Greetings from Bharat ( India)

[Bhathen]

16 hours ago, ChiDragon said:

Based on what I have read the definitions online, I disagree with the former but agree with the latter. The latter is more like acupressure.

I should have been more clear with my statement since the art involves a broader array of practices. During a recent workshop, my Varma master was explaining a vivid and detailed description from older texts of the tradition. Interestingly, he was reading the exact description of a portion of this image.

[Maddie]

Welcome :-)

[Chang dao ling]

On 12/29/2023 at 3:53 AM, ChiDragon said:

If you believe that Qigong is about breathing, yes. Somehow, I had an impression that when Dharma went to China, he introduced Yoga to the Shaolin monks. It seems that Qigong is the derivative of Yoga.

I think Qigong is not a derivative of yoga. Because of exercises  like Dao yin practiced from 5000 years in china this is way before bodhi Dharma. Second by observing different Qigong systems ( medical, martial arts, ZZ etc) we can say Qigong is "originated " in China. 

[ChiDragon]

Perhaps 吐納 (tu na ) was the original 气功 (chi kung) in China.

[Chang dao ling]

10 hours ago, ChiDragon said:

Perhaps 吐納 (tu na ) was the original 气功 (chi kung) in China.

Tu na is breathing exercise right?

[ChiDragon]

6 minutes ago, Chang dao ling said:

Tu na is breathing exercise right?

Yes. It is. It was performed by the ancient Chinese Taoist doing the internal Alchemy.

Edited December 31, 2023 by ChiDragon

[Chang dao ling]

3 hours ago, ChiDragon said:

Yes. It is. It was performed by the ancient Chinese Taoist doing the internal Alchemy.

Do you practice neidan?

[ChiDragon]

33 minutes ago, Chang dao ling said:

Do you practice neidan?

I practice chi kung. Actually practice chi kung is a universal term for all forms of breathing exercise. People just like to call it something else to claim some credit. Neidan and Taiji are  good examples of cih kung. What I am saying is if practice any breathing method, then it is actually practicing chi kung. You call it something else if you like. Also explain any way you want. You will have the same health effect.

Edited December 31, 2023 by ChiDragon

[silent thunder]

FFS.  Coldbie and ChiDraaaagon could you two fundies stfu with all your projections and just let the person join the forum?

[Cobie]

14 hours ago, ChiDragon said:

… chi kung is a universal term for all forms of breathing exercise …

Really? lol. Please meet  自发功 zi4 fa1 gong1  -  Spontaneous Qigong 

Spontaneous Qigong is a type of Qigong. 

It requires only natural breathing i.e. breathing normally without even thinking about breathing.

 

 

[ChiDragon]

4 minutes ago, Cobie said:

Really? lol. Please meet  自发功 zi4 fa1 gong1  -  Spontaneous Qigong 

Spontaneous Qigong is a type of Qigong. 

It requires only natural breathing i.e. breathing normally without even thinking about breathing.

 

 

Don't think about it, just breathing.

PS Why don't you move this to the Delete thread before someone get upset again here?

Edited January 1 by ChiDragon

[Cobie]

9 minutes ago, ChiDragon said:

... Why don't you move this to the Delete thread …

 

Definitely not. It is vital information for @Narayana that zifagong qigong does not involve breathing control. 
 

 

Edited January 1 by Cobie

[ChiDragon]

@Cobie
No one ask him to practice zifagong. It was very popular in Taiwan I believe. It has a very serious mental side effect for those who cannot control their minds to stop it at the end of the practice. Peace!


PS
How do you define natural breathing? How deep or shallow do you breathe is considered to be natural breathing?
Since it doesn't involve with abdominal breathing, by definition, I do not considered that it is a form of Qigong.

Edited January 1 by ChiDragon

[Cobie]

31 minutes ago, ChiDragon said:

… breathing? …

I repeat:

 

On 30/12/2023 at 9:36 PM, Cobie said:

It’s the abdominal breathing that gives health/energy.  
But breathing must never be controlled/interfered with; only observed.

If ‘you’ get out of the way, the body will settle itself to abdominal breathing.

The body knows how to breath; ‘you’ do not. 

 

 

 

[Gerard]

On 31/12/2023 at 1:02 AM, Chang dao ling said:

I think Qigong is not a derivative of yoga. Because of exercises  like Dao yin practiced from 5000 years in china this is way before bodhi Dharma. Second by observing different Qigong systems ( medical, martial arts, ZZ etc) we can say Qigong is "originated " in China. 

 

China it was, is and will be. 
 

The Hindu system is completely static; Chinese/Taoist is dynamic.

 

Qigong owes nothing to India; end of story. Its roots are completely shamanic in nature (imitates movements of animals and the natural cycles). Most likely Siberian/Mongolian practices could have been influenced Qigong in the Neolithic period. 

 

 

 

 

[Narayana]

On 27/12/2023 at 4:10 AM, Pak_Satrio said:

Welcome to the forum!

Thanks 

[Narayana]

On 27/12/2023 at 5:24 AM, ChiDragon said:

Welcome! Why can you not follow Buddhist meditation? They should be the same.

Thanks. In my opinion they are same at very High level. But not at beginning. For example Taoist meditators cultivate Lower Dantian. Buddist meditators meditate on breath, kasina, Vipassana meditation etc. 

I like 3 religions ( Taoism, Hinduism, Buddhism) but I like Taoism more due to neidan ( internal alchemy). 

 

Thanks for welcoming me🙏

[Narayana]

On 29/12/2023 at 3:23 AM, ChiDragon said:

I don't think people in India ever practiced Taoism. There would be a greater chance to find a Buddhist in India. I think!

Yes. Most people don't know about Taoism in India. There are many buddist meditation centers in India which teaches Vipassana meditation and other buddist meditation techniques. So your assumption is right 👍

[Narayana]

On 29/12/2023 at 3:31 AM, Pak_Satrio said:

Ah it’s not a proper TDB welcome without an argument in the comments section!

I never expected I get a grand welcome 😁 here 😉

[Narayana]

On 29/12/2023 at 3:43 AM, Cobie said:

Is “yoga breathing” the same as Buddhist/Taoist meditation? 
 

No. There is huge difference between Indian yogic breathing and Taoist breathing. Buddhism didn't have   breathing techniques except for Tibetan Buddhism

[Cobie]

 

On 02/01/2024 at 10:02 AM, Narayana said:

… There are many buddist meditation centers in India …

Thank you very much for the info.  

 

On 02/01/2024 at 10:09 AM, Narayana said:

… Buddhism didn't have   breathing techniques except for Tibetan Buddhism

I had formed the impression (from reading posts on this forum) that Buddhist meditation is all about controlling the breath.

? Confused. 

 

 

Edited January 7 by Cobie

[Narayana]

8 hours ago, Cobie said:

 

Thank you very much for the info.  

 

I had formed the impression (from reading posts on this forum) that Buddhist meditation is all about controlling the breath.

??? Confused. 

 

 

Are you talking about Anapanasati ( breath meditation) ? In Anapanasati meditation we simply watch breath we don't control breath. 

[Cobie]

 

16 hours ago, Narayana said:

Are you talking about Anapanasati ( breath meditation) ?

 

Yes, that’s typically what people bring up. E.g. thank you to @Sketch https://www.thedaobums.com/topic/54363-on-the-nature-and-utility-of-goal-posts-in-meditative-and-energetic-practice/?do=findComment&comment=999183

 

Quote

In Anapanasati meditation we simply watch breath we don't control breath. 

 

Thank you for the info. Then Buddhist meditation differs from Daoist meditation: 

Buddhist meditation - anapanasati - “we simply watch breath we don't control breath”

Daoist meditation- 吐纳 tu3 na4 - intentionally adjusting the breathing. E.g. thank you to @ChiDragonhttps://www.thedaobums.com/topic/55424-the-ultiamte-method-of-breathing/?do=findComment&comment=1021736

 

As you said, they may ultimately lead to the same at the highest level.  

I also read you are interested in Taoist neidan (internal alchemy). I refer you to  @Taoist Texts  

 

Edited January 3 by Cobie

[Narayana]

7 hours ago, Cobie said:

 

 

Yes, that’s typically what people bring up. E.g. thank you to @Sketch https://www.thedaobums.com/topic/54363-on-the-nature-and-utility-of-goal-posts-in-meditative-and-energetic-practice/?do=findComment&comment=999183

 

 

Thank you for the info. Then Buddhist meditation differs from Daoist meditation: 

Buddhist meditation - anapanasati - “we simply watch breath we don't control breath”

Daoist meditation- 吐纳 tu3 na4 - intentionally adjusting the breathing. E.g. thank you to @ChiDragonhttps://www.thedaobums.com/topic/55424-the-ultiamte-method-of-breathing/?do=findComment&comment=1021736

 

As you said, they may ultimately lead to the same at the highest level.  

I also read you are interested in Taoist neidan (internal alchemy). I refer you to  @Taoist Texts  

 

Thank you very much for the links 😊