wuhan lab and there's the possibility she could be patient zero...

 

 

 

[SirPalomides]

I posted this in the other COVID-19 thread but it's worth putting here too:

 

https://thegrayzone.com/2020/04/20/trump-media-chinese-lab-coronavirus-conspiracy/

[dawei]

13 minutes ago, idiot_stimpy said:

I would say it first started spreading early December.

 

Also I do not believe that Western Governments did not know about it until it broke in the media. I believe many Western Governments knew about it late December.

 

I agree.   An interesting issue is to look at Taiwan's timelines:

Dec:  Taiwan sends experts to Wuhan.  They find data lacking and decide it is worse than being shared.  They start planning actions.

Dec 31:  The CDC director saw online chats among doctors in china of an outbreak.  Li Wengliang (whistleblower arrested and eventually died of the virus) was among those.   That night began a campaign to alert health community and implement inspection of flights from Wuhan.   Also began development of testing.

Dec. 31: Taiwan notifies WHO and Chinese authorities about the online chatter of an outbreak.  The WHO refuses to listen.  China decides to report to WHO that patients in Wuhan are being treated for a new virus. 

Jan. 5:  Flights from Wuhan are inspected for contagions with folks quarantined as needed.

Jan. 12: Testing improves from 24 hours to 4 hours. 

Jan. 21: First confirmed case, person came from Wuhan flight on Jan. 20.   (US announces first case, person came from Wuhan).

Jan. 21: WHO reports worldwide cases as 282, only in Asia.   In their section on "Country Responses", Taiwan is not mentioned. 

Jan. 24: Mask exports banned with beginning of rationing within the country.

Jan. 24: Flights from China, Hong Kong, Macau require health and travel declaration.

Jan. 25: Suspend all tours to China

Jan. 30: WHO announces public health emergency of international concern.  Reports cases close to 8,000.

Feb. 2: Stop opening of schools.   Mask and alcohol (cleaning) production increases

Feb. 6: Ban all flights from China

Feb. 15: First confirmed death from the virus (China first death was Jan. 11 and the person infected dozens of others).

Feb. 18: WHO reports more than 75,000 cases. 

Apr. 23: Taiwan has reported 427 cases and 6 deaths. 

[SirPalomides]

Also, posting propaganda from the Epoch Times/ NTD is forbidden per the anti-right wing garbage guidelines promulgated by  @sean and enforced by @Trunk. For those needing further information on Epoch Times,  see this report here: https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-news/trump-qanon-impending-judgment-day-behind-facebook-fueled-rise-epoch-n1044121

[ralis]

The origin of the Coronavirus is in nature. When a virus meets the specific conditions to spread this is what happens!

[KuroShiro]

1 hour ago, dawei said:

 

I agree.   An interesting issue is to look at Taiwan's timelines:

Dec:  Taiwan sends experts to Wuhan.  They find data lacking and decide it is worse than being shared.  They start planning actions.

Dec 31:  The CDC director saw online chats among doctors in china of an outbreak.  Li Wengliang (whistleblower arrested and eventually died of the virus) was among those.   That night began a campaign to alert health community and implement inspection of flights from Wuhan.   Also began development of testing.

Dec. 31: Taiwan notifies WHO and Chinese authorities about the online chatter of an outbreak.  The WHO refuses to listen.  China decides to report to WHO that patients in Wuhan are being treated for a new virus. 

Jan. 5:  Flights from Wuhan are inspected for contagions with folks quarantined as needed.

Jan. 12: Testing improves from 24 hours to 4 hours. 

Jan. 21: First confirmed case, person came from Wuhan flight on Jan. 20.   (US announces first case, person came from Wuhan).

Jan. 21: WHO reports worldwide cases as 282, only in Asia.   In their section on "Country Responses", Taiwan is not mentioned. 

Jan. 24: Mask exports banned with beginning of rationing within the country.

Jan. 24: Flights from China, Hong Kong, Macau require health and travel declaration.

Jan. 25: Suspend all tours to China

Jan. 30: WHO announces public health emergency of international concern.  Reports cases close to 8,000.

Feb. 2: Stop opening of schools.   Mask and alcohol (cleaning) production increases

Feb. 6: Ban all flights from China

Feb. 15: First confirmed death from the virus (China first death was Jan. 11 and the person infected dozens of others).

Feb. 18: WHO reports more than 75,000 cases. 

Apr. 23: Taiwan has reported 427 cases and 6 deaths. 

 

 

  Taiwan has been exemplary during this ccp virus tragedy.

[KuroShiro]

1 hour ago, ralis said:

The origin of the Coronavirus is in nature. When a virus meets the specific conditions to spread this is what happens!

 

 

 

1 hour ago, ralis said:

The origin of the Coronavirus is in nature. When a virus meets the specific conditions to spread this is what happens!

 

lol

 

I'm sorry but I really don't understand what you mean with your statement in the context of this thread.

Notice I've been very polite, I asked "You're not very bright, are you?" and did not state it as a matter of fact.

 

I'll wait for you to explain and maybe you can surprise me but I'm not holding my breath.

[KuroShiro]

5 hours ago, SirPalomides said:

Also, posting propaganda from the Epoch Times/ NTD is forbidden per the anti-right wing garbage guidelines promulgated by  @sean and enforced by @Trunk. For those needing further information on Epoch Times,  see this report here: https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-news/trump-qanon-impending-judgment-day-behind-facebook-fueled-rise-epoch-n1044121

 

LOL

 

Don't tell me you're a ccp troll !

 

 

 

[ralis]

4 hours ago, KuroShiro said:

 

 

 

 

lol

 

I'm sorry but I really don't understand what you mean with your statement in the context of this thread.

Notice I've been very polite, I asked "You're not very bright, are you?" and did not state it as a matter of fact.

 

I'll wait for you to explain and maybe you can surprise me but I'm not holding my breath.

 

I am in keeping with the thread which was started by Immortal4Life. There is a lot of conspiracy bullshit in this thread from many that are uninformed or believe Fox News propaganda. The Corona virus evolved in nature, is not a biological weapon, plus is not an escapee from a lab.

 

Ad hominem attacks are not welcome here!

Edited April 24, 2020 by ralis

[SirPalomides]

10 hours ago, KuroShiro said:

 

LOL

 

Don't tell me you're a ccp troll !

 

 

It’s true, NBC news is a famous communist mouthpiece. I get paid 50 cents every time I share one of their articles.

[Master Logray]

 

In spite of all the happenings these 4+ months, the China government has not yet reported any result on the origin of the case.   If the virus is not leaked  from the lab, then the whatever species of animals carrying the virus would still be running around Wuhan and can infect the population again, perhaps with mutation too.  This is worrisome.

 

[SirPalomides]

7 minutes ago, Master Logray said:

 

In spite of all the happenings these 4+ months, the China government has not yet reported any result on the origin of the case.   If the virus is not leaked  from the lab, then the whatever species of animals carrying the virus would still be running around Wuhan and can infect the population again, perhaps with mutation too.  This is worrisome.

 

That's a silly thing to say. While research is still being done to determine how and from what species the virus might have transferred to humans from, the government has been taking measures to curb or completely shut down wildlife trade. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/apr/18/covid-19-a-blessing-for-pangolins

[SirPalomides]

Journalist Yasha Levine is great as usual.

Quote

I’ve written quite a bit about how our society loves blaming foreigners for American domestic political problems — the liberals do

this as much as the right. It happened after Donald Trump’s victory in 2016 and it’s happening once again with COVID-19 — on what will probably an even great scale.

 

The virus has revealed the total hollowness of our oligarchic society. Other than bailing out the ruling class, our corrupt political class and their political institutions have failed us spectacularly on every level — from the federal government down to the local level. We’re looking at continued lockdowns with no testing, no tracing, no economic relief for the millions out of the jobs, no help of any kind. Out here in LA, the city’s neoliberal government won’t do anything — it won’t even pass an eviction moratorium. In New York, the place we just left, the grossly privileged second-generation governor is telling people who lost their jobs because of a government quarantine order to go out and get a job. “It’s that simple, bums! Get a job or starve!”

 

In cities all across America, revenues have been built on taxing consumption and tourism, while leaving our oligarchs untouched. So budgets are gonna fall through the floor, and there is already wide talk about imposing austerity on a local level. Combine that with historic unemployment and mass business failures, it’s gonna be fucking ugly.

 

Like all pathogens, COVID-19 does not care about borders or nationalities. It might have come from abroad, but the havoc it’s causing in America is the result of our domestic politics: a degenerate bipartisan elite that has presided over stunning levels of national decline and degradation, and which has outsourced all political power to private, concentrated capital. COVID-19 is like a tracer chemical injected into our body politic, allowing us to see that process clearly.

 

And that’s why this “China did it” propaganda wave is so useful. Like all elite-driven xenophobic campaigns, it displaces the blame for domestic political problems onto an inscrutable, foreign enemy. This is what the cynical assholes who rule us want — want and desperately need. They need to focus our attention away from their own failure.

[Master Logray]

11 minutes ago, SirPalomides said:

That's a silly thing to say. While research is still being done to determine how and from what species the virus might have transferred to humans from, the government has been taking measures to curb or completely shut down wildlife trade. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/apr/18/covid-19-a-blessing-for-pangolins

 

Heard the same thing in 2003.  May be more discreet now.   If they can ban eating dogs and cats, it would be a real improvement.  Even today a government agency talking about the medicinal value of white dolphins.  But it was quickly withdrawn. 

[SirPalomides]

26 minutes ago, Master Logray said:

 

Heard the same thing in 2003.  May be more discreet now.   If they can ban eating dogs and cats, it would be a real improvement.

 

 

Any link between dog and cat consumption and COVID-19, or is this just the usual racist garbage?

 

[KuroShiro]

1 hour ago, SirPalomides said:

That's a silly thing to say. While research is still being done to determine how and from what species the virus might have transferred to humans from, the government has been taking measures to curb or completely shut down wildlife trade. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/apr/18/covid-19-a-blessing-for-pangolins

 

 

49 minutes ago, SirPalomides said:

 

Any link between dog and cat consumption and COVID-19, or is this just the usual racist garbage?

 

 

 

LOL LOL

 

I was right you're clearly a ccp troll !

[SirPalomides]

13 minutes ago, KuroShiro said:

 

 

 

 

LOL LOL

 

I was right you're clearly a ccp troll !

 

Yes, yes, of course!

 

Don't forget to vaccinate yourself with bleach now.

[KuroShiro]

15 hours ago, ralis said:

 

I am in keeping with the thread which was started by Immortal4Life. There is a lot of conspiracy bullshit in this thread from many that are uninformed or believe Fox News propaganda. The Corona virus evolved in nature, is not a biological weapon, plus is not an escapee from a lab.

 

Ad hominem attacks are not welcome here!

 

Thank you for your reply but unfortunately you didn't surprise me...

 

You clearly have no idea what you're talking about and considering this thread is about the ccp virus, which until today has killed more than 200,000 people, should give you pause.

 

The fact that the corona virus evolved in Nature is irrelevant to the fact, now almost 100% certain, that this virus came from the lab.

 

"Conspiracy bullshit" is also irrelevant to the fact, now almost 100% certain, that this virus came from the lab.

 

"Biological weapon" or not is also irrelevant to the fact, now almost 100% certain, that this virus came from the lab.

[Master Logray]

49 minutes ago, SirPalomides said:

 

Any link between dog and cat consumption and COVID-19, or is this just the usual racist garbage?

 

 

The point is, it is the culture to eat a wide range of animals, reptiles and insects.   It is commonly said everything with 4 legs can be eaten except a table.   During the capture, domestication, transport, in the market to the kitchens,  there are just too many chances of diseases come to humans.   TCM also makes use of animal parts.  

 

[SirPalomides]

5 minutes ago, Master Logray said:

 

The point is, it is the culture to eat a wide range of animals, reptiles and insects.   It is commonly said everything with 4 legs can be eaten except a table.   During the capture, domestication, transport, in the market to the kitchens,  there are just too many chances of diseases come to humans.   TCM also makes use of animal parts.  

 

Ah, I see, so the usual racist garbage it is!

[SirPalomides]

11 minutes ago, KuroShiro said:

 

Thank you for your reply but unfortunately you didn't surprise me...

 

You clearly have no idea what you're talking about and considering this thread is about the ccp virus, which until today has killed more than 200,000 people, should give you pause.

 

The fact that the corona virus evolved in Nature is irrelevant to the fact, now almost 100% certain, that this virus came from the lab.

 

"Conspiracy bullshit" is also irrelevant to the fact, now almost 100% certain, that this virus came from the lab.

 

"Biological weapon" or not is also irrelevant to the fact, now almost 100% certain, that this virus came from the lab.

 

Li Hongzhi's UFO cult said it, so it must be true!

[dawei]

2 hours ago, SirPalomides said:

That's a silly thing to say. While research is still being done to determine how and from what species the virus might have transferred to humans from, the government has been taking measures to curb or completely shut down wildlife trade. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/apr/18/covid-19-a-blessing-for-pangolins

 

Neither the pangolins nor bats are confirmed as sold at the Wuhan wet markets, which are now re-opened... so whatever they are trying to do with wildlife bans doesn't seem to move the needle towards understanding the origin of the virus. 

 

Instead, what is spread is that the US Army made the virus and brought it to the 2019 World Military Games in Wuhan. 

[C T]

Qouting Dr. William Schaffner in a recent news interview: "Its been a revelation. This is a very elusive virus. It snuck into this country unbeknownst, hiding under the guise of influenza, because influenza and this virus cause very similar symptoms when they present, and it was initially not recognized, and this case (referring to the first recorded covid death), this death, indicated that it had come not directly from China, but had been spreading in the community for some time already, so this virus was way ahead of us - we've been playing catch-up the whole time, but we didn't realize it had such a long head start. It was way ahead of us." 

 

Dr. Schaffner's professional bio: Schaffner continues to serve as professor of preventive medicine and infectious diseases at Vanderbilt University School of Medicine. From 2010 to 2012, Schaffner served as president of NFID. In his new role, he will succeed Susan J. Rehm, M.D. who has served as NFID medical director since 2004. As medical director, Schaffner will help to advance NFID’s mission with a focus on education and increased awareness among both healthcare professionals and the public about the causes, treatment, and prevention of infectious diseases across the lifespan. His medical and scientific expertise will be critical to the development of new NFID programs, including continuing education and public outreach. In his new position, Schaffner will help to strengthen partner collaborations and will continue to serve as NFID medical spokesperson, a role he has shared since he first joined the NFID Board of Directors in 2001. He will also continue to represent NFID as liaison to the Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices.

 

 

How much the Trump admin has been hiding about this whole pandemic, relative to how much of a head start is too much is beginning to clarify. About time. 

[SirPalomides]

5 minutes ago, dawei said:

 

Neither the pangolins nor bats are confirmed as sold at the Wuhan wet markets, which are now re-opened...

 

And it remains unproven that the wet markets had anything to do with it.

 

5 minutes ago, dawei said:

 

so whatever they are trying to do with wildlife bans doesn't seem to move the needle towards understanding the origin of the virus. 

 

That's not the task of regulators but scientists, and they're working on it.  

 

5 minutes ago, dawei said:

 

Instead, what is spread is that the US Army made the virus and brought it to the 2019 World Military Games in Wuhan. 

 

Conspiracy theories are popular in every country. Your "instead" however suggests that's the only thing going on, which is dishonest.

[dawei]

1 minute ago, SirPalomides said:

 

And it remains unproven that the wet markets had anything to do with it.

 

 

That's not the task of regulators but scientists, and they're working on it.  

 

 

Conspiracy theories are popular in every country. Your "instead" however suggests that's the only thing going on, which is dishonest.

 

Can agree with first two points.

 

My 'instead' means, aside from the wildlife ban that doesn't really help on origins, I'm not seeing anything substantive on the virus origins from china.   Happy to read a useful link aside from wildlife bans.   

 

This back and forth started about origin issues.   So, china has pushed the US Army idea and vehemently denied Lab release where both have brought forth no evidence and denying other countries access to investigate the latter.

 

They have tightened any publications as requiring review before release to contain what is shared now.  They pushed the bat angle but have been saying that for months.  A bat from Yunnan (how far from Wuhan?) comes closest in the virus signature but couldn't transmitted it to man... so an intermediate is required... the pangolins were pushed too... but we're back to neither one is shown to be sold there.   This is all old news.  I don't see anything new coming out of China.   

 

The US embassy had visited the lab in Jan. 2018 and sent back warnings about research on bat coronavirus.   An Israeli Intelligence Officer in Jan. 2019 was maybe the first to speculate something about the Wuhan Lab.   It certainly seems reasonable to want to investigate the lab to help further establish potential issues there, or eliminate them.   Allowing an international team of scientist in would be something new.