Martial Arts - Realm of the Insecure

[Sudhamma]

On 6/2/2021 at 7:09 AM, Yueya said:

an essay by Damo Mitchell titled, Martial Arts - Realm of the Insecure

I have not read that essay, and so would not be able to add anything relevant to what Damo Mitchell is saying. However, the sense of insecurity would arise, as it did with me when I am unable to 'breakthrough' in the expression of the routine (toulu or exercises) to bring it to a higher level of understanding or training. What I did then is to talk to practitioners from other systems on the particular problem in my training or watch videos on how the routine is done, or come to this forum for instance, and state my problem.

[Bhathen]

21 hours ago, Vajra Fist said:

 

Is that Juan Carlos Aguilar's place?

Not him.

[lrn2livorlive2lrn]

I’m not going to say what is said isn’t generally true but Like a lot of things it is what you make it. Like was said in an earlier post many things in life are used in this way. It’s a very common reaction to life. There’s some nuances twists and turns to this martial art thing aswell like if you actually spar or “compete” your fear, delusion and ego take a different trip, if you practice a not combative martial art the sky is the limit for feeding your insecurity if that’s the process driving you. So many things are the realm of insecurity we seem to be terrible at dealing with this common  situation in general. 

[Nungali]

On 02/06/2021 at 10:07 AM, liminal_luke said:

Thanks for those insightful, rather piercing observations Yueya.

 

I just finished watching an episode of RuPaul´s Drag Race, a surprising source of life wisdom.  One of the contestants stood before the judges panel visibly distraught after having received low marks.  A guest judge offered this excellent advice: you´ve gotta separate your worth as a person from your craft.  How often do we believe we are what we do?  Overidentification with a given art -- or career or sport or social position -- is a pitfall for many.  I am not the tropies I win or lose.  I am not the physical beauty (or lack thereof) of my body.  I am not the people who like or dislike me on Daobums.  Especially not that.

 

Yes.

 

My lest favourite  question when meeting someone ;  " What do you do ? "

 

I am not my  'craft', my hobby, my sport, my position  ... least of all;  my job .  Why the bigger interest in whet someone does rather than who they are .

[Nungali]

On 02/06/2021 at 5:28 PM, Earl Grey said:

And then there are some of us who just do these things, longevity or martial, for fun. Narf. 

 

Or necessity .   Kids and adults    ( I will qualify with, ' some of them ' )   like a bit of rough and tumble, why not learn how to be good at that .  A wrestle can be fun ... why not learn to do that better ?   Water skiing is great fun, practice and lessons help you have more fun with it .  And so on .     One can fell over and hurt oneself .... is it 'insecurity about gravity' that  stimulates one to practice balance ?  So I fell insecurity may not be at the heart of it at all ...  at least for me  - yet I cannot  deny the observations Yueya makes about others  , as I have observed that as well.

 

Thats my view.. I have never been one for 'competition'  though .    I do however see this 'curse of insecurity' in many and in the way they practice play and compete .    Most noticeably  I see a difference in 'types' when doing martial arts, say with a sword .... I dont mind being 'killed' one bit , I find it interesting in how the other did that, but some get annoyed, offended or might even argue against the 'point' scored.

 

Personally ,  I have to stop and  think about what 'insecure' actually means .

 

1.

not firm or fixed; liable to give way or break.

 

2.

(of a person) uncertain or anxious about oneself; not confident.

 

Hmmm ...  1. might apply to my old bones .  2.  anxious about myself  ????    Confidence  ? I have a cocky confidence in what I know I can achieve well,  but I dont have confidence in doing well at what I know I am not good at .

 

I find such subjects interestingly challenging .  Two of the young ladies here  asked me  about it the other day , I was hanging my washing out  t the communal laundry and they where sitting on the grass looking at me all sparkly eyed and lolling around on the grass and asking me all types of questions  ( I think they where on ecckies ) . They wanted to know if I suffered from past trauma and any current insecurities and had I felt bliss .   Oh kids   If only you knew .       anyway, I wont get into that as this thread is about something else .

 

Fir me, the 'dynamic'  was different  from what Yeuya  outlined above . I had a very large and strong big brother . he and his mates often had 'fun' with me . I was the small   'weedy' guy. not becasue of my build but because I was younger and smaller ,  doing  martial arts  was  not going to help ( I started much later after this due to  being a xenophile and fascinated with the foreign   and exotic )  .  I realised, very early on,  that 'smarts'   ( developing and using the intelligence  and the application of MY specific intelligence )  was going to preserve me a LOT more. The same in martial arts ; there is always gong to be someone bigger, tougher, better,  smarter than you .....   but not necessarily smarter in the  way that you re

[Nungali]

On 02/06/2021 at 11:30 PM, liminal_luke said:

 

Like I always say, why express insecurity beating people up when I can do so much more comfortably seated on a faux-leather couch, latte in hand, writing quippy posts on Daobums?

 

 

 

Dont let the cute little face and the heart shaped 'chest fuzz' fool ya folks  ..... inside lurks  devious mind of cruelty

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Nungali]

On 03/06/2021 at 2:13 AM, forestofemptiness said:

 

I've had an on-again, off-again relationship with martial arts. I was always drawn by the promise of fitness, self-defense, and spirituality, but for me I have found they tend to fail on all counts.

 

Bad systems then .   I have been able to blend them ... but I did that blending myself since I became proficient in those three aspects separately and then joined them together later .

 

 

On 03/06/2021 at 2:13 AM, forestofemptiness said:

 

 

There seems to be a triangle here--- the more you focus on one dimension, the others tend to suffer.

 

yes, in  a  bad  system or blending , in  good blending , of course, they should all support and uplift each other .

 

 

On 03/06/2021 at 2:13 AM, forestofemptiness said:

 

 

So for self-defense, the best would likely be some MMA training, but there is no spirituality there. The more spiritual arts strike me as useless for other aspects. 

 

The main issue I have with MA though is the violent/aggressive mentality. I have a hard time avoiding that, and judging by my other students, so do most of them. For me, it usually shows up in how I handle conflicts in dreams. 

 

 

 

Very interesting point that .

 

and now, a joke ;

 

Spoiler

In a small country town there is  karate instructor,  judo instructor,  boxing instructor and an aikido instructor  . One Friday night at the pub, all hell breaks loose, huge brawl ; . the karate guy is kicking and chopping people,  the judo guy is throwing them round the room, the boxer is punching guys in the head .......

 

What about the aikido guy ?

 

 

-   he didnt go to the pub that night .

 

 

Spoiler

its about 'smarts and intuition'   , if you didn't get that .

 

 

[Nungali]

On 03/06/2021 at 6:26 AM, forestofemptiness said:

 

Sure. Let's take a recurring dream pattern for me--- the many vs. the few. I am alone, or with a few other people facing an opposing group of some sort--- it can be a group of criminals, aliens, zombies, a Nazi/fascist government, whatever. My old habits, especially when I was a kid, would be to run and hide. 

 

When I take up a martial art, there is less running and hiding. As I practice more, and it steeps into my mind/body, the practices start to show up in dreams. Maybe I'll fight one or two of the "enemies." Over time, as I continue to do MA, I eventually stop running and fight, sometimes an entire group. It can get so intense that I will wake myself up. 

 

Now in other circumstances, when I'm working on bodhicitta or compassion, the whole tenor of the dream changes. The opposing group is often an apparent enemy, but I don't see them as a threat. The threat level is usually tied directly to my resistance. If I am afraid or resisting them in some way, they usually become scary and violent. But if I am more open and accepting, they tend to become either friendly or they don't engage at all. 

 

So usually my dreams manifest in some way according to the habits I am building during the day. 

 

 

 

I think this piece is  brilliant offering on that subject ;

 

 

.....   a whole other subject worth its own thread

 

[Nungali]

On 03/06/2021 at 8:56 AM, dwai said:

I went through a phase in my life where I would frequently face multiple opponents in dreams -- initially in physical confrontations, and after I started my spiritual practices, in psychic confrontations. The multiple opponents could be due to the fact that I was attacked by about sixteen guys (from a rival school) when I was in high school -- ambushed one evening while I was walking home on a desolate little side-road -- it was a most traumatic event -- I was helpless -- there was no way I could fight off those many guys...so a cycle of shame, guilt, self-loathing (eventually) started. That led to all sorts of psychological and physiological problems for me, that took more than 20 years to resolve...

 

After I started my spiritual practices, I was going through an especially difficult period, when a yogi visited me in a dream, and told me to practice a mantra. I woke up chanting the mantra under my breath, and I practiced it daily, as he told me to -- the problems started resolving themselves within 2 weeks -- I mean serious existential ones. And then, I somehow knew how to use the mantra in my dreams to deal with troubles (especially psychic ones) -- when I'd find certain unsavory characters come at me, I'd form the "sword finger" in my dream, say the mantra mentally and the characters would literally disappear into a puff of smoke.  This became a specific pattern for many years -- often these types of characters would appear (sometimes in the form of loved ones, family members, etc) -- and the mantra would make them disappear. 

 

When I started doing Aikido, I'd have dreams where these "enemies" would attack me, and I'd do the aikido techniques on them, but they'd just roll and jump right back....so frustrating. 

 

After I had the realization one day, the next few times these dream "enemies" stopped by, instead of fighting them or vanquishing them, I decided to lovingly hug them, knowing them to be my own Self, and lo and behold! they merged into me. There is no longer the "forgetting" my 'Self' in dreams...

 

That is because they where all pert of you in the first place .  But sometimes its better ( or 'handy') to see them as separate .

 

Not just in dreams, but also in 'reality '  .... I was not going to write about this , but ....   few nights back , I felt someone was arriving, I opened the door and looked out and  saw  fleeting shape  that was not really there .  I focused more into the darkness   and saw a ragged dishevelled rotted  humanoid shape . It seemed to want to frighten me.  Now there re  lot of 'spirits' around here of all different types , some associated with horrific indigenous massacres .  The angry old lady that will scare you has been sighted by a few, even driven some clear out the valley .  It was a cold night , so I invited them in to sit by the fire. I made them a cup of tea and out it near the seat, with a biscuit on  a plate .

 

Such approaches can be greatly beneficial , to both parties    ( if one knows what one is doing and what is going on ) .

 

[TranquilTurmoil]

I know little about martial arts, don’t know any martial artists but am more familiar with insecurity and have been accused of being deluded for years. I think if we are skillful then insecurity, delusion, and realization can dance together. We have to be mindful of the extent of our insecurity and delusion, how it influences us and work with it and on it. I think that’s a form of subtle awareness or “realization” (though obviously not a major transcendental realization) and is quite helpful. 
A main enemy of realization and cultivation is believing we are realized and cultivated and the self-righteousness and pride that accompanies such an attitude. Which I’m sure many of us have gone through or are going through🙏🏼