The feel of a place/space

[dwai]

I’ve been thinking about how a specific feeling arises from a space/place. I remember certain sensations/feelings being evoked by specific places.

 

There is a concept called “Tanmatra” in Hindu cosmology - “ Tanmatras are rudimentary, undifferentiated, subtle elements from which gross elements are produced. There are five sense perceptions – hearing, touch, sight, taste and smell – and there are five tanmatras corresponding to those five sense perceptions and the five sense-organs“ (Wikipedia)

 

it’s hard to describe the phenomena - but spaces have a certain feel about them - some feel comfortable, like home, while others feel different/uncomfortable - something that doesn’t go away even with prolonged exposure/familiarity. 
 

For example, some places are conducive to meditation, while others aren’t. Some tend to encourage activity, others tend to make us feel lethargic. 
 

Would love to read what the bums have to say on this topic. 

[liminal_luke]

Yesterday I befriended Mario, a guy who I suspect is homeless.  He was hanging out in an empty lot filled with weeds and debris.  He offered to cure my bum foot with his manos de milagro, miracle hands, but I turned him down.  I just walked by the same lot a few minutes ago and noticed a still life of sorts very consciously constructed in the very center: two low cardboard boxes stacked on top of each other, topped by a piece of cement cinder block which was in turn topped by a potted green plant.  To me, the arrangement had the feeling of an altar or a shrine.  It seemed to heighthen the energy of the entire space, infusing the otherwise junky lot with the intentional consciousness of it´s creator.  Did Mario put it together?  Perhaps I shouldn´t have been so quick to say no to that healing treatment.

Edited May 28 by liminal_luke

[dwai]

15 hours ago, liminal_luke said:

Yesterday I befriended Mario, a guy who I suspect is homeless.  He was hanging out in an empty lot filled with weeds and debris.  He offered to cure my bum foot with his manos de milagro, miracle hands, but I turned him down.  I just walked by the same lot a few minutes ago and noticed a still life of sorts very consciously constructed in the very center: two low cardboard boxes stacked on top of each other, topped by a piece of cement cinder block which was in turn topped by a potted green plant.  To me, the arrangement had the feeling of an altar or a shrine.  It seemed to heighthen the energy of the entire space, infusing the otherwise junky lot with the intentional consciousness of it´s creator.  Did Mario put it together?  Perhaps I shouldn´t have been so quick to say no to that healing treatment.

Sounds like Mario changed the energy of the space. IIRC there was another bum who talked about meeting an enlightened homeless man in NYC serendipitously a few times. Could be something there. 

 

How did the encounter make you feel?

[liminal_luke]

25 minutes ago, dwai said:

 

How did the encounter make you feel?

 

Actually, it felt really good.  He had a white rock that he´d tied up with twine and made into a necklace.  I commented that I liked it and he took it off his neck and gave it to me.  In the end he did hit me up to give him something and I offered a banana from my grocery bag which he seemed happy enough with.  I´ll give him something else if I see him again, food or money.  An uplifting encounter.

[Nungali]

On 28/05/2024 at 8:47 AM, dwai said:

I’ve been thinking about how a specific feeling arises from a space/place. I remember certain sensations/feelings being evoked by specific places.

 

There is a concept called “Tanmatra” in Hindu cosmology - “ Tanmatras are rudimentary, undifferentiated, subtle elements from which gross elements are produced. There are five sense perceptions – hearing, touch, sight, taste and smell – and there are five tanmatras corresponding to those five sense perceptions and the five sense-organs“ (Wikipedia)

 

it’s hard to describe the phenomena - but spaces have a certain feel about them - some feel comfortable, like home, while others feel different/uncomfortable - something that doesn’t go away even with prolonged exposure/familiarity. 
 

For example, some places are conducive to meditation, while others aren’t. Some tend to encourage activity, others tend to make us feel lethargic. 
 

Would love to read what the bums have to say on this topic. 

 

Are you familiar with  'Genius Loci '  ?

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genius_loci

 

Here , with the indigenous, such concepts hold high importance , the 'spirit' of a place  plus your 'belonging ' - becasue you came 'out of a place'   (in the landscape or 'country'  that you where born in ) . Ideed , to the extent that a few years back an indigenous artists won the  premier 'Archibald Prize '   portrait competition with a painting of her home 'country' .  It was protested but  the decision was upheld as such indigenous people see themselves and their specific landscape as the same thing . To see the 'self' as somehow different  or separate from it   would be to deny a huge part of your identity meaning and purpose .

 

We have many different types of  'power sites ' and also some that are  'bad juju' .  They are highly regulated by tradition and Law .

 

I posted about one on Daobums years back , it was about Ainslee Robert's  - he started off as reasonable artist   but seemed to have developed some problem with coping, or depression ;

 

" In 1950, with a burgeoning business employing 35 staff, Roberts experienced what was diagnosed as a nervous breakdown and was ordered rest and quiet. His wife Judy bought him a one-way ticket to Alice Springs,  "     - that's one way of dealing with your partner having a breakdown  !      

 

He moped around there for a while until some guy took pity on him and thought 'You need a stint out in the bush  and they took horses on a trek and at one point  decided to go into this site - ' Palka Karinya '   . A radical place , a gorge  with a huge 'needle spire' stuck into the ground in the middle   , as if a huge shard of nearby rock and been broken off and speared down into the ground  . The horses would not enter , even for water .  They camped in there overnight .

 

      

 

Something happened to Ainslee that night  he never 'recovered' , but from then on he became one of Australia's renown artists  ( well, used to be ,  the general public doesnt seem to know much of him any more .

 

 

         

 

 

Daobums might find this  view interesting   :

 

" On entering the Palka Karrinya gorge, it is tradition to circumambulate and touch the monolith stone representing the Jungarrayi ancestor, with a branch of eucalyptus –  first timers have to throw a stone in a rock pool nearby. This is why it is worn at the base.

From a Taoist perspective, all the horizontal strata of the rocks in the gorge and the red colour would create a very potent masculine Yang chi. Conversely the sole vertical shard, due to its vertical Yin orientation and the yin water in the rock pool next to it, would concentrate, by virtue of polarity, a powerful Yin feminine force.

...

Of all the sacred places that Ainslie Roberts visited in Central Australia, Palka Karrinya had the most profound influence. He believed that Universal archetypes manifested through myths and could be channelled by the artist. Mountford felt the original spirit of the land could be accessed through the ceremonies, art and myths of the Aborigines and glimpses of ancient powers and histories as old as time itself could be experienced. "

 

 

 

 

Edited May 28 by Nungali

[dwai]

My hometown is Mysore in south India, and is considered one of the 108 shakti peethas. When I’m there, it feels like I’m plugged into a high voltage power line. Strangely, I never noticed it when I lived there. Maybe I wasn’t sensitive to it. 
 

@Nungali thanks for sharing! 

[liminal_luke]

Can people be mobile power spots?  Is the force that draws us to some people the same as the force that attracts us to places?  

[Taomeow]

12 hours ago, liminal_luke said:

Can people be mobile power spots?  Is the force that draws us to some people the same as the force that attracts us to places?  

 

Definitely.  And just like with places, or even more so, it's not one kind of force, it's different kinds of power.  The most obvious is sexual attractiveness which in some people reaches its peak at a certain age, stays there for a certain while, and then begins to ebb.  It is the force some modern folks try to cling to (and some make fools of themselves in the process) -- whereas it's meant to work like that line in the I Ching: "It flares up, dies down, gets thrown away."  Other forces are waiting in line to take its place.  Motherly/fatherly energy -- powerfully attractive when it's there, and a talented teacher (or even a general whom soldiers see as a "father figure" on occasion) has it.  Powerful but unscrupulous leaders exploit it to the max.  Then there's forces that make someone talented, or even a genius -- also a magnet, although a more selective kind, or rather, the kind that can pull on one end and push on the other.  And so on.        

[dwai]

12 hours ago, liminal_luke said:

Can people be mobile power spots?  Is the force that draws us to some people the same as the force that attracts us to places?  

That is certainly possible. My teacher is like that - we can feel his field in a 40-50 mi radius around him (Maybe because we are attuned to him). 
 

[Taomeow]

4 minutes ago, dwai said:

That is certainly possible. My teacher is like that - we can feel his field in a 40-50 mi radius around him (Maybe because we are attuned to him). 
 

 

Yeah, strong cultivators are a separate story.

 My teacher never failed to give me a boost of qi by his sheer presence.  It's as though no matter how you feel, no matter where your baseline is, after spending some time around this person you invariably feel better.

 

   

[dwai]

55 minutes ago, Taomeow said:

The most obvious is sexual attractiveness

I've encountered this with a con person. It was very unsettling - it made my skin crawl 

[snowymountains]

49 minutes ago, Taomeow said:

 

Yeah, strong cultivators are a separate story.

 My teacher never failed to give me a boost of qi by his sheer presence.  It's as though no matter how you feel, no matter where your baseline is, after spending some time around this person you invariably feel better.

 

   

 

Feeling someone's presence energising you, is attributed to Qi in Daoism ? - genuine question.

It does happen, I view it through the lens of transference & countertransference.

[Taomeow]

17 minutes ago, snowymountains said:

 

Feeling someone's presence energising you, is attributed to Qi in Daoism ? - genuine question.

It does happen, I view it through the lens of transference & countertransference.

 

I'm talking about my taiji teacher.  After 20 years of taiji and a lot of assorted taoist "stuff" I dare say I can tell transference from qi.  (Besides, I am not a fan of pop psychology parlance, I've been around that block too, but on entirely different terms.)  

 

In practical terms, in the presence of my teacher, my taiji is better, everything is smoother, easier, and more efficient.  Verifiable by (e.g.) performance in sparring with others.  I don't have physical or mental strength to throw a guy half my age, twice my size -- I have skill learned from my teacher, and that skill is qi based.  

[snowymountains]

2 minutes ago, Taomeow said:

 

I'm talking about my taiji teacher.  After 20 years of taiji and a lot of assorted taoist "stuff" I dare say I can tell transference from qi.  (Besides, I am not a fan of pop psychology parlance, I've been around that block too, but on entirely different terms.)  

 

In practical terms, in the presence of my teacher, my taiji is better, everything is smoother, easier, and more efficient.  Verifiable by (e.g.) performance in sparring with others.  I don't have physical or mental strength to throw a guy half my age, twice my size -- I have skill learned from my teacher, and that skill is qi based.  

 

Transference is not easy to detect, and not limited to projecting onto others, it goes further than that.

[forestofclarity]

I know what you mean, but feel that I'm going to opposite way--- space(s) is (are) appearing more similar.

[dwai]

2 hours ago, forestofemptiness said:

I know what you mean, but feel that I'm going to opposite way--- space(s) is (are) appearing more similar.

Curious. Can you share more?

[Taomeow]

19 hours ago, dwai said:

My hometown is Mysore in south India, and is considered one of the 108 shakti peethas. When I’m there, it feels like I’m plugged into a high voltage power line. Strangely, I never noticed it when I lived there. Maybe I wasn’t sensitive to it. 

 

My not hometown, New York, used to feel like that to me when I lived there, and especially when I commuted from New Jersey to work there.  I'd be sleepy, tired in advance in the morning, dozing off on the train, and then -- as soon as I stepped out of the subway underpass -- wham!  A huge jolt of energy.  I liked it for a while, but after a while, not so much.  It felt like some kind of artificial stimulation, too much adrenaline, too much cortisol, too little harmony.  The energy of perpetual stress.  But there was definitely a sense of power to the place.  Manhattan stands on a bedrock of shist that's 450 million years old -- I think that's what imparts its underlying strength, unyielding, hard, aggressive, very yang... I could feel it.   

[dwai]

57 minutes ago, Taomeow said:

It felt like some kind of artificial stimulation, too much adrenaline, too much cortisol, too little harmony

That was not how it feels in Mysore. Just that all the subtle energies and senses  are super amplified.

NYC feels very stressful to me. I’ve been there only once, and don’t want to go back  

Edited May 29 by dwai

[silent thunder]

I lived in Brooklyn and worked in Manhattan from 93 to 2000.

 

Your description of the subtle field of the island is spot on with what I experienced @Taomeow

 

My wife and I agreed we needed to move by our mid 30's at the latest.  There was no dimmer switch to that ever present thrumming field of that place.

 

Potent but overwhelming over long periods.  Adrenal burnout.

[forestofclarity]

6 hours ago, forestofemptiness said:

I know what you mean, but feel that I'm going to opposite way--- space(s) is (are) appearing more similar.

 

Sort of like an undercurrent of a pleasant, vivid, semi-lucid dream. 

 

[dwai]

1 hour ago, forestofemptiness said:

 

Sort of like an undercurrent of a pleasant, vivid, semi-lucid dream. 

 

Sounds great  

[forestofclarity]

11 hours ago, dwai said:

Sounds great  

 

It is also a bit destabilizing. Another reason to work with people and traditions--- they provide a solid anchor for destabilizing periods. 

 

But the interesting point you bring up here is what is lost--- the diverse feelings of times and places. If a concert at Red Rocks has the same underlying current as an ancient Church in Rome, have you gained or lost? If you go to the concert for the people buzz, and the Church for the sacred space vibe, then you've definitely lost something. Or perhaps that is the cost of increased equanimity? 

 

[dwai]

7 hours ago, forestofemptiness said:

 

It is also a bit destabilizing. Another reason to work with people and traditions--- they provide a solid anchor for destabilizing periods. 

 

But the interesting point you bring up here is what is lost--- the diverse feelings of times and places. If a concert at Red Rocks has the same underlying current as an ancient Church in Rome, have you gained or lost? If you go to the concert for the people buzz, and the Church for the sacred space vibe, then you've definitely lost something. Or perhaps that is the cost of increased equanimity? 

 

Based on your description, it seems like a phase that will stabilize by itself. The blissful "state" rises from within, so everything else seems "similar" (and less focused). But the system (mind) gets used to it after a while, and the enjoyment will be of a different kind. 

[Maddie]

Sounds like Feng Shui

[Apech]

7 minutes ago, Maddie said:

Sounds like Feng Shui

 smells like teen spirit