Discussion On Immortals

[stirling]

NO academics from your resources, or those above have been willing to reply to your questions?

[Iliketurtles]

21 hours ago, stirling said:

NO academics from your resources, or those above have been willing to reply to your questions?

 

That is correct. 

 

So far it has only resulted in a few people telling me they could not or would not help, and several others wanting to argue about how stupid my questions are and how I should give up and quit being an idiot. 

 

 

[manitou]

On 3/24/2021 at 5:00 AM, Iliketurtles said:

I am not talking about this forum, but my experience in other spiritual forums have led me to believe that such matters are best discussed in private to prevent conflict. 

 

 

Could you give a for-instance on a question that created this type of argument?

[stirling]

I see. Well... you have piqued my interest, but I cannot claim any academic standing with regard to Buddhism or Daoism, only actual insight, study with known teachers, and a once powerful and hearty autodidactic appetite. I have read and understood your reservations about posting here, but I doubt they will be anything worse than what you found elsewhere.

 

If actual, practical knowledge is what you most thirst for, I would ask here. If it is merely about finishing your academic work, I'd look elsewhere.

 

Best of luck.

 

[Iliketurtles]

23 minutes ago, manitou said:

 

 

Could you give a for-instance on a question that created this type of argument?

 

I can in private sure.

[manitou]

 

22 minutes ago, Iliketurtles said:

 

I can in private sure.

 

 

 

You're going to deny this group a foray into argumentation?

 

If you continually run up against arguments and people telling you you're not asking the right questions -- are you hoping to find a forum that will be in total agreement all of the time?  I don't think it exists.  Are you afraid that because we don't all have diplomas from a university, that we don't know what we're talking about?

 

If this is what you're thinking, you are limiting yourself.  What you'll find on this site is wisdom - not credentials - and there is a huge difference.  Anybody can lift facts from a Wikipedia and get to know 'about' anything they want.  But to speak with those who have been practitioners for years, who have undergone the painful internal process of being totally honest with themselves and with others - this forum will rate up there pretty high.  A path is just a path.  It doesn't get you 'there'.  You have to do that all on your own.  If you want to learn How, and are willing to listen to some folks with different points of view - then you're in the right place.  If the knowledge in your head isn't pliable, it won't work here either.

[Cleansox]

1 hour ago, Iliketurtles said:

 

 

 

So far it has only resulted in a few people telling me they could not or would not help, and several others wanting to argue about how stupid my questions are and how I should give up and quit being an idiot. 

 

 

So, with that feedback, have you looked at your questions again? 

If one gets the same kind of feedback from different persons, situated at different places (triangulating), they might have a point. 

 

We might never know since you are hesitant in popping any of those questions here. 

 

Now, the present mod team has a relatively low level of acceptance of rudeness, so it is not likely someone will call you an idiot here. But still, if you feel that any feedback that is not in line with your view is painful, you are probably following the right strategy. 

[Iliketurtles]

2 hours ago, manitou said:

 

 

 

 

You're going to deny this group a foray into argumentation?

 

If you continually run up against arguments and people telling you you're not asking the right questions -- are you hoping to find a forum that will be in total agreement all of the time?  I don't think it exists.  Are you afraid that because we don't all have diplomas from a university, that we don't know what we're talking about?

 

If this is what you're thinking, you are limiting yourself.  What you'll find on this site is wisdom - not credentials - and there is a huge difference.  Anybody can lift facts from a Wikipedia and get to know 'about' anything they want.  But to speak with those who have been practitioners for years, who have undergone the painful internal process of being totally honest with themselves and with others - this forum will rate up there pretty high.  A path is just a path.  It doesn't get you 'there'.  You have to do that all on your own.  If you want to learn How, and are willing to listen to some folks with different points of view - then you're in the right place.  If the knowledge in your head isn't pliable, it won't work here either.

 

Yes.

 

I am looking to have private discussions, with qualified people assuming they are willing to help. 

 

Public discussion on such things doesn't seem like a wise idea to me for the reasons I have previously stated. 

[Iliketurtles]

1 hour ago, Cleansox said:

So, with that feedback, have you looked at your questions again? 

If one gets the same kind of feedback from different persons, situated at different places (triangulating), they might have a point. 

 

We might never know since you are hesitant in popping any of those questions here. 

 

Now, the present mod team has a relatively low level of acceptance of rudeness, so it is not likely someone will call you an idiot here. But still, if you feel that any feedback that is not in line with your view is painful, you are probably following the right strategy. 

 

It is the correct strategy, thanks. 

 

 

 

[Apech]

1 hour ago, Iliketurtles said:

 

Yes.

 

I am looking to have private discussions, with qualified people assuming they are willing to help. 

 

Public discussion on such things doesn't seem like a wise idea to me for the reasons I have previously stated. 

 

 

Well I did suggest you post your questions on the open forum but I fear that if you are unwilling to do so you won't get any help.

 

 

[Iliketurtles]

10 minutes ago, Apech said:

 

 

Well I did suggest you post your questions on the open forum but I fear that if you are unwilling to do so you won't get any help.

 

 

 

I think private discussion is best to prevent conflict. 

[Apech]

6 minutes ago, Iliketurtles said:

 

I think private discussion is best to prevent conflict. 

 

Fair enuf

[manitou]

Nuf said

 

[forestofclarity]

Not a hook 🪝 I’d care to bite. 😆 

[Taomeow]

.

Edited April 17, 2021 by Taomeow

[JohnC]

On 3/24/2021 at 8:00 AM, Iliketurtles said:

It has been my experience that serious seekers usually remain silent and lurk to avoid conflict with the most egoic and vocal members of the community that want to control the narrative on every topic. 

 

Look dude, if you want input you are going to have to ask your questions, and hope you get some quality answers.

 

There are serious seekers here, but they are only going to waste their time so much with someone who wants them to jump through your hoop.

[Indiken]

i am looking for immortals. Am i in the wrong forum?

[Taomeow]

4 hours ago, Indiken said:

i am looking for immortals. Am i in the wrong forum?

 

Not necessarily -- but how would you verify their claim?  It's not like the resident immortals can produce academic credentials to verify their immortal status.  A clear case of "takes one to know one." 

 

Come back in a few hundred years --  whoever is still around is it.  

[stirling]

4 hours ago, Indiken said:

i am looking for immortals. Am i in the wrong forum?

 

You probably need to frame that question: Is an immortal a person who lives forever, or that which has never been born and never died? One of these answers would be hilarious nonsense from the standpoint of enlightened mind - the other makes complete sense.

 

Which amongst the two are you looking for?

 

Edited April 18, 2021 by stirling

[zerostao]

29 minutes ago, Taomeow said:

 

Not necessarily -- but how would you verify their claim?  It's not like the resident immortals can produce academic credentials to verify their immortal status.  A clear case of "takes one to know one." 

 

Come back in a few hundred years --  whoever is still around is it.  

Whoever may still be around. However, I’m not sure this forum or the internet will. Fragmented remnants of discussions on the way relegated to obscure historical footnotes may possibly be found, but those types of citations are often regarded as dubious by scholars.

[Taomeow]

23 minutes ago, zerostao said:

Whoever may still be around. However, I’m not sure this forum or the internet will. Fragmented remnants of discussions on the way relegated to obscure historical footnotes may possibly be found, but those types of citations are often regarded as dubious by scholars.

 

I believe the I Ching, having described all of creation, offered its take on things like the internet too.  Hexagram 30, line 4.     

 

Surely the immortals are not made out of Li on top of Li -- so they are not likely to share the fate of the world wide web. They'll find a way to stay in touch long after it's gone.    

 

As for scholars...  their fate depends on what they disregard and what they pursue.  I wonder why the I Ching didn't include a line dedicated to those in a dark room chasing a black cat who isn't there.  But then, total light is as blinding as total darkness, so this one might be it.  "It flares up, dies down, is thrown away."      

[Indiken]

2 hours ago, Taomeow said:

 

Not necessarily -- but how would you verify their claim?  It's not like the resident immortals can produce academic credentials to verify their immortal status.  A clear case of "takes one to know one." 

 

Come back in a few hundred years --  whoever is still around is it.  

 

I ask and trust my intuition.

 

Life is risky affair.

 

The other way is to become immortal by self effort.

 

Self effort is a must even with a "teacher".

 

Because only the self is the teacher.

 

Edit: The lessions are attracted to oneself when one is ready.

Edited April 18, 2021 by Indiken

[Indiken]

1 hour ago, stirling said:

 

You probably need to frame that question: Is an immortal a person who lives forever, or that which has never been born and never died? One of these answers would be hilarious nonsense from the standpoint of enlightened mind - the other makes complete sense.

 

Which amongst the two are you looking for?

 

 

I am looking to lengthen my lifespan to learn the needed lessions in this lifetime.

[Master Logray]

I don't think Immortals will ever go to a forum.  They probably don't understand English, or even modern Chinese.   Very serious seekers, if ever been in contact with Immortals, would be too busy to engage in discussions here.

[Cleansox]

55 minutes ago, Indiken said:

 

I am looking to lengthen my lifespan

Blue zone diet and lifestyle, some basic qigong. 

55 minutes ago, Indiken said:

to learn the needed lessions in this lifetime.

1) Life is suffering. 

2) To relieve suffering, you might want to pursue the buddhist path. 

3) There are more Buddhist Sutras and Tantras than any normal person can read and have use for in one lifetime.

 

So you might choose to bail out, and pursue something more clear. 

Netflix, anyone?