It is known

[Taomeow]

44 minutes ago, rene said:

Hope they name him Sparky 

 

Hi Rene

 

Hope they burn in the special hell for the stupid people whose stupidity hurts others (I don't know which circle it is -- did Dante ever mention it?)

 but other than that, welcome back!

[Nungali]

51 minutes ago, Taomeow said:

 

Hi Rene

 

Hope they burn in the special hell for the stupid people whose stupidity hurts others (I don't know which circle it is -- did Dante ever mention it?)

 but other than that, welcome back!

 

Its that circle  2 below the one for bad designers  and planers  ( where there are a bunch of bad designers and planners  being forced to sit in the uncomfortable chairs they designed and the atrocious apartment buildings they planned  and use  strong tempered steel metal files .... fitted with a soft plastic handle that breaks and  jabs into your thumb and drips blood all over  the brand new wall surface you where working on   ( which , obviously, happened to me yesterday     ) 

[Taomeow]

28 minutes ago, Nungali said:

 

Its that circle  2 below the one for bad designers  and planers  ( where there are a bunch of bad designers and planners  being forced to sit in the uncomfortable chairs they designed and the atrocious apartment buildings they planned  and use  strong tempered steel metal files .... fitted with a soft plastic handle that breaks and  jabs into your thumb and drips blood all over  the brand new wall surface you where working on   ( which , obviously, happened to me yesterday     ) 

 

My regards to your thumb from my middle finger  -- no, not in that sense.   And I can't even send any designers to hell, the design is impeccable -- no plastic anything, solid 1075 high carbon steel all of it, but I'll gladly send to that Circle 2 any and all corner-cutting manufacturers who have this screw the finishing touch mentality.  Don't they know that god is in the details, whereas inattention to details is the domain of the devil?  I'm talking about a Condor Matagi knife which arrived dull -- so I sharpened it myself, to perfection -- trouble is, after a while I forgot that I did, and when I decided to handle it at some point, I operated on the unconscious assumption that it was still dull.  Big mistake.  Hope your thumb recovers nicely -- my middle finger did, took 10 days though.     

[rene]

1 hour ago, Taomeow said:

 

Hi Rene

 

Hope they burn in the special hell for the stupid people whose stupidity hurts others (I don't know which circle it is -- did Dante ever mention it?)

 but other than that, welcome back!

Thanks bunches for the welcome back! but it looks like I won't be staying. I was asked to leave over a year ago... and I thought maybe there'd be a spiritual shift in energy by now but after reading through many threads it's actually more toxic than before.

Sooo... I checked my ppj for needed changes (there were none) & now it's time to go.

(((TM)))

Warmest regards! 

[doc benway]

7 minutes ago, rene said:

Thanks bunches for the welcome back! but it looks like I won't be staying. I was asked to leave over a year ago... and I thought maybe there'd be a spiritual shift in energy by now but after reading through many threads it's actually more toxic than before.

Sooo... I checked my ppj for needed changes (there were none) & now it's time to go.

(((TM)))

Warmest regards! 

 

Sorry to see you go

[silent thunder]

3 hours ago, rene said:

Hope they name him Sparky 

My wife suggested 'Blaze'.

 

I responded... "Bet he's a red head..."

[rene]

7 minutes ago, steve said:

 

Sorry to see you go

I doubt that. Actually it was a post of yours (from Aug 15) that made up my mind. 

 

Thread locked, couldn't quote it.

Your comment  about the very fine people who left. Right.

Edited September 10, 2020 by rene

[doc benway]

33 minutes ago, rene said:

I doubt that. Actually it was a post of yours (from Aug 15) that made up my mind. 

 

Thread locked, couldn't quote it.

Your comment  about the very fine people who left. Right.

 

I do remember saying that.

It was said with some degree of sadness and some bitterness for what tore us apart.

And also with irony though I don't recall the specific context.

I mainly stayed out of the political ruckus that went on here but it did help to poison the board.

Still does somehow.

I actually miss you and many others who left over the political stuff.

I've said that several times here as well but I guess you didn't notice that.

Anyway, I wish you well. 

 

[thelerner]

23 hours ago, rene said:

I doubt that. Actually it was a post of yours (from Aug 15) that made up my mind. 

 

Thread locked, couldn't quote it.

Your comment  about the very fine people who left. Right.

A.  Very good to see you

 

B. People are so much more then Political arguments. 

 

It's awful, what happened on the bums was a micro-cosm of what was/is happening to family and friends across the US.  People breaking up because of strong opinions on a matter they have no power over.  It's a damn shame.  I'm glad much of the political crap (not all & its simmering) has settled down, but I also mourn the loss of some good members I consider friends. 

[Taomeow]

 

"Mad Max" was set in 2021.

[Taomeow]

Yeah, that emoji might laugh all it wants but I'm still distressing the hell out of a leather jacket, making spears and steampunk jewelry and breaking in a pair of military boots.  And I haven't even seen Mad Max.

[Taomeow]

[Taomeow]

[Nungali]

Another  gentle reminder ...   about perspective .

 

The above picture makes Earth look small , but if you can,    imagine how big it is in relation to our individual size. , Then lie on the surface   where we  actually live , in the near invisibly thin layer, at the top of the crust and the bottom of the atmosphere

 

 

between the  freezing radiation filled expanse of space - just above our heads  and the super hot ,  twisting,  flowing,  electro magnetic , massive molten ,  and hugely compressed 'solidity' - just beneath our feet .  Then try to imagine all those forces, the immensity and how small we are .

 

Then, with that in mind,  go back to the above diagram .

 

And some people think life isn't a miracle  ! 

[Taomeow]

38 minutes ago, Nungali said:

Another  gentle reminder ...   about perspective .

 

The above picture makes Earth look small , but if you can,    imagine how big it is in relation to our individual size. , Then lie on the surface   where we  actually live , in the near invisibly thin layer, at the top of the crust and the bottom of the atmosphere

 

 

between the  freezing radiation filled expanse of space - just above our heads  and the super hot ,  twisting,  flowing,  electro magnetic , massive molten ,  and hugely compressed 'solidity' - just beneath our feet .  Then try to imagine all those forces, the immensity and how small we are .

 

Then, with that in mind,  go back to the above diagram .

 

And some people think life isn't a miracle  ! 

 

Life is a miracle, but my point was not that we are small but that there's an elephant in the room. 

 

You know a lot of Australian aboriginal myths -- have you noticed by any chance that the size of a protagonist's significance, his or her ability to make a dent in the fabric of reality, is not necessarily proportional to their physical size?  Some myths I know from other parts of the world are like that.  

 

One of the most unforgettable images ayahuasca showed me was this monster, one of many she insisted I observe and the biggest of them, extending its spiky, vibrating, oscillating tentacles everywhere on Earth, dwarfing it with its magnitude.  I asked her, what is this thing, expecting some metaphysical metaphor, some abstract notion -- "greed,"  "anger," "desire," funny how precepts of pop spirituality can groom one's expectations.  She said, it's a virus.  I understood right away.  What she showed me was the size of what it is capable of.  The size of its impact.  Nothing to do with its size under the microscope.

Edited September 19, 2020 by Taomeow

[Nungali]

39 minutes ago, Taomeow said:

 

Life is a miracle, but my point was not that we are small but that there's an elephant in the room. 

 

You know a lot of Australian aboriginal myths -- have you noticed by any chance that the size of a protagonist's significance, his or her ability to make a dent in the fabric of reality, is not necessarily proportional to their physical size?  Some myths I know from other parts of the world are like that.  

 

Yep .   Many small and  'insignificant ' animals   wield great power and authority .   There is a more recent story called 'The Oldest Rock'. Its a great story and goes on and on, eventually at the end  our 'hero'  triumphs, he finds the location , meets the people who are custodians  and affirm "Sure, we look after the oldest rock in the world , the first one. "   The quester  wants to find it and see and feel it, the people say " Thats okay, its down by the water , down there . "  He searches and finds it  (by its energy, whose trail he has been on ), but its no more than a tiny speck. He takes it back to the people / guardians  and they affirm " Yep, Thats it . "

 

He complains ' But is so small .... its tiny ! "

 

" Well, " one of guardians offers , " it is the oldest rock, after all ...   so its  been all worn down ."

 

(love the end of that story !  )

 

39 minutes ago, Taomeow said:

 

One of the most unforgettable images ayahuasca showed me was this monster, one of many she insisted I observe and the biggest of them, extending its spiky, vibrating, oscillating tentacles everywhere on Earth, dwarfing it with its magnitude.  I asked her, what is this thing, expecting some metaphysical metaphor, some abstract notion -- "greed,"  "anger," "desire," funny how precepts of pop spirituality can groom one's expectations.  She said, it's a virus.  I understood right away.  What she showed me was the size of what it is capable of.  The size of its impact.  Nothing to do with its size under the microscope.

 

Do you know what the 'human centric'     'purpose'   of a virus is  ? 

[old3bob]

a mote in a giant gods eye passes through but not without payment... 

[old3bob]

 

[silent thunder]

I usually return to Carl Sagan and The Pale Blue Dot monologue he shared decades ago when topics such as this come up.  I recall a realization that flashed in awareness one afternoon while sitting on a parking bumper after working on my motorcycle.  While looking down on some ants, carrying food home to their burrow, in a flash the image of Earth flashed in imagination and I saw our entire planet in a procession of small spheres, oscillating about a speck of light, in a sea of inky void... not unlike the ants I watched. 

 

These words presented in mind, not as a thought, but as if spoken from another directly to my mind.

 

I am always touching something infinitessimally smaller than,

and unspeakably more massive than my own self...

 

It seems I am part of something infinitely massive,

while comprised entirely of the tiniest of things.

 

The characteristics of life, and how I experience it, often depend entirely upon the degree of magnification of my perception of it.  The skin of my hand looks smooth to my eyes, but when I place it under a microscope, it's more resembles the craggy unconquerable terrain of Afghanistan.

 

When Myopic and when turning Within, it seems I am capable of extremes of power and influence.

 

When turned Without, I'm less than a flea, on a moist speck of dust.

 

And each reflect and mirror all aspects of the other, all the time.  Holographic in nature.

 

Indra's Net

 

 

As Above, So Below.

As Within, Without.

 

 

[Taomeow]

10 hours ago, Nungali said:

 

Do you know what the 'human centric'     'purpose'   of a virus is  ? 

 

No.  I do know what the virus centric human purpose is though.  Or at least I see too many confirmations of a version I heard from someone who claimed to be non-human.  There's this reptilian dude who asserted that he's the enemy of our enemies and therefore our friend.  I don't know if I am to believe him, snakes lie, it is known.  But the story he told makes too much sense.  Let's think of it as a modern myth, myths make sense even if they aren't telling verbatim the story of what actually took place.  Maybe I'll tell this myth here sometime.     

[silent thunder]

 

2 hours ago, Taomeow said:

I don't know if I am to believe him

I hear you...

 

recently though I lean toward a suspicion that they are as varied in their makeup and behavior as humans, djinn... and many others are...

[shunka]

2 hours ago, Taomeow said:

There's this reptilian dude who asserted that he's the enemy of our enemies and therefore our friend.   

perhaps the "enemy of my enemy" -  really has no friends?

 

2 hours ago, Taomeow said:

 I don't know if I am to believe him, snakes lie, it is known.

 

re: snakes... long story ... short version:

huge flood,

a compassionate feller is convinced by a rattlesnake to carry said snake across the flood to safety,

snake promises not to bite the feller.

on the other side snake bites the feller.

feller cries out  " omg, i am poisoned! why did you bite me? you promised!"

snake said " i'm a snake" and slithers off.

 

walk in beauty

shunka

[Taomeow]

57 minutes ago, shunka said:

perhaps the "enemy of my enemy" -  really has no friends?

 

 

He has powerful friends.  We are not it.  But his powerful enemies use us, and that's what his stake is in our lot.  He doesn't care for us and doesn't pretend he cares, which is reassuring, oddly enough.  He is after revenge against his enemies and also the restoration of what he understands as the right order of things as god meant it to be, he's very religious and quite fundamentalist at that.  So his enemies' transgressions against us is not something that motivates him, what is is that he sees them as transgressions against god, plus his own and his species' self-interest.  I dunno.  He didn't propose to carry us across a flood, he proposed something we ourselves should do to send a beacon of distress and be heard.  Long story though, some other time.  Thanks for the parable.      

[Nungali]

8 hours ago, Taomeow said:

 

No.  I do know what the virus centric human purpose is though.  Or at least I see too many confirmations of a version I heard from someone who claimed to be non-human.  There's this reptilian dude who asserted that he's the enemy of our enemies and therefore our friend.  I don't know if I am to believe him, snakes lie, it is known.  But the story he told makes too much sense.  Let's think of it as a modern myth, myths make sense even if they aren't telling verbatim the story of what actually took place.  Maybe I'll tell this myth here sometime.     

 

I heard some scientist say once that virus cause mutation in DNA and are the agent of evolution . I was wondering if others think that .

 

Maybe we are in for an evolutionary jump ?     For some that is  ... I think the way it works is , there are all sorts of nasty mutations but the more favourable mutations (according to new circumstances ) are the ones that thrive  . The rest  ..... its  a   dead and street .

[Taomeow]

38 minutes ago, Nungali said:

 

I heard some scientist say once that virus cause mutation in DNA and are the agent of evolution . I was wondering if others think that .

 

Maybe we are in for an evolutionary jump ?     For some that is  ... I think the way it works is , there are all sorts of nasty mutations but the more favourable mutations (according to new circumstances ) are the ones that thrive  . The rest  ..... its  a   dead and street .

 

Favorable mutations are very rare.  We had one in the past 400,000 years.  It gave us an enzyme that allows some limited populations to digest and metabolize small amounts of seaweed.

 

All other mutations have been either neutral or harmful.  We've accumulated far more than any other species of mammals on earth, and our mutation rate is accelerating.  Viruses do contribute, although wild viruses do it rarely and we have to do something to help them, often in a rather roundabout way at that. 

 

E.g. start grain agriculture.  Arthritis that came simultaneously with its adaptation is an autoimmune disease where the immune system attacks the cartilage of the joints.  The structure of wheat and related grains' lectins (highly reactive proteins that stick to the cartilage via a process of agglutination) is hypothesized by some researchers to be close enough to "something" that our immune systems used to fight maybe a million, two million years ago, and can mistake wheat lectins for this "something"-- which in all likelihood was some ancient virus, most probably long extinct. 

 

The virus may be gone but immune systems have long, looooong memories.  Normally it would be to our advantage --  if we didn't drastically change our ancestral diets and lifestyles.  We did though, and hey presto-- autoimmune this and that and counting.   Our immune systems are not stupid, but we do too much to confuse them with stuff they never encountered before.  They fall back on what they learned in the course of natural evolution and try to "deal with" whatever resembles anything they encountered before, anything they remember.  But today most of it is not what they can reliably identify.  So they have a choice of either ignoring it and missing a dangerous invader, or overreacting to a harmless one and damaging what they are trying to protect.  All in all not a great evolutionary venue IMO.

 

Still, wild viruses coexisted with us since the beginning of time and never did us in.  Presently I'm much more worried about the frankenviruses...  perhaps more than about anything else under the sun.