Max's Gamma Radiation

[Xienkula1]

I dare say I think the level of scientific ignorance is rather funny, the strange anomaly is not gamma radiation, as in radioactivity, as in the popular philosopher's stone of some people's conjecture, but must be reffering to an EEG reading of Max's brain waves where he showed higher levels of gamma range activity, higher approx 25-approx 100Hz . There are higher brain wave functions than gamma, associated with Samadhi. Tibetan compassion meditators were shown to have high levels of "gamma synchronisation." The current view is that levels of gamma synchronisation increased incrementally with practice.

 

http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlere...gi?artid=526201

 

Maybe this tid bit is irrelevant and the issue has already been addressed. I haven't yet picked through all the Kunlun threads.

Edited April 5, 2008 by Xienkula1

[Xienkula1]

Let's get a cheek swab from Max and do some DNA testing and while we are at it, test our own dna too, we might have mutated as well with all the recent solar flare activity, not to mention cosmic rays

 

http://www.jci.org/112/4/487?content_type=full

 

I think triple helix dna has been observed in certain forms of cancer cells, but I need to get the source on that one.

Edited April 5, 2008 by Xienkula1

[satyagraha]

I know when I spoke with max privately he mentioned passingly about quantum physicists examining his DNA, he is really a genuine person, we have already beaten the discrepancies of the kunlun page to death, the consensus of those who meet him (including myself) is that he is more than the real deal. the only way to find out is to see him yourself.

[Xienkula1]

we have already beaten the discrepancies of the kunlun page to death

 

Well I can't help flogging a dead horse, thanks for enlightening me to my apparent sadism. Have to work on that compassion some more

[Wun Yuen Gong]

There was a TTB member that was very active and high level cultivator that went to Max's kunlun workshop and paid to do a private and came here and said Max is not a high level master at all and dodged all this guys questions. The guy asked for his money back!!!

 

I cant wait to meet him when he comes to Oz i have some interesting questions to ask him myself!

 

WYG

[satyagraha]

From Jakara' date='Jan 11 2008, 11:56 AM post='48497' (the post that started this discussion)

 

Even though many of these issues have been addressed and answered, I will oblige you. My answers are in red.

 

"Max Christensen is not out to make money, the teachings are free. You are your own teacher, you can do it by yourself."

 

- The book costs $15, which is not an unreasonable price for a book, but this part is what gets me...

 

Website:

 

NOTE: This book is a great way to familiarize yourself with Kunlun, but to get the most from your practice you must have the ability transferred to you by Lama Dorje(!). Then you can perform the exercises to unlock what you have been given. This is best used as a companion to the seminars.

 

- So I cant really learn from the book and practice effectively. The seminars (which cost $300 each) are an essential part of the program, along with the "initiation" so really im not my own teacher. Taking these into account it only takes 20 or so people to make $6000 for 4 hours work - 1 seminar.

 

You can learn from the book and have a lot of success. It comes down to how much you can let go and fall into the feeling and then allow the feeling to guide you through your own internal world.

 

If you want to go all of the way as in tradition, you would receive the transfer which connects you with the lineage. The masters of the lineage then help you with your evolution.

 

Many here have experienced this already.

 

Also, seminars are two days (8 hours of instruction), plus a free lecture the night before. $300 is not a lot of money for what you are getting. Some people pay a hell of a lot more for shit information. These are the highest practices of their respective systems, really.

 

Putting on a seminar isn't free, and no one makes you go. There is a significant overhead with all of the travel, lodging, meeting room rental, bookstore rental, vehicle rental, food, gas, employee wages, etc. so it can't be free. Sorry.

 

We haven't had anyone yet who has been to a seminar, complain about the price. They know the value of what they've received. Many consider it priceless.

 

"Max does not want followers:"

 

- Then why create a system, write a book on it, make a website on it, do seminars on it and publicise it on the radio?

 

To share it with the world. It is a practice that empowers people so that they don't need a teacher. They become their own teacher. That's the "no follower" part.

 

Also, Max didn't create the Kunlun system, it already existed for hundreds of years. Max was able to bring the divided elements of the root practice back together though with Kunlun and Red Phoenix, to offer the complete system. Kunlun had one part, Mao Shan had the other. The two groups don't historically get along.

 

"The results actually work, bliss can be felt, just try the practice for yourself!"

 

- I have to pay money to try this practice, get initiationand travel to seminars. I can achieve a state of bliss by manipulating my body in certain ways, but this isn't enlightenment. Many have reported bliss feeling, im not questioning that, but feeling bliss is not part of the daoist tradition, it creates attachment to feelings.

 

Here is another way you can learn: Travel to China, find someone who will translate for you (and travel with you) as you search for a teacher who has this system. Become accepted by the teacher (if you are white you better have a damn bright aura or forget it). Spend years going through their tests. Master their tests. Then pray that they find you worthy enough to leak the first hint of how to do Kunlun properly.

 

Then you could continue to travel until you find a Mao Shan sorcerer who is willing to part with the highest practice in their system (Red Phoenix)... I'll stop this scenario here because anyone who knows anything about Mao Shan knows that there is no way in hell you will get a thing from them.

 

Golden Flower? You won't find the key to that either. A lot of info, but not the key.

 

I hope you are getting my point.

 

The fact is that you cannot otherwise find these teachings anywhere. Whole armies died for the Golden Flower alone. Most Chinese don't think Westerners can or should do these practices.

 

Fortunately, Max's teachers liked him and recognized him from past connections, so they shared practices with him that they didn't even give to their own children, knowing that he would share them with the West. These arts are dying out in China. The government forbids these things from being taught and many masters are being eliminated, once found.

 

Feeling bliss is feeling the divine. It's very nature is bliss and void. Attachment to the feeling is discouraged but nature takes care of this by itself because it becomes more subtle and refined with time. Opening to the Tao and your true nature is the ultimate objective.

 

Scientific claims:

 

"Practitioner will continue to do Level I practice in Level II. The purpose of this level is to generate and circulate magnetic energy through the body. When the energy is at its highest, magnetic power is able to flow through the body. "

 

- Have you taken a hall probe to measure this effect and verify it is magnetic? Its easily insertable into various cavaties of the human body to make internal measurments of magnetic fields.

 

The Chinese government in Beijing have a device that can measure this. It different from an electronically produced field.

 

Make a chi ball between your palms and while you can feel the magnetic field ask yourself if you think the energy is a typical kind of magnetic energy.

 

"Technically, a black hole absorbs matter into a rotating vortex of magnetic energy. However, a black hole also emits waves and particles into space. One can use this form of energy for his personal awakening.

 

This form of radiation from the "black hole" is called ultraviolet-three and is only found in the depth of space, or in objects such as meteorites. This radiation does not travel through the earth because of the earth's protective magnetic field will not allow ultraviolet-three to penetrate to the earth's surface."

 

- Where is the evidence for this? Conveniently we can't find a black hole to test it. Theres no such thing as ultraviolet-three radiation. How do you know its found in meteorites, have you opened one up? Even if it can't penetrate the Earth's surface, why haven't satellite based instruments detected it?

 

Refer to past articles of Scientific American. They discuss it there.

 

"Celestial Chi Gung is a sitting meditation that allows one to tap into the energy of the universe via black hole. "

 

- I doubt that was the explanation given by the ancient masters who invented it.

 

They referred to these points as the "dark light." It's the same concept. A powerfully attracting cool radiance. They discovered a way to pull the power from a vacuum.

 

"As you become more clear, you become more magnetic. "

 

- Should I worry about metal objects flying randomly towards me as I ascend towards enlightenment?

 

Only if you are playing in traffic.

 

"The video samples show people being affected by Max's energy. Can this energy be applied to anybody?

Nothing is being done without people's permission. In fact, if someone is consciously aware of this type of energy being directed at them they can usually close themselves to it."

 

- This is a typical trick proven with modern psychological methods. You have to believe you are going to be manipulated and then you are. If you don't belive nothing happens. Theres no mystical energy involved here.

 

This energy can be applied to anybody who has opened up their energetic system. That is why a lot of first timers who have done lots of chi gung or Reiki or other energy work, respond so quickly. The same reason women respond quicker than men. Women are more open than men, in general.

 

The fun part is during seminars when you come up from behind someone and start to transfer the energy. They have no idea you are there but yet they still respond. I did this all morning today.

 

"These can be proven scientifically. Quantum physicsists understand but can't apply it. There's free energy"

 

We are referring to the internal application of quantum physics. Tapping the "zero-point" vacuum points (bindus) in the body to awaken dormant abilities (siddhas) and become more able to dissolve into the divine (Gold Dragon Body). This is currently happening for many Kunlun practitioners and we have a few who are at the Gold Dragon level.

 

What is at the center of a black hole? The sun? The three dan tiens?

 

A vacuum.

 

How do you get the energy from a vacuum? Ancient Chinese secret...

 

My apologies if I seem over cynical, its not my intention to cause an argument or insult anyone, but there should be some questions given the amount of people on this forum asking about these methods.

 

As I said most of these questions have already been answered over the past six months if you'll check, but when I have the time I will try to answer whatever questions I can.

 

Hope this helps.

 

 

this was an old post by mantra, one of max's top students, I hope it helps clarify..

at any rate, you guys can very well think that max isn't the real deal, it doesn't detract from all our experiences with him, just know that we have already been over all of this, reading some of mantras posts (by clicking on his name then opening the tab in the upper right corner of his account profile) can be very informative.

[Xienkula1]

this was an old post by mantra, one of max's top students, I hope it helps clarify..

 

Im not contesting whether Max is real or fake. Actually, I have posted links that perhaps even point to the fact that his claims may not be as bizarre as they first appear. The post is interesting but does not really clarify because it is using physics terms out of context to describe alleged phenomenon that have not been studied or if they have been, they are not accessible to the public domain. Perhaps Max should commit himself to several controlled well designed scientific studies if his aim is to further the science of biology as John Chang attempted. Max does not have a dead Taoist teacher screaming at him if he does such things, and doesn't seem to be bound by an oath of secrecy. Either that, or it may serve better to detract from the hype. It would be childishly gullible to eat up such claims up such as golden dragon body without some objective verification. If there are such students who have accomplished Golden Dragon body why are they not there at the seminar to demonstrate their attainments? I think that if we are sincere cultivators of any system, we need to be asking these questions. Im not coming from this perspective without experience, or without having tried the Kunlun. I did get some strong reactions from the practice. However, I need more time to discover if this is a practice that is for me. I have learned already Buddhist practices that develop the Rainbow Body and Diamond Body. Im wondering how this compares to Golden Dragon body. I noticed that the Kunlun1 posture is very much similar to a position in the seated practice of Falun Gong for developing supernormal powers. However, I don't know of any falun gong practicioner who developed any such powers, but even if they did, in their system they are forbidden to report such phenomenon.

Edited April 6, 2008 by Xienkula1

[.broken.]

You wish to see proof of supernatural powers. Your cynicism abounds, yet you still practice. I can only assume that you do not believe that your practices are developing such within you. If this is the case, will it ever manifest? I cannot answer this question for you...

 

Regardless, all serious cultivators working toward enlightenment know that things happen... unexplainable things. Alas, they are always somewhat attached to their conceptualising minds throughout the process and, thusly, the attempt to explain these happenings. Throughout history you will find that those working toward the desired perspective/understanding/wisdom always use the limits of their intellectual knowledge to explain. In the early 1900s western adepts explained their experiencing through the latest theories at the time: the electrons and atoms. Kabalists, Gnostics, Jesus, Buddha, Wiccas, Transcendental poets, etc. all did the same. They used current space/time limitations and understanding to help describe experiences and philosophies. Alas, such is the 'problem' with teachings... The conceptual minds of the teachers are the tools to communicate, and as such they are limited to the pinnacle of intellectual understanding and thinking of that moment in space/time. Similarly, as this... this which I am currently attempting to communicate will not be read in the same manner depending on previous conceptual experiences that you, the 'individual', has had. In 100 years time, the shift in intellectual thinking that I am attempting to inspire with what I write will have less of an affect.

 

Perhaps this is why Hawking radiation is mentioned in previous posts. Our intellectual minds cannot help but attempt to fathom the infathomable. This is ultimately what Buddha meant by pointing to the mind as the flaw; why Jesus highlighted the individual's judging (conceptualising) as the flaw; why Plato and Chuang Tsu highlighted ignorance.

 

You seem to have understanding of science, and that I respect highly. But perhaps if you drop your doubt, and accept that all might be possible... perhaps then your practices will be exceedingly fruitful (if they aren't already ).

 

Seek proof in yourself, your own mind, your own experience. Not that which others can show you.

[Guest winpro07]

Steve?

Let's get a cheek swab from Max and do some DNA testing and while we are at it, test our own dna too, we might have mutated as well with all the recent solar flare activity, not to mention cosmic rays

 

http://www.jci.org/112/4/487?content_type=full

 

I think triple helix dna has been observed in certain forms of cancer cells, but I need to get the source on that one.

[Guest winpro07]

Im not contesting whether Max is real or fake. Actually, I have posted links that perhaps even point to the fact that his claims may not be as bizarre as they first appear. The post is interesting but does not really clarify because it is using physics terms out of context to describe alleged phenomenon that have not been studied or if they have been, they are not accessible to the public domain. Perhaps Max should commit himself to several controlled well designed scientific studies if his aim is to further the science of biology as John Chang attempted. Max does not have a dead Taoist teacher screaming at him if he does such things, and doesn't seem to be bound by an oath of secrecy. Either that, or it may serve better to detract from the hype. It would be childishly gullible to eat up such claims up such as golden dragon body without some objective verification. If there are such students who have accomplished Golden Dragon body why are they not there at the seminar to demonstrate their attainments? I think that if we are sincere cultivators of any system, we need to be asking these questions. Im not coming from this perspective without experience, or without having tried the Kunlun. I did get some strong reactions from the practice. However, I need more time to discover if this is a practice that is for me. I have learned already Buddhist practices that develop the Rainbow Body and Diamond Body. Im wondering how this compares to Golden Dragon body. I noticed that the Kunlun1 posture is very much similar to a position in the seated practice of Falun Gong for developing supernormal powers. However, I don't know of any falun gong practicioner who developed any such powers, but even if they did, in their system they are forbidden to report such phenomenon.

Yes, we have been kept in the dark for hundreds of years now.

 

You assume to know Max's aim? All assumption comes from Duality. Have you not found the middle way?

Edited April 6, 2008 by winpro07

[froggie]

the middle way (among many things) is to practise both sides of the 'duality' with great skills, strong and active acting, etc and humbleness, gentleness, compassion, etc at the same time (2 sides of the coin (duality) combined (in the highest, individual, form of harmony possible to you at any time)

 

my 2 cents to that and to say that i would like to agree with you greatly if i may

 

to add to that: i'm not a fan of hard skeptics and i'm not a fan of people taking things to simply so that others may possibly take advantage of them. in my perspective so far, sifu dorje, also known by birth (i assume) as max christensen is not a fraud and is also not in question for a hard form of (blind. may i call it that?) skepticism, but i propose rather of genuine and honest inquiry in a most acceptable and decent, yet honest form, i am sure that even a sufi would not mind it like this. in fact, a genuine sifu would love it. so i propose we all live up to ourselves a bit, but do it in the (only) right way. any way, that's my opinion, take it or leave it, as a suggestion. because i can add nothing more, for the moment, to that.

 

and thank you.

[rain]

mmm...yes max.

 

 

 

 

 

 

the silent one.

 

 

deeds

Edited April 6, 2008 by rain

[Guest winpro07]

Assumption is in question. Lacking sensitivity to simply feel, and or know the truth in all matters forces reliance on mind, and to make assumption. We cannot assume, and be right.

Edited April 6, 2008 by winpro07

[Xienkula1]

 

You assume to know Max's aim? All assumption comes from Duality. Have you not found the middle way?

 

Actually this is what you appear to be guilty of If you had read the post you would have seen the word "if."

 

Be careful when you use the word feel, truth is not a feeling. Nope, Im not Steve.

Edited April 6, 2008 by Xienkula1

[.broken.]

We cannot assume, and be right.

 

Great assumption

 

No right, no wrong. All shades of grey.

 

No yang, no yin. Always both in varying form.

[Wun Yuen Gong]

Real skill works on all people not just students!

 

 

 

WYG

[joeblast]

Real skill works on all people not just students!

WYG

true, but the difference between an open individual and one that resists with all his might are astronomical. my understanding is that if someone is so skeptical that they feel they must resist with all their might just to prove their assumptions, then the amount of 'force' necessary to break through that resistance would cause a good deal of harm.

[froggie]

true, but the difference between an open individual and one that resists with all his might are astronomical. my understanding is that if someone is so skeptical that they feel they must resist with all their might just to prove their assumptions, then the amount of 'force' necessary to break through that resistance would cause a good deal of harm.

 

 

anyone who works or has worked with energy knows that this is true. (anyone who hasn't might not know, but that doesn't mean it's not so

- i should probably add to that, just to underline the the purpose of this particular statement; anyone who works or has worked in any decent (or real, if you will) way or method of energy-''workings''.

[Guest winpro07]

there are always absolutes

Great assumption

 

No right, no wrong. All shades of grey.

 

No yang, no yin. Always both in varying form.

 

 

Given the context of your post, this word 'if' does imply assumption.

Actually this is what you appear to be guilty of If you had read the post you would have seen the word "if."

 

Be careful when you use the word feel, truth is not a feeling. Nope, Im not Steve.

the word 'feeling' here implies sensing truth in situation, and not of absolute truth. Absolute truth is sensed on three levels, and has three sources. I meant that you cannot 'sense' the difference between lies, and truth. Edited April 7, 2008 by winpro07

[satyagraha]

People are skeptical about kunlun...

 

history has shown that no amount of genuine explanation has broken the skepticism (for most of the people who debate it; mantra has been very willing to answer questions). words beget more words. If mantra came on here and explained all of this, I guarantee people would just pick that apart even further, and we would only get further from anything productive.

 

just a thought.

 

either try it or don't,

either breath in or breath out.

 

 

clinton.

Edited April 7, 2008 by satyagraha

[Xienkula1]

there are always absolutes

Given the context of your post, this word 'if' does imply assumption.

 

In your mind only. I know what I was attempting to say, and you are clearly confused by what was written.

If in the context of my post does not apply any assumption whatsoever, only in that which you have yourself misinterpreted. The mind is a funny thing. Two people can observe the very same thing, and think they are right about it. You assume to be right about what I meant.

 

If you want to be at work tomorrow by 8 AM, you'll be sure to wake up before that to ensure that you will.

This statement does not assume that you want to go to work, it's merely what you must do IF your goal is to go to be at your job by 8 AM. That does not however imply in any way that your aim is to go work tomorrow at 8 AM. Your aim may be to play sick and watch tv all day, or do kunlun for all I know

Edited April 7, 2008 by Xienkula1

[Old Baby 108]

Was it not gamma radiation that transformed physicist Bruce Banner into The Incredible Hulk?

 

How can anyone doubt the scientific veracity of these claims when it is a well known fact that not only The Hulk but Spider-man and the Fantastic Four have all developed superpowers based on their exposure to gamma radiation in one form or another. Now some skeptics may argue, "Spider-man was bitten by a radioactive spider," or "The Fantastic Four were exposed to cosmic rays," but I say gamma radiation is the meat and potatoes of any good superhero story. Nowadays everyone is crying 'genetic mutation"-but what do you think makes their DNA grow that extra helix?

 

"Don't make me angry...you won't like me when I'm angry."

[Trunk]

Was it not gamma radiation that transformed physicist Bruce Banner into The Incredible Hulk?

You had me grinning interested laughing through the whole thing...

Post gets 5 *'s.

[Yoda]

Was it not gamma radiation that transformed physicist Bruce Banner into The Incredible Hulk? blink.gif

 

[karen]

Was it not gamma radiation that transformed physicist Bruce Banner into The Incredible Hulk?

 

David Banner

 

"Don't make me angry. You wouldn't like me when I'm angry."