Why am I not Enlightened?

[dwai]

From James Swartz 

 

Spoiler

What is Awareness?

 

If the object of inquiry is beyond the scope of perception, it will be difficult to describe because language operates only in the world of experience. Therefore, we can never get a precise definition of consciousness from words. How can the limitless cause of existence be packed into words? Perception tells us that the universe is quite small, limited to what we can see with the eyes, hear with the ears, smell with the nose, taste with the tongue and touch with the skin. The invention of instruments that extend the range of the senses expands our notion of the scale of the universe and we now infer that it is infinite. When we try to infer the cause of the universe, both perception and inference break down and imagination takes over. We imagine someone or something so vast, grand and glorious that it cannot be experienced or described.

This imagination-fed belief leads to the conclusion that words are useless as far as enlightenment is concerned. It is responsible for the notion that consciousness is a mystery and will forever remain a mystery. It is a mystery if you do not know how to look for it, but once you are in on the secret, it is as accessible as the nose on your face. What if the cause of the universe is not out there somewhere in space or locked in the infinite past, but is in our own minds? What if you have unwittingly been tricked by perception into looking in the wrong place? Nobody says that love cannot be experienced and known, even though no words can describe it. In fact we do not need a word to describe the self, because it is self evident. But if it is not self evident to you, then words can be very helpful.

A finger pointing at the moon is not the moon. If attention goes in the direction indicated by the finger, the mind will experience and know the moon. If it is properly assimilated, the knowledge contained in a sentence or a group of sentences can destroy ignorance. The implied meaning of a sentence can also give knowledge. Self inquiry does not claim to describe the self, prove the existence of the self, or generate an experience of the self. It is not necessary because consciousness is always present and self evident. But if you allow its words to guide your investigation, they will reveal what is always revealed:

“The self, pure awareness, is limitless bliss and unending pleasure. It is beyond the dualities of the mind. It is the is-ness that sees, the is-ness that is known through Vedanta’s statement, ‘You are That.’ It is the one, eternal, pure, unchanging witness of everything. It is beyond experience and the three qualities of nature. I bow to that self, the one that removes ignorance.”

Furthermore, awareness is the non-physical “light” that makes experience possible. It is the container of experience and experience is the content. We exist quite happily in deep sleep without experience of objects, but we cannot experience anything without awareness, including the experience of sleep.

There are so many ways to explain this - but it requires a truly open mind to understand/realize. If one’s mind is preoccupied by concepts and ideas, then it cannot truly accept the knowledge (indirect though it may be). If it cannot accept the knowledge, how can it realize? 

Edited April 24 by dwai

[old3bob]

On 4/24/2024 at 11:08 AM, dwai said:

From James Swartz 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

What is Awareness?

 

If the object of inquiry is beyond the scope of perception, it will be difficult to describe because language operates only in the world of experience. Therefore, we can never get a precise definition of consciousness from words. How can the limitless cause of existence be packed into words? Perception tells us that the universe is quite small, limited to what we can see with the eyes, hear with the ears, smell with the nose, taste with the tongue and touch with the skin. The invention of instruments that extend the range of the senses expands our notion of the scale of the universe and we now infer that it is infinite. When we try to infer the cause of the universe, both perception and inference break down and imagination takes over. We imagine someone or something so vast, grand and glorious that it cannot be experienced or described.

This imagination-fed belief leads to the conclusion that words are useless as far as enlightenment is concerned. It is responsible for the notion that consciousness is a mystery and will forever remain a mystery. It is a mystery if you do not know how to look for it, but once you are in on the secret, it is as accessible as the nose on your face. What if the cause of the universe is not out there somewhere in space or locked in the infinite past, but is in our own minds? What if you have unwittingly been tricked by perception into looking in the wrong place? Nobody says that love cannot be experienced and known, even though no words can describe it. In fact we do not need a word to describe the self, because it is self evident. But if it is not self evident to you, then words can be very helpful.

A finger pointing at the moon is not the moon. If attention goes in the direction indicated by the finger, the mind will experience and know the moon. If it is properly assimilated, the knowledge contained in a sentence or a group of sentences can destroy ignorance. The implied meaning of a sentence can also give knowledge. Self inquiry does not claim to describe the self, prove the existence of the self, or generate an experience of the self. It is not necessary because consciousness is always present and self evident. But if you allow its words to guide your investigation, they will reveal what is always revealed:

“The self, pure awareness, is limitless bliss and unending pleasure. It is beyond the dualities of the mind. It is the is-ness that sees, the is-ness that is known through Vedanta’s statement, ‘You are That.’ It is the one, eternal, pure, unchanging witness of everything. It is beyond experience and the three qualities of nature. I bow to that self, the one that removes ignorance.”

Furthermore, awareness is the non-physical “light” that makes experience possible. It is the container of experience and experience is the content. We exist quite happily in deep sleep without experience of objects, but we cannot experience anything without awareness, including the experience of sleep.

There are so many ways to explain this - but it requires a truly open mind to understand/realize. If one’s mind is preoccupied by concepts and ideas, then it cannot truly accept the knowledge (indirect though it may be). If it cannot accept the knowledge, how can it realize? 

 

The mind and or our minds with all of its powers can not pass over or through the threshold to no-thing, although it can realize that and be lawful servant up to the threshold.  Few of us are ready to pay the absolute price to cross over to no-thing which is  no-mans and no gods land,  I'm not although a partial peek can take place but that also has its price...

Edited April 26 by old3bob

[manitou]

On 4/6/2024 at 10:04 PM, Gerard said:

The real question is not enlightenment but the ULTIMATE STATE you are in besides this physical experience of you here and now for the time being.

 

The Egg

 

Little good reading. 

 

 

 

Thanks you so much, Gerard!  I have finally realized that the 'buddhalands' spoken of in the Amakansaka and Lotus Sutras are none other than the individual universes.

[manitou]

Someone mentioned earlier that enlightenment can't be defined.  I agree. It is like a taste that can't be described, it must be eaten.

 

There has been much cogitation on this thread around the subject of enlightenment.  The kind of knowledge used on this thread has pretty much all been head knowledge, which isn't enlightenment.  That's 'knowing about stuff'.

 

Enlightenment is What You Become.  It no longer is a head trip, and it matters not whether you still have remnants of religions inside you. It is obtained by soul searching and getting those things out of the way that have been imprinted since childhood. 

 

You walk around with the 'good of all' being on your mind more than it ever way, because you realize that each and every person you see is 'god', is You!  And it seems to deepen and deepen, as your connection with the Whole deepens to the point that your whole being becomes infused with it, more day by day.  The post-Enlightenment life is a practiced in merging this Whole Love into your life, regardless of whether you're a social worker or a sewer worker.

 

I'd love to hear @Dwai or @SilentThunder describe their post-E life, and how it has changed.  Or anyone else with a post-E life.  It seems to be that how you wear this thing is a learning process day by day.  But it's no longer a book-learning thing.  It's more of a 'how to love life' proposition.

 

The odd thing is to walk around with this secret, this magnificent secret, that very few in the world know.  Men have been put into rubber rooms for less.

 

 

[old3bob]

I'd use a change in wording to say: enlightenment or the  Self is what we are, for if it could "become" then it could also unbecome.  (so at that level I'd say ST is right about it is all now)

 

We or It realizes that we are not just a human being, mind or soul which is a form used or even a god which is also a form used.  (for the Self is not a form and only it is truly enlightened, although and granted it does echo through forms,  and more pointedly through very evolved, wise and compassionate ones but it is still a kind of (technical like) mistake to say that such and such a person is enlightened for if the Self is unveiled and working more through a particular being then it knows that that  particular being which many people may see, proclaim or talk about is really and also a passing vehicle, whether relatively young or countless eons mature in form.  (for example the life time of Lord Brahma is a very long cosmic cycle!)  

 

(I changed some of my wording above being that most folks would not appreciate hearing or being more or less pigeon holed or labeled as a thing...)

Edited April 27 by old3bob

[manitou]

On 4/13/2024 at 6:27 PM, Tommy said:

Time is a function of memory.

 

 

Time is planetary rotation.  Memory notices.

[Tommy]

16 hours ago, manitou said:

 

 

Time is planetary rotation.  Memory notices.

Are you talking about spin or solar rotation? Anyway, the planet takes no notice of either. It's memories are buried in the crust.

 

When my friend died, I could not talk to her anymore. Could not reach her memories. So time is what happens now. Only memory makes for having known a past or notice of a future to come. When the body is gone then so are the memories. Then there is only now.

 

As an edit: I would like to say that I am genetically inclined to have dementia as I grow older. So, my memories will fade away and the past will disappear. My past will have no meaning.

Edited April 28 by Tommy

[silent thunder]

Any meaning we derive from any experience is our mind and conditioning applying onto memory, a story.

It is a layering of interpretation, assumption and projection.  It is not inheirently true, real or even important.

It's just another thought/story.

 

stories are stories, and meaning is entirely personal and able to shift as we recall repeatedly.

 

This is why Doubt is such a potent teaching and companion to the human minding process.

Doubt all and release all.  What remains will be one's natural essence.  All else is mind and story...

[old3bob]

in the meantime "old chums come to the cabaret"!