For Clarity on Philip Toledo

[farmerjoe]

[Satori]

Perhaps this is why the attempts were not successful.

 

 

Clarity is seeing beyond one side of an issue. Perhaps with some compassion and understanding the outcome would have been different.

 

There was no effort on either side to "Dig it up, blow it out, harmonize".

 

Regardless of how it transpired I do apologize to those involved for my heavy handedness. The wounds of those events are as fresh as the day they were inflicted.

With this I bid you all farewell.

There was no effort on either side to "Dig it up, blow it out, harmonize".

This was referring to the Kunlun practice. Chris said both he and Max contacted the dude and he wouldn't accept the truth.

 

Also, why are you so obsessed with Phil Toledo? That dude won't listen to someone calling them and saying, "Hey man, it's me Max. I am not dead." And he instead makes up a fantastic story about it.

 

I think the point of posting the letter might have been to show an example of what not to do as a student. Keep it real and don't go profiting off someone who in your mind has to be dead so you can maintain your own online business.

 

Anyway, last year's news...

 

You speak about the Kunlun group like you know them, but then you haven't even studied with Max in person. You seem pretty bright but it's hard to dig your points when you are shooting them from such an outside perspective.

 

I heard Max will still be teaching small private groups. Maybe you should study with him. He is amazing and I think you would probably be a good student.

[farmerjoe]

I think people should know - the tapes may not have the full procedures on them - there are key features left out of the videos. I know this to be true for Thunderbreath, Advance Thunderbreath, Red Dragon. So you may be wasting your money if you are looking to acquire these skills from the tapes. Also each of the above techniques have inherent dangers and you MUST have guidance from a teacher as incorrect practice can be damaging to the body - and in some cases the consequences will not be seen until years after.

 

This is a serious issue. Very serious. I can't see how both sides wouldn't have done everything possible to rectify it. It reflects negatively on the student who produced the tapes as well as the teacher who allowed it. What kind of secret teachings are these? They obviously do not promote clear thinking or lead to sound judgment, but instead contribute to allowing one to make poor choices for themselves that can potentially lead to severe consequences for others. This signals to me great instability and gives me cause for concern. Based on what I've been reading though it is the student that is always to blame. I think -O- that you and others give the teacher far too much credit, far too much. Thank you to all for your posts. I will never consider becoming a student of this teacher or practice again. Joe.

Edited June 26, 2009 by farmerjoe

[-O-]

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Edited August 25, 2009 by -O-

[farmerjoe]

1) to hear his teacher was gone 2) that this teacher no longer held him in esteem. It is indicative of just how much this man trusted, admired and loved his teacher, so much so he cannot accept the current truth of the situation.

 

The wounds of those events are as fresh as the day they were inflicted.

 

I sincerley hope for your sake and as well as everyone elses that it all gets worked out and goes well for all of you. Joe.

Edited June 26, 2009 by farmerjoe

[-O-]

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Edited August 25, 2009 by -O-

[goldisheavy]

Hey folks,

A lot of people have asked about Philip Toledo. He's the guy who illegally sells Max's old videos from his web site. We have asked you not to because he does not pay Max any royalties.

 

It is sad that he is confused, but as many of you know, Max is still very much alive. He did fake his own death a few years ago when I met him in New Mexico to remove himself from his life in Hawaii. Many teachers have done this in the past for a period of time to see what their students will do in their absence. When the teacher returns the shit usually hits the fan.

 

Some simply refuse to accept the reality that the teacher has not actually died and was merely testing them.

 

That's the deal here.

 

Take care,

 

~Chris

 

I think if the teacher has faked his own death, he needs to stop being a baby and accept the consequences. One consequence of faking your own death is that people actually think you are dead.

 

On the other hand, I believe copyright stretches beyond author's death, but don't quote me since I haven't cared about copyrights in a long time now. But if you want to take a legal angle, why even talk about death?

 

I guess I am confused.

[farmerjoe]

-O-

 

Please read what you wrote:

 

I am reluctantly adding my two cents to this....

 

Self, identity, opinion etc. are all (from the perspective of meditation) structures (form) given to energy. This is necessary as the ego, self, identity becomes the vehicle or container for experience (it creates the space or room to reflect). Without it self awareness (in an ontological sense) would not be possible. As energy builds the structure of the self becomes malleable, a little unstable then eventually releases.

 

The release feels wonderful as now there is more room to move, more access to energy. Understanding simplifies and more energy(attention) is available for present moment experience. The tendency when this occurs (during the point of instability) is to throw more structure up. After all the structure is the ego and it will fight for its existence - and frankly the experience feels very much like a break down. If the practitioner allows the new structure to form (by not surrendering into it, and not or by placing meaning on the experience) then partial insight are experienced. This is because the new structure is slightly larger than the last.

 

The key to recognising when this happens is a rambling, driven mind; and the content of the thinking involved will always have a connection back to self importance (I'm now enlightened, or now I get it "just let go"). Even self importance by proxy (my teacher is so great, my lineage is the oldest, the Jade emperor adopted my teacher in spirit). No matter how "out there" or how ordinary (for instance interest in the history of the practice - or interest in the mechanics of what is happening) at its root it is the same - form given to awareness, structure given to energy which, if you are dedicated to your practice, will eventually need to be dissolved. Surrender, letting go allows the process to continue, as well as cultivating the energy. Forming opinions, new appendages to our identity (I'm a kunluner, I'm a bodhisattva, I'm am advanced practitioner) halts the process, so does theory history etc.

 

The only word knowledge which should be given for this type of practice is "poison for poison" or thinking which sabotages the tendency to think about what is going on. Talk of histories, teachers extraordinary lives, reptiles etc. only gets in the way. The Any other word knowledge should be given after the accomplishment is made.

 

The appropriate answer from the teacher to the student will always be the same "keep practicing" as any other answer will only encourage the student to create more form, more structure - which eventually has to be dealt with. But this is why a teachers answers are sometime vague (or non-existent) - or no more than platitudes, as it is only to set or correct the direction of the students intent. This isn't the case with all practices but is definitely applicable to KL.

 

This becomes problematic if you are attempting to reach many people. Why would someone chose to follow a practice, come to a seminar, if they do not have a "reason to" (like reaching enlightenment, constant bliss)? Or trust in a teacher without some verifiable credibility?

 

The issue with the current marketing is it encourages the very faculty which the teaching is attempting to dissolve, leads to confusion, attachment and prolongs the instability of the process. I would also say that the vast majority of "successful" kunlun students will be stuck on the attachment to the blissful feelings they feel. When this occurs (attachment to the good feelings) the energy will keep cycling around leading to fantasy and delusion. Awareness will keep taking slightly further steps away from reality. It is easily rectified - keep practicing - surrender the bliss as well as the blah. (approach the practice with equanimity)

 

Also building community around the practice - like a forum only encourages the participants to form and re-enforce the identity as part of the kunlun community, draw lines between the inexperienced, the advanced, the infidels etc. But both the forum and the marketing messages hinge off the same issue(problems) that the kunlun practitioners which are having problems with which the kunlun practioners who are experiencing problems are dealing with... motivation. If the seat of your motivation is centered outside of yourself - then you will look outside of yourself for the answers to your problems. If not found then frustration builds and an identity around that will begin to be formed and acted on.

 

It is very important to point out two things. The experiences which occur in the practice are only that - sensations. They are not verification of truth, advancement, etc.

 

And spiritual skills or powers are not indicative of spiritual advancement only energetic savvy.

 

I have learned what is written from doing the practices Max teaches - and yes he does teach this by what he does not say - he is a far better guide then people give him credit for (and people give him allot of credit).

 

And then read it again. What you wrote is based on what Max didn't say? I have to repeat that it seems to me that you give too much credit to the teacher and not enough to what you learned for yourself. He seems to make the process harder for students now encouraging things that are best to avoid. Consider please that you got him at the right time as well as got the best of him. I am glad you are moving on. I don't think you need him anymore. Joe.

[-O-]

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Edited August 25, 2009 by -O-