Damo Mitchell Free MCO Course

[-_sometimes]

If ya'll don't mind the off-topic, just popping in to say this thread is positively fascinating, and one of the reasons I love to lurk this forum. Many little gems if you look long enough. Thank you all for contributing as you do  

[Maddie]

3 hours ago, freeform said:

Hopefully that lays visualisation to rest?

 

I don't practice visualization either, but out of curiosity what method do you use?  

[freeform]

10 hours ago, dmattwads said:

 

I don't practice visualization either, but out of curiosity what method do you use?  

Do you mean what tradition I’m part of?

 

Or do you mean what method of visualisation I practice for mental training?

[Maddie]

1 hour ago, freeform said:

Do you mean what tradition I’m part of?

 

Or do you mean what method of visualisation I practice for mental training?

 

I guess more what tradition but what techniques do you use what ever they may be.

[freeform]

19 minutes ago, dmattwads said:

 

I guess more what tradition but what techniques do you use what ever they may be.

Oh I see.

 

Longmen Pai.

 

There are literally hundreds of methods to be honest. Quite similar overall to what Damo teaches, some similarity to what Wang Li Ping teaches.
 

There are some differences in approach, but overall the process and progression is the same. 
 

Its the same overall tradition.

 

YJJ -> XSJ + alchemical and meditative processes.

 

There are periods where there’s hard work on using methods… but once their effect becomes ‘second nature’ I just let the process lead my practice. Just sit, stand or move.

 

After a while - more methods, more challenging work until they become second nature… then you let the practice unfold organically by itself again. 
 

This repeats over and over. At key milestones I need to go see my teachers to be tested and to be instructed.

[Maddie]

1 hour ago, freeform said:

Oh I see.

 

Longmen Pai.

 

There are literally hundreds of methods to be honest. Quite similar overall to what Damo teaches, some similarity to what Wang Li Ping teaches.
 

There are some differences in approach, but overall the process and progression is the same. 
 

Its the same overall tradition.

 

YJJ -> XSJ + alchemical and meditative processes.

 

There are periods where there’s hard work on using methods… but once their effect becomes ‘second nature’ I just let the process lead my practice. Just sit, stand or move.

 

After a while - more methods, more challenging work until they become second nature… then you let the practice unfold organically by itself again. 
 

This repeats over and over. At key milestones I need to go see my teachers to be tested and to be instructed.

 

Thanks.

 

I have the feeling that a lot of what is said to be YJJ and XSJ isn't actually that, an I correct?

 

Also in regards to side effects in addition to the ones we discussed before did you notice periods of having to go to the bathroom a lot more? And having other random emotions pop up spontaneously that have no relation to circumstances?

[freeform]

25 minutes ago, dmattwads said:

 

I have the feeling that a lot of what is said to be YJJ and XSJ isn't actually that, an I correct?

Yup - thousands of teachers claim to teach both. Almost all of them have completely lost the understanding of how they work.

 

YJJ has become a gentle stretching routine… and XSJ is generally an imagination routine.

 

Damo teaches authentic YJJ principles within his school.
 

I’ve also seen a few internal martial arts teachers teach it (with an emphases geared to martial arts rather than qigong or Neigong)

 

I don’t know if anyone teaches the authentic XSJ openly.

 

32 minutes ago, dmattwads said:

did you notice periods of having to go to the bathroom a lot more? And having other random emotions pop up spontaneously that have no relation to circumstances?

Yup. Both.

 

Temporary disharmony as your system adapts to a change.

 

These should generally be quite short term - if they last for a while then something is not quite right.

[Shadow_self]

2 hours ago, freeform said:

Oh I see.

 

Longmen Pai.

 

There are literally hundreds of methods to be honest. Quite similar overall to what Damo teaches, some similarity to what Wang Li Ping teaches.
 

There are some differences in approach, but overall the process and progression is the same. 
 

Its the same overall tradition.

 

YJJ -> XSJ + alchemical and meditative processes.

 

There are periods where there’s hard work on using methods… but once their effect becomes ‘second nature’ I just let the process lead my practice. Just sit, stand or move.

 

After a while - more methods, more challenging work until they become second nature… then you let the practice unfold organically by itself again. 
 

This repeats over and over. At key milestones I need to go see my teachers to be tested and to be instructed.

 

10 minutes ago, freeform said:

Yup - thousands of teachers claim to teach both. Almost all of them have completely lost the understanding of how they work.

 

YJJ has become a gentle stretching routine… and XSJ is generally an imagination routine.

 

Damo teaches authentic YJJ principles within his school.
 

I’ve also seen a few internal martial arts teachers teach it (with an emphases geared to martial arts rather than qigong or Neigong)

 

I don’t know if anyone teaches the authentic XSJ openly.

 

Yup. Both.

 

Temporary disharmony as your system adapts to a change.

 

These should generally be quite short term - if they last for a while then something is not quite right.

 

Thanks for posting this @freeform

 

This is something I feel needs to be highlighted. When you have someone from a lineage, who is an inner door student...telling you that you can make real genuine progress with methods that are easily available, accessible and within the financial reach of most people.

 

I say this in the absolute most respectful way possible, you really should close your mouth and open your ears.

 

Damo has demystified a fine portion of these arts for people..The one thing that has been relayed to me time and time again, since he started teaching publicly is

 

I wish this was available when I started out.

 

If those who wanted to seek out deeper lineage teachings and high level masters were to approach them with the foundations already in place...your odds of success will go up

Edited October 21, 2021 by Shadow_self

[freeform]

37 minutes ago, Shadow_self said:

Damo has demystified a fine portion of these arts for people..

His books put a lot of what I was picking up from my training in context.
 

The way he laid things out and explained them made all these disparate concepts, internal experiences and practical methods that I learned from my teacher - ones that were quite difficult to grasp, articulate and contextualise - his work helped everything fall into place and be understandable.

 

He clearly has genuine experiences and achievements in the authentic methods - and he explains things with a clarity I’ve never come across before.

[Maddie]

1 hour ago, Shadow_self said:

 

 

Thanks for posting this @freeform

 

This is something I feel needs to be highlighted. When you have someone from a lineage, who is an inner door student...telling you that you can make real genuine progress with methods that are easily available, accessible and within the financial reach of most people.

 

I say this in the absolute most respectful way possible, you really should close your mouth and open your ears.

 

Damo has demystified a fine portion of these arts for people..The one thing that has been relayed to me time and time again, since he started teaching publicly is

 

I wish this was available when I started out.

 

If those who wanted to seek out deeper lineage teachings and high level masters were to approach them with the foundations already in place...your odds of success will go up

 

Thank you again very much for your answers. What's interesting to me is a lot of what you explain in regards to your experiences through what sounds like a Taoist or Qigong approach I have experienced a lot of the same things through a Buddhist approach but unfortunately no one on the Buddhist side told me that these side effects would occur.

 

The main methods I used were meditation and chanting various mantras and sutras.

Edited October 21, 2021 by dmattwads

[Shadow_self]

47 minutes ago, freeform said:

His books put a lot of what I was picking up from my training in context.
 

The way he laid things out and explained them made all these disparate concepts, internal experiences and practical methods that I learned from my teacher - ones that were quite difficult to grasp, articulate and contextualise - his work helped everything fall into place and be understandable.

 

He clearly has genuine experiences and achievements in the authentic methods - and he explains things with a clarity I’ve never come across before.

 

This is one of the main reasons I value him as a teacher so highly....His insight into such matters is quite astonishing, both practically and theoretically...Its just mind boggling to hear someone pick these things apart in the manner he does...and honestly...his books are really just a taster...the catalogue of material in his  IAA library is overwhelming to say the least

 

But then, as I mentioned before...the public know very little of his actual level of attainment

[freeform]

20 minutes ago, dmattwads said:

no one on the Buddhist side told me that these side effects would occur.

Probably because they didn’t have them.

 

There’s most certainly energetics in Buddhism. It just looks different. This is especially so if you’re learning under a recognised teacher with attainment… lots of energetic stuff happening with that sort of relationship.

 

In Daoism this aspect is just emphasised much more and taken to a deeper level than in Buddhism because materiality is considered an extension or a mirror of ethereality - microcosm-macrocosm.

 

I’ve already mentioned that you’re an unusual fellow as you have a natural ability to connect through various layers… it’s like you have a more open bandwidth between mind, body and spirit.

 

That also means you’ll tune into the transmission of a lineage more easily.

 

Most people don’t have this (to begin with) - so when reciting sutras or chanting mantras they’re just repeating sounds and not connecting to the energetic transmission behind it.

 

Different people have different ‘inner talents’ - that one is yours. On a practical level, in my school at least, your training would still be the same as for anyone else - at least for the first few years.

 

There’s a downside to this too of course - and that’s because traumas, energetic pathogens or even karmic issues can also use this enhanced bandwidth and penetrate to a deeper level than for most.

 

Thats why the foundations would be just as important (if not more so) for you as for everyone else.

[freeform]

16 minutes ago, Shadow_self said:

the public know very little of his actual level of attainment

yup. His normal, casual demeanour, lack of ‘grandmaster’ type titles and young age all help to conceal it.

 

I suspect that’s very much by design. 
 

Otherwise he’d attract the ‘heavenly immortal master’ type characters who want to shoot lightning out of their fingers (so that their crush finally likes them back or so their dad finally respects them 😅) - these tend to be the worst type of students… and these arts create lots of problems for them anyway.

[Maddie]

3 hours ago, freeform said:

There’s a downside to this too of course - and that’s because traumas, energetic pathogens or even karmic issues can also use this enhanced bandwidth and penetrate to a deeper level than for most.

 

This has also unfortunately been the case as well. This has caused me to keep backing up to practices that I feel are more basic and gentle, like chanting, or at least I thought lol. 

 

3 hours ago, freeform said:

Otherwise he’d attract the ‘heavenly immortal master’ type characters who want to shoot lightning out of their fingers (so that their crush finally likes them back or so their dad finally respects them 😅) - these tend to be the worst type of students… and these arts create lots of problems for them anyway.

 

So Palpitine isn't a good student to have? lol 

 

Edited October 21, 2021 by dmattwads

[dwai]

23 hours ago, dmattwads said:

I think what I find interesting about all of this is that it seems to show that there are multiple methods of accomplishing cultivation. When I read the Pali texts they seem to suggest that only what the Buddha taught works, but maybe that's because at the time they were made they only knew of a small part of the world. 

Early Buddhism was heavily missionary-oriented  style. So of course there will be “my way is the better way” propaganda in them  

 

Edited October 21, 2021 by dwai

[Maddie]

6 minutes ago, dwai said:

Early Buddhism was heavily missionary-oriented  style. So of course there will be “my way is the better way” propaganda in them  

 

 

Hmmmm interesting .....

[Maddie]

Oh something else I've noticed lately is that at work there's kind of this long hallway and in the hallway are a series of lights and I've noticed that as I walk down that hallway very often the lights that are near me get really bright and flare for a second as I'm walking past them. This is kind of new and different and I'm not sure what that is 

[forestofclarity]

23 hours ago, dmattwads said:

Buddhist side told me that these side effects would occur.

That's weird. Most experienced teachers are aware of these things. Of course, different people experience different things. 

 

17 hours ago, dwai said:

So of course there will be “my way is the better way” propaganda in them

 

I have yet to meet a tradition that didn't have a superiority complex. I remember when I went to my first retreat, they told me they were teaching the "original teaching of the Buddha." Just the first of many "original teachings of the Buddha."  

 

22 hours ago, freeform said:

n Daoism this aspect is just emphasised much more and taken to a deeper level than in Buddhism because materiality is considered an extension or a mirror of ethereality - microcosm-macrocosm.

 

Maybe a subject for another thread, but I'm not sure that Daoism and Buddhism are even going in the same direction. 

 

To make a gross comparison, for Daoism immortality is said to be the goal, whereas in Buddhism it is the problem. 

[Maddie]

32 minutes ago, forestofemptiness said:

That's weird. Most experienced teachers are aware of these things. Of course, different people experience different things. 

 

I mostly was talking to western Theravada monks and I kept telling them about these side effects and they kept acting like they either didn't know what was going on or thought I was weird lol. 

[dwai]

2 hours ago, dmattwads said:

Oh something else I've noticed lately is that at work there's kind of this long hallway and in the hallway are a series of lights and I've noticed that as I walk down that hallway very often the lights that are near me get really bright and flare for a second as I'm walking past them. This is kind of new and different and I'm not sure what that is 

You are turning into an X-man — (electro)magneto? 

[Piyadasi]

52 minutes ago, forestofemptiness said:

Maybe a subject for another thread, but I'm not sure that Daoism and Buddhism are even going in the same direction. 

 

To make a gross comparison, for Daoism immortality is said to be the goal, whereas in Buddhism it is the problem. 

What is the difference between the word 'deathless' (Pali: amata, Sanskrit: amrta) and the word 'immortal'?

Maybe immortality means something a little different than what the folk/outer door understanding is. Not that I know any of that from experience, just something to consider...

Edit: an alternative title for the Buddha in Pali is Amata Santam, which roughly means Deathless Continuity/Offspring... (Immortal Being?)

Edited October 22, 2021 by Piyadasi

[Maddie]

9 minutes ago, dwai said:

You are turning into an X-man — (electro)magneto? 

hahaha, something weird is going on lol

[johndoe2012]

20 minutes ago, Piyadasi said:

What is the difference between the word 'deathless' (Pali: amata, Sanskrit: amrta) and the word 'immortal'?

Maybe immortality means something a little different than what the folk/outer door understanding is. Not that I know any of that from experience, just something to consider...

Edit: an alternative title for the Buddha in Pali is Amata Santam, which roughly means Deathless Continuity/Offspring... (Immortal Being?)

 

Yes it is the same.

 

It is just that some confuse the word immortal with someone whose physical body never dies.

[Maddie]

21 minutes ago, Piyadasi said:

What is the difference between the word 'deathless' (Pali: amata, Sanskrit: amrta) and the word 'immortal'?

Maybe immortality means something a little different than what the folk/outer door understanding is. Not that I know any of that from experience, just something to consider...

Edit: an alternative title for the Buddha in Pali is Amata Santam, which roughly means Deathless Continuity/Offspring... (Immortal Being?)

 

That's actually a really good point. I'm not sure what the implications are yet, but it is a very interesting point to ponder. 

[Piyadasi]

6 minutes ago, johndoe2012 said:

 

Yes it is the same.

 

It is just that some confuse the word immortal with someone whose physical body never dies.

That was my point, yes. I don't claim to know what these states are, how similar or how different, but the wording is actually pretty goddamn similar.

Edited October 22, 2021 by Piyadasi