Jade emperor

[ChiDragon]

46 minutes ago, Taoist Texts said:

a shaman is weaker than the spirits. it is the spirits who tell him what to do. Priests/wu are stronger than the spirits. they boss the spirits around.

 

I believe a shaman can perform healing ritual to cure a sick person as a witch doctor. A Shaman act as a communication agent to contact all spirits. Shaman can make predictions of certain events and carved on oracles. For example, shaman can predict, in advance,  who is going to win the war between two rival tribes. No strike will take place if the war was predicted in a no win situation.

[Gerard]

22 hours ago, awaken said:

Moreover, traditional Chinese medicine is much more effective than Western medicine. To me, Western medicine is poison and has no specific effect on curing diseases

 

Glad to see you realised about it. But modern China was too involved in this corona 'virus' circus. How come?

[Chang dao ling]

3 minutes ago, Gerard said:

 

Glad to see you realised about it. But modern China was too involved in this corona 'virus' circus. How come?

I think ccp don't like it's country traditional medicine. Read this book Born a Healer by chunyi lin and Hunyanqigong book

[Master Logray]

Shaman is witch.   It has many names in different cultures and doing more or less similar things all over the world.   The name Shaman has been getting more popularly used since Carlos Castaneda's writings in 1960s, to describe witches in tribes.   There is no universal term for these people in Africa, central America, Siberia, China, South East Asia, Europe and India.   This term Shaman has even been spread to space, when Master Logray became the Shaman of Bright Tree Village, details can be found in Star Wars 6.

 

For centuries, China doesn't really have witches (巫).   So who serves the above functions?  - Taoism.   Taoism religion consists of QuanZhen temples, they are most conspicuous and fit into what is described as religion.   But under this umbrella of Taoism, it is increasingly mixed with witchcraft.   The 2nd main branch of Taoism is ZhengYi.  They are considered as the magical arm, the ceremonies and ritual servers, run worship temples (most of them don't work in formal temples).   It has witch or Shaman elements.   ZhengYi is extremely diversified.  So it is arguable some of them are really Taoist or not, as many are just being called "Sifu".

 

If ZhengYi is less known and associated with the supernatural side, there is another main branch which is even more obscure.  They are believed to be descendants of the White Lotus which is one of the earliest Taoist groups.   They are the Sin Tin Toa (Primordial Toa).  They worship Buddhist deities, well versed in Neidan, also have magic.   They were banned in China in Qing Dynasty.  In early communist China, they were regarded as reactionary, which was one of the worst possible accusation.   Nowadays they are widely spread  in Taiwan, and estimated in 25-40% of the temples in Hong Kong, also exist in Japan and Vietnam.

 

Some scholars/researchers regard these more fringe factions as China's folk religions.  While for normal people, they are loosely regarded as Taoists.  It is not easy to draw the line between formal religion, folk religion, witchcraft, superstition, and, frauds. 

 

 

 

 

 

[awaken]

18 hours ago, Taoist Texts said:

of course it is . westerners do not understand what a shaman does and how it is different from  巫. 

子曰：「南人有言曰：『人而無恆，不可以作巫醫。』

 

As I said long ago, there are witches, but no shamans.

 

我早就說過了，有巫，但是沒有薩滿。

 

 

[awaken]

15 hours ago, Cobie said:

In your opinion, what is “sacrificial culture”? And how is it different from “shaman”?

~~~
https://anthropoetics.ucla.edu/ap0102/china/  “… oracular activity typical of the Shang …”

 

 

 

As I have said many times, there is no record of Shaman in Chinese literature. This term was invented by the West. If there is any record of the term shaman in Chinese literature, please provide evidence. Otherwise, please change your wording.

 

說過很多次了，中國文獻找不到任何關於薩滿的紀載。這個名詞是西方編造出來的。如果中國文獻有任何關於薩滿這個名詞的紀載，請你拿出證據來。否則就請你更改你的用詞。

[awaken]

7 hours ago, Gerard said:

 

Glad to see you realised about it. But modern China was too involved in this corona 'virus' circus. How come?

 

I have said many times that Western medicine is completely ineffective in treating viruses, and Chinese medicine should be trusted. Chinese people do not believe in Chinese medicine because of one reason. For the same reason as the transfer method. The transfer method has changed the alchemy path, causing many people to be unable to achieve the golden elixir. Shi Fang tampered with traditional Chinese medicine, making it invalid.

 

我早就說過很多次了，西藥治療病毒完全無效，應該要相信中醫。中國人不相信中醫，是因為有一個原因。跟搬運法一樣的原因。搬運法竄改了丹道，導致很多人無法達成金丹。時方竄改了中醫，導致中醫無效。

 

What is the difference between Chinese people being brainwashed by Western medicine and Westerners being brainwashed by fake qigong masters?
same situation.
Look at how many people here have been brainwashed by fake qigong masters to the point where they don't know what's real and what's not. It's so funny that some people say that I forged classics. All of my classics are sourced, and those sources are not written by me, but public websites, such as government websites. How can I fake it?

 

中國人被西醫洗腦跟西方人被氣功假大師洗腦有何不同?
一樣的情況。
看看這裡有多少人，被氣功假大師洗腦到搞不清楚什麼是真甚麼是假。竟然還有人說我假造經典，太好笑了。我所有的經典都有註明來源，那些來源都不是我寫的，而是公共的網站，例如政府的網站。請問我如何假造?

 

 

https://ctext.org/

 

 

Edited February 13, 2023 by awaken

[awaken]

2 hours ago, Master Logray said:

Shaman is witch.   It has many names in different cultures and doing more or less similar things all over the world.   The name Shaman has been getting more popularly used since Carlos Castaneda's writings in 1960s, to describe witches in tribes.   There is no universal term for these people in Africa, central America, Siberia, China, South East Asia, Europe and India.   This term Shaman has even been spread to space, when Master Logray became the Shaman of Bright Tree Village, details can be found in Star Wars 6.

 

For centuries, China doesn't really have witches (巫).   So who serves the above functions?  - Taoism.   Taoism religion consists of QuanZhen temples, they are most conspicuous and fit into what is described as religion.   But under this umbrella of Taoism, it is increasingly mixed with witchcraft.   The 2nd main branch of Taoism is ZhengYi.  They are considered as the magical arm, the ceremonies and ritual servers, run worship temples (most of them don't work in formal temples).   It has witch or Shaman elements.   ZhengYi is extremely diversified.  So it is arguable some of them are really Taoist or not, as many are just being called "Sifu".

 

If ZhengYi is less known and associated with the supernatural side, there is another main branch which is even more obscure.  They are believed to be descendants of the White Lotus which is one of the earliest Taoist groups.   They are the Sin Tin Toa (Primordial Toa).  They worship Buddhist deities, well versed in Neidan, also have magic.   They were banned in China in Qing Dynasty.  In early communist China, they were regarded as reactionary, which was one of the worst possible accusation.   Nowadays they are widely spread  in Taiwan, and estimated in 25-40% of the temples in Hong Kong, also exist in Japan and Vietnam.

 

Some scholars/researchers regard these more fringe factions as China's folk religions.  While for normal people, they are loosely regarded as Taoists.  It is not easy to draw the line between formal religion, folk religion, witchcraft, superstition, and, frauds. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So shamanism is the culture in which Westerners look at other people through the glasses they made up.
It is not traditional Chinese culture.

 

所以薩滿就是西方人用自己編造的眼鏡在看別人的文化。
並非是中國傳統的文化。

[awaken]

The Taoist practice culture was originally a minority culture among the elite. Common people have always been based on superstitious culture.

The same carrying method also belongs to the relatively low-level Taoist practice culture, not the real practice culture of the elite.

Therefore, the lowest level is the witchcraft culture of the Fulu Sect, followed by the superficial transfer method fake training culture, and the real training culture of Taoism is at the top of the pyramid.

 

道家修練文化本來就是菁英份子之間的少數文化。平民百姓本來就是以迷信文化為主。

同樣的搬運法也是屬於比較低階的道家修練文化，並非屬於菁英份子真正的修練文化。

所以最低階的部分是符祿派的巫術文化，然後是膚淺的搬運法假修練文化，金字塔最頂端的才是道家真正的修練文化。

 

 

https://ctext.org/library.pl?if=gb&collection=132

 

This is also the case in Daoist classics.
The low-level Fulu Sect has the most superstitious cultural materials. The middle-level carrying method has more fake practice cultures. The highest level of Taoist practice has the least cultural information.

Therefore, a person must have sufficient comprehension ability to find out what is the real Taoist cultivation culture from a pile of materials.
Those with the worst savvy can only go to the temple to worship and pray for blessings.
Those with ordinary comprehension can only practice qigong.
Only those with the highest savvy can practice the real Taoist cultivation culture.

 

在道藏典籍當中同樣也是這樣的分布情況。
低階的符祿派迷信文化資料最多。中階的搬運法假修練文化次多。最高階的道家修練文化資料最少。

所以一個人要有足夠的悟性才有辦法從一堆資料當中找出甚麼才是真正的道家修練文化。
悟性最差的，只能到廟裏面拜拜祈福。
悟性普通的，只能練氣功。
只有悟性最高的，才有辦法修練到真正的道家修練文化。

 

This phenomenon has long been mentioned in the Tao Te Ching.
A person of upper virtue, middle virtue and lower virtue.

 

這種現象，道德經早就說過了。
上德，中德和下德之人。

Edited February 13, 2023 by awaken

[awaken]

8 hours ago, Taomeow said:

 

The word shaman -- Evenki to Russian to international -- comes from the verb ša, "to know," but interestingly enough, sounds pretty close to Chinese 沙門 -- shāmén, "Buddhist monk.”  Basically it's an umbrella term for the way "to know" and to do things with this knowledge that used to be universal.  I've studied shamanism of many traditions (Siberian -- Chuckchi, Tungus, Evenki, Buryat, Kalmyk, etc., Manchu, Mongolian, Native American, South American, Japanese, Korean, African, Bön, and of course Chinese), some in some depth.  Even within one tradition there were typically a plethora of shamans "specializing" in different things, and wu 巫 most certainly had their own specializations.  They are not a distinct and separate category from their brethren/sistren except when such distincti從你的說法當中，很明顯的薩滿一詞就是西方人發明出來的。ons arise from terminological disagreements.  All shamans do both -- they obey some spirits, they command other spirits.  They are stronger than some spirits, weaker than some other spirits.  A strong shaman in any tradition bosses spirits around, and occasionally goes to battle with them to bring them to heel.  

 

What they all had in common was service to community, often enough against their will -- that's where the spirits had the upper hand, typically they chose the shaman and it was an offer no one chosen could refuse without dire consequences.  I don't think it was different with wu.  

 

From what you said, it is obvious that the word shaman was invented by Westerners.

This kind of culture that believes in spirits and ghosts also has a lot in the popular culture of the new era. As long as the person's mental level has not improved, he will fall into this belief, even Westerners are the same.

 

從你的說法當中，很明顯的薩滿一詞就是西方人發明出來的。

像這種相信靈魂鬼神的文化，在新時代流行文化當中也一大堆。只要這個人的心智的水準沒有提升，就會陷入這種信仰，即使是西方人也是一樣的。

 

 

 

 

[awaken]

This kind of culture of belief in ghosts and gods is also very popular in the West. As long as the savvy is poor, it will fall into this kind of culture.

It is not that ancient China was a witchcraft culture. Rather, the witchcraft culture in ancient China was spread by a group of people with poor understanding. But people with higher savvy are spreading another kind of cultivation culture.

And these people with poor comprehension can only see the superficial layer of cultivation culture, and superficially distort it into ghost culture.

For me, Christianity is also a culture of belief in ghosts and gods, either in God or in the devil.

 

這種信仰鬼神的文化，在西方也非常流行。只要悟性差的，就會陷入這種文化。

並不是中國古代是巫術文化。而是中國古代的巫術文化是屬於悟性比較差的一群人在流傳的。但是悟性比較高的人是流傳另外一種修練文化。

而這些悟性比較差的人，只能看到修練文化的表層，便膚淺的扭曲成了鬼神文化。

對我來說，基督教也是信仰鬼神文化，不是信神就是信魔鬼。

 

Therefore, it is wrong to think that ancient Chinese culture is only witchcraft culture. It's a superficial statement.
You can't talk nonsense just because you can't understand Chinese, and make up a term like shaman to distort other people's culture.

 

所以認為中國古代文化就是只有巫術文化，這是錯誤的說法。是一種膚淺的說法。
你不能因為你看不懂中文，你就胡說八道，自己編造一個薩滿這樣的名詞，來扭曲別人的文化。

 

 

Edited February 13, 2023 by awaken

[awaken]

16 hours ago, Cobie said:

In your opinion, what is “sacrificial culture”? And how is it different from “shaman”?

~~~
https://anthropoetics.ucla.edu/ap0102/china/  “… oracular activity typical of the Shang …”

 

 

 

I don't know what shaman is, how to compare?

Since you want to use the term shaman, you have to explain it clearly, and it's not me who wants to use this term.

My argument is that shaman does not exist in ancient Chinese literature at all, so you should not use the term shaman instead of Wu 巫.

Because you don't know what 巫wu is and what a shaman is.

 

我又不知道甚麼是薩滿，如何比較?

你既然要使用薩滿這個名詞，你就要解釋清楚，又不是我要用這個名詞。

我的說法是，薩滿根本不存在於中國古代文獻當中，所以你不應該用薩滿這個名詞來代替巫。

因為你根本搞不清楚甚麼是巫，甚麼是薩滿。

Edited February 13, 2023 by awaken

[awaken]

10 hours ago, Taoist Texts said:

a shaman is weaker than the spirits. it is the spirits who tell him what to do. Priests/wu are stronger than the spirits. they boss the spirits around.

 

I don't know what a shaman is.
However, there are indeed a lot of articles in Daozang's Talisman School classics that mention how to command gods to do things for him.
You are the only person on this website who can understand classical Chinese, it is really not easy.
Few Westerners are willing to learn classical Chinese in order to learn Taoist culture, you are really amazing.

 

我不知道甚麼是薩滿。
但是道藏的符祿派經典當中確實有一大堆文章提到如何指揮神替他辦事情。
你是這個網站唯一一個看得懂中文文言文的人，真的是非常不容易。
沒幾個西方人肯為了學習道家文化去學習文言文的，你真了不起。

 

But I don't read this kind of articles, because they are all deceiving themselves. It's so ridiculous, how can man command God to do things for him. The problem is that a bunch of Chinese people believe in this.

但是這種文章我是不看的，因為都在自欺欺人。笑死人了，人怎麼可能指揮神替他辦事情。問題就是有一堆中國人都信這個。
 

 

[awaken]

The thinking logic of these Fulu sects is that there are ghosts everywhere, and they have the ability to order gods to drive out ghosts.

So you will be very unlucky, you just have a ghost on you. You have to spend money to find this kind of Taoist priest to help you drive away ghosts.

If you want to become this kind of Taoist priest who can command the gods, you have to take a series of courses and finally step on the mountain of swords. After passing all the tests, you can get a license. With this license, it proves that you can command the gods to cast out ghosts.

Do you believe it?

I don't believe it.

It's the same as I don't believe that the teacher of the portering school has the ability to help you open the meridians.

 

這些符祿派的人的思想邏輯就是到處都有鬼，而他們才有能力可以命令神去驅趕鬼。

所以你會很倒楣，你就是有鬼在你身上。你就要花錢去找這種道士幫你驅趕鬼。

如果你想成為這種可以命令神的道士，你就要接受一系列的課程，最後還要踩刀山。通過一切考驗之後，你就可以拿到執照。有了這個執照，就證明你可以命令神來驅趕鬼。

你信嗎?

我是不信的。

就跟我不信搬運派老師有能力幫你打開經脈的說法一樣。

 

 

 

[awaken]

https://ctext.org/wiki.pl?if=gb&chapter=205322

 

爾時，元始天尊與諸天大聖、妙行真人、及諸天龍、鬼神、天仙、飛仙、神仙、天童、玉女、太上、二師在玉京山說法，廣大濟惠。是時天雨寶花，地皆金色，天尊放大光明，徧照十方無量世界，上至三十六天帝諸宮，下至幽冥無數地獄，悉令普褊，救攝眾生，令得安穩，受諸妙樂，天香普薰，飢餐玉粒，渴飲金漿，餓鬼眾生皆得飽滿，速得離苦，面見天尊，生於清浄長樂界中，常居法會。

2 爾時，下方有一真人，名曰月光，乘白鶴，手執玉英，來至法會，整理衣冠，恭敬禮拜，長跪稽首，白天尊言：我今修行，欲得救治一切眾生，而無神通方便智慧，我見下方閻浮世內，種種諸惡，或被水漂，或遭火難，或遇飢饉，或有劫賊，或有疫疾，或遇大旱，草木焦然，五穀不熟，國界不安，人民驚懼，如何救拔？唯願天尊廣說方便，救護眾生，令免斯厄。

3 爾時，元始天尊語月光真人曰：善哉善哉！子今能為大地眾生作大利益，至誠救護，我有無量天丁力士、妙行真人、慈悲真人、玉清真人、皇洞真人，百千萬眾，玉清童子二十萬眾，天靈赤官、功曹主簿、長生司馬、韓君丈人，以百千萬眾，天仙飛仙神仙二十萬眾，威劍神王、大力神王、攝毒神王、消魔神王、食邪神王、碎魔神王、擲火神王、洒水神王、食精神王、收瘟神王、飛仙神王百千萬眾，禁戒三師、雲雷八部，常居世間，救諸厄難。若遇水火，當轉此經，若有劫賊，當轉此經，若遇時疫，亦轉此經，若遇灾旱，亦轉此經，國界不安，亦轉此經，五穀不收，亦轉此經。若能書寫，至心轉讀，獲無量福，是諸惡毒，悉皆消滅，是諸劫賊，悉令破散，是諸疫毒，自得除滅，水火災患，自然止息，國界不安，當得安帖，四夷歸奉，異國來朝，疫病速差，口舌磨滅，官事枷鏁，速得解散，復連斷絕，魔邪不興，疫毒遠去。

4 爾時，月光真人又白天尊言：天下及諸方外國，時遭災旱，如此苦惱，作何法事，即得雨水調和，五穀令得豐熟，人民飽滿？

5 天尊語月光真人曰：子受吾教，於閻浮之內，或在聚落，或在高山，或在水岸，或在洞穴，或在清浄之處，建立壇場，安置尊像，掛諸幡蓋，燒香然燈，香湯沐浴，著新淨衣服，轉讀此經，廣為眾生設諸花果名香，隨時供養，廣設齋饌，上獻十方無量天尊、三十六天帝君、天功父母，及諸神仙、一切龍神，及諸靈聖，作大利益，天帝當遣八部大龍王、雲雷雨師，興動雲霧，旋遶世間，須臾之頃，即令江河溪澗、上下田疇，令得霶霈，草木叢林、一切花果五穀之類，悉皆生成，枝葉茂盛。

6 於是月光真人禮謝元始天尊，以偈讚曰：

7 北雲曇曇至，西雲呼嘯來。南注江流水，東方九神靈。

8 中央真龍王，救濟諸眾生。五龍一時下，飄飄太上京。

9 天降開大雨，蔭蓋崑崙山。吾以此經教，永得共興行。

10 爾時，月光真人重啟天尊曰：我從無量劫來，希見難遇，今日得聞微妙經典，及大醫王，一切聖眾，種種變化，不可思議，是經當何名之？我等如何受持？

11 天尊曰：此經名曰《天功護國祈雨消魔經》，子好宣傳，恭敬頂戴，若有愚人輕賤，當墮惡道，長夜受苦。坐中天人龍梵仙眾，皆悉信受，作禮而去，稽首奉行。

 

At that time, Yuanshi Tianzun, the great sages of the heavens, the Daoist Miaoxing, and the dragons, ghosts and gods, celestial immortals, flying immortals, gods, celestial children, jade girls, Taishang, and the second master preached the Dharma in Yujing Mountain, and benefited a lot. It is the time when the heavens rain on precious flowers and the earth is all golden. The celestial deity magnifies the light, illuminating the immeasurable worlds in the ten directions, up to the palaces of the thirty-six heavenly emperors, and down to the countless hells in the nether world. Enjoying all kinds of wonderful music, heavenly fragrance and universal fragrance, eating jade grains when hungry, and drinking golden milk when thirsty, hungry ghosts and all living beings will be full, get rid of suffering quickly, meet the gods face to face, be born in the pure world of eternal happiness, and often live in the dharma assembly.
2 At that time, there was a real person below, named Moonlight, who rode a white crane and held a jade flower in his hand. He came to the Dharma Assembly, adjusted his clothes, worshiped respectfully, knelt down and bowed his head, and said during the day: I am practicing now, and I want to save all sentient beings. Supernatural powers, expedient wisdom, I see all kinds of evils in the world of hell and floating below, such as being drowned by water, or being burned by fire, or suffering from famine, or robbing robbers, or suffering from epidemic diseases, or suffering from severe drought, where the vegetation is scorched, and the grains are not ripe. , the borders are uneasy, and the people are frightened, how to rescue them? I only hope that Tianzun will speak expediently and save all living beings, so as to avoid Sierra.
3 At that time, Yuanshi Tianzun said to the Moonlight Master, "It's good, it's good!" I can do great benefits for all living beings on the earth, and sincerely rescue them. I have countless heavenly warriors, Miaoxing real people, compassionate real people, Yuqing real people, Huangdong real people, hundreds of thousands of people, Yuqing boys and 200,000 people, and heavenly spirits. Red officials, masters of meritorious service, Sima Changsheng, Han Junzhang, hundreds of thousands of people, 200,000 gods of heaven and flying immortals, king of mighty swords, king of Hercules, king of poisoning, king of eliminating demons, god of eating evil The king, the god of breaking demons, the king of fire-throwing, the king of sprinkling water, the king of eating spirits, the king of pestilence harvesting, and the king of flying immortals. There are hundreds of thousands of people, the three masters of prohibition, and the eight divisions of cloud and thunder. They always live in the world and save all disasters. If there is fire and water, you should recite this sutra; if there are thieves, you should recite this sutra; if you encounter epidemics, you should also recite this sutra; , also turn this scripture. If you can write and read it sincerely, you will gain immeasurable blessings. All evil poisons will be wiped out. Deantie, four barbarians return to worship, foreign countries come to court, epidemics are slow, tongues are wiped out, official affairs are shackles, quickly dismissed, reunions are cut off, evil spirits are not prosperous, and epidemic poisons are far away.
4 At that time, the real moonlight said again in the daytime: "The world and all foreign countries are suffering from droughts. If you are so distressed, what can you do to get the rain to be mixed, the grains to be plentiful, and the people to be full?"
5 Tianzun said to Moonlight True Man: My son accepts my teachings, and in Jambudha, or in settlements, or in high mountains, or on the water's edge, or in caves, or in clean places, build a mandala, place statues, hang all Cover the banner, burn incense and light the lamp, bathe in fragrant soup, wear new and clean clothes, recite this sutra, set up famous incense of flowers and fruits for all living beings, make offerings at any time, set up fast food, and offer immeasurable gods in ten directions, thirty-six heavenly deities For the great benefit of the emperor, Tiangong parents, all gods, all dragon gods, and all spirit saints, the Heavenly Emperor should send eight great dragon kings, cloud thunder and rain masters, to stir up clouds and mists, and circle the world. Tianchou is so beautiful that vegetation, forests, all flowers, fruits and grains are all grown, with luxuriant branches and leaves.
6 Then the Moonlight Master thanked Yuanshi Tianzun and praised him in verse:
7 When the northern clouds arrive, the western clouds roar. The flowing water of the south pours into the river, and the nine gods of the east.
8 The true dragon king of the center, save all sentient beings. The five dragons descended for a while, and Piao Piao went to Beijing too.
On the 9th day, heavy rain fell, covering Kunlun Mountains. I use this sutra to teach, and we will prosper and act together forever.
10 At that time, the moonlight real person restarted Tianzun and said: I have come from immeasurable kalpas, and I have seen it so hard to meet. Today, I heard the wonderful scriptures, and the great doctor, all saints, all kinds of changes, incredible, what is the name of this scripture? How can I be supported?
11 Tianzun said: This sutra is called "Tiangong Protects the Country, Praying for Rain and Dispelling Demons Sutra". I like to publicize it and respect it. If there are fools who look down on me, I will fall into the evil way and suffer forever. All the gods, humans, dragons, Brahma, and immortals who sat in the middle believed and accepted it, made a ceremony and left, and Jishou carried it out.

 

--------------------------

 

This is translated by Google, I have not made any changes, just for your reference.

There is a mention of Moonlight Reality, just recently there is a TV series in China that plays the love story of the Moonlight God, for your reference.

 

 

 

[Taomeow]

2 hours ago, awaken said:

 

From what you said, it is obvious that the word shaman was invented by Westerners.

This kind of culture that believes in spirits and ghosts also has a lot in the popular culture of the new era. As long as the person's mental level has not improved, he will fall into this belief, even Westerners are the same.

 

 

The word "cat" was also invented by Westerners.  I guess it proves that cats are a a belief in the "popular culture of the new era." 

 

Thanks, I'll make sure to cancel my "Pretty Litter" subscription and stop buying cat food.  Whatever meows its protest in my house in response will be informed that it's called a Western word and therefore is merely a belief of mine proving my "mental level has not improved."

 

I'll tell you more.  Not only has it not improved -- it got worse!  My previous cat was called a Chinese name, Haomao 好貓 .  My current cat, however, has two names, both of them Western invented!  Her English name is Monkey, and her similarly sounding Russian name is Man'ka (an informal diminutive of "Maria"), chosen so she can be addressed in either language by her bilingual humans.  But both words are Western, which proves she's not real, just a pop culture inspired belief of mine.  I'm surprised my phone camera can also fall for it. 

 

 

Of course a picture of a cat taken by a Western invented piece of technology proves nothing.  A picture of a cat is not a cat anymore than the word "cat" is.  But think about it for a minute...  how does it prove that the cat itself is invalidated by having a Western name to be called?..   

 

 

 

    

[Maddie]

To say at some point in the past the beliefs of any group of people were "Shamanistic" is not really a stretch at all as it is believed it was the original belief system of our hunter-gather ancestors. It also does not have any specific location of origin as it seemed to organically begin in most cultures around the world weather they were in contact with each other or not. 

[Cobie]

20 hours ago, Taomeow said:

The word shaman … comes from the verb ša, "to know," … All shamans do both -- they obey some spirits, they command other spirits.  They are stronger than some spirits, weaker than some other spirits.  A strong shaman in any tradition bosses spirits around, and occasionally goes to battle with them to bring them to heel.  

 

What they all had in common was service to community, often enough against their will -- that's where the spirits had the upper hand, typically they chose the shaman and it was an offer no one chosen could refuse without dire consequences.  …

Interesting. By this way of looking at it, I consider Jesus a shaman.  
 

 

Edited February 14, 2023 by Cobie

[Taomeow]

2 minutes ago, Cobie said:

Interesting. By this way of looking at it, I consider Jesus a shaman. 
 

 

 

Maybe he had shamanic abilities (provided he existed), but he also had twelve disciples and preached stuff and asserted (e.g. in his Sermon on the Mount) that what's happening to people on earth is not important as they will find all the good things in heaven once they die (provided they use him, Jesus, as a go-between to secure god's graces.)  This behavior doesn't seem shaman-like to me at all, nor this ideology.  But then, some shamans were quirky, so who knows.  

[Cobie]

 

3 hours ago, Taomeow said:

… shaman-like …

 

“A shaman in shamanism is considered to be a person who has mastered mysterious knowledge and has the ability to enter the state of "man-god", with the ability to prophesy, heal, communicate with the spiritual world, and travel to the spiritual world.”

 

薩滿信仰中的薩滿被認為是掌握神秘知識，有能力進入「人神」狀態的人，有著預言、治療，與屬靈世界溝通，以及旅行到屬靈世界的能力。

 

Sà mǎn xìnyǎng zhōng de sà mǎn bèi rènwéi shì zhǎngwò shénmì zhīshì, yǒu nénglì jìnrù `rén shén'zhuàngtài de rén, yǒuzhe yùyán, zhìliáo, yǔ shǔ líng shìjiè gōutōng, yǐjí lǚxíng dào shǔ líng shìjiè de nénglì.

 

https://zh.wikipedia.org/zh-tw/萨满教   
 

 

Edited February 14, 2023 by Cobie

[Cobie]

 

On 11/02/2023 at 3:42 PM, awaken said:

… Since ancient times, China has focused on offering sacrifices to ancestors, which began in the Xia Dynasty. 

中國自古以來就是以祭祀祖先為主，這是從夏朝就開始的。

 

Righto, so this is 祭祀文化 (jìsì wénhuà - sacrificial culture). 
 

~~~

祭祀  jìsì - to offer sacrifices; to worship {崇拜 chóngbài - to worship}

文化  wénhuà - culture

祖先 zǔxiān - ancestors 

 

Edited February 14, 2023 by Cobie

[Cobie]

 

On 13/02/2023 at 2:43 PM, awaken said:

… you don't know what 巫wu is …

 In your opinion, what is 巫 (wu1 - witch)?

 

[Sahaja]

There is an interesting piece written on this called “the wu and the shamen” by Gilles Boileau of Tamkang University on Academia.com that looked at historical writings and inscriptions from Shang and Zhou periods  and compared it to studies on the role of the Siberian shamen. . His conclusion was that the Wu had a different,  narrower , more negatively viewed role in society  than  shamans had in hunter gatherer society so shamen should probably  not be used as a direct translation for wu.