Why it's time to say goodbye

[manitou]

Hi friends,

 

Over the last months, it's been getting harder to sign in here and participate.  I find myself wanting to be amidst you, because of the love I have for the Bums - and a handful of Bums in particular.  So I seem to end up reading a post or two and putting a Like on what I consider to be a beautiful post that points the Way.  Or to find a laugh in the What made you laugh today thread.  The personality part of me, the ego, still connects to the personality parts of you, and I have enough ego left to want to feel the comradeship of one who lives in Culver City (or somewhere around there), one who lives in Baltimore, one who lives in Baja.  There are a few others, I just don't know where they live, but you know who you are.

 

What made me realize that it's time to drop out of active participation, is that I'm tired of my own words.  I've been evolving into these words for 40 years and it is partly because of you that I have learned these words.  These are not words that come through your mouths, but through your hearts; the hearts that have arrived at, or are very close to, Self Realization. You've pointed me to books, to philosophies; so many things to read and discuss.  And it is because of the melting pot nature of this place that I've been here as long as I have.  It is through the channel of my heart that these words and ideas come to me now, which I feel a need to communicate to you.  

 

I know that to put Freemasonry in the tag portion of this post seems odd.  I want to use this as an example, because the 33 degrees of Freemasonry are a very direct path to self-realization.  Of course I'm not a Freemason, I am merely a woman.  But I did get my hands on Morals and Dogma by Albert Pike at a yard sale some years ago, and was immediately captivated by it.  I studied it, and it pointed me to something.

 

When a man begins his journey in the Scottish Rites, he learns the name of a strange entity, introduced to him in the third degree.  That name is Hiram Abiff, a representation of Hermes.  This entity is introduced as the head mason appointed by King Solomon at the time the temple was built, and it is a lodestar for all further engagement within the Scottish Rites.  But it has a more esoteric meaning as well.  He is a half god/half man figure, a representation of that of which we are capable of understanding, once realized.  I use 'realized' because that is the final necessity for entrance into the 33rd degree.  It is a realization of who we are.  I'll pick this up again a little later.  Continuation along the Freemason path is an arduous task.  Each degree, as outlined in Pike's Morals and Dogma, enumerates in grueling detail the character qualities one must develop, but even more grueling, remove from one's character to ascend to the next level; the selfishness, the self centered aspects of ourselves.  Any seemingly odd ceremonies are in furtherance of the goal of removing conditioning from the individual; old beliefs, iffy upbringings, rejection of structure, in the end.

 

On a seemingly different note, I went to a retirement dinner a few years back.  I hadn't been to a police function in a long time, but when I walked in the door of the conference room, a gleaming bit of light immediately hit my eye.  It was the reflection off an oxygen tank worn by a particular man, who I immediately recognized.  His name was Jan, and he had been the police chaplain for some years.  He wrote a monthly spiritual article in The Blue Line, a police publication which I still get.  I was very glad to see him, we used to work together in the West L.A. squad room.  As I crossed the room to talk to him, the words 'lack of inspiration' came to mind, because he had manifested a breathing problem. I let that go, and walked up to him.  As we talked, I noted that he was wearing a Freemason ring.  I asked him if he was a 33rd degree, given the depth of his spirituality.  He answered 'No, I'm a 32nd degree'.  I'll pick this up again a little further down.

 

There was a 33rd degree Freemason named Manley Hall who is now deceased.  I knew him from his lectures at the Philosophical Research Society in Hollywood, CA, where he spoke on Sundays.  I tried to get to as many of his lectures as I could - this was in the early to mid seventies.  This beautiful man, always impeccable in a black suit and starched white shirt, his white hair gleaming under the lights on the stage where he sat, would slowly walk onto the stage, sit in the chair in the middle of the stage, close his eyes, and start channeling.  That was all you could call it.  The words flowed out of his being and into my heart, where I could 'feel' the resonance.  Although I was young, in my early 20's, something inside me knew that they were true words, straight as an arrow.  He had written metaphysical books, a few of which I still have.  It was one big seed he planted in my heart, although I didn't have the eyes or the ears yet to understand them - not fully.  If I were to reread them today, I would be reading with a different set of eyes.  He didn't speak of Freemasonry, not ever.  He spoke with the I Am consciousness as his context.  And subsequently, in one of his books, Mr. Hall did answer a question about the 33rd degree.  He said "Yes, it is the I Am consciousness".

 

In trying to describe this consciousness (which can't be described:  'the Dao that can be spoken is not the true Dao')  all I can do is to relate this to my own experience, and say what I have said ad nauseum on this site - the experience of a recovering alcoholic person.  The key to recovery, as it turns out, is to go through all previous conditionings, see where we made wrong turns, make amends to those we harmed; all in all a pretty humiliating experience to one with a large flaming ego.  But over the past 40 years, the rough edges have been smoothed; the peaks have turned into valleys; patience is with understanding; and most importantly, the realization of the oneness of all mankind, regardless of where on the planet we live, or what religious structure we've been brought into as a child, or adopted as an adult.  And as it also turns out, I am grateful for the fact that I was an alcoholic, because it led me here.  To you.  To a consciousness of oneness.  

 

And not just one with people; one with animals.  Oneness with trees, with rocks, with mountains, with sky, with fire and all the elements.  The total Oneness of life.  It is this mind expansion which is our reward - the ability to grasp this consciousness, the I Am.  The awareness that we are all the same substance,  the same stardust, and that we all have the I Am inside us that knows, although our egos like to capture that knowing to bolster ourselves and elevate ourselves to a higher position.  That's a challenge too; to keep our necessary ego out of the mix; that is a practice all its own.  But the Valley of the Dao is the goal; the ability to receive everything, to make no judgments, to see things as neither Good or Bad or Evil; to realize that if it's not done with Love, which is utilized in different forms, it's not the true Way.  To fully embrace Is-ness, with a twist of agape love and understanding as our guideposts.  Lofty, indeed.  And here we are, stuck in these skin bags walking this physical earth.

 

And what are religions?  They are conveyances to get us to the other shore.  Once arrived, there is no need to stay in the boat.  Just get out and walk the challenge; the challenge to remain in Consciousness as much as 'humanly' possible, the challenge to meet each situation with love, whatever that requires... and what your wisdom has taught you as to how to apply it.  The wisdom of how to love is a great challenge.  But above all, love life; not as a feeling, but as a practice.  Chop wood, carry water.  But with love always, placing ourselves as the valley into which all things flow.  No need for contention, no need for ambition; egoless.  And finally realizing that we really have no control over anything; that most often, the best answer to the enigma is to Do Nothing.  The universe knows what it's doing, and putting our hands into the water usually muddies it.

 

The reason I put such odd references in the Tags box, including will.i.am and Morgan Freeman, is because they get it.  The Black Eyed Peas singer gets it now.  William James Adams changed the spelling of William to will.i.am.  He now lives the I Am consciousness; his words now reflect that.  And Morgan Freeman?  I saw him interviewed by Larry King once.  As Freeman is instrumental in producing highly spiritual documentaries, King asked him "Do you believe in God?"  Freeman didn't miss a step; he looked right at Larry, and quietly said "I am god".  Larry then said "you mean, you believe in god, right?"  I don't recall Morgan saying anything further, other than smiling, but Larry King abruptly changed the subject, no doubt believe that he had a real kook on his hands.  I wonder how many folks are still sitting in mental institutions because they have this understanding.  That which we have been drawn to search for 'outside' is not outside at all.  It's this common entity that we all share.  We Are.  We are god, in that sense of the word. If you look at all of creation as a spear, we are the tip.  We're the thinking, feeling, seeing, touching, tasting, hearing tip.  The essence burns within us, always prodding us forward and into situations that are required for our further understanding.  Perhaps this is why we learn to still the mind, and why no harm comes to the sage.  Because life gets so incredibly smooth; we realized that all Time and Space are ours.  And that comes when we finally become capable of stilling the monkey mind.

 

And what is 'It' looking for?  Self realization; realization of who we Are.  We're 'It'.  I guess little kids had the answer all along;  'Tag, you're it!'  It occurs to me that that's what all of life, this wonderful earth, is looking for; Self Realization, but on a communal level.  There are so many seemingly horrible things now happening world-wide, but I take comfort in the Daodejing when it says 'that which is to be deflated must first be inflated'.  When I look at the political stuff that's happening, I try to keep this in mind.  And moreover, those politicians which appear most grievous are actually Me!  So, we wait and love, trusting that the universe knows what it's doing.  Actually, what's even more comforting is the Nowness of it all; and knowing that that which gives me anxiety, when I fall from consciousness on any given day, has actually already happened.  That snaps me back.

 

Like Ouroboros, the tail eating snake, I return to my friend Jan, the 32nd degree with 'lack of inspiration' in his oxygen tank at the retirement dinner.  We spoke for a few minutes, and then I was about to walk back to my table.  As I left, Jan smiled and said "God be with you", and he turned to talk to another.  I walked a few steps and stopped, turning around.  I realized his 'lack of inspiration' and the need for the oxygen tank.   I leaned down and whispered in his ear, "Jan, we are god", and then I walked away.  I turned back a few steps later to see how he reacted to this.  He had stopped talking to the other person, and he was staring in disbelief at me.  His eyes were sparkling, like a little kid's.  His jaw was hanging open.  He got it.  And this encounter was written up in his next article in the Blue Line.  

 

At that moment, my friend Jan ascended to the 33rd Degree. 

 

He became Hiram Abiff,  just in time.  He died a month later.

 

For anyone who reads this, thanks for hearing me out.  If this turns into a thread, I don't want to make it about me.  Any personal comments, please PM me.  I'll still be around, just not quite so often.  And this is most likely my last lengthy post.

 

Love to everyone.

 

You're the best.

        

 

Barb Ortega

 

 

 

 

 

[Nungali]

First off, how delightful and refreshing to read intelligent comment on Freemasonry instead of the silly old  incorrectly informed conspiracy crap .

 

And also interesting , to me, to read a woman's perspective on what is considered a Man only realm  ( except for  Co-Masonry) . Also to read a perspective that comes from reading and observation  that seems perceptive and balanced .

 

Poor old Hiram .   He was privy to the mysteries , being a Master .  But as is the way of the world , the unscrupulous sought to seize his power.  He refused and the first 'ruffian'  dealt him a blow on the head , the second a blow to the heart and the third , to the lower body .

 

 

 

Death and rebirth , a new  life, activated by a new 'power of three '

 

 

 

 

So a  Master Mason is ritually killed and 'raised again' .   A note on Hiram ;

 

In 1 Kings 7:13–14, Hiram is described as the son of a widow from the tribe of Naphtali who was the son of a Tyrian bronze worker, sent for by Solomon to cast the bronze furnishings and ornate decorations for the new temple. From this reference, Freemasons often refer to Hiram (with the added Abiff) as "the widow's son."   - Wiki .

 

 

Jesus Raises a Widow's Son ;

 

 

^... As he drew near to the gate of the town, behold, a man who had died was being carried out, the only son of his mother, and she was a widow, and a considerable crowd from the town was with her. ¹³ And when the Lord saw her, he had compassion on her and said to her, “Do not weep.” ¹⁴ Then he came up and touched the bier, and the bearers stood still. And he said, “Young man, I say to you, arise.” ¹⁵ And the dead man sat up and began to speak,

 

 

.

Edited December 12, 2021 by Nungali

[Indiken]

Hi @manitou,

 

I am speaking to myself,

 

At last I am leaving, finally,

 

I urged myself to leave last year,

 

but, I did not hear myself,

 

I have nothing to achieve, hence I do not belong here,

 

All is one and infinite,

 

hence,

 

there is nothing at all

[manitou]

20 hours ago, Nungali said:

Also to read a perspective that comes from reading and observation  that seems perceptive and balanced .

 

 

 

There is another component that is needed.  Inner work.  There is much in the steps of recovery that parallels the first 32 degrees.  Those of us who finally get it are called Cosmic Masons, according to Manley Hall - even if we didn't take the exact same path.  Many masters can be found within the halls of recovery.

[Nungali]

2 hours ago, manitou said:

 

 

There is another component that is needed.  Inner work.  There is much in the steps of recovery that parallels the first 32 degrees.  Those of us who finally get it are called Cosmic Masons, according to Manley Hall - even if we didn't take the exact same path.  Many masters can be found within the halls of recovery.

 

Yes, I have found this on my  journey through initiation  ( both receiving and giving ) ; an initiation should reflect a major life experience and be education about that experience .  Either ;

 

a preparation for experience to come

 

or a context to put experience one has  already had  into perspective and understanding .

 

So people are all different in their journey , the life journey may not play out consecutively  as the degree progression does .  As one goes along through the degree progression some stages might be harder or easier , some might have already been 'cemented' on the earth plane  and others yet to be experienced .

 

Eg . the nature of the  Rosicrucian Degrees might be more easily accomplished by one that has had the life experience of marriage, children and 'giving up primary self focus' to that of the family unit.  

 

And because initiation is a reflection of lif'e's stages ... one who navigates through those  will be 'Cosmic Masons '  /  Cosmic Initiates ....  'raised' themselves by their own bootstraps , as it where .    It might  harder path ,  navigating it oneself, suffering perhaps more bumps, smashes and long periods of recover , sometimes taking the long route , etc .  But also, there are other systems  out there , with similar principles  ( that you found , in the seeking of help for your recovery ) that can deal with specific issues  and focus on them .

 

Addiction is a tricky one .   I have seen many a person get a 'shake up '   when doing their first degree OTO  and encountering the oath against being unduly influenced by  ANY  drug  .... which are tiresomely  all listed and gone through   (  " Damn !  I thought this was going to be some type of debauched Aleister Crowley drug party ! "     )      

 

 

No one system trumps another  - generally . But certain systems suit certain types of people better than others .

[natural]

54 minutes ago, Nungali said:

 

No one system trumps another  - generally . But certain systems suit certain types of people better than others .

Yes!

[manitou]

5 hours ago, Nungali said:

No one system trumps another  - generally . But certain systems suit certain types of people better than others .

 

And this affirms that all systems, all paths, all religions end up in the same place.

 

I watched Gandhi again a few weeks ago.  At one point, a reporter asks him if he is Hindu.  Gandhi replied, Yes.  I am Hindu, Buddhist, Sikh, Christian....

 

There is one thing I would like to ask you, Nungers.  Reverse geyser?  Does it have to do with character traits you are eliminating, rather than expressing?  Or does it have more to do with your toilet flushing in the opposite direction than mine?

 

 

Edited December 14, 2021 by manitou

[Nungali]

1 hour ago, manitou said:

 

And this affirms that all systems, all paths, all religions end up in the same place.

 

I watched Gandhi again a few weeks ago.  At one point, a reporter asks him if he is Hindu.  Gandhi replied, Yes.  I am Hindu, Buddhist, Sikh, Christian....

 

There is one thing I would like to ask you, Nungers.  Reverse geyser?  Does it have to do with character traits you are eliminating, rather than expressing?  Or does it have more to do with your toilet flushing in the opposite direction than mine?

 

 

 

I dont like the idea of a geyser  in a toilet bowl  !  

 

Reverse geyser ; think of a black hole;   a black hole of  knowledge , understanding and wisdom .

 

Also its about how attractive I still am      and NOT turning into an old geyser at all ,  no way  ...... not one bit       

 

 

 

 

[Nungali]

 

<glitch>

Edited December 14, 2021 by Nungali

[Shadao]

On 12/12/2021 at 3:04 PM, manitou said:

Of course I'm not a Freemason, I am merely a woman

To this day I still hate how many freemasons speak of freemasonry as a means to achieve self-realization, personal growth and such, and how this is something they wish of/for others, but still keep this archaic practice of prohibiting women of being freemasons themselves...so much for being an "enlightening group" huh?

[Earl Grey]

1 hour ago, Shadao said:

To this day I still hate how many freemasons speak of freemasonry as a means to achieve self-realization, personal growth and such, and how this is something they wish of/for others, but still keep this archaic practice of prohibiting women of being freemasons themselves...so much for being an "enlightening group" huh?

Sororities will probably allow men to join before that happens.

[dwai]

I know the impulse you mention @manitou but you are what this community needs. Some might not read your posts, some others might read and not understand, but there are seeds of wisdom you plant through your interactions.

 

On 12/12/2021 at 12:04 PM, manitou said:

all I can do is to relate this to my own experience, and say what I have said ad nauseum on this site - the experience of a recovering alcoholic person

What is the rest of humanity, if not suffering from one or more forms of (form) addictions?

 

So, if you want to leave, that's your prerogative. But there are those of us who value your presence.  

[liminal_luke]

...

Edited December 15, 2021 by liminal_luke

[Nungali]

16 hours ago, Shadao said:

To this day I still hate how many freemasons speak of freemasonry as a means to achieve self-realization, personal growth and such, and how this is something they wish of/for others, but still keep this archaic practice of prohibiting women of being freemasons themselves...so much for being an "enlightening group" huh?

 

The thing is , it is a 'male mystery '   and the initiate is playing the part of the man ( Hiram ) .   In Old Boy dont like women doing that .

 

In   (originally )  an offshoot from FM , the OTO  went through changes to become something different  and was updated by Aleister Crowley , a one time Grand Master of the order . Its still a 'male mystery' but women are free to join , lead groups  and become initiators .  But in the rite of initiation they are still playing the part of a man ( not Hiram, another ) .     Thats they way the rite is , and if they want to experience that , that is okay  ( there is no restriction against gay people either ) .

 

In many aspects FM is way behind the times , thats why its dying out , and similar more progressive groups with more modern views had been  filling the void.

 

Of course there are some wonderful stories and myths that can be and have been made into woman's mysteries and rites of passage .   We wrote and performed one ourselves when our group was active  ;  Rite of  Persephone .

 

It might be good for Men to go through some of those rites and be 'ritually exposed' to some of the issues women have been dealing with for centuries . 

Edited December 14, 2021 by Nungali

[Nungali]

14 hours ago, Earl Grey said:

Sororities will probably allow men to join before that happens.

 

Oh no !   I read a Freemasons magazine where it had an article refuting all this .  "  Women are not involved in FM ?  How ridiculous  .....  "

 

<  wait for it >

 

" Our wives make the costumes , They are involved in cooking and the preparation of feasts   .....  "     

 

 

... and the washing up afterwards of course .

[Earl Grey]

25 minutes ago, Nungali said:

 

Oh no !   I read a Freemasons magazine where it had an article refuting all this .  "  Women are not involved in FM ?  How ridiculous  .....  "

 

<  wait for it >

 

" Our wives make the costumes , They are involved in cooking and the preparation of feasts   .....  "     

 

 

... and the washing up afterwards of course .

I mean hey, there are dudes in sororities already.

 

Spoiler

 

[doc benway]

@manitou

 

I can relate to your rationale for stepping away from the forum.

I am also "tired of my own words," tired of words in general. 

I delete the vast majority of my posts and replies before ever posting them.

Silence nearly always seems more valuable and more significant than words for me.

 

While you don't want this thread to be about you, sorry - your last major post here cannot be about anything or anyone else for me!

You are a blessing and a delight, one of my favorite people here.

You have demonstrated courage, honesty, warmth, generosity, and insight that is rare among people.

You are loved and will be sorely missed around here, the community will be diminished by your absence.

With love and deep respect.

 

[Nungali]

Oooo ... thats nice, but dont do that  ( as requested ) .   

 

Just keep asking her questions ....

 

 

Spoiler

... try to distract her from her intent  ....like I do  at a  party or other situation, when someone says they are leaving  ..... and I dont want them to leave .

 

[manitou]

7 hours ago, steve said:

I can relate to your rationale for stepping away from the forum.

I am also "tired of my own words," tired of words in general. 

I delete the vast majority of my posts and replies before ever posting them.

Silence nearly always seems more valuable and more significant than words for me.

 

 

@steve,

 

This says it for me, exactly.  I guess I felt that I had to write something because my attendance has been so spotty over the past months.  But it's because of you, and Nungers, and Dwai, and the others I mentioned, that I wanted to write 'something' to explain my absence.  We've known each other soul to soul for too many years to just drop off the planet.  I remember when Songs of Distant Earth did the same thing - I was so sorry to see him go, it almost made me cry.  But when it gets harder and harder to sign on, for some strange reason, it just seems like 'pushing it' isn't a viable answer.

 

I too started deleting my posts before posting them.  What is it?  Not ennui.  I don't know.  Maybe when  certain consciousness is reached, it's too repetitive or something.  But I appreciate the fact that you hang in here anyway and shine your light for us.  As we all do.

 

I suspect that I'll be around.  I've got lots of art works to do now, and maybe an art hiatus is what I need.  I probably couldn't stay away from my loved ones here for very long.  Maybe I'll just turn into Marbles and wisecrack (as though I don't already).

 

Love you!

[thelerner]

Please be around, we need you.  Course so does your art.  

 

I'm back from a month or so hiatus.  Don't know if it was an intended plan, some laziness or maybe feeling without inspiration.  It was good to take time off, and it's good to be back.  There's a self reflection in writing on the board and a reflection reflection seeing how people react.  In these strange, uh Covid days its good to have companionship.

 

If you feel it's right, take time off, but don't stay away.

Edited December 16, 2021 by thelerner

[manitou]

2 hours ago, thelerner said:

Please be around, we need you.  Course so does you're art.  

 

I'm back from a month or so hiatus.  Don't know if it was an intended plan, some laziness or maybe feeling without inspiration.  It was good to take time off, and it's good to be back.  There's a self reflection in writing on the board and a reflection reflection seeing how people react.  In these strange, uh Covid days its good to have companionship.

 

If you feel it's right, take time off, but don't stay away.

 

 

Thank you so much, Michael.

[Owledge]

On 12/12/2021 at 7:04 PM, manitou said:

I leaned down and whispered in his ear, "Jan, we are god", and then I walked away.  I turned back a few steps later to see how he reacted to this.

The words alone could have failed in so many ways, but when the time and place and source and means of delivery are right, it can throw someone off balance. When I read that, it reminded me of the eerie moments of dawning realization I vaguely remember from ayahuasca experiences. That moment where one feels like having been shown 'the whole conspiracy', suddenly stuff feels magical, and even if it is just the surrounding circumstances, the how instead of the what, the feeling is the actual potency, the core of it all, the heart-opening that opens the mind, as opposed to our default state where the mind decides when and how much the heart is allowed to open.

 

Truth is best told in a hug.*

 

 

*) Could also say "through" a hug. - Which is the messenger and which is the message?

 

 

P.S.: When good people move on when naturally drawn to, it is never a loss. It might only be perceived as one for our ego. But those who understand the supreme power of the subtle, quiet currents know that it will be good for the whole system, nourish the root of all things.

It is by the nature of the dynamic that the purest cure for current society's ailments will fly under its radar.

 

This world is arguably obsessed with doing, so only through doing less can we change it towards balance.

 

Good luck will be with us. We wish so. It is our intention. No one could stop it but one alone.

[old3bob]

Might we be being fast and loose with terms or meanings? 

My take is that a "we" as the term is commonly used  equates to beings,  countless trillions and trillions of us at different stages of evolution thus  going through changes.   So in that sense a "we" does not equate to  an  absolute  God  beyond evolution or changes, even though we like the transcendental  idea of we being God (and appreciate having certain experience's along such lines) yet most of we will not or are not ready to return all the way;  I'm not, even though ultimately "we" also never left.

Edited December 16, 2021 by old3bob

[manitou]

17 hours ago, old3bob said:

Might we be being fast and loose with terms or meanings? 

My take is that a "we" as the term is commonly used  equates to beings,  countless trillions and trillions of us at different stages of evolution thus  going through changes.   So in that sense a "we" does not equate to  an  absolute  God  beyond evolution or changes, even though we like the transcendental  idea of we being God (and appreciate having certain experience's along such lines) yet most of we will not or are not ready to return all the way;  I'm not, even though ultimately "we" also never left.

 

 

My take is that we are the intelligence.  The same intelligence that tells all the identical cells in the embryo how to line up differently so that they will be different organs.  The cells are all the same.  But a fingernail cells lines up differently than the cells in an eyeball.  What is evolution if not the supreme intelligence you speak of?  It's not separate from us.  It's within us, pushing outward.  It's the intelligence that enables matter to retain its form.

 

 

[old3bob]

9 hours ago, manitou said:

 

 

My take is that we are the intelligence.  The same intelligence that tells all the identical cells in the embryo how to line up differently so that they will be different organs.  The cells are all the same.  But a fingernail cells lines up differently than the cells in an eyeball.  What is evolution if not the supreme intelligence you speak of?  It's not separate from us.  It's within us, pushing outward.  It's the intelligence that enables matter to retain its form.

 

 

yes and no to me....in the sense that derivates of said intelligence do not equate to the full intelligence that does not evolve,  or to put it another way still evolving souls (we) have limits and do not equate to our or the unchanging core or Spirit or "God".   The  "ten thousand" spoken of in the T.T.C. as derivatives can be named thus do not to equate to the Tao that can not be limited by name.