Teaching authentic neigong

[小梦想]

3 hours ago, Jaba said:

Did you imply 30minutes in total or only per session and multiple session a day? -- so, how much to practice in this system, daily?

In the beginning I don't recommend doing more than 10 mins active neigong a day, this can slowly be increased over time. You still need to do the recommended stillness and external practice too which comes to about 30-40 mins total practice time per day. 

Safety for me in very important and people should not start with too much or increase time if they are having any adverse reactions. Health plays a big part and considering I don't know the health situation of people who will be joining, I will put emphasis on safely practicing above anything else.

 

3 hours ago, Jaba said:

Problems with any type of exercise? Like gym free weights and preworkout daily? Isometrics/Isotonic workout (tensing/flexing the muscles only, basically)? -- ok to do any exercise together with your system?

Being active and getting exercise is good for health. As long as your training isn't draining your health and leaving you weak, it should be fine.

 

3 hours ago, Jaba said:

You know Damo Mitchells online academy? Problem with your system and his online academy system?

Considering he teaches neigong too, you would not expect them to be incompatible.

 

3 hours ago, Jaba said:

But what is electric qi?

Please watch the video I shared, it will explain.

 

3 hours ago, Jaba said:

Can you fa qi this special electric qi online

I honestly can't tell if you are trolling or not.

 

Edited September 1, 2021 by 小梦想

[Andy_W]

18 hours ago, freeform said:

Look up yin depletion and blood depletion, and see if the symptoms line up.

Thanks thats interesting. I looked up  depletion symptoms and I have none of those. I was mainly wondering  what dantien cultivation could do for health and it makes sense that its not enough on its own but must go together with a healthy lifestyle.

 

 

[freeform]

2 hours ago, Andy_W said:

Thanks thats interesting. I looked up  depletion symptoms and I have none of those. I was mainly wondering  what dantien cultivation could do for health and it makes sense that its not enough on its own but must go together with a healthy lifestyle.

 

 

 

Depends on the methods.

 

If the method helps to anchor your Qi in your Dantien, then it will support the yin, it will enable your organs to work efficiently and will slowly fill your channels. This can help to support the Yin, it can help to keep you calm, centred and confident and less emotionally reactive.

 

It's also a prerequisite for much of the Daoist methods of transformation and growth.

 

If the Qi rises and is too erratic, it will instead start to power your emotions and habitual stress response.

 

And there's another major issue that comes up (for men in particular) - a strong dantien and a lot of Qi will invariably start to inflame your 'base desires'... basically cravings for sex, power, status etc. Genuine lineages have specific ways of avoiding this.

[Dev]

1 hour ago, freeform said:

 

Depends on the methods.

 

If the method helps to anchor your Qi in your Dantien, then it will support the yin, it will enable your organs to work efficiently and will slowly fill your channels. This can help to support the Yin, it can help to keep you calm, centred and confident and less emotionally reactive.

 

It's also a prerequisite for much of the Daoist methods of transformation and growth.

 

If the Qi rises and is too erratic, it will instead start to power your emotions and habitual stress response.

 

And there's another major issue that comes up (for men in particular) - a strong dantien and a lot of Qi will invariably start to inflame your 'base desires'... basically cravings for sex, power, status etc. Genuine lineages have specific ways of avoiding this.

 

What are the recommended lifestyle/health practices to get your body healthy and ready for nei'gong? I read something about avoiding the 5 grains, is that a diet that is applied to nei'gong? I'm reasonably healthy already (no dairy/meat, low sugar, lowish saturated fat, no high-GI, very few processed foods, mostly wholegrain, do yoga here and there and hike once a week - also starting to plank for a few minutes daily). What could I improve on? Any suggestions/insights?

[小梦想]

1 hour ago, freeform said:

And there's another major issue that comes up (for men in particular) - a strong dantien and a lot of Qi will invariably start to inflame your 'base desires'... basically cravings for sex, power, status etc. Genuine lineages have specific ways of avoiding this.

A strong healthy body with good testosterone levels will do this.

 

1 hour ago, freeform said:

If the method helps to anchor your Qi in your Dantien, then it will support the yin, it will enable your organs to work efficiently and will slowly fill your channels. This can help to support the Yin, it can help to keep you calm, centred and confident and less emotionally reactive.

This is one of the main reasons people run into problems with some of the qigong/neigong currently being taught, way too little emphasis put on having qi where it should be. There is also a failure to specify when certain practices should be done. 

[Dev]

Also, in around november I'm going to do a series of fasts (juice and normal), and do a herbal intestinal cleanse (using a gentle, gradual cleansing agent), along with a kambo ceremony to clear my body of toxins and waste products. Also will be doing an iboga retreat to get some solid shadow work done, to decondition and resolve a couple traumas and balance myself mentally, because I would rather approach nei'gong with a focused, balanced, clean mind, free of shadows and trauma that will interfere and hold me back. Also likely to go on a vippassana retreat. What I want to know, is since iboga has a metabolite that lasts for 2-3 weeks or so, and continues to work its magic for that period, should i hold off the nei'gong etc for a while after the retreat just to be safe? Will the iboga/kambo interfere at all? Freeform pointed out to me that kambo activates your wei qi, is that a good/bad thing?

[freeform]

4 hours ago, Dev said:

What are the recommended lifestyle/health practices to get your body healthy and ready for nei'gong?

Basically building ‘blood’ - which is a Chinese medical term (as in - it means more than just the red stuff flowing through you).

 

Its difficult to build blood on a vegetarian diet. Lots of dark green leafy veg and lots of beetroot and stuff like pumpkin and sweet potato… spirulina, chlorella… nuts, seeds (black sesame seeds are particularly good). Have to have a lot of this stuff if vegetarian. 
 

If not vegy - beef, pork, chicken, bone marrow, organ meats, bone broth etc - don’t need to have a lot, but regularly.

 

Learn about your habitual emotional patterns… what makes you overthink, what makes you stressed, angry, agitated… what are you addicted to? This means subtle addiction - anything that is compulsive. Checking the phone and the socials is a big addictive thing for many… porn… masturbation… video games… late nights… alcohol… weed… food… addictive tendencies will drain kidney yin and disperse the jing.

 

I would say avoid Neigong while fasting and leave a couple of months between Neigong and psychedelics or other powerful psychoactive drugs.

 

You can certainly learn the method - just don’t practice it while fasted or too soon before or after taking psychoactives.

 

In the beginning while you’re still learning it’s probably ok - but when things start to ‘work’ you’ll realise just how powerful these methods are - and why there are contraindications.

[小梦想]

12 hours ago, freeform said:

Its difficult to build blood on a vegetarian diet. Lots of dark green leafy veg and lots of beetroot and stuff like pumpkin and sweet potato… spirulina, chlorella… nuts, seeds (black sesame seeds are particularly good). Have to have a lot of this stuff if vegetarian. 
 

If not vegy - beef, pork, chicken, bone marrow, organ meats, bone broth etc - don’t need to have a lot, but regularly.

 

Learn about your habitual emotional patterns… what makes you overthink, what makes you stressed, angry, agitated… what are you addicted to? This means subtle addiction - anything that is compulsive. Checking the phone and the socials is a big addictive thing for many… porn… masturbation… video games… late nights… alcohol… weed… food… addictive tendencies will drain kidney yin and disperse the jing.

 

I would say avoid Neigong while fasting and leave a couple of months between Neigong and psychedelics or other powerful psychoactive drugs.

Your advise is spot on.

One thing that isn't often explained, especial to those who are trying to heal up from previous bad habits is the fact that a lot of "healthy" food can be quite damaging to their attempts to get healthier. 

Examples would be starting to consume a lot more nuts, fruit and smoothies, which sounds super healthy to do, but depending on your internal condition can actually put increased strain on your body. Having spleen qi deficiency for instance makes digesting hard to digest food quite difficult and the increase in acid from fruit causes it's own set of problems. Healthy oils can also cause problems despite their nutritional values and "healthy smoothies" which are consumed cold can do more harm than good. 

It's important to understand these little caveats when your goal is to get healthier.

Edited September 2, 2021 by 小梦想
Always fixing grammar.

[Dev]

15 hours ago, freeform said:

building ‘blood’

I'll research this

 

15 hours ago, freeform said:

Lots of dark green leafy veg and lots of beetroot and stuff like pumpkin and sweet potato… spirulina, chlorella… nuts, seeds (black sesame seeds are particularly good)

What specific nutrients/compounds are in these foods that you need more of? Or is it more that they are yin/yang foods?

 

15 hours ago, freeform said:

This means subtle addiction - anything that is compulsive. Checking the phone and the socials is a big addictive thing for many… porn… masturbation… video games… late nights… alcohol… weed… food… addictive tendencies will drain kidney yin and disperse the jing.

I see. I've been cutting a lot of addictions recently - social media, caffeine. I think the main thing i need to focus on right now is not overeating, even though i eat healthily, too much is not good, especially when its just a subtle 'feel-good' mechanism. I saw that video by damo on nourishing the kidneys, i'm gonna watch it and see what he says

 

15 hours ago, freeform said:

Learn about your habitual emotional patterns… what makes you overthink, what makes you stressed, angry, agitated

Yeah thats a big part of why I'm doing the iboga, I know many of these patterns already, I just need to go a bit deeper into them and cleanse myself of them

 

15 hours ago, freeform said:

I would say avoid Neigong while fasting and leave a couple of months between Neigong and psychedelics or other powerful psychoactive drugs.

Okay, will do. Thanks for the advice  

[freeform]

14 minutes ago, Dev said:

What specific nutrients/compounds are in these foods that you need more of? Or is it more that they are yin/yang foods?

Its the overall quality - not specific nutrients. When you take nutrients out of the whole, then the quality will change.

[Dev]

3 hours ago, freeform said:

Its the overall quality - not specific nutrients. When you take nutrients out of the whole, then the quality will change.

Okay so definitely organic, wholefoods are the way to go

 

https://www.shenspace.ca/blood-nourishing-foods

 

Can you tell me what you think of the info in this article? Very much appreciated  

[freeform]

5 hours ago, Dev said:

Okay so definitely organic, wholefoods are the way to go

 

https://www.shenspace.ca/blood-nourishing-foods

 

Can you tell me what you think of the info in this article? Very much appreciated  

It’s ok. It breaks things down into nutrients, which I think is an unhelpful way of understanding these things. 
 

My advice is better for Neigong. This is because for Neigong you generally want energetically warm and neutral foods… spirulina is cool, but things like beetroot, sweet potato, dark green kale, pumpkin etc. for fruit - dates, figs, grapes, pomegranate, apricots, cherry…
 

These are generally warm or neutral…

 

Ideally you would be diagnosed according to Chinese medicine to see your constitution - but overall warm and neutral is good…

 

you can have cool foods in moderation (if you have heat issues energetically, a bit more cool might be helpful for a time) but avoid cold foods (yogurt, bananas, dandelion leaf, most seaweeds, tomatoes, melons, cucumbers)… also avoid hot foods in general. Don’t need to be strict, just don’t rely too heavily on these foods… once in a while it’s ok. Once you have a Dantien you’ll know what’s good for you and what isn’t.

[Master Logray]

8 hours ago, freeform said:

It’s ok. It breaks things down into nutrients, which I think is an unhelpful way of understanding these things. 
 

My advice is better for Neigong. This is because for Neigong you generally want energetically warm and neutral foods… spirulina is cool, but things like beetroot, sweet potato, dark green kale, pumpkin etc. for fruit - dates, figs, grapes, pomegranate, apricots, cherry…
 

These are generally warm or neutral…

 

Ideally you would be diagnosed according to Chinese medicine to see your constitution - but overall warm and neutral is good…

 

you can have cool foods in moderation (if you have heat issues energetically, a bit more cool might be helpful for a time) but avoid cold foods (yogurt, bananas, dandelion leaf, most seaweeds, tomatoes, melons, cucumbers)… also avoid hot foods in general. Don’t need to be strict, just don’t rely too heavily on these foods… once in a while it’s ok. Once you have a Dantien you’ll know what’s good for you and what isn’t.

 

Avoid ice cold beer is a must.

[Dev]

14 hours ago, freeform said:

which I think is an unhelpful way of understanding these things

Right, I was wondering about that

 

14 hours ago, freeform said:

Ideally you would be diagnosed according to Chinese medicine to see your constitution - but overall warm and neutral is good

Maybe I can try find a TCM practitioner to give me a diagnosis. They're few and far inbetween here in RSA though.

 

14 hours ago, freeform said:

but avoid cold foods

Does 'cold' have anything to do with heat? E.g if i mash a banana into some warm oats, is it now a warm food?

 

14 hours ago, freeform said:

also avoid hot foods in general

Does this include chilli?

[Dev]

5 hours ago, Master Logray said:

Avoid ice cold beer is a must.

 

Okay thanks, that's unfortunate, but if it's gotta be done, it's gotta be done.

[freeform]

1 hour ago, Dev said:

Does 'cold' have anything to do with heat? E.g if i mash a banana into some warm oats, is it now a warm food?

 

Heat has a minor effect… as in there’s a difference between a frozen banana and a grilled banana… but it’s not a big difference.

 

Food combinations can balance things a little… for instance oats are warm and bananas are cold - this can shift the dish as a whole into the cool category. (Try oats with dates )

 

The way you cook things also affects the Energetics… grilling creates a hot quality whereas steaming is neutral. Local climate and seasonal variation will have an effect too… for instance it’s ok to eat a little more cool foods in the middle of summer (which is when most of the cool fruits and veg ripen).

 

You'll find local, traditional, seasonal peasant dishes from a few hundred years ago have almost perfect combinations of ingredients for good health.

 

Its a pretty big, involved subject - I’m sure people will be able to recommend decent books on it. (Try a search here).
 

But the whole diet thing doesn’t have to be compulsive. Don’t get too embroiled in it. If 80% of your meals meet the criteria then you’re fine. Its only if you have health issues, that you could be more careful about doing the right things.

 

[Piyadasi]

@freeform

Thank you for elaborating on all this, I didn't look as deeply into this as I wanted to so far. I had no idea bananas and tomatoes were cold, not just cool, for example.

I'm wondering if bananas+oats make cool, adding something like cinnamon would make it neutral? And adding more, say chilies , would make it warm? So can you theoretically keep altering the overall quality like this? But I guess this where it comes in that too many ingredients confuse the digestion and make it more difficult or perhaps 'damage' the overall energetic makeup of the dish?

I also wonder with the idea that the DT will help discern what is good for you to eat... I feel like that must be something that is affected by how you view food, whether you have an addiction or something you like a lot, preferences like that, it will presumably cloud your body's ability to make it clear for your mind (so to speak)?

Any favorite European/Middle-eastern (for sake of ingredient accessibility) style recipes btw ?

[freeform]

42 minutes ago, Piyadasi said:

I'm wondering if bananas+oats make cool, adding something like cinnamon would make it neutral?

It’s tricky because as you say you can easily over-complicate a dish. Also ingredients at the direct opposite spectrum can confuse the digestion… such as frozen bananas in chilli and garlic oil  

 

Or deep fried Mars bar with ice cream 😅

 

So generally you match ingredients that aren’t extreme opposites.

 

Though saying that, some herbs and spices can be helpful in balancing a dish if not over-done.

 

42 minutes ago, Piyadasi said:

Any favorite European/Middle-eastern

Borscht  that’s a great blood building and tasty dish.

 

Personally I eat quite simply most of the time - just steamed veggies with rice (though I’m fussy about rice - in Asia you can get what they call ‘gaba rice’ which is like sprouted brown rice - love that). Sometimes chicken or beef or some liver.

 

Stir-fries are great especially in spring and summer.

 

Simple stews, soups, beans, pumpkin, root veg etc for winter.

 

42 minutes ago, Piyadasi said:

I also wonder with the idea that the DT will help discern what is good for you to eat... I feel like that must be something that is affected by how you view food, whether you have an addiction or something you like a lot, preferences like that, it will presumably cloud your body's ability to make it clear for your mind (so to speak)?

Yeah totally. Any sort of compulsiveness around eating will pull you away from correctly reading your needs.

 

Though it’s also true that your Dantien will give you a bad case of the shits if it comes across something it really doesn’t like

 

After a few years, once the ‘container’ is built, it’s a lot less sensitive - and you tend to be naturally drawn to the right food for you anyway… sometimes you’ll be drawn to fasting.

 

I would say that this is the stage you want to shoot for - then all these distinctions don’t matter too much anymore, as you’ll get a really intuitive understanding of what’s right for you. But it takes time - and it takes weaning yourself off compulsive eating habits.

 

—————

 

Im conscious that this is getting really off topic - maybe we could splinter off the food stuff into another post?
 

How can that be achieved? Maybe a mod could help?

Edited September 3, 2021 by freeform

[小梦想]

1 hour ago, freeform said:

Im conscious that this is getting really off topic - maybe we could splinter off the food stuff into another post?

I honestly haven't minded it. It kept the thread alive and it's relevant for those who do wish to practice. 

You have explained it really well and hopefully will have helped quite a few people who are struggling with their health and diet in the process.

[小梦想]

I had some emails from people worried that I might be dishonest about my level of cultivation and/or knowledge of neigong. Asking that I upload videos onto youtube showing faqi as proof. I don't feel comfortable uploading videos on youtube showing faqi but funny enough there is a video of me on youtube showing my first faqi, although i wasn't the one who uploaded it. I have tons of videos, I just don't feel comfortable uploading them, I don't know why, I just don't like the idea of them being there. 

 

I have been on this forum for as long as I have been in china, and only ever really took part in the discussions on dantian cultivation or trying to give information on cultivation because I had access to authentic lineages and teachers. I never intended to teach but that is just how things worked out. Maybe it's karma...

 

It would be very stupid of me to be offering to teach authentic neigong and not know it or plan to teach some generic, widely known practices. People will almost certainly ask after the seminar how it was, make a thread about it and I would lose my credibility completely I taught the same practices you can find in many neigong books.

 

Those who join the seminar will know my full name, know some of the teachers I work with and know my phone number. it would be silly of me, downright stupid really, to try and cheat or con people.

[liminal_luke]

15 minutes ago, 小梦想 said:

I had some emails from people worried that I might be dishonest about my level of cultivation and/or knowledge of neigong. Asking that I upload videos onto youtube showing faqi as proof. 

 

I might be in some weird minority camp but if you linked to videos of yourself "showing faqi as proof" I´d feel less, not more, confident in you as a teacher.  I think your discomfort with the idea of proving yourself to strangers online with a video is good inner guidance.

 

Just sayin´.

[silent thunder]

23 minutes ago, liminal_luke said:

 

I might be in some weird minority camp but if you linked to videos of yourself "showing faqi as proof" I´d feel less, not more, confident in you as a teacher.  I think your discomfort with the idea of proving yourself to strangers online with a video is good inner guidance.

 

Just sayin´.

Count me a +1 on this.

 

I do not find such videos convincing, or inspiring.  Often, it's the opposite.

[senseless virtue]

Just now, silent thunder said:

I do not find such videos convincing, or inspiring.  Often, it's the opposite.

 

Besides, it wouldn't be enough unless there had been a team of accredited scientist examining the demonstration throughout on the scene and ruling out all possibilities of fraud. Some people have incredible standards, you know. 

[Master Logray]

1 hour ago, virtue said:

 

Besides, it wouldn't be enough unless there had been a team of accredited scientist examining the demonstration throughout on the scene and ruling out all possibilities of fraud. Some people have incredible standards, you know. 

 

Stage magician too.

[Takingcharge]

10 hours ago, 小梦想 said:

I honestly haven't minded it. It kept the thread alive and it's relevant for those who do wish to practice. 

You have explained it really well and hopefully will have helped quite a few people who are struggling with their health and diet in the process.

Yes Ive been paying attention for this reason