Maddie Posted June 15 2 minutes ago, snowymountains said: These are false dichotomies which keep people away from "the truth"(TM) 😂 What could possibly go wrong? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Salvijus Posted June 15 10 minutes ago, Maddie said: The problem with this statement would be, which spirituality are we talking about? Any spirituality that focuses on truth. 10 minutes ago, Maddie said: And how can you demonstrate that your statement is correct? Is your mind at peace when you are honest, sincere, and true to yourself. Or is your mind at peace when you're lying to others and to yourself? Everybody knows the answer to that question. I close my case. Haha. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Salvijus Posted June 15 14 minutes ago, snowymountains said: Perhaps back yours on Gestalt? Or alternatively eg read a book about it before making statements about it? I did give my arguments. And I probably know much more about Gestalt than you think. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Maddie Posted June 15 1 minute ago, Salvijus said: Any spirituality that focuses on truth. What is "the truth" according to Salvijus? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
snowymountains Posted June 15 1 minute ago, Salvijus said: I did give my arguments. And I probably know much more about Gestalt than you think. It sounds like you know nothing about it to be fully honest. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Salvijus Posted June 15 Just now, Maddie said: What is "the truth" according to Salvijus? Honesty would be another word for it. Vipassana would be a buddhist word for it. "Seeing things as they are" not as you think they are. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
snowymountains Posted June 15 1 minute ago, Maddie said: What is "the truth" according to Salvijus? "The truth" it's one, maybe nobody else has discovered it though 😁 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Salvijus Posted June 15 (edited) 1 minute ago, snowymountains said: It sounds like you know nothing about it to be fully honest. It's okay to have an impression. When you want to back it up with arguments one day, I'm all ears. Edited June 15 by Salvijus Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
snowymountains Posted June 15 Just now, Salvijus said: It's okay to have an impression. When you want to back it up with arguments one day, I'm all ears. Your posts are the argument 🙂 but again if you equate spirituality with therapy, no arguments will ever convince you and I'm not interested in that anyhow. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Salvijus Posted June 15 Just now, snowymountains said: Your posts are the argument 🙂 but again if you equate spirituality with therapy, no arguments will ever convince you and I'm not interested in that anyhow. I gave my arguments why I think spirituality is the only legit therapy. So far you're just running circles and failing to say anything to address those arguments. Or debunk those arguments. That's the story of the situation unfortunately. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Maddie Posted June 15 7 minutes ago, Salvijus said: Honesty would be another word for it. Vipassana would be a buddhist word for it. "Seeing things as they are" not as you think they are. So your saying mindfulness is the truth then? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
snowymountains Posted June 15 1 minute ago, Salvijus said: I gave my arguments why I think spirituality is the only legit therapy. So far you're just running circles and failing to say anything to address those arguments. Or debunk those arguments. That's the story of the situation unfortunately. The "story of the situation is", have a nice day 👍♥️🙂 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Salvijus Posted June 15 Just now, Maddie said: So your saying mindfulness is the truth then? Observing reality without conceptualizing it leads to truth. Because now you truly see things for what they are. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
snowymountains Posted June 15 Just now, Maddie said: So your saying mindfulness is the truth then? Do not spread confusion about "the truth"(TM), in itself this is an untruthful act 😁 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Salvijus Posted June 15 1 minute ago, snowymountains said: The "story of the situation is", have a nice day 👍♥️🙂 Of course having a nice day was my intention all along hehe 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Salvijus Posted June 15 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Maddie said: So your saying mindfulness is the truth then? Mindfulness is the means to truth in other words. But not the only means. Edited June 15 by Salvijus Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Maddie Posted June 15 2 minutes ago, Salvijus said: Observing reality without conceptualizing it leads to truth. Because now you truly see things for what they are. Would this not be the means to the end and not the end in and of itself? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Salvijus Posted June 15 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Maddie said: Would this not be the means to the end and not the end in and of itself? Yes mindfulness is the means to the end. Not the end itself. Edited June 15 by Salvijus 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Maddie Posted June 15 Just now, Salvijus said: Yes mindfulness is the means to the end. The the end itself. So you have told me what the means to the "truth" is, but not what the "truth" is. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
snowymountains Posted June 15 Just now, Maddie said: So you have told me what the means to the "truth" is, but not what the "truth" is. apophatic theology 😁 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
liminal_luke Posted June 15 In my (admittedly limited) experience, hard-core traditional Buddhist teachers are very clear that Buddhism isn´t therapy. It´s the Buddhist hobbyists that push that equivalence. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Salvijus Posted June 15 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Maddie said: So you have told me what the means to the "truth" is, but not what the "truth" is. "Perception of reality without mental defilements or mental filters" that would be one way of saying it. But a much simpler way of saying it would be just "honesty" imo Edited June 15 by Salvijus Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Salvijus Posted June 15 (edited) 3 minutes ago, liminal_luke said: In my (admittedly limited) experience, hard-core traditional Buddhist teachers are very clear that Buddhism isn´t therapy. It´s the Buddhist hobbyists that push that equivalence. The goal of therapy is to restore the peace of mind. The same goal that every spiritual path has aswell. So therapy is basically spirituality just under a different name. Still progressing. And if therapy ever reaches a final stage of development it will become inseparable from the classic spirituality that we see. Edited June 15 by Salvijus Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
snowymountains Posted June 15 Just now, liminal_luke said: In my (admittedly limited) experience, hard-core traditional Buddhist teachers are very clear that Buddhism isn´t therapy. It´s the Buddhist hobbyists that push that equivalence. Mostly yes, that's my experience as well, there is some malpractice though and the degree can dependent on the lineage, again in my experience. Monasteries typically work with psychiatric clinics btw when their staff needs help, they ( rightfully so ) do not depend on the Suttas for that, so they clearly do not see Buddhism as therapy. The hobbyists which are "self-ordained" do most of the damage, agreed. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
