Deep Universe Inside?

[Shadao]

I don't know if it's because I'm a newbie at this site or if it's just my own introversion "speaking" but I am feeling a bit stupid of writing of this even though I know there is no need to feel like that.

 

Does any one here also feels like there is an infinite deep/infinite universe inside yourself?

 

This happened alot in the past, nowadays not so frequently but sometimes when I feel excited(even if due only to my own imagination/visualizations...of which I do alot as a frequent daydreamer...) or just "feel at peace with myself", I'll feel as if I have no bounds "inside myself"...I don't know how to explain it better, I feel like words are hard to use to explain certain things.

 

I'll just feel like I'm not this body, or that this body is just a "gate" linking "this" to the physical world...man, words are really hard to use.Specially when it's another language not your own.

[RiverSnake]

Boundaries of self and other can get a bit slippery....as you go deeper into these things. 

[liminal_luke]

1 hour ago, Knowthing said:

 

Does any one here also feels like there is an infinite deep/infinite universe inside yourself?

 

This happened alot in the past, nowadays not so frequently but sometimes when I feel excited(even if due only to my own imagination/visualizations...of which I do alot as a frequent daydreamer...) or just "feel at peace with myself", I'll feel as if I have no bounds "inside myself"...I don't know how to explain it better, I feel like words are hard to use to explain certain things.

 

 

I think what you describe is exactly how things are.  Infinite space inside, infinite space outside.

Edited February 6, 2021 by liminal_luke

[doc benway]

9 hours ago, Knowthing said:

I don't know if it's because I'm a newbie at this site or if it's just my own introversion "speaking" but I am feeling a bit stupid of writing of this even though I know there is no need to feel like that.

 

Does any one here also feels like there is an infinite deep/infinite universe inside yourself?

 

This happened alot in the past, nowadays not so frequently but sometimes when I feel excited(even if due only to my own imagination/visualizations...of which I do alot as a frequent daydreamer...) or just "feel at peace with myself", I'll feel as if I have no bounds "inside myself"...I don't know how to explain it better, I feel like words are hard to use to explain certain things.

 

I'll just feel like I'm not this body, or that this body is just a "gate" linking "this" to the physical world...man, words are really hard to use.Specially when it's another language not your own.

 

Yes, it is an experience I’ve also shared.

In the tradition I follow it’s often referred to as the unbounded space of being.

It’s an important part of our practice and theoretical paradigm. I agree that words are inadequate to describe such things. I think such experiences can be very meaningful and profound, hence the sensitivity and discomfort in discussing them openly.

Welcome to the DaoBums.

[Shadao]

11 hours ago, RiverSnake said:

Boundaries of self and other can get a bit slippery....as you go deeper into these things. 

Really?

 

Then should I be thankful that I(or at least the "I" I see on the mirror) is selfish enough to have a strong sense of "self"? 

 

In truth though, when I get in one of my "philosophic moods" I do tend to question any and everything...not gonna lie, it can be a downer moment.It's only this selfish, delusional "I'm a Sovereign, a God-King, bow to me peasants!" that somehow stops me from feeling lesser.

 

2 hours ago, steve said:

 

Yes, it is an experience I’ve also shared.

In the tradition I follow it’s often referred to as the unbounded space of being.

It’s an important part of our practice and theoretical paradigm. I agree that words are inadequate to describe such things. I think such experiences can be very meaningful and profound, hence the sensitivity and discomfort in discussing them openly.

Welcome to the DaoBums.

People feel discomfortable about talking of such things?I get not being able to properly explain with words, but is there another reason why people feel bad talking about it?

[doc benway]

1 hour ago, Knowthing said:

People feel discomfortable about talking of such things?

 

14 hours ago, Knowthing said:

I don't know if it's because I'm a newbie at this site or if it's just my own introversion "speaking" but I am feeling a bit stupid of writing of this even though I know there is no need to feel like that.

 

Apparently you and I do, at least...

 

1 hour ago, Knowthing said:

I get not being able to properly explain with words, but is there another reason why people feel bad talking about it?

 

I don't so much feel "bad" talking about it.

For me, there are a few aspects of talking of these things that can feel a bit uncomfortable.

There is the feeling that perhaps I'll say something "wrong," something "incorrect" and that others may think less of me.

This is the spiritual ego speaking.

There is the feeling that maybe I'm sharing things I shouldn't, sharing things that my lead others astray unintentionally.

Part of me wants to share to help and support others and part of me knows that we are not always ready to hear things and some of these discussions can have negative effects on some people.

There is a sense of reverence, due to how valuable and rare such experiences are, making me feel a bit protective, even defensive that can make me feel uncomfortable sharing, as if I am being disrespectful by putting some of these experiences into words.

 

[Zhongyongdaoist]

14 hours ago, Knowthing said:

I don't know if it's because I'm a newbie at this site or if it's just my own introversion "speaking" but I am feeling a bit stupid of writing of this even though I know there is no need to feel like that.

 

Does any one here also feels like there is an infinite deep/infinite universe inside yourself?

 

This happened alot in the past, nowadays not so frequently but sometimes when I feel excited(even if due only to my own imagination/visualizations...of which I do alot as a frequent daydreamer...) or just "feel at peace with myself", I'll feel as if I have no bounds "inside myself"...I don't know how to explain it better, I feel like words are hard to use to explain certain things.

 

I'll just feel like I'm not this body, or that this body is just a "gate" linking "this" to the physical world...man, words are really hard to use.Specially when it's another language not your own.

I haven't followed all of the replies, but your post above indicates that you are experiencing one of the features common to mystical teachings both East and West.  I posted this on the matter a few years back:

 

On 11/5/2014 at 9:44 AM, Zhongyongdaoist said:

The notion that all one needs to know is oneself is founded on the Microcosm/Macrocosm analogy, well represented by this quote attributed to Paracelsus:

 

Quote

If I have manna in my constitution, I can attract manna from heaven. Melissa is not only in the garden, but also in the air and in heaven. Saturn is not only in the sky, but also deep in the ocean and Earth. What is Venus but the artemisia that grows in your garden, and what is iron but the planet Mars? That is to say, Venus and Artemisia are both products of the same essence, while Mars and iron are manifestations of the same cause. What is the human body but a constellation of the same powers that formed the stars in the sky? He who knows Mars knows the qualities of iron, and he who knows what iron is knows the attributes of Mars. What would become of your heart if there were no Sun in the Universe? What would be the use of your 'Vasa Spermatica* if there were no Venus? To grasp the invisible elements, to attract them by their material correspondences, to control, purify, and transmute, them by the ever-moving powers of the living spirit—this is true Alchemy." (Burgoyne, Thomas H., The Light of Egypt, H. O. Wagner, Denver, Colorado, USA, 1965, Vol. II, p. 63, I have not been able to otherwise source this quote attributed to Paracelsus)

 

In the West it became fundamental to Metaphysics and Ontology, but originated as an Epistimological theory:

Like is only known by like in Empedocles

 

because it solves a lot of problems created both by Parmenides on the one hand and the early Greek Atomists on the other.

This doctrine was worked out by Plato in a very profound way and continued to influence Western Philosophy up to Hegel.

 

It existed in China as can be seen in this quote from the Confucian, Mencius:

Quote

7A:4
萬物皆備於我矣。反身而誠、樂莫大焉。彊恕而行、求仁莫近焉。
(Mencius at The Chinese Text Project)

I prefer this translation to the one on The Chinese Text Project:

"All the ten thousand things are there in me. There is no greater joy for me than to find, on self-examination, that I am true to myself. Try your best to treat others as you would wish to be treated yourself, and you will find that this is the shortest way to benevolence."
(D. C. Lau, Mencius, Penguin Books, 1970, p. 182, Emphasis mine, ZYD)

 

and was also used in Daoism.

In Plato, as becomes very clear in Plotinus, all things, including our own divine being as already there within us, it allows this type of knowledge of God:

Quote

Then, in this way know God; as having all things in Himself as thoughts, the whole Cosmos itself. If, then, thou dost not make thyself like unto God, thou canst not know Him. For like is knowable to like [alone]. Make, [then,] thyself to grow to the same stature as the Greatness which transcends all measure; leap forth from every body; transcend all Time; become Eternity; and [thus] shalt thou know God. Conceiving nothing is impossible unto thyself, think thyself deathless and able to know all,—all arts, all sciences, the way of every life. Become more lofty than all height, and lower than all depth. Collect into thyself all senses of [all] creatures,—of fire, [and] water, dry and moist. Think that thou art at the same time in every place,—in earth, in sea, in sky; not yet begotten, in the womb, young, old, [and] dead, in after-death conditions. And if thou knowest all these things at once,—times, places, doings, qualities, and quantities; thou canst know God. But if thou lockest up thy soul within thy body, and dost debase it, saying: I nothing know; I nothing can; I fear the sea; I cannot scale the sky; I know not who I was, who I shall be;—what is there [then] between [thy] God and thee? For thou canst know naught of things beautiful and good so long as thou dost love thy body and art bad. The greatest bad there is, is not to know God’s Good; but to be able to know [Good], and will, and hope, is a Straight Way, the Good’s own [Path], both leading there and easy. (Corpus Hermeticum XI, "Mind unto Hermes", p. 187-8) (Emphasis mine, ZYD)

as is found in the Corpus Hermeticum. The text which I emphasized above, "If, then, thou dost not make thyself like unto God, thou canst not know Him. For like is knowable to like", emphasizes the epistemological origin of this practice and it is only the Microcosm/Macrocosm analogy that makes it possible. This is a very Western approach approach to God as the fullness of Creation and the unifying One at its root, though the approach to the One as the one itself is also part of Western Philosophy especially in Plotinus.

 

I hope that you find that useful.

 

ZYD

[Shadao]

1 hour ago, steve said:

 

 

Apparently you and I do, at least...

 

 

I don't so much feel "bad" talking about it.

For me, there are a few aspects of talking of these things that can feel a bit uncomfortable.

There is the feeling that perhaps I'll say something "wrong," something "incorrect" and that others may think less of me.

This is the spiritual ego speaking.

There is the feeling that maybe I'm sharing things I shouldn't, sharing things that my lead others astray unintentionally.

Part of me wants to share to help and support others and part of me knows that we are not always ready to hear things and some of these discussions can have negative effects on some people.

There is a sense of reverence, due to how valuable and rare such experiences are, making me feel a bit protective, even defensive that can make me feel uncomfortable sharing, as if I am being disrespectful by putting some of these experiences into words.

 

Ah, my question was more on the line of "is this such a serious/bad/heavy topic that people feel discomfort?" while my comment was more about the fact that I thought that talking about feeling that would be seen as "foolish" or "non-sense"

 

 

[doc benway]

53 minutes ago, Knowthing said:

Ah, my question was more on the line of "is this such a serious/bad/heavy topic that people feel discomfort?" while my comment was more about the fact that I thought that talking about feeling that would be seen as "foolish" or "non-sense"

 

For serious practitioners, sharing meditative experience can be very supportive.

It is important, however, to share with like-minded people, IMO.

[liminal_luke]

I´m guessing that there is a range of experiences that could fall into a general category: experiences of inner boundlessness.  I´ve had inklings along these lines and am also sure that the experience can become much more profound than I´ve discovered thus far.  

 

One thing´s for sure though -- there´s nothing a bit foolish or nonsensical about your perceptions, Knowthing.  I think it´s great that you asked your question because it lets others who have had similar experiences know they are not alone.

 

My feeling is that we´re sometimes at our most vulnerable, our most open, when we´re having what we might call "spiritual experiences."  And because we´re vulnerable, it makes sense to protect ourselves.  Unfortunately, not everyone we meet online is a friend.  It´s rational and self-caring to be a bit discriminate about sharing our deepest and most tender spiritual moments. LIke with anything, people differ.  Some can reveal a lot without negative consequences and may even benefit from doing so, while others are better off keeping their own counsel.

Edited February 6, 2021 by liminal_luke

[RiverSnake]

Should you continue training...the level of "weird" in your life will only expand. Have fun!  

Edited February 7, 2021 by RiverSnake

[Shadao]

6 hours ago, liminal_luke said:

I´m guessing that there is a range of experiences that could fall into a general category: experiences of inner boundlessness.  I´ve had inklings along these lines and am also sure that the experience can become much more profound than I´ve discovered thus far.  

 

One thing´s for sure though -- there´s nothing a bit foolish or nonsensical about your perceptions, Knowthing.  I think it´s great that you asked your question because it lets others who have had similar experiences know they are not alone.

 

My feeling is that we´re sometimes at our most vulnerable, our most open, when we´re having what we might call "spiritual experiences."  And because we´re vulnerable, it makes sense to protect ourselves.  Unfortunately, not everyone we meet online is a friend.  It´s rational and self-caring to be a bit discriminate about sharing our deepest and most tender spiritual moments. LIke with anything, people differ.  Some can reveal a lot without negative consequences and may even benefit from doing so, while others are better off keeping their own counsel.

Hmmm, personally I don't tend to feel vulnerable with spiritual experiences, usually I'm "cool" with it regardless of what it is(although it ain't cool when people hex you).

 

My feeling of talking about this being foolish or non-sense is due to the fact that I'm still new here(don't know much of the people and even less of the paths and knowledge) and I was a shy kid growing up so when it seems to me that I lack experience or knowledge at something AND I'm new, I feel like I go back to that shy kid.So, I guess it would be more of a psychological thing?

 

 

[Conan]

@Knowthing

 

What you're describing relates to a cosmological principle shared by many occult philosophies. I've seen it most commonly expressed with the phrase 'as above, so below'.

 

Quote

The phrase comes from a Hermetic text known as the Emerald Tablet. The Hermetic texts are almost 2000 years old and have been incredibly influential in occult, philosophical and religious views of the world throughout that period.

Quote

The phrase expresses the concept of microcosm and macrocosm: that smaller systems – particularly the human body – are miniature versions of the larger universe.

https://www.learnreligions.com/as-above-so-below-occult-phrase-origin-4589922

[Jadespear]

On 2/5/2021 at 9:46 PM, Knowthing said:

I don't know if it's because I'm a newbie at this site or if it's just my own introversion "speaking" but I am feeling a bit stupid of writing of this even though I know there is no need to feel like that.

 

Does any one here also feels like there is an infinite deep/infinite universe inside yourself?

 

This happened alot in the past, nowadays not so frequently but sometimes when I feel excited(even if due only to my own imagination/visualizations...of which I do alot as a frequent daydreamer...) or just "feel at peace with myself", I'll feel as if I have no bounds "inside myself"...I don't know how to explain it better, I feel like words are hard to use to explain certain things.

 

I'll just feel like I'm not this body, or that this body is just a "gate" linking "this" to the physical world...man, words are really hard to use.Specially when it's another language not your own.

 

 

.... I totally get what you're saying.  I'd like to add that I have in the past actually "seen" this said universe from my own personal journeys within.  It is filled with stars.  So... in a certain sense, be assured that said universe is totally real and exists.  Feeling like it is there leads you to investigate... as it did me.  The larger truth that this universe is a part of becomes a great subject to study for oneself as you live.  You'll find that many people like to assert so called "universal" truths after they notice some type of cause/effect relationship between their inner universe and the outer universe.    However, the more you study and see.....the more it feels like and makes sense that it is all just one universe that is intermingled between everyone and everything.  

 

...The space within is the same as the space around you in the sense that it operates under the same laws.  That's why people say "as it is above, so it is below". Everything that exists and operates on a large macrocosmic scale, also exists and operates exactly the same on a minute scale everywhere.  Keep in mind that the things being referred to that are the same are things like metaphysical energy dynamics and truths that can be seen throughout time - like everything begins, sustains itself, and dies or changes or evolves... and things like everything vibrates because it is all energy, etc.

 

So - that is why it is important to nurture the inner universe with compassion and understanding IF you want your life to be nurtured by the larger universe ( your fate ) in the same way.  

 

 

[exorcist_1699]

From Zhongyongdaoist's post :

 

It existed in China as can be seen in this quote from the Confucian, Mencius:

Quote

7A:4
萬物皆備於我矣。反身而誠、樂莫大焉。彊恕而行、求仁莫近焉。
(Mencius at The Chinese Text Project)

I prefer this translation to the one on The Chinese Text Project:

"All the ten thousand things are there in me. There is no greater joy for me than to find, on self-examination, that I am true to myself. Try your best to treat others as you would wish to be treated yourself, and you will find that this is the shortest way to benevolence."
(D. C. Lau, Mencius, Penguin Books, 1970, p. 182, Emphasis mine, ZYD)

 

It is the same Mencius further says  :

 

" 吾善養浩然之氣.. 其為氣也，至大至剛，以直養而無害，則塞於天地之間 "

 

( " I am good at nourishing that magnificent qi ..such qi  fills the whole universe , so enormous  and strong  that we can nourish  it straight   without worry  "  )

 

so for both Confucians and Taoists , the precondition for those ten thousands things inside us ,  for  such a great joy inside us  is the common ground : qi   ;  without it , we  can not overcome the sufferings and adversities in  life.  Yet  the existence of a  bodily boundary and the qi so weak  we initialize  separate   the internal qi and the  external  qi  ,  making us not sense them  as a unity . Therefore most of us remain living in the world as mediocre folks, hardly appear as any kind of saints or heroes .

 

Edited May 4, 2021 by exorcist_1699