John Changs 1st Westerner student

[DentyDao]

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Edited July 11, 2015 by seandenty

[DentyDao]

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Edited July 11, 2015 by seandenty

[shidoin]

I like you to Max.

The point is that there can be an interesting discussion of what's possible without repeating the same point over and over, ad nausium. I don't know who the poster of the video is, but I don't think his intention was to provide proof of anything. I think the idea was to have a discussion.

 

I do agree that people should not blindly believe something, definitly. I wouldn't ask anyone to do that.

 

I put the Video up Sean! of course I wanted to discuss it and not have a pissing match. if I wanted that I would just go to youtube and fight with the teenagers. I want to know who this guy is and who posted the video on youtube. Was the poster the man in the video? you can't leave comments or send messages to him, How was this video obtained?

[DentyDao]

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Edited July 11, 2015 by seandenty

[DentyDao]

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Edited July 11, 2015 by seandenty

[Sahaj Nath]

here's a reason why i love ken wilber.

 

 

for most scientists, (Karl Popper being the most famous) in order for a proposition to be scientific it has to be falsifiable, i.e., there has to be a way to test it.

 

"i can emit energy from my palm" is a falsifiable statement, but not a false one.

 

"the energy i emit comes directly from Gautama Buddha," on the other hand, can not be tested in any way.

 

illusionists can very likely fake every feat that a master can perform. that only shows that the master's abilities are indeed testable by all known methods of trickery.

 

 

also, given that some folks are hung up on science, there's another concept worth considering:

 

scientific knowledge is paradigm-dependent.

 

in other words, a person who has never seen, used, or even heard of a microscope, isn't qualified to have an opinion about cellular structure. in order to gain access to the necessary data, that person would need a proper medium to grant them access to that data. reason alone does not suffice.

 

the same is true of what can be realized through internal practice. the specific practice and duration necessary for development is the medium by which one gains access to those experiences. they can't be apprehended through mere reason. other high-level practitioners are the only ones qualified to debate the abilities, and even then it's suspect if they haven't employed the exact same methods.

 

and just like science, reason is also paradigm-dependent.

 

the only way to get to the necessary paradigm shift is to employ the technology, i.e., sit on a cushion for the next ten years and breathe in a special manner.

 

 

 

a quote i've used once before:

 

"no, i've never heard of water," said the fish. "why do you ask?"

 

 

 

[Buddy]

"What you see in the video is real. That the possiblity of that is too far out or outlandish, just seems silly to me."

 

Sorry, denty this is just a stupid statement. You just want people to accept what you say blindly. It seems silly that someone can move inanimate objects with a wave of the hand? That you believe this seems inordinately naive.

 

"There's actually nothing that incredible about these things to me personally."

 

Of course not, you WANT to believe in the fantastic. Your lifestyle is incomplete without fantasy.

 

"I'm a little baffled by the amount of energy people devote to denying their existence."

 

Of course you are. You need a belief and it hurts you when others see your belief as childish.

 

"There are plently of higher order skills far more unbelievable that get written or talked about;"

 

Sure, we've all read the fables, the fairy tales, the myths. Native peoples have their own creation stories but that doesn't change the fact that the DNA studies have proven that the stories are only that.

 

 

"science is slow to catch on; there's no money in it."

 

It's a matter or fact, not money, son.

Edited May 7, 2008 by Buddy

[Smile]

Buddhist teaching does have an excellent road map to realization; unfortunately Daniel's work is incomplete.

 

Incomplete in what sense?

[sheng zhen]

seandenty and buddy could compare to Jerry Springer in making entertainment

[Buddy]

Nah, I'm more like the William F. Buckley. denty's like Timothy Leary.

[DentyDao]

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Edited July 11, 2015 by seandenty

[voidisyinyang]

These are good questions -- can a Muslim practice this or is it a banned "secret art"? Yes I've read the Quran and keep a copy out for quick access.

 

Is that healing I posted just a "1 in a 100" statistical coincidence? Or is this practice a consistent method for achieving results?

 

That's why I'm titling my book: THE SOUND SOUL: HOW HARMONICS HEAL.

 

I'm just so excited about how effective and how practical it is to use harmonics for healing in every day life. My muslim friend, Mustapha, has told me that I can sit "for hours on end" in full-lotus. Sure we joke that I am his "Kelb en Nasrani" or "Christian Dog," (haha!) but still Mustapha tells me that there are "no bad words" in his cafe. And so it is true with using words for healing. Chanting, prayer -- these are just free and universal examples of how people in all cultures use words for healing. Most language is based in emotions and even secularism -- science -- relies on focusing language into precise measurements for resonance -- contained matter of amplitude, phase, frequency and spin.

 

There are really no secrets here -- no need for special beliefs. All we have to do is understand the consistent terms in which resonance originally occurs -- the divergent sequence of the harmonic series. Sound, in its original form, is not contained. As sound resonates the form returns to the formless which is recognized in all religions as the source of the universe. When we listen to the source of sound then the natural resonance creates free healing energy. Sacred geometry is just the application of healing harmonics to the visual realm and this is why sacred geometry is a key practice in all religions. Even science is based on sacred geometry -- whether it's Buckyfullerenes from Platonic geometry or the spacetime cone of Minkowski.

 

The application of sacred geometry to harmonics means that we use only pure number without the attachment to language. This is why harmonics is impersonal and it's also why early religion did not allow the use of human images for worship. The tetrahedron resonates as a healing harmonic through the process of listening to the source of sound in our body and mind, thereby focusing the source of sound as the soul -- the heart which is beyond any visual place, with no start and no ending. By enacting the process of listening to sacred geometry we resonate with the source of our own I-thought and therefore logically infer the source of reality as something we can not visualize yet something that is real: pure consciousness.

[Buddy]

The difference between us denty is that you feign a benign spirituality until you can't (like when that guy asked about your guru's credentials, which you refuse to discuss) then you resort to cursing. It's a typical passive/aggressive way of acting. I'm not feigning anything. I am who I am and am completely comfortable with that. I don't need to involve myself in the fantastical. And whenever I see bullshit I'm going to point it out. You want to promote it, I want to expose it. So far, none of the videos of these alleged powers ring true. Most of them have been debunked, yours will too. But if you want to remain deluded more power to you. It's when you try to justify your nonsense that I'll chime in. Om Mani Padme Hum.

[宁]

Excuse me gentlemen,

 

Buddy, I agree that people dont need fantasy and mysticism to make their life worthwhile.

But in your statement... well, what would RING TRUE to you?

Edited May 7, 2008 by Little1

[DentyDao]

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Edited July 11, 2015 by seandenty

[joeblast]

Drew, please make it known when your book is done, I would be interested in reading it!

 

Sean...you might get further trying to argue with a ridiculously spoiled 9 year old....

 

Buddy, we've all read enough of your postings to understand that you're not going to believe anything anyone writes. Unfortunately, none of us is going to pony up the cash to ship you over to china so you can come back with a welt on your hand saying 'I guess I was wrong...' so....really, either make the trip or just let there be intelligent, mature discussion instead of running around trumpeting your ohhhhhhhh-so-accurate bullshit meter. Honestly...time after time you divert threads that could have some decent discussion and instead you make them into shit slinging matches. Have some consideration for the rest of us forum users, please.

[Jedi777]

Drew, please make it known when your book is done, I would be interested in reading it!

 

Sean...you might get further trying to argue with a ridiculously spoiled 9 year old....

 

Buddy, we've all read enough of your postings to understand that you're not going to believe anything anyone writes. Unfortunately, none of us is going to pony up the cash to ship you over to china so you can come back with a welt on your hand saying 'I guess I was wrong...' so....really, either make the trip or just let there be intelligent, mature discussion instead of running around trumpeting your ohhhhhhhh-so-accurate bullshit meter. Honestly...time after time you divert threads that could have some decent discussion and instead you make them into shit slinging matches. Have some consideration for the rest of us forum users, please.

 

very well said joeblast!!!!!!!!

[sunshine]

Thank you Matt

 

 

I thought that was a good analogy Harry. Thanks.

[Buddy]

joey,

 

"Buddy, we've all read enough of your postings to understand that you're not going to believe anything anyone writes."

 

So you've appointed yourself spokesman for the whole group, joey?

 

"Unfortunately, none of us is going to pony up the cash to ship you over to china so you can come back with a welt on your hand saying 'I guess I was wrong...' so....really, either make the trip or just let there be intelligent, mature discussion instead of running around trumpeting your ohhhhhhhh-so-accurate bullshit meter."

 

You and whom? Clearly you believe the hype, that's fine.

 

"Honestly...time after time you divert threads that could have some decent discussion and instead you make them into shit slinging matches."

 

I don't give a rats ass what you like or don't like, joey. I calls it like I sees it. If you need to believe in this crap, it's telling.

 

"Have some consideration for the rest of us forum users, please."

 

Don't read my posts if you don't like them, son. Seems simple to me.

 

Little,

 

"But in your statement... well, what would RING TRUE to you?"

 

Sorry, I'm not certain I understand your question. I'm in Massachusetts, if someone can show me this magic in person...or we can go to MIT here and do some verifiable tests. That would ring true.

[Neikung]

The difference between us denty is that you feign a benign spirituality until you can't (like when that guy asked about your guru's credentials, which you refuse to discuss) then you resort to cursing. It's a typical passive/aggressive way of acting. I'm not feigning anything. I am who I am and am completely comfortable with that. I don't need to involve myself in the fantastical. And whenever I see bullshit I'm going to point it out. You want to promote it, I want to expose it. So far, none of the videos of these alleged powers ring true. Most of them have been debunked, yours will too. But if you want to remain deluded more power to you. It's when you try to justify your nonsense that I'll chime in. Om Mani Padme Hum.

 

Buddy, It is healthy to have some levels of skepticism but one can't be too closed minded either. In addition to dark matter/energy, there are many phenomena unexplained by the current state of science. Acupuncture, for example, has been proven to work (clinical trials have been done and scientific papers have been published) but we have no clue how. Of course if you haven't experienced it, you won't believe that a few needles can somehow cure a disease. I am sure for many people the same principle applies for Qi.

As for Sean Denty, his teacher's credential is indeed questionable. I don't understand why his teacher, David, wouldn't gladly supply the information about where/when he got his doctoral degree. There shouldn't be anything secretive about it especially because PhD thesis is usually available publicly either in the university library or published in a journal. Having said that, I wouldn't discount Sean's claims about Sifu Jiang so easily either. The burn on the palm looks interesting and looks real although I also don't understand why anyone would want his/her laogong point burned like that. According to Chinese doctors, laogong is a major point, if hurt, it can lead to health problems.

[Matt]

Edited December 2, 2008 by Matt

[Gamuret]

As for Sean Denty, his teacher's credential is indeed questionable. I don't understand why his teacher, David, wouldn't gladly supply the information about where/when he got his doctoral degree. There shouldn't be anything secretive about it especially because PhD thesis is usually available publicly either in the university library or published in a journal. Having said that, I wouldn't discount Sean's claims about Sifu Jiang so easily either. The burn on the palm looks interesting and looks real although I also don't understand why anyone would want his/her laogong point burned like that. According to Chinese doctors, laogong is a major point, if hurt, it can lead to health problems.

 

An excellent point you made Neikung! I also cannot understand why David Verdesi's Ph. D. and the topic of his dissertation are such a tremendous secret.

 

And I assure you that I would never put these questions, if Sean Denty and David Verdesi were not making far-reaching claims of scholarly excellence and co-operation with the Chinese government in order to give David Verdesi's enterprise the veneer of respectability and to boost his reputation.

 

Sean Denty has been repeatedly advertising David Verdesi's scholarly abilities and close co-operation with the Chinese official institutions both at their website as well as at this forum. Why doesn't he back up his and his teacher's claims with solid evidence and state the names of the institutions and dates when these credentials were obtained?

 

One should really walk the walk and not just talk the talk.

 

For the sake of convenience let me again repeat the questions:

 

From which university and when exactly did D. Verdesi get his doctorate?

 

What was the subject and title of his thesis?

 

What academic area inside anthropology did he do his Ph. D. in? Medical anthropology, cultural anthropology?

 

It's also been stated that D. Verdesi is collaborating with the Chinese government as far as his forthcoming book is concerned. His masters are mentioned to be respectable members of the community holding official posts.

 

With which branch of the Chinese government does David Verdesi co-operate? The Ministry of Science and Technology, the Ministry of Culture? State Administration for Religious Affairs?

 

What kind of official positions do D. Verdesi's masters hold? And with which institutions?

 

Please keep in mind that I am not claiming David Verdesi or his teachers are fake. Quite on the contrary, if their abilities are genuine and David Verdesi is deceiving people with false or at least questionable credentials in order to attract new clientele, then this perfectly demonstrates the validity of my previous statement i. e. that we cannot simply equate preternatural powers with spiritual accomplishments, maturity of character or simply being an honest and decent person.

 

Would you want to study under a teacher who has genuine powers, but at the same time deceives or lies to you?

 

Isn't this much more worse than simply being duped by a fraud?

 

To further demonstrate my point let me quote Sean Denty's responses to my above listed questions:

 

Badges, we don't need no stinking badges!

 

...

 

No, why would I. I certainly am not interested in sharing anything with you. Your an asshole. To the sincere people who have inquired privately, I have already answered. David holds numerous titles which he happily showed me and others. Wang Liping and his other teachers are not public figures, but their position remains regardless of what you or anyone thinks. It is of no consequesnce whether you believe me or not. As far as I'm concerned you and Buddy can go fuck eachother.

 

And I ask again: is the liberal use of profanity and the most primitive insults the level of spiritual maturity that all of David Verdesi's students exhibit?

 

Were my questions or the tone of my posts really so arrogant, condescending and offensive?

 

It is also quite obvious that Sean Denty is neither honest nor self-critical. He often accuses members of this forum of immaturity and lack of good manners and yet at the same time he employs ad hominem attacks and the basest swear-words.

 

What is more important: honesty and transparency or power?

Edited May 7, 2008 by Gamuret

[voidisyinyang]

In the meanwhile -- this book covers EVERYTHING:

 

http://www.cs.org/publications/csq/csq-article.cfm?id=1658

[Buddy]

"Though I think there is an healthy, appropriate place for your opinions and skepticism, the way you hi-jacked the thread kind of sucks."

 

Matt, I didn't hijack the thread and it's unfair of you put it on me. I made a critical observation and then responded to the replies. That I have a forward way of expressing myself is who I am. I can't be concerned about the good opinions of internet personalities. If someone challenges my position I'm going to defend it. Unfortunately for some I'm better at it than they.

 

 

Nei,

"Buddy, It is healthy to have some levels of skepticism but one can't be too closed minded either."

 

I'm not closed minded, I just don't believe that fakers and posers should go unchallenged.

 

"In addition to dark matter/energy, there are many phenomena unexplained by the current state of science."

 

Of course, but let's not start attributing them to magical powers.

 

"Acupuncture, for example, has been proven to work (clinical trials have been done and scientific papers have been published) but we have no clue how."

 

Actually there's some evidence that it could be placebo. But the results are thusfar inconclusive.

 

"Of course if you haven't experienced it, you won't believe that a few needles can somehow cure a disease. I am sure for many people the same principle applies for Qi."

 

I had acupuncture for sciatica. It was useless. That said I had triggerpoint acupuncture that had some affect, just not lasting.

[voidisyinyang]

Buddy -- the person who started this thread flew to MN to take qigong master Chunyi Lin's classes and can assure you that http://springforestqigong.com is the real thing. Chunyi Lin is like John Chang -- only Lin is teaching in the U.S. and has a healing center here.