The Construction of Judaism

[Nungali]

16 minutes ago, Thrice Daily said:

so what we are basically saying is that the old testament needs to be rewritten/updated then?

 

No, of course not . I am not attacking your religion or faith . I am simply not coming from that angle ... this is an historic view .

 

if I thought like that I would not be visiting my Jewish friend on Sabbath and pressing the button on his coffee machine  for him . I dont mind that ,,, its his BELIEF .

 

However if he said he wanted me to press it for him becase he claimed he had  sore finger ... I would check first , as he might be just lazy . 

 

let me ask YOU a question now ... no need to answer me but I want you to think about it .  Does your faith belief and experience with Jesus ( not Christianity but Jesus )    depend on the OT being exactly accurate ?

[Nungali]

... you see, because we still have not examined all the archaeological material in stores - mostly various languages written in cuneiform  we have had to rely on a historical sources , like the Jewish Bible / Torah . It had permeated  HISTORY ( the written records of past events ... otherwise its oral history or 'pre-history'  or future fiction )  .

 

What needs to be rewritten is history ... not religion .

 

You could look up a history subject on wiki and its FULL off Solomon's temple , Kingdom of untied Israel , etc etc  a bland of historical accounts as seen by those people AND myths and stories and yes, some propaganda and  past politically motivated stuff  ( see past posts for referenced info on that one , it was  part of 'scribal method'  ) , they are highlighted which means you can click on them and get a link ... then that link might explain its not historical or even doubted . But it is , at a glance, included in history , its history that needs to be re-written .

[Thrice Daily]

I don't think its an attack. i think a lot of history needs rewriting to be honest... I think threads like this are valuable.

 

Re your question, I don't see the old testament as relevant to Christianity, if anything it seems more in opposition to it tbh.

 

I think its more likely to confuse people and scare them away from Jesus to be fair. Depends who you are talking about though, a lot of people are bat shit crazy. And religious texts are like drugs to them, I don't think many care if historically accurate.

 

I think its important to set the record straight, once we know the truth. Not keep peddling lies to keep previous scholars held in good light, as the expense of others with promising careers and new perspectives, they should be valued and respected. 

[Nungali]

2 hours ago, Daniel said:

 

That hasn't been my experience.

 

 

Certainly.  However, I have heard a lot of these allegations before.  I had already watched the Yonaton Adler interview, which is why I knew immediately where to go with in the interview to show the faults in Nungali's assumptions regarding when the Torah was composed.

 

If Nungali was open, in the manner you describe, then, he would be admitting he's wrong, and adjusting his point of view due to receiving new information.

 

The simple truth is, it's uncertain when and under what circumstances the Torah was composed.  But the archeological evidence can be used to support either conclusion.  It's more likely the Egyptians were influenced because they changed their theology dramatically after the immigrants arrived.

 

No its not likely or unlikely . I already showed the recent scholastic evidence that supports my view (.. and I have had it as my view  for years as that is where researcher led to . )  but you will not have read it , nor a lot of the other stuff, because yo be too busy trying to personally dis me

 

now THAT is a ' continual ;

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem

 

 

Edited November 6 by Nungali

[Thrice Daily]

1 minute ago, Nungali said:

... you see, because we still have not examined all the archaeological material in stores - mostly various languages written in cuneiform  we have had to rely on a historical sources , like the Jewish Bible / Torah . It had permeated  HISTORY ( the written records of past events ... otherwise its oral history or 'pre-history'  or future fiction )  .

 

What needs to be rewritten is history ... not religion .

 

You could look up a history subject on wiki and its FULL off Solomon's temple , Kingdom of untied Israel , etc etc  a bland of historical accounts as seen by those people AND myths and stories and yes, some propaganda and  past politically motivated stuff  ( see past posts for referenced info on that one , it was  part of 'scribal method'  ) , they are highlighted which means you can click on them and get a link ... then that link might explain its not historical or even doubted . But it is , at a glance, included in history , its history that needs to be re-written .

I totally agree, it's very important work and should not be taken lightly in our times, anything less is Orwellian.. We got our fill of that already that we are trying to combat. 

 

No I think it's very important for humanity to swallow its pride and just admit that people in the past got all sorts of shit wrong. History books and educational material in schools and universities should be updated periodically. Hopefully we are moving into a golden age of truth and world peace and we can free up time and resources to do such things.

 

Fostering more of a collaborative effort from governments too, especially I would say, Egypt. I'd like to see what's under the Sphinx myself. Their government very cagey

[Nungali]

8 minutes ago, Thrice Daily said:

I don't think its an attack. i think a lot of history needs rewriting to be honest... I think threads like this are valuable.

 

Re your question, I don't see the old testament as relevant to Christianity, if anything it seems more in opposition to it tbh.

 

I think its more likely to confuse people and scare them away from Jesus to be fair. Depends who you are talking about though, a lot of people are bat shit crazy. And religious texts are like drugs to them, I don't think many care if historically accurate.

 

I think its important to set the record straight, once we know the truth. Not keep peddling lies to keep previous scholars held in good light, as the expense of others with promising careers and new perspectives, they should be valued and respected. 

 

One important aspects of the Baha'i central beliefs ;

 

" The independant investigation of truth ."

[Nungali]

.

 

Edited November 6 by Nungali

[Thrice Daily]

But it's good if Daniel can challenge you and meet you in the same places. That's where the rubber meets the road and we can really move on with this. He has to be honest though if its time to concur on and point and you do too.

 

Emotion wont help but it's understandable...

 

It's all part and parcel though and admitting defeat comes with the territory here, and there is nothing wrong with that... But if you are right and speaking truth, that is important that it is heard and assimilated. imo

[Nungali]

8 minutes ago, Thrice Daily said:

I totally agree, it's very important work and should not be taken lightly in our times, anything less is Orwellian.. We got our fill of that already that we are trying to combat. 

 

No I think it's very important for humanity to swallow its pride and just admit that people in the past got all sorts of shit wrong. History books and educational material in schools and universities should be updated periodically. Hopefully we are moving into a golden age of truth and world peace and we can free up time and resources to do such things.

 

Fostering more of a collaborative effort from governments too, especially I would say, Egypt. I'd like to see what's under the Sphinx myself. Their government very cagey

 

Down under the Sphinx ?

 

Ancient Egyptian public toilets .

 

 

[Thrice Daily]

that's one way to put it.

[Nungali]

1 minute ago, Thrice Daily said:

But it's good if Daniel can challenge you and meet you in the same places.

 

Oh dear  ... you haven't noticed the miserable failure there . Look what they have thrown up to' meet me in the same place '  ... stuff about my mother !

 

Really !

 

 

[Thrice Daily]

1 minute ago, Nungali said:

 

I thought that was Cobie having a light hearted one, not serious was it, if so I certainly missed that...

[forestofclarity]

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