Taomeow Posted January 31, 2023 25 minutes ago, Maddie said: One other thing I noticed for not just myself but my daughter as well as as an acupuncturist sometimes that also use herbs that enter various channels to cultivate and they also seem to have some of the same emotional side effects as meditation or mantra. Has anyone noticed this? Especially entheogens. Other than that, a very fresh lobster, for me, seems to be the magic substance that unlocks meditative bliss and insight and transforms my emotions into something quietly glowing -- as though I've swallowed a star on the sly. But only if it's been transported straight from the ocean to the pot -- if it had to spend any time in between in captivity, it loses 100% of that special quality. 32 minutes ago, Maddie said: Without wanting to start a new thread I was also wondering if anyone has cultivated through the intellect as in studying texts and what not? A long time ago I was taught some raja yoga, as arcane as high-level asana yoga but targeting the mind. I didn't go "all the way" with it, not even close, but it was a useful experience -- to step aside from your own mind and take conscious disciplined control of it, instead of letting it either control you as most mundane experiences go, or asking it to STFU as the most widespread meditation methods go. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Maddie Posted January 31, 2023 2 hours ago, Taomeow said: Especially entheogens. Other than that, a very fresh lobster, for me, seems to be the magic substance that unlocks meditative bliss and insight and transforms my emotions into something quietly glowing -- as though I've swallowed a star on the sly. But only if it's been transported straight from the ocean to the pot -- if it had to spend any time in between in captivity, it loses 100% of that special quality. Very interesting, I've never heard that before. Quote or asking it to STFU as the most widespread meditation methods go. This has to be by FAR the most common misconception of what meditation is. Meditation isn't stopping the mind, it's knowing the mind. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Taomeow Posted January 31, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, Taomeow said: asking it to STFU as the most widespread meditation methods go. 35 minutes ago, Maddie said: This has to be by FAR the most common misconception of what meditation is. Meditation isn't stopping the mind, it's knowing the mind. "Knowing the mind" may be the stated goal, but "silencing the mind" is the most widespread method. It's not a "misconception" that it's the most widespread method, it's a fact. Not saying it's a good method or a bad method, just that it's the most widespread method. Raja yoga I was talking about uses totally different methods. To wit, "training the mind to do what it couldn't do without such training." The methods for training the mind in that tradition involve body-inclusive senses-engaging visualizations -- e.g. you grow infinite stuff out of your big toes and keep infinitely expanding it, in a fractal pattern, all the while not losing awareness of your big toes which keep multiplying, together with the stuff growing out of them that includes more big toes with stuff growing out of them, etc.. Or you play with your brain hemispheres -- on the left you have a sunny summer day and a freezing cold winter day on the right, complete with all the sounds, smells, sensations -- simultaneously. Or you have a dog barking in your left hemisphere and a monk chanting a mantra in your right one, simultaneously. And so on. This is not "the most widespread method" -- which is the only thing I asserted. Edited January 31, 2023 by Taomeow 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
S:C Posted January 31, 2023 2 hours ago, Taomeow said: time in between in captivity, it loses 100% of that special quality. That is fascinating! And what you wrote about Raja yoga too. It’s not something you can get a hold of at your local yoga studio, I suppose. Sad, but sounds amazing, from what I gather… even while being sure that I ain’t even getting the gist of it… 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Maddie Posted January 31, 2023 1 minute ago, Taomeow said: "Knowing the mind" may be the stated goal, but "silencing the mind" is the most widespread method. It's not a "misconception" that it's the most widespread method, it's a fact. Not saying it's a good method or a bad method, just that it's the most widespread method. Yes I agree that quieting the mind is an important means to an end, but I think the misunderstanding comes in because people hear that and then think that they are supposed to "make" their mind quiet and since this is not how it works then feel frustrated when it does not work this way. We can not make the mind directly quiet because according to the teaching of no-self the mind is not the self and therefore we can not control it as self. We can only set up causes and conditions that facilitate the mind becoming quieter (which it will if given time) but we can not make it quieter, and this is where most of the frustration and misunderstanding comes from. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
S:C Posted January 31, 2023 6 minutes ago, Maddie said: We can only set up causes and conditions that facilitate the mind becoming quieter Sounds awesome! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cobie Posted January 31, 2023 (edited) 40 minutes ago, Maddie said: … the mind is not the self and therefore we can not control it as self. … My (me, Cobie) “self” is not my “mind” and my self can control my mind. Edited January 31, 2023 by Cobie Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Maddie Posted January 31, 2023 12 minutes ago, Cobie said: My (me, Cobie) “self” is not my “mind” and my self can control my mind. Lol. Although clearly the teaching of non-self does not negate conscious choice. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
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